Fast pass plus

[djlaosc]

My biggest complaint is I think the 60day window is a mistake. The window should be very short IMO - less than 7 days.

Yeah, I think that the window is one of the main problems with FP+. If it was "the night before", there would be a lot less complaints about that area. We don't do table service, so don't have any ADRs to make at 180/190 days out (we only made 1 ADR last time - TREX, and it was the worst meal that I had all holiday - it was inedible.)

Another one is the wristband (it's fine if you're going to be there for a day or two but if we go for a two or three week holiday from the UK, given that we're not going to be tanned, is going to leave a noticeable tanline, and be annoying to wear for such a long time, and if we don't wear it, it's going to take up more space in a pocket than a ticket would.)

Another one is that you can't get more than one FP+ for the same ride on the same day, and for example, you can't get TSMM/RnRC on the same day - it's more restrictive than the current setup - I understand why it is how it will be, but it doesn't make it any less annoying. As I have already said - we got 18 Fastpasses on our last holiday, based on the current FP+ setup, we couldn't get at least 3 of them, and we didn't need them for the other attractions.

And I don't mind the rush to TSMM, Soarin' or Everest - last holiday we were up at 6am, asleep at midnight every night for 3 weeks - it's not like we're going to stop that because we can reserve Fastpasses ahead of time - it just means that we're going to be able to ride the main rides less, and the queues for the smaller rides will be longer.

 

[John]

No - I'm not calling the system flawless. I'm calling it different. But much of the points people are making to support their belief are crap.. and completely ignoring what the system DOES bring to the table. It's much more a perception problem right now than actual problems. I think most of the problems as I stated in another post are going to be user interaction. How much man power is Disney going to have to invest in staffing 'support' calls and how much massaging are they going to have to do when customers didn't get what they wanted, etc. By putting everyone through 'one door' - you have now made yourself responsible for that one door. How frustrated will customers get with time it takes to get issues resolved.. vs simply just 'doing something' on their own without having to talk to anyone.

The system increases the number of dependencies... dependencies are expensive to maintain and support.

In the positive... I think this system addresses most of the concerns about FP. It offers no-wait services to many popular things like M&G and shows. It offers online self-service portals.

My biggest complaint is I think the 60day window is a mistake. The window should be very short IMO - less than 7 days.

Well stated as always Fynni....I am sure its hard to take into account how well the Honey Boo Boo crowd can manage. I am sure there are aspects that are simply magical about the program but for now I will hold on to my skepticisim until further notice.One of the problems I already see (here) is perception. Sometimes weather it is a good program or not will not matter if it dosnt come off with minimal flaws. Sure it may need to be tweeked but if the returns on the thing early are registering low on the guest polls. The problems may snoball.

Part of the bad perception that is present is the latest sub-PR that WDW has recieved....warranted or not. IMO warranted. I personally think WDW has a little trouble on thier hands. It exsacerbated by whats going on at Uni and the lack of any new announcement at home. Maybe there have been anouncements but not much movement. In the FLE the biggest attraction turns out to be a very low capacity dining option. What does that say about the rest of the land?....sorry to get off track and thread drift but I think that its all relevant.

 

[flynnibus]

I think Disney's lack of info about the upcoming service says a lot.

I mean look at how far in advance they were pumping things like New Fantasyland - months, months, months in advance. Now here is a platform that enables a host of services.. that they hope will redefine the theme park visiting experience. And they are barely saying ANYTHING. No build up.. no series of videos trying to convince everyone. Heck, where is the training for all their armies of travel agents, CMs, etc? This should be a massive rollout.. and Disney is be coy about it all.

I find that disturbing.. from what the public perception will be.. to how smooth the rollout really will be.. and how Disney really feels universally about the whole thing.

Very concerning..

 

[John]

I think Disney's lack of info about the upcoming service says a lot.

I mean look at how far in advance they were pumping things like New Fantasyland - months, months, months in advance. Now here is a platform that enables a host of services.. that they hope will redefine the theme park visiting experience. And they are barely saying ANYTHING. No build up.. no series of videos trying to convince everyone. Heck, where is the training for all their armies of travel agents, CMs, etc? This should be a massive rollout.. and Disney is be coy about it all.

I find that disturbing.. from what the public perception will be.. to how smooth the rollout really will be.. and how Disney really feels universally about the whole thing.

Very concerning..

Your honor.....I rest my case!

 

[nepalostparks]

I saw at least some of this was posted earlier, but since I uploaded these images in another thread, I thought I would post them here too.

These are from the Terms and Conditions when switching your account over on the new Disney World website, pertaining to FP+...

 

[captainkidd]

What we do know:

• Once you go black.. you don't go back. The ToS says once you convert to RFID paperless, your old ticket media won't be able to use the legacy FP system.
• The system encompasses rides, shows, fireworks shows, M&Gs, and dining experiences
• Dining experiences will also offer pre-ordering meals (This doesn't necessarily mean you MUST pre-order.. but that isn't specified, but another area people are quick to jump to)
• The system appears open to all MYW ticket holders (and probably more.. but some may be excluded. An example might be Comp tickets)
• The system is offering 'up to' 60 days advance bookings
• The system allows you to modify your bookings
• The system is usable for one park per day
• You can only use FP+ once per day per attraction (no repeat FP+ on same attraction)
• Return times will not allow late or early entry (presumably Disney's policies on grace windows will still apply)
• "When you initially make FastPass+ selections for a particular park, you will select a FastPass+ experience set and if your plans change, you may modify the entire FastPass+ experience set until the first FastPass+ experience is redeemed or the first unredeemed experience expires. You may modify an unredeemed individual FastPass+ experience any time prior to the end the day"
• If you miss a reservation, you will be able to book a new FP+ reservation using that credit up until the end of the day. 'Credits' expire at the end of the day
• The system has both touch based, and general proximity pickups
• You may link a credit card to your device.. and transactions *may* require a PIN (Presumably over a certain $$ amount)
• You may make reservations for yourself, any managed accounts, and any connected accounts (allows groups to book together)

Areas that we have examples, but doesn't necessarily mean this is the ONLY way it will be

• today people get to pick X amount of rides from a group, and Y out of a second group, etc. This is how Disney will keep everyone from using all their FP+ for just a handful of things. You also can not use multiple FP+ for the same ride in the same day. Example: Pick 3 things from Group A, and 2 things from Group B.
• How many picks you get for each day does not appear 'fixed'. This may be something Disney can alter based on capacity, time of year, etc. This is another area people speculate Disney will tier or sell. Say in Value, get 3 picks, stay in a deluxe, get 6, etc.
• Disney is not expecting guests to micro-manage their time. When a guest picks their selections, the site spits out an itinerary for them to plan their day with all their selections included. You basically get a 'recommended touring guide'. It's not clear exactly what type of micro-level control you will get over reservation times, but since you can edit reservations day of, I would assume you can pick from available timeslots when editing individuals.

To me, this is taking it to extremes.

 

[flynnibus]

To me, this is taking it to extremes.

The system? Or the idea if we actually show you the facts.. you'll still just close your eyes?

 

[GoofGoof]

No - I'm not calling the system flawless. I'm calling it different. But much of the points people are making to support their belief are crap.. and completely ignoring what the system DOES bring to the table. It's much more a perception problem right now than actual problems. I think most of the problems as I stated in another post are going to be user interaction. How much man power is Disney going to have to invest in staffing 'support' calls and how much massaging are they going to have to do when customers didn't get what they wanted, etc. By putting everyone through 'one door' - you have now made yourself responsible for that one door. How frustrated will customers get with time it takes to get issues resolved.. vs simply just 'doing something' on their own without having to talk to anyone.

The system increases the number of dependencies... dependencies are expensive to maintain and support.

In the positive... I think this system addresses most of the concerns about FP. It offers no-wait services to many popular things like M&G and shows. It offers online self-service portals.

My biggest complaint is I think the 60day window is a mistake. The window should be very short IMO - less than 7 days.

I agree with this about the window time. I think it would eliminate some of the issues people have if it were shorter. Maybe one of the benefits for WDW is they can shift staffing around and maybe even ride maintenance based on expected crowd levels. For instance, if during a given week Tuesday has the least FP+ reservations at EPCOT then make that the day you take Test Track down for a few hours for maintenance. If that same day has a larger than normal number of reservations at MK they can add CMs and potentially open additional food carts. These decisions could be made a month or more in advance if people actually use FP+ and make reservations.

 

[ParentsOf4]

When anything moves electronic - it's easier to change than adapting physical things. That's just how it goes. But people are assuming evil here.. and is that really warranted? The same controls could be used for GOOD - yet everyone focuses on the evil.

The focus on the negative aspects of FP+ is largely the result of TDO's recent track record, along with some business sense:

• TDO is making a $1.5B capital investment in Next Gen. IMHO, FP+ is the centerpiece of Next Gen. TDO is part of TWDC, a large for-profit corporation. For-profit corporations do not make $1.5B investments without expecting significant returns on investment. Since we've repeatedly been told FP+ will be "free", how does TDO recoup its investment?
• In recent years, TDO has shown an extreme focus on profits and revenue, to the point where the last decade represents a period of the fewest WDW theme park expansions ever, with pieces literally falling off major attractions, even as TDO continues to construct new resorts and DVCs, which can be more easily associated with new revenue.
• WDW's annual attendance is "down modestly", along with resort occupancy rates. Businesses usually don't survive if their sales continually decline. TDO needs to reverse recent trends and, at this point, might take desperate measures to do so.
• TDO has been secretive about Next Gen's details. Some aspects of it are already under trial, investment houses continue to ask about it at earnings teleconferences, yet, as far as I know, there has been no public presentation describing exactly what Next Gen is.
• TDO let Harry Potter "get away", disappointing many Disney fans, while favoring Avatar instead, something that a lot of Disney fans are considerably less enthused about. Meanwhile, rumor is that TDO is resisting bringing a proven winner like Carsland to DHS. The point being that TDO's decision-making track record has, to put it mildly, not been exactly the best of late.
• FP+ does nothing to increase ride capacity. The fact that they are adding FP+ to attractions that don't need them suggests TDO is manipulating guest behavior with FP+. People usually don't like feeling that they are being manipulated.
• FP+ might solve one of WDW guests' biggest complaints for some guests, long lines. The current FP system provides a solution but takes effort. You have to get yourself out of bed and get to the parks at a decent hour in order to get "good" FP. FP+ allows people to, theoretically, sleep in on their WDW vacation without having to worry that they are going to stand in line for 120 minutes for TSM (for example). However, the number of FP+ is limited. Clearly, some people will be able to get a FP+ for TSM while most will not. Exactly how will TDO distribute those limited FP+? With its sophisticated FP+ system, is TDO simply going to allow it to be an online free-for-all at the 60-day mark?
• Rumor is that TDA strongly opposes Next Gen. In the Disney fan community, recent opinion is that TDA is "doing things right" while TDO continues to operate as TDA's evil doppelgänger. If TDA doesn't like it but TDO does, what are fans supposed to think?

The idea that TDO would spend $1.5B so some guests could sleep in a few extra hours because they have FP+ is, IMHO, ludicrous. They've got bigger plans for Next Gen. The fact that they haven't given the public (or shareholders) any idea what these are only lets people fear the worst.

 

[John]

One thing in the discription of srvices poated by Nepal that immediately jumps out at me is.....once a FP time window expires it counts against your daily allotment. I can see a scenario where parents who have children and have a unforseen reason they have to miss an attraction reservation.....before you could if available.... go back later and get another FP for a later time. Even maybe for different attraction all together....now that is not the case. Once you blow a FP its lost forever....atleast that is how I read it. You have a certian amount of FPs a day....period! I can see all kinds of lines at Guest Services for this.

 

[nepalostparks]

One thing in the discription of srvices poated by Nepal ....

It's NEPA Lost Parks.... not nepal... why doesn't anyone ever get that?!

The terms and conditions, while shedding some light on FP+ in an "official" sense, sure does raise just as many questions as it does answer, if not more so.

 

[John]

The focus on the negative aspects of FP+ is largely the result of TDO's recent track record, along with some business sense:

• TDO is making a $1.5B capital investment in Next Gen. IMHO, FP+ is the centerpiece of Next Gen. TDO is part of TWDC, a large non-profit corporation. Non-profit corporations do not make $1.5B investments without expecting significant returns on investment. Since we've repeatedly been told FP+ will be "free", how does TDO recoup its investment?
• In recent years, TDO has shown an extreme focus on profits and revenue, to the point where the last decade represents a period of the fewest WDW theme park expansions ever, with pieces literally falling off major attractions, even as TDO continues to construct new resorts and DVCs, which can be more easily associated with new revenue.
• WDW's annual attendance is down "modestly", along with resort occupancy rates. Businesses usually don't survive if their sales continually decline. TDO needs to reverse recent trends and, at this point, might take desperate measures to do so.
• TDO has been secretive about Next Gen's details. Some aspects of it are already under trial, investment houses continue to ask about it at earnings teleconferences, yet, as far as I know, there has been no public presentation describing exactly what Next Gen is.
• TDO let Harry Potter "get away", disappointing many Disney fans, while favoring Avatar instead, something that a lot of Disney fans are considerably less enthused about. Meanwhile, rumor is that TDO is resisting bringing a proven winner like Carsland to DHS. The point being that TDO's decision-making track record has, to put it mildly, not been exactly the best of late.
• FP+ does nothing to increase ride capacity. The fact that they are adding FP+ to attractions that don't need them suggests TDO is manipulating guest behavior with FP+. People usually don't like feeling that they are being manipulated.
• FP+ might solve one of WDW guests' biggest complaints for some guests, long lines. The current FP system provides a solution but takes effort. You have to get yourself out of bed and get to the parks at a decent hour in order to get "good" FP. FP+ allows people to, theoretically, sleep in on their WDW vacation without having to worry that they are going to stand in line for 120 minutes for TSM (for example). However, the number of FP+ is limited. Clearly, some people will be able to get a FP+ for TSM while most will not. Exactly how will TDO distribute those limited FP+? With its sophisticated FP+ system, is TDO simply going to allow it to be an online free-for-all at the 60-day mark?
• Rumor is that TDA is strongly opposed to Next Gen. In the Disney fan community, recent opinion is that TDA is "doing things right" while TDO continues to operate as TDA's evil doppelgänger. If TDA doesn't like it but TDO does, what are fans supposed to think?

The idea that TDO would spend $1.5B so some guests could sleep in a few extra hours because they have FP+ is, IMHO, ludicrous. They've got bigger plans for Next Gen. The fact that they haven't given the public (or shareholders) any idea what these are only lets people fear the worst.

Judge Flynni, I would like to introduce to you my co-council...ahhh yes....Ms PO4......Thank you.

 

[John]

It's NEPA Lost Parks.... not nepal... why doesn't anyone ever get that?!

The terms and conditions, while shedding some light on FP+ in an "official" sense, sure does raise just as many questions as it does answer, if not more so.

LMAO.....because we dont feel like typing....dont you get it

stand corrected and promise I will never use nepal ever again....Its NEPA!

 

[ScoutN]

For the same reasons they gave out 'suprise FPs' in the past.. it helps distribute the load to available capacity. By directing guests with FP+ to other attractions they might have otherwise opt'd to skip.. the park is increasing the utilization of the available capacity.

Instead of having 4 rides at 100% and 10 at 20%.. you try to get it more balanced.

Good. Let the fools stand in line for two hours to get on one ride while I do eight in the meantime. Seems like we are helping the helpless here.

 

[nytimez]

It's NEPA Lost Parks.... not nepal... why doesn't anyone ever get that?!

The terms and conditions, while shedding some light on FP+ in an "official" sense, sure does raise just as many questions as it does answer, if not more so.

Just go with Nepal. Sounds more exotic.

 

[nepalostparks]

Just go with Nepal. Sounds more exotic.

But kills the 12 + years of time and research that is the namesake (www.NEPALostParks.com)

 

[RSoxNo1]

For the same reasons they gave out 'suprise FPs' in the past.. it helps distribute the load to available capacity. By directing guests with FP+ to other attractions they might have otherwise opt'd to skip.. the park is increasing the utilization of the available capacity.

Instead of having 4 rides at 100% and 10 at 20%.. you try to get it more balanced.

The other option is to build more high quality rides that people want to experience instead of trying to artificially distribute crowds. It hasn't succeeded previously, I don't see it succeeding now.

 

[awoogala]

I am going in January, on a friend's dvc. Haven't pufchased my myw tickets yet. I wonder if I purchase them advance, if I have any chance of fastpass + trial?

 

[Neverland]

One thing in the discription of srvices poated by Nepal that immediately jumps out at me is.....once a FP time window expires it counts against your daily allotment. I can see a scenario where parents who have children and have a unforseen reason they have to miss an attraction reservation.....before you could if available.... go back later and get another FP for a later time. Even maybe for different attraction all together....now that is not the case. Once you blow a FP its lost forever....atleast that is how I read it. You have a certian amount of FPs a day....period! I can see all kinds of lines at Guest Services for this.

Nope. For this last test, you got 4 MK FPs and 3 DHS FPs. If an FP expired, you could get another one for a different time (depending on what was still available). You could even get one for a different attraction. You still got 4 at MK and 3 at DHS even if you missed one. Trust me, the point of this whole system is to get guests to use more FPs than they currently do. More FPs = more attractions done = more likely to come back = more $. More FPs also = more time to go shopping and eating = more $.

 

[nytimez]

But kills the 12 + years of time and research that is the namesake (www.NEPALostParks.com)

Don't worry, people are geographically ignorant. You won't have to change a thing.