Fantasmic gets cut to just 2 shows per week

[markjohns1]

Really...if that were the case, why didn't they do this years ago? Millions and miliions of dollars could have been saved with little impact on guests to the park.

Many of the things Disney does with their parks I agree with and see logic in. This is not one of those things. I think Disney is taking a huge risk on this move, and I think they know they are too. Disney is trying to make more money any way they can...I just think they are giving some guests excuses to spend some of their Disney money elswhere. I think they believe it is worth the risk. We shall see.

I think the reason their logic is elusive is because we are looking at this as an isolated move with no real idea of the inspiration or reasoning behind it. It's like taking a piece of a puzzle and trying to guess what the entire picture is. We have no idea regarding the big picture. The only thing we know for sure is that the hours are changed. And if we want to lump the PI and LTT changes into this, fine, but that may have nothing to do with the Fantasmic situation. Determining it was a cost-cutting move is an assumption, based on the current economic situation and the assumption that attendance is going to be low this year. And assuming it is solely a cost cutting move makes us the short-sighted ones. It is hard to see their logic because we don't know where this is going or any of the actual reasoning behind it.

I said this earlier, but what if their plan is to start a park-wide nighttime event? That way they aren't limited to a crowd of 10,000 enjoying the show, and they eliminate the need for guests to queue way in advance.

What if they are wanting DHS to be an attraction-oriented park? The current rumors indicate we're about to see an increase in the strength of the attraction lineup at DHS. And when you look at attractions like ToT, RnRC, and TSM combined with the rumored MI coaster, Star Tours 2.0, and the possibility of the Cars attraction coming if successful in DCA, and you've got a hefty lineup of repeatable attractions for guests to go on. When combined with their shows, you may not need a nighttime event to keep people in the park.

It just seems to me that the WDW marketing execs already know that the way to bring in more business is to offer deals like that to entice people to come down. So if they really were facing a bleak forecast for attendance, I don't see why they wouldn't employ that strategy again to combat it, rather than doing things like cutting popular attractions, which won't even save that much in the grand scheme of things, anyway.

Exactly. Accuse me of wearing rose-colored glasses, but I can't believe that this decision was made simply to reduce costs. I've got more faith in the execs then that. This move has strategic or vision-related written all over it.

 

[aeroc33]

If this cut is only for Jan/Feb then I really don't think it is that big a deal. Also, if this was related solely to lower visitor forecasts why wait til Jan? I would instead expect a schedule change in the next month or two. I, for one, think it is just as simple as much of the park resources shifting over to the opening of the American Idol attraction for the first couple of months. If the daily operation of this attraction is as complicated as it appears, they will need as many resources as possible to pull it off initially. With Jan being a slow month anyway, why not save some money and cut one show's schedule if you are additing new entertainment. Not sure why they would annouce all of this and cause a firestorm 6 months ahead of time. Especially when they sometimes wait till the last minute to annouce an attraction refurb.

 

[Timmay]

I think the reason their logic is elusive is because we are looking at this as an isolated move with no real idea of the inspiration or reasoning behind it.

I am not looking at this as isolated at all.

It's like taking a piece of a puzzle and trying to guess what the entire picture is .

See above. Yes,this is just one piece to the puzzle, but we have several other pieces to work with.

Determining it was a cost-cutting move is an assumption, based on the current economic situation and the assumption that attendance is going to be low this year.

Which makes this a very safe assumption...much like the assumption I have that the sun will come up in th east every morning. It just isn't a guess made out of thin air.

It is hard to see their logic because we don't know where this is going or any of the actual reasoning behind it.

I think we have a pretty good idea behind the reasoning. There only to seem to be a very few who think this is something other than a way to cut costs/increase the profit.

I said this earlier, but what if their plan is to start a park-wide nighttime event?

Cool, that would be great. I just don't see any evidence that points in that direction

What if they are wanting DHS to be an attraction-oriented park? The current rumors indicate we're about to see an increase in the strength of the attraction lineup at DHS. And when you look at attractions like ToT, RnRC, and TSM combined with the rumored MI coaster, Star Tours 2.0, and the possibility of the Cars attraction coming if successful in DCA, and you've got a hefty lineup of repeatable attractions for guests to go on. When combined with their shows, you may not need a nighttime event to keep people in the park.

Two words...Magic Kingdom. Oh, wait, one more word...Epcot. Both have nightly entertainment that isn't "needed" to keep people in the parks.

Accuse me of wearing rose-colored glasses, but I can't believe that this decision was made simply to reduce cost

And that is a problem...you refuse to beleive anything else. I could find it very easy to believe that the removal of 72% of the Fantasmic shows was not based on financial concerns...if there was evidence that pointed in that direction.

I've got more faith in the execs then that. This move has strategic or vision-related written all over it.

How? Show me something that indicates that.

Airlines are cutting flights and jobs left and right. Hospitals are laying of nursing staff at an alarming rate. Is this because these companies have something "vision related" in mind, or is it because they are cutting costs? Disney is no different. Why pretend they are?

 

[jt04]

And that is a problem...you refuse to beleive anything else. I could find it very easy to believe that the removal of 72% of the Fantasmic shows was not based on financial concerns...if there was evidence that pointed in that direction.

How? Show me something that indicates that.

Airlines are cutting flights and jobs left and right. Hospitals are laying of nursing staff at an alarming rate. Is this because these companies have something "vision related" in mind, or is it because they are cutting costs? Disney is no different. Why pretend they are?

From Investerms:

The second quarter was a bit of a struggle for Disney with the writers strike, but it still managed to flourish despite the economic drought. The company reported a 22% rise in net income from a year ago on surprisingly strong business at its theme parks and resorts and its TV networks. Many are speculating that Americans forwent larger vacations for simpler Disney vacations while more people staying at home have increased television traffic across the states.

From me:

The weak dollar continues to drive overseas visitors to WDW as well as Americans who can't afford to go overseas so they continue to book vacations to WDW. ESPN, ABC and many other Disney franchises are doing well and fuel prices and airline tickets have peaked which will create even more visitors.

 

[Giraffe Lounge]

If the daily operation of this attraction is as complicated as it appears, they will need as many resources as possible to pull it off initially.

I'm interested in what part of operating this attraction you think will be complicated?

It seems fairly straightforward to me. Yes it will require staffing, some performers, and a few entertainment techs, but its not exactly ground breaking-- we're not talking about a $100 million Cirque show here.

 

[tonythetigerasn]

Many people have been discussing how Fantasmic's absence 5 nights a week won't have a huge impact on the AVERAGE WDW guest. I find this to be an exaggeration. While Fantasmic certainly doesn't leave NOTHING to do in the studios, it also doesn't leave a whole lot. Playhouse Disney, Little Mermaid, Indy, Lights Motors Action, and Beauty and the Beast are all done showing by late afternoon in the off season, as has been said many times. Besides these five shows, what else is there to do at night? Tower of Terror, Great Movie Ride, Toy Story Mania, Rockin Rollercoaster, Star Tours, and Muppets 3D. That's six attractions... So of the studios 11 total major attractions, 5 of them are shows that close in the late afternoon.

Figure in the amount of people who have done those 6 attractions by the evening, and, without Fantasmic, there isn't a huge reason to stay in the studios for dinner or later. Most tourists aren't going to take a second spin on every ride in the park as opposed to a 2-hour nightly spectacular (once you figure in wait times and the actual show, as well as time spent leaving the park). These people will simply leave. They might not leave property and this move might make more money for Disney, but the Studios will DEFINITELY see decreased crowds on nights Fantasmic doesn't show.

Let's say of the 10,000 people in Fantasmic nightly, 5,000 of those people PLAN to see the show either before they enter DHS or sometime by mid-afternoon of their trip. The removal of Fantasmic takes away their reason to stay in the park after dinner altogether.

 

[jmvd20]

Many people have been discussing how Fantasmic's absence 5 nights a week won't have a huge impact on the AVERAGE WDW guest. I find this to be an exaggeration. While Fantasmic certainly doesn't leave NOTHING to do in the studios, it also doesn't leave a whole lot. Playhouse Disney, Little Mermaid, Indy, Lights Motors Action, and Beauty and the Beast are all done showing by late afternoon in the off season, as has been said many times. Besides these five shows, what else is there to do at night? Tower of Terror, Great Movie Ride, Toy Story Mania, Rockin Rollercoaster, Star Tours, and Muppets 3D. That's six attractions... So of the studios 11 total major attractions, 5 of them are shows that close in the late afternoon.

Figure in the amount of people who have done those 6 attractions by the evening, and, without Fantasmic, there isn't a huge reason to stay in the studios for dinner or later. Most tourists aren't going to take a second spin on every ride in the park as opposed to a 2-hour nightly spectacular (once you figure in wait times and the actual show, as well as time spent leaving the park). These people will simply leave. They might not leave property and this move might make more money for Disney, but the Studios will DEFINITELY see decreased crowds on nights Fantasmic doesn't show.

Let's say of the 10,000 people in Fantasmic nightly, 5,000 of those people PLAN to see the show either before they enter DHS or sometime by mid-afternoon of their trip. The removal of Fantasmic takes away their reason to stay in the park after dinner altogether.

When you state " The removal of Fantasmic takes away their reason to stay in the park after dinner altogether" I must ask - How much money is WDW really going to squeeze out of them during that additional time. After all they have already paid to enter the park, paid for lunch, paid for dinner, and maybe even bought some souvenirs. So at this point they may buy some popcorn, maybe some pop, possibly even a glow in the dark necklace. Even if they did purchase all of these things does that money make up for the cost to run Fantasmic?

In my post #350 I assumed that every person who would have been at Fantasmic was not staying on property and did not have a park hopper. Even in that extreme circumstance I doubt WDW loses out on much -if anything out all. Now couple that with the fact that many of those people will stay at DHS, or have a park hopper, or be staying on resort and it becomes clear that WDW will not be losing huge amounts of revenue by not running Fantasmic during the off season.

Sure, people can question the execs who make these decisions. However, these people make millions of dollars a year because they make the mouse tens of millions of dollars a year. Of course they have made some rather bad decisions in the past but you do not become ( and sustain) being a multi-billion dollar a year company by consistently making the wrong choices. Due to these items I will stand by my argument that Fantasmic is not nearly the draw, nor the money maker that many seem to think it is.

As a side note, even with the disagreement in this thread I am amazed that it has all been very civil to this point. Guess that is what discussion forums are all about, discussing things... peacefully!

 

[Pumbas Nakasak]

. Of course they have made some rather bad decisions in the past but you do not become ( and sustain) being a multi-billion dollar a year company by consistently making the wrong choices.

So the save Disney era completely passed you by?

 

[dreamscometrue]

The weak dollar continues to drive overseas visitors to WDW as well as Americans who can't afford to go overseas so they continue to book vacations to WDW. ESPN, ABC and many other Disney franchises are doing well and fuel prices and airline tickets have peaked which will create even more visitors.

I appreciate the fact that most WDW visitors are Americans, but you are correct about the difference the dollar makes. Our family makes it a priority to save for our WDW trips, but several other people I know who had been thinking of visiting 'someday' have done so in the past year because of the near parity of the Canadian and U.S. dollars.

Here's a brief example of the difference it makes to us. In 2000, it cost nearly $1.50 CDN to buy $1.00 U.S. When looking at prices for hotels, meals and park passes, I had to add 50%!! In 2003, the exchange rate was about 38% and even last year, our March and August trips still saw an exchange rate of about 20%. Now, with the 2 currencies essentially equal, each family trip is $2000 cheaper than 8 years ago! I assume that the situation must be similar for visitors from the U.K. and other 'overseas' nations.

 

[Pumbas Nakasak]

I believe my lowest was £1 = $1.43 best whatever it is now around £1.93 ish. Thats why long term DVC dues may be a worry:shrug:

Our food bill is normally a £100 a day for the 5 (as was) now a 50c in the pound virtual saving means that I go from $143 a day to £193 or a t shirt per day if the merchandise weren't such tat. Over 14 nights thats a lot of shirts

 

[dreamscometrue]

I believe my lowest was £1 = $1.43 best whatever it is now around £1.93 ish. Thats why long term DVC dues may be a worry:shrug:

Our food bill is normally a £100 a day for the 5 (as was) now a 50c in the pound virtual saving means that I go from $143 a day to £193 or a t shirt per day if the merchandise weren't such tat. Over 14 nights thats a lot of shirts

That certainly is a lot of shirts.

We actually purchased our DVC last year when the exchange rate was awesome. On a large purchase like that, it was several thousand dollars cheaper than early in 2007.

Just as a point of interest, a check of the Statistics Canada website shows 2.5 million visitors to Florida (not the U.S., just Florida) in 2007, up from 2.1 million in 2006. (The relative parity of the dollar was only at the end of the year too!). I know that some people visited more than once, but with only 33 million people in our country, that's a lot of Canadians visiting Florida! Despite high oil prices, Canadians will continue to travel to the U.S. as a consequence of the equal currencies.

 

[Frank&Ollie]

The only proper response to this is to burn something in effigy until they bring me back my fantasmic! :fork:

I would pay admission to just see Fantasmic!

This idea is worse than the movie adaptation of The Country Bear Jamboree!

 

[lynnie5150]

Do you really think that the show reduction will continue after Jan? Each month after you will see more and more shows come back until your back to two shows a night some days during the week in the summer. You probably wont even see a full crown the two nights a week in Jan. With AI coming on and low projections DHS will be a ghost town the first 6 weeks next year. Besides, I am willing to bet that 95% of you that need to complain on this topic everyday won't even go in the first month or two. RELAX and all will be well!!!

 

[Timmay]

You probably wont even see a full crown the two nights a week in Jan.

That's odd...why would that be the case? I have never seen much in the way of empty seats in January when it runs 7 nights a week.:shrug:

Now people are just making things up.

 

[markjohns1]

I am not looking at this as isolated at all. See above. Yes,this is just one piece to the puzzle, but we have several other pieces to work with.

What are those pieces that we know? PI closing? Reduction in character dining? Who knows if those are related at all? Does anyone actually know that projected attendance or resort reservations are down?

I think we have a pretty good idea behind the reasoning. There only to seem to be a very few who think this is something other than a way to cut costs/increase the profit.

Short of being in those meetings where this decision was made, we have no idea of the big picture on this change. We can't see the future plans for the park, the research that went into the decision. It is obvious that cutting the shows down to 2 per week will cut costs, but it is far from a safe assumption that this is the only reason behind this change.

Two words...Magic Kingdom. Oh, wait, one more word...Epcot. Both have nightly entertainment that isn't "needed" to keep people in the parks.

The difference is at both of those parks, all park guests are able to see the nightly entertainment. Only 10,000 can enjoy the Fantasmic show. They can spread that cost amongst all park guests. They also don't have to deal with 10,000 guests standing in a line at MK and Epcot. They are free to move around, shop, see attractions, eat, and buy that popcorn and glow necklaces that are offered at Fantasmic.

And that is a problem...you refuse to beleive anything else. I could find it very easy to believe that the removal of 72% of the Fantasmic shows was not based on financial concerns...if there was evidence that pointed in that direction.

I suppose I have a more positive outlook for WDW and the decisions being made. Obviously if Disney announces that they made these cuts simply to save money I will believe it. But I am seeing evidence that points in the other direction. I haven't seen any of the other upcoming Disney projects put on hold, postponed, or cancelled (DCA upgrade, the AIE, the resort refurbs, DVC resort construction), and I would think those would save a heck of a lot more money than cutting Fantasmic shows by 72% would. We're also seeing compelling rumors about attraction and dining additions to the parks, like the MI coaster, TLM coming to MK, Star Tours 2.0, and a handful of others. Even if half of those rumors come true, that's quite a bit of spending for a company that makes illogical decisions like cutting Fantasmic to cut costs.

How? Show me something that indicates that [this is strategic or vision-related].

Like all of the rest of the speculation in this thread, it's all in the perception of the information at hand. I perceive the latest rumors and announcements to indicate a lot going on at WDW, and not just cuts, but lots of additions as well.

Airlines are cutting flights and jobs left and right. Hospitals are laying of nursing staff at an alarming rate. Is this because these companies have something "vision related" in mind, or is it because they are cutting costs? Disney is no different. Why pretend they are?

Because they are different. The WDC does not solely do business in theme parks. And as jt04 pointed out, they are actually doing quite well. It does help that they've got some monster entertainment franchises right now, with HSM, Pixar, and Hannah Montana. As Bob Iger has pointed out, the WDC is more resilient than other companies during times like these. It's hard to imagine there's not more to this decision than just cutting costs.

And to add to what jmvd20 said, that "...you do not become ( and sustain) being a multi-billion dollar a year company by consistently making the wrong choices." You also do not achieve that by making illogical or off-the-cuff decisions, and especially ones that would only achieve short-term gains.

 

[jt04]

That's odd...why would that be the case? I have never seen much in the way of empty seats in January when it runs 7 nights a week.:shrug:

Now people are just making things up.

I would just add to what markjohns1 said, that DHS is undergoing a major transformation into a completely different park than what MGM was. These are just baby steps in a very long journey. There is a bigger picture IMO involved in all these changes.

 

[princess17]

I agree with the OP. I think its horrible that they are cutting back on one of the best and my favorite show at WDW. I wonder what's coming next. It seems like disney is making quite a few changes all at once.

 

[RiversideBunny]

It could be that DHS just won't be open late on the nights when there is no Fantasmic.
In late 2001 they were closing it early, like 6 or 7 pm, on many nights and on those nights they did not run Fantasmic.

A lot of the discussion on here is based on having the park open at night but no Fanstamic. That may not be the case. The whole park may be closing early.

 

[wdwmagic]

It could be that DHS just won't be open late on the nights when there is no Fantasmic.
In late 2001 they were closing it early, like 6 or 7 pm, on many nights and on those nights they did not run Fantasmic.

A lot of the discussion on here is based on having the park open at night but no Fanstamic. That may not be the case. The whole park may be closing early.

It is closing at 7pm every day in January (with just a couple of days exception), with Fantasmic showing at 6:30pm on it's two days per week.

 

[jmvd20]

So the save Disney era completely passed you by?

I never knew there was any era other than the save Disney era.