epcot changing?

[Daveeeeed]

haven't been to the Chattanooga one since i was a kid so dont really remember it

but i'd say when it comes to aquariums its quality over number of gallons

and it definitely needs a rebuild rather than a renovation as some things just cant be changed with just a renovation you cant modernize the entire structure and change the layout/design

The number of gallons goes a massive way towards the Georgia Explorer tank. It is literally stunning, like you could just spend hours. The GA is easily one of the top 10 aquariums in Earth, and that tank makes it what it is. The Living Seas can be done better with what they have, the main tank could be made to look like a coral reef, like you are really under water. Effects could be made for the lobby's ceiling. It doesn't really need to be torn down, it just needs an overhaul.

 

[Pi on my Cake]

The number of gallons goes a massive way towards the Georgia Explorer tank. It is literally stunning, like you could just spend hours. The GA is easily one of the top 10 aquariums in Earth, and that tank makes it what it is. The Living Seas can be done better with what they have, the main tank could be made to look like a coral reef, like you are really under water. Effects could be made for the lobby's ceiling. It doesn't really need to be torn down, it just needs an overhaul.

I'd expect it to have a Marine Life Institute retheme (Finding Dory). Add some interactive science museum type displays (Most Powerful pair of glasses), get Sigourney Weaver to record some voice over stuff, and give it a fresh coat of paint and you're done. It wouldn't take much and if done right could be very good. And it's an IP implementation that still fully fits with the themes of Epcot.

 

[Daveeeeed]

I'd expect it to have a Marine Life Institute retheme (Finding Dory). Add some interactive science museum type displays (Most Powerful pair of glasses), get Sigourney Weaver to record some voice over stuff, and give it a fresh coat of paint and you're done. It wouldn't take much and if done right could be very good. And it's an IP implementation that still fully fits with the themes of Epcot.

Agreed. 20 million could easily bring The Living Seas to a must-do when at Disney World.

 

[Pi on my Cake]

Agreed. 20 million could easily bring The Living Seas to a must-do when at Disney World.

Honestly, I think part of the problem is that the actual Living Seas is treated by both guests and Disney as just the exit to the Nemo ride. An after thought to Epcots worst attraction. The Living Seas should be treated by Disney as it's own attraction, not an exit. Maybe that will make guests treat I that way too.

 

[marni1971]

Honestly, I think part of the problem is that the actual Living Seas is treated by both guests and Disney as just the exit to the Nemo ride. An after thought to Epcots worst attraction. The Living Seas should be treated by Disney as it's own attraction, not an exit. Maybe that will make guests treat I that way too.

Very good analogy. The Living Seas masterly built up the anticipation and expectation of the arrival at Alpha. Now the ride is treated as the highlight (!) and anything after it a throwaway.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Honestly, I think part of the problem is that the actual Living Seas is treated by both guests and Disney as just the exit to the Nemo ride. An after thought to Epcots worst attraction. The Living Seas should be treated by Disney as it's own attraction, not an exit. Maybe that will make guests treat I that way too.

Goodness, if people really feel that the Living Seas aquarium is an exit and the Nemo Ride is the attraction they have got to be a special kind of stupid or they enjoy the shortest attraction in the history of theme parks.

Aquariums have had the residue affect due to the negativity of Sea World. Those of us that feel that the life of a sea animal is so awful really haven't thought out what life is like for one of them in the wild. That is until they become some other sea animals dinner or worst yet get caught up in the nets of fishermen bringing back tonight's seafood special at their local restaurant. Because of that they have had to tone down the special shows, etc. because someone is going to get upset about how we have these poor animals as entertainment. It still is fun to watch the fish swim, but, I don't care what place you are in... one can only do that so long before you suddenly realize that you have seen that already.

 

[No Name]

The poll at the top of this thread... gosh. That's probably the most vague and hard-to-answer poll I've ever seen. Of course I'd want change, as everyone here should. But I'd want good change.

Honestly, I think part of the problem is that the actual Living Seas is treated by both guests and Disney as just the exit to the Nemo ride. An after thought to Epcots worst attraction. The Living Seas should be treated by Disney as it's own attraction, not an exit. Maybe that will make guests treat I that way too.

Not sure how I'd rank the Nemo ride among the others in the park (I don't know that I'd say it's the worst) but I think it's far better than what it replaced. The Nemo ride tells a story. The previous ride would tell what's on floor two. Also @Goofyernmost , it's far from the shortest ride, perhaps you were joking?

But I'd never thought about the downside that you point out, and I agree. Though while that may be the biggest factor, I'm sure it isn't the only responsible for this change in guest behavior. The kid-to-adult ratio is higher than it was back when the park opened, people may have shorter attention spans, people (including me) have negative views of aquariums, etc.

And finally, on the "should be treated by Disney as it's own attraction" part, I don't see what Disney can do. What do you suggest?

 

[Pi on my Cake]

The poll at the top of this thread... gosh. That's probably the most vague and hard-to-answer poll I've ever seen. Of course I'd want change, as all should. But I'd want good change.



Not sure how I'd rank the Nemo ride among the others in the park (I don't know that I'd say it's the worst) but I think it's far better than what it replaced. The Nemo ride tells a story. The previous ride would tell what's on floor two. Also @Goofyernmost , it's far from the shortest ride, perhaps you were joking?

But I never thought about the downside that you point out, and I agree. Though while that may be the biggest factor, I'm sure it isn't the only responsible for this change in guest behavior. The kid-to-adult ratio is higher than it was back when the park opened, people may have shorter attention spans, people (including me) have negative views of aquariums, etc.

And finally, on the "should be treated by Disney as it's own attraction" part, I don't see what Disney can do. What do you suggest?

I actually agree that Nemo is better than what was there imo. I still think it's the weakest current ride at Epcot (though mission space may take that prize just because of how sick it makes me and so many others lol).

One think Disney could do is list the aquarium part as an attraction on maps. Currently it just gets a blurb in the description for the Nemo ride. Turtle Talk is listed seperately, but one of the largest aquariums in Florida just gets a brief mention in the blurb for an ok ride.

Also, maybe expand thecurrent exit so there is an actual aquarium entrance. Now you either have to ride nemo or enter through what is very obviously intended to be an exit tucked behind a well with no signs.

So, expanded entrance, a sign, and a listing on the maps would be my steps to make the aquarium it's own thing.

Also, as I mentioned earlier, use the MLI from Finding Dory as a way to breath some new life/energy into the pavilion without messing up the current nemo stuff.

 

[Goofyernmost]

The poll at the top of this thread... gosh. That's probably the most vague and hard-to-answer poll I've ever seen. Of course I'd want change, as everyone here should. But I'd want good change.



Not sure how I'd rank the Nemo ride among the others in the park (I don't know that I'd say it's the worst) but I think it's far better than what it replaced. The Nemo ride tells a story. The previous ride would tell what's on floor two. Also @Goofyernmost , it's far from the shortest ride, perhaps you were joking?

But I'd never thought about the downside that you point out, and I agree. Though while that may be the biggest factor, I'm sure it isn't the only responsible for this change in guest behavior. The kid-to-adult ratio is higher than it was back when the park opened, people may have shorter attention spans, people (including me) have negative views of aquariums, etc.

And finally, on the "should be treated by Disney as it's own attraction" part, I don't see what Disney can do. What do you suggest?

Are we talking about the same thing. If you are talking about the shell ride that goes through the middle of the aquarium and has those occasional projections of Nemo and friends, then no I'm not kidding. Can you name one that is shorter because I surely cannot think of any. Lucky if it goes 100 yards. That ride was there when the ride first opened but it was just a glass ride that was truly in the middle of the aquarium, with all kinds of fish swimming overhead. At least that was real, plus it had the Hydolators which were fake but fun and a film about the ocean. I'd say, from experience the kid/adult ratio is about the same. Everything was new when it first opened and, at the time, was the largest aquarium in the world, but, it hasn't shrunk, it's still the same size but, without Nemo, it hasn't much entertainment value. Kids love aquariums with or without Nemo.

 

[No Name]

Are we talking about the same thing. If you are talking about the shell ride that goes through the middle of the aquarium and has those occasional projections of Nemo and friends, then no I'm not kidding. Can you name one that is shorter because I surely cannot think of any. Lucky if it goes 100 yards. That ride was there when the ride first opened but it was just a glass ride that was truly in the middle of the aquarium, with all kinds of fish swimming overhead. At least that was real, plus it had the Hydolators which were fake but fun and a film about the ocean. I'd say, from experience the kid/adult ratio is about the same. Everything was new when it first opened and, at the time, was the largest aquarium in the world, but, it hasn't shrunk, it's still the same size but, without Nemo, it hasn't much entertainment value. Kids love aquariums with or without Nemo.

I'm also wondering whether we're talking about the same thing. "Shortest attraction in the history of theme parks," you say?!?! I still think you must be joking!

To give the most indesputable and embarrassing example, the ride that it replaced was shorter. Disney extended the track when they turned it into the Nemo ride, and the ride time has risen. So there's that.

Here's a list of ride times. It's not fully accurate, actually Nemo is at the very least 4:30 long, but it's worth a look: http://www.wdwinfo.com/wdwinfo/ridelength.htm There are many rides and attractions far under even 4 minutes.

As for the kid to adult ratio and the rest of what you said... I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, since you were there as an adult before me. The bigger concern is in your glaringly false statement. I hope we are on the same page... I'm awfully baffled, to be honest.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I'm also wondering whether we're talking about the same thing. "Shortest attraction in the history of theme parks," you say?!?! I still think you must be joking!

To give the most indesputable and embarrassing example, the ride that it replaced was shorter. Disney extended the track when they turned it into the Nemo ride, and the ride time has risen. So there's that.

Here's a list of ride times. It's not fully accurate, actually Nemo is at the very least 4:30 long, but it's worth a look: http://www.wdwinfo.com/wdwinfo/ridelength.htm There are many rides and attractions far under even 4 minutes.

As for the kid to adult ratio and the rest of what you said... I'll give you the benefit of the doubt, since you were there as an adult before me. The bigger concern is in your glaringly false statement. I hope we are on the same page... I'm awfully baffled, to be honest.

Wow, did some relative of yours build that attraction or what. If it is 4 minutes it is still the shortest slow moving dark ride in WDW. If as you say the track was extended, I'll take your word for that, but, I know the aquarium is no bigger so where did they extend it too? It is a dark ride that relies entirely on projections and took away the original intent of it that was to see the underwater world from the perspective of the sea animals. I could sit in a dark room and watch cartoon projections. Lighten up, I don't believe I just insulted your grandmother or anything. It's a damn theme park short, short dark ride that could have been stretched out simply by slowing it up more, but, that would have required extra staff to wake guests up at the end so they could get off.

 

[marni1971]

Wow, did some relative of yours build that attraction or what. If it is 4 minutes it is still the shortest slow moving dark ride in WDW. If as you say the track was extended, I'll take your word for that, but, I know the aquarium is no bigger so where did they extend it too?.

Top of my head, through theatre two and the hydrolators and associated hallways. Where today's load is the track used to turn 90 degrees, go through the back wall that exists today to get to the old load and then turn left right into what is today's EAC tunnel.

 

[jdmdisney99]

When I read they were going to make Epcot "more Disney", I officially declared Epcot dead. All hail to Magic Kingdom 2.0.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Top of my head, through theatre two and the hydrolators and associated hallways. Where today's load is the track used to turn 90 degrees, go through the back wall that exists today to get to the old load and then turn left right into what is today's EAC tunnel.

Didn't know that... but still not impressed. It's still a very short, nothing ride in the dark past projections.

 

[Otterhead]

When I read they were going to make Epcot "more Disney", I officially declared Epcot dead.

That's a weird reaction. I think the point they're making is that the pavilions have drifted off course in various directions over the years. Making it "more Disney" doesn't mean everything (or anything) will be a kiddie ride. There's ways to do IP-themed attractions right and they have the money and edict to do so on a larger scale rather than just a rushed "let's fix Imagination with a quickie IP overlay!". I'm curious to see what's on the way.

 

[jdmdisney99]

That's a weird reaction. I think the point they're making is that the pavilions have drifted off course in various directions over the years. Making it "more Disney" doesn't mean everything (or anything) will be a kiddie ride. There's ways to do IP-themed attractions right and they have the money and edict to do so on a larger scale rather than just a rushed "let's fix Imagination with a quickie IP overlay!". I'm curious to see what's on the way.

The problem isn't what kind of job they can do with Disney characters. I'm sure there will actually be some great attractions out of this. The problem is, Epcot is not the park for characters or IP. What has made Epcot so great is its actual theme: the Earth - its diversity, its unity, and its outlook. It's supposed to be the park of inspiration, of edutainment, of international pride. Here is a place where you could witness cultures from the far reaches of the globe. You could indulge in their foods, listen to their musics, and appreciate their arts and experiences. Here is a place where you could gaze at truly plausible technologies which could alter the face of the Earth. You could test out the home appliances of the future, be stirred by the trajectory of our interpersonal interactions, and encounter the underlying expanse of your imagination. All of it has been brilliant, original entertainment, unaffected by money-driven IP influence. Its goal was to inform and inspire, and it succeeded in encouraging generations of children to go into STEM or international fields. With this announcement, it shows that its new goal is to simply print money. Now, Disney will trade our renewable future and the intriguing cultures of the world for Guardians of the Galaxy and Frozen. That is a serious shame. That is why I presume Epcot dead. From hereafter, it seems that the park will simply morph into another Magic Kingdom, stacked with random franchises under vague labels like "futuristic" and "worldly". So, I wouldn't call it a weird reaction. I'd call it a realistically disappointed one.

 

[marni1971]

Didn't know that... but still not impressed. It's still a very short, nothing ride in the dark past projections.

I'm at work at the mo, so pardon the crudeness and the stolen plan. The pink line is the old load and track, the loop to its right is all new. You won't be surprised to know I've more detailed art at home if you're Interested.

 

[Jon81uk]

View attachment 175894
I'm at work at the mo, so pardon the crudeness and the stolen plan. The pink line is the old load and track, the loop to its right is all new. You won't be surprised to know I've more detailed art at home if you're Interested.

So the EAC tunnel part does pass through the aquarium? I was stood in the aquarium last trip, trying to work out why you don't get to see more of the real fish when on the ride. The parts where Nemo is swimming in the real tank are the best bits of the ride, so I am surprised they didn't make the most of that opportunity.

 

[JohnD]

The poll at the top of this thread... gosh. That's probably the most vague and hard-to-answer poll I've ever seen. Of course I'd want change, as everyone here should. But I'd want good change.

Asking, "Should they change Epcot?" is like a woman asking, "Am I fat?" Your answer will be wrong no matter what. On the one hand, Epcot needs some serious love so change is needed. On the other hand, any change will provoke reactions of steering away from Walt's vision.

 

[OvertheHorizon]

In my mind, the problem isn't adding more Disney IP to Epcot. It is ensuring that the IP serves the story of the pavilion rather than repeat the IP's story. If adding a cartoon character will make parents want to bring their children (i.e. make it more family friendly), then fine. But when Nemo took over The Living Seas all we got was a re-telling of Nemo's story, rather than using the characters from the movie to tell the story of the seas that cover two-thirds of our planet.