MagicHappens1971
Well-Known Member
I just don’t know how you get to decide what “abuse” of the system is. Is kind of my point
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- Thread starter wdwmagic
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MagicHappens1971
Well-Known Member
I don’t see how you can find that conclusion. If you get into the VQ you can go to the attraction and get a DAS return time when your boarding group is called and use the Lightning Lane.
But only once, can’t go back for seconds (or thirds, etc)
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
How about we not blame people with disabilities for Disney’s bad decisions?
Pi on my Cake
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- Yes
Exactly why any reform to stop abuse (which I doubt is as rampant as people are saying, but I do know it's becoming an increasingly common "hack" for locals) shouldn't make it harder to actually get a DAS pass or effect how useful it is as a way for people would can't stand in long lines to avoid long lines. You really can't tell who legitimately needs it and who is faking for a free fastpass (unless you hear them Brag about it on tiktok or in the breakroom). Especially since many of the people who need DAS need it for invisible reasons like chronic pain, incontinence, or mental health problems.
The only clear cut "abuse" is people who lie about not being able to wait in 2 hour lines, but then wait in 2 hour lines while using DAS to virtually wait in a different line at the same time. But there's no practical way to stop that without just punishing all DAS users.
mattpeto
Well-Known Member
I certainly want disabled guests be able to enjoy the parks and skip the lines. There is no question in my mind that on principle, a DAS system is inclusive and makes WDW a welcoming place for all and those are less fortunate than others.
I do think the honor system just simply isn't cutting it. They have make the criteria more challenging for guests to obtain it.
@MagicHappens1971 - what do you propose?
I do think the honor system just simply isn't cutting it. They have make the criteria more challenging for guests to obtain it.
@MagicHappens1971 - what do you propose?
This^
I would maybe make DAS lounges, with seats, refreshments, a tv and bathrooms that would be required waiting rooms for anyone who has checked into a DAS line to wait, and make staying in the room required in order to use your pass. It would be less disruptive than tapping in for everyone.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
What you are describing is called a barrier to access and they are generally illegal.
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
I haven't used Universal's system yet, but it does seem that having a 3rd party verification that requires some semblance of documentation is a good start.
I have an autistic older brother and we will likely be using Universal's new system this year. That being said, if there are additional hurdles for acquiring it but the actual in park usage is similar than my brother will be going to Universal. If we think the system doesn't accommodate his needs, than he won't be going to Universal.
Pi on my Cake
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- Yes
The problem with Universal's system requiring verification is that Healthcare (especially mental health care as well as care for invisible chronic issues in young people especially especially women) is not always readily accessible or willing to believe there is actually an issue. So requiring any kind of proof like that, while technically allowed and sounds good on paper, adds a big barrier for many who do legitimately need the help. There's a reason Universals new system is so controversial
Tha Realest
Well-Known Member
If someone doesn’t appreciate or believe they have an issue, how do they arrive at the conclusion they need DAS?
I don't understand. The system requires showing proof, right? So are you saying they're not believing in the proof shown them. Or, are you saying there are situations where there is no proof and they're not willing to take people's word on it?
mattpeto
Well-Known Member
There is not an easy solution. How do people get parking handicap tags? (Legit question- is it an honor system?)
What do you propose?
Disgruntled Walt
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- No
Is there another thread we can move this discussion to?
SplashJacket
Well-Known Member
Here’s the real issue. Assume these numbers for the sake of discussion:
Average guest rides 5 rides in a day
Average Genie guest rides 8 rides in a day
Average DAS guest rides 9 rides in a day
Do think the system is working?
Ignoring the percentage of DAS guests who are abusing the system (using multiple DAS guest's in the same party, not needing it, etc) this is not the intention of the system.
DAS intends to level the playing field and allow access to guests that would otherwise not experience what they would like/be able to experience.
DAS is not Make a Wish. DAS should not give an advantage beyond what’s achievable by the average guest. Currently, it does.
It’s hard to balance DAS in a proper way, because the people who need it the most, will likely experience the least, so with the current amount of abuse, if the average number of experiences by DAS guests gets closer to the park average guest, like 6, due to the amount of abuse, the figure would be greatly skewed by guests who don’t need DAS, so the ones that do might have an average of 3 attractions.
That said, in theory, if you make it less valuable, there would be less abuse, but once again it’s tricky because it could harm guests that actually need it.
So effectively, you either make it harder to get to decrease abuse, or decrease the value to decrease the incentive for abuse. Both have potential to harm the experience of guests needing the service, so it’s very tricky.
Average guest rides 5 rides in a day
Average Genie guest rides 8 rides in a day
Average DAS guest rides 9 rides in a day
Do think the system is working?
Ignoring the percentage of DAS guests who are abusing the system (using multiple DAS guest's in the same party, not needing it, etc) this is not the intention of the system.
DAS intends to level the playing field and allow access to guests that would otherwise not experience what they would like/be able to experience.
DAS is not Make a Wish. DAS should not give an advantage beyond what’s achievable by the average guest. Currently, it does.
It’s hard to balance DAS in a proper way, because the people who need it the most, will likely experience the least, so with the current amount of abuse, if the average number of experiences by DAS guests gets closer to the park average guest, like 6, due to the amount of abuse, the figure would be greatly skewed by guests who don’t need DAS, so the ones that do might have an average of 3 attractions.
That said, in theory, if you make it less valuable, there would be less abuse, but once again it’s tricky because it could harm guests that actually need it.
So effectively, you either make it harder to get to decrease abuse, or decrease the value to decrease the incentive for abuse. Both have potential to harm the experience of guests needing the service, so it’s very tricky.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
Parking tags are a separate process defined by the laws and regulations. Those requirements intentionally do not extend to places of public accommodation.
I propose building adequate capacity instead of trying to keep attractions per guest per hour as low as possible.
TeriofTerror
Well-Known Member
Sooo...
Encanto? Indiana?
Encanto? Indiana?
MerlinTheGoat
Well-Known Member
Pi on my Cake
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- Yes
The proof needs to be in the form of doctors notes or something similar.
Access to Healthcare is needed to produce doctors notes.
Access to health-care is not a given, especially in this country right now where insurance is largely tied to your place of employment
Even if you have access to Healthcare, mental Healthcare access is a whole other issue
Plus, medical practitioners historically overlook "invisible" chronic issues such as fibromyalgia in younger people. Especially women.
So, requiring proof for a DAS pass sounds good on paper. But in practice makes it much more difficult if not impossible for people who need it.
That being said, I'm just parotting what I've heard from friends who either use DAS or work guest relations about issues they've seen with Universal's system and fears of Disney adopting it. So I'm far from an expert
Of course, this thread has gotten WAY off topic and I definitely take some blame there lol
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
This is why replacing Dinosaur instead of expanding is a bad idea.
www.wdwmagic.com
Nearly all rides at Disney's Hollywood Studios have waits above 2 hours at a very busy Walt Disney World
Nearly all rides at Disney's Hollywood Studios have waits above 2 hours at a very busy Walt Disney World
www.wdwmagic.com