News 'Encanto' and 'Indiana Jones'-themed experiences at Animal Kingdom

tanc

Premium Member
I'm glad they're going to get rid of Dinorama because I always thought it was completely out of place. However, replacing Dinosaur I think is a bit too much. I have only rode Indiana Jones in DisneySea, and while I think it's a cool ride, I personally like Dinosaur more. Dinosaur is a special attraction that should be preserved, and this whole idea of rethemeing every ride is getting old.
 

RoysCabin

Well-Known Member
It's arrogance for sure, but I don't think it's arrogance in the sense that they believe they can produce anything and people will flock to it. Even I don't believe Iger believes that (anymore - I think the SW:GE opening opened his eyes to that.)

I don't think what we're seeing is that belief. I think what we're seeing is the effects of long-term brand erosion and a leader who lacks the creativity to solve for it. Iger is a business man, and by most regards a darn good one at it. But most business men are not a brand builders. That takes a different mindset in understanding how and why a brand resonates, and clear safeguarding of potential decisions that may erode this resonance. From incessant price increases and upcharging in the parks, to the focus on quantity over quantity in content, to his infamous IP mandate stifling the development of new stories, each of these choices have led to brand erosion.

It's arrogance in the sense that the brand can persevere despite this erosion. But it can't and it won't. Just my two cents.
Honestly, I think a lot of it is that we're in an era of "content overload", if that makes sense as a phrase for it.

The IP mandate is bad enough; it holds back interesting or fresh attraction ideas, it makes so much more about the experience feel like a commercial for Disney+ rather than a standalone theme park experience, etc., all the stuff we've been over a million times. But when you'd see that happen in the old days, it was an era with around one animated movie per year, plus maybe a new Pixar film every couple of years. So, if there was a push to integrate them into the parks it wasn't usually overwhelming and it was often done in a "soft launch" kind of way where they could take some time to gauge how popular the film was and how much cultural impact it had before trying to do anything else with it, e.g. having things like parades and stage shows based on various films before going further with them with rides or anything else.

Now? The streaming era means there's something new all the time, and we get the drumbeat how "this deserves a ride in the parks". But this isn't easy to pull off: when you've got all these different studios within a giant media conglomerate producing content for different parts of the audience and making films and episodic series' and more all the time, you're both going to overwhelm your fans at a certain point.

Worse, it also means that it's harder for a given franchise or film to really become a cultural touchstone that a general park-going audience will all want to experience; even films that make a billion dollars today don't always leave that much of a lasting impression in ways we were once accustomed to in the past, so what seems like a hot commodity this year and a surefire bet to be a long-lasting addition to the parks is a cold product that people mostly shrug off by next year.
 

Rich Brownn

Well-Known Member
I thought "Ant Man" and "Indiana Jones" were going to be the big hits that were going to break the spell and get Disney studios back on track to glory. I then was 100% sure that "The Marvels" was the spell breaker. Disney's has such bad luck lately! (I don't understand why...it's not like these movies don't have the Disney logo on them)

There is hope though..."Wish" is looking to be a really good movie and we also have one of Disney's biggest power-house brands, "Snow White" in production now. If "Wish" sill cant break the spell...then the power of "Snow White" will be the sledge hammer that finally breaks this bad luck cycle.

I just wish that Disney fans would get their act together and start supporting Disney more instead of avoiding it. We need to band TOGETHER, go to the theaters and watch these movies and please subscribe to Disney + ASAP.

If we can do that, they wont need to steal so much money from our parks. We need to HELP Disney keep parks money to stay "inside" parks investments. C'mon guys...do it for the parks we love.

Everybody that cancels their Disney + subscription...every time we avoid a Disney movie in the theaters,...we HURT our parks ability to get new stuff. Let's stop doing that. Please?
"Wish" got lambasted by the critics, unfortunately, which may convince more people to wait for streaming
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
Ok...ok...sarcasm on pause for this one post. Sincerity switch = "on"

Lately, I feel that Disney's errogance has broken the guage and is off the charts. They believe their logo is spectacular, noble and bulletproof. Disney believes that they are virtueous and everything they make is extrordinary. If something fails?...it's never "them" that is the issue. Instead, it's their customers fault for not wanting it or liking it. "We" are the problem!

Disney just seems to be socked at their failure. They think soooo highly of themselves that they just can't comprehend why we often dont want what they make. Disney is completely disconnected from it's customer's want's. Here is a simple sentence that sums it all up:

"We are NOT going to make products that our customers want. We are going make products that WE want our customers to want....and if they don't like it?...too bad"

I believe the US parks are in big trouble and I don't see any significant improvements to them for the next 5 years at best. It's time to clear out the rott in the Burbank boardroom and rebuild the Disney logo right now.
I like most of the content has been making. There are exceptions (looking at you, Artemis Fowl, and The Nutcracker and the Four Realms).

Sorry you don't.
 

Cliff

Well-Known Member
Honestly, I think a lot of it is that we're in an era of "content overload", if that makes sense as a phrase for it.

The IP mandate is bad enough; it holds back interesting or fresh attraction ideas, it makes so much more about the experience feel like a commercial for Disney+ rather than a standalone theme park experience, etc., all the stuff we've been over a million times. But when you'd see that happen in the old days, it was an era with around one animated movie per year, plus maybe a new Pixar film every couple of years. So, if there was a push to integrate them into the parks it wasn't usually overwhelming and it was often done in a "soft launch" kind of way where they could take some time to gauge how popular the film was and how much cultural impact it had before trying to do anything else with it, e.g. having things like parades and stage shows based on various films before going further with them with rides or anything else.

Now? The streaming era means there's something new all the time, and we get the drumbeat how "this deserves a ride in the parks". But this isn't easy to pull off: when you've got all these different studios within a giant media conglomerate producing content for different parts of the audience and making films and episodic series' and more all the time, you're both going to overwhelm your fans at a certain point.

Worse, it also means that it's harder for a given franchise or film to really become a cultural touchstone that a general park-going audience will all want to experience; even films that make a billion dollars today don't always leave that much of a lasting impression in ways we were once accustomed to in the past, so what seems like a hot commodity this year and a surefire bet to be a long-lasting addition to the parks is a cold product that people mostly shrug off by next year.

Disney has literally dumped over 15+ billion dollars into Disney + since in inception. Disney + has not profited even 1 penny in that time!!!...nothing but stealing and vacuming money from the parks!

"If" Disney + ever reaches a "break even" year...how many decades will it take to actually PROFIT enough to make that 15+ billion investment back? The answer is quite possibly...never. 15 + billion tossed straight into a black hole.

Imagine if Disney split the money they dumped on Disney + and put 7.5 billion into Disneyland and 7.5 billion into WDW? At least that 15 billion would be RETURNING money back on that investment.

And now we are stuck with a ton of repeating "what if" Blue Sky dreaming ideas for WDW that can't seem to even get any finance green light to move forward.
 
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celluloid

Well-Known Member
People already think AK is too light on non exhibit attractions for their day.

If you truly think all of these plans are going to happen anytime soon, imagine Its Tough to Be a Bug and this change of Dinosaur starting with the entire are blocked off.

Downright sucky.
 

Squishy

Well-Known Member
How to keep Disney fans hyped by only paying a concept artist 101:
1. Showcase bluesky plan that will never happen, wait 1 year.
2. Showcase another bluesky plan closer to the Disney budget, wait few months.
3. Say previous bluesky plan has adjustments made to it, wait 1 year.
...
Possible step four, showcase the adjustment concept, say its still being imagined for final touches
Possible step five, quit or switch positions and leave it for the next guy to figure out
 

TheMaxRebo

Well-Known Member
"Wish" got lambasted by the critics, unfortunately, which may convince more people to wait for streaming

we shall see - if it does bomb then that is a huge issue for Disney as they really were marketing this one and putting a lot of stock in it (using it in shows already, having the main character do M&Gs, building it as the film for the 100th)

I will add Mario got really bad critics reviews too (was also "rotten" on RT) - so doesn't mean Wish will fail

I saw Wish this past weekend and thought it was rather good - good music, straight forward plot with clear good vs evil - plus a ton of nostalgia/easter eggs. Is it the best Disney animated movie ever? Definitely not, but worth seeing and with the holiday weekend coming up (and some iffy weather. at least in the North East) I can see it doing pretty well
 

Epcot82Guy

Well-Known Member
we shall see - if it does bomb then that is a huge issue for Disney as they really were marketing this one and putting a lot of stock in it (using it in shows already, having the main character do M&Gs, building it as the film for the 100th)

I will add Mario got really bad critics reviews too (was also "rotten" on RT) - so doesn't mean Wish will fail

I saw Wish this past weekend and thought it was rather good - good music, straight forward plot with clear good vs evil - plus a ton of nostalgia/easter eggs. Is it the best Disney animated movie ever? Definitely not, but worth seeing and with the holiday weekend coming up (and some iffy weather. at least in the North East) I can see it doing pretty well

Most reviews I have seen would be better classified as "panned" vs. "lambasted". And, that lines up to most GP people who have seen it from what I'm seeing. It's "fine", kind of "nice", "good music", etc. I'm just not sure a milk toast Disney film is going to be the savior. I think your Mario comparison is a fair one. But, Mario had a TON of fan hype going in. And, it was 100% fan service - something it delivered on in spades. I'm not sure Wish has that momentum behind it. They will likely be able to spin it given the 6 day (??!??!?) holiday weekend. But, that will only last this coming weekend.

It seems to be Journey of Water, not Cosmic Rewind - when Disney really needs a Flight of Passage for the 100 flagship animation release.

It will be interesting to see where it stands on Monday.
 

HauntedPirate

Park nostalgist
Premium Member
Most reviews I have seen would be better classified as "panned" vs. "lambasted". And, that lines up to most GP people who have seen it from what I'm seeing. It's "fine", kind of "nice", "good music", etc. I'm just not sure a milk toast Disney film is going to be the savior. I think your Mario comparison is a fair one. But, Mario had a TON of fan hype going in. And, it was 100% fan service - something it delivered on in spades. I'm not sure Wish has that momentum behind it. They will likely be able to spin it given the 6 day (??!??!?) holiday weekend. But, that will only last this coming weekend.

It seems to be Journey of Water, not Cosmic Rewind - when Disney really needs a Flight of Passage for the 100 flagship animation release.

It will be interesting to see where it stands on Monday.

"But... but... there's Easter eggs!! We're so clever!!!"
 

TheMaxRebo

Well-Known Member
Most reviews I have seen would be better classified as "panned" vs. "lambasted". And, that lines up to most GP people who have seen it from what I'm seeing. It's "fine", kind of "nice", "good music", etc. I'm just not sure a milk toast Disney film is going to be the savior. I think your Mario comparison is a fair one. But, Mario had a TON of fan hype going in. And, it was 100% fan service - something it delivered on in spades. I'm not sure Wish has that momentum behind it. They will likely be able to spin it given the 6 day (??!??!?) holiday weekend. But, that will only last this coming weekend.

It seems to be Journey of Water, not Cosmic Rewind - when Disney really needs a Flight of Passage for the 100 flagship animation release.

It will be interesting to see where it stands on Monday.

It definitely felt "safe" vs something that was a bigger swing/pushing boundaries

I think it will do "fine" - definitely not bombing like other recent films, but also not Mario levels or anything
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
It definitely felt "safe" vs something that was a bigger swing/pushing boundaries

I think it will do "fine" - definitely not bombing like other recent films, but also not Mario levels or anything
“Safe” seems like what many around here keep calling for. “Pushing boundaries” (imagined) is what many are blaming for poor box office returns.

So Wish should be a huge success, right?
 

_caleb

Well-Known Member
Disney has literally dumped over 15+ billion dollars into Disney + since in inception. Disney + has not profited even 1 penny in that time!!!...nothing but stealing and vacuming money from the parks!
How much should it cost to pivot your entire business to a new/emerging model? How long should it take to get to profitability? The parks were originally funded by the studios.
"If" Disney + ever reaches a "break even" year...how many decades will it take to actually PROFIT enough to make that 15+ billion investment back? The answer is quite possibly...never. 15 + billion tossed straight into a black hole.
Disney+ has generated billions in revenue. They're building the business. It takes money to spend money, and Disney never intended for D+ to make any money until well into next year.
 

denyuntilcaught

Well-Known Member
Honestly, I think a lot of it is that we're in an era of "content overload", if that makes sense as a phrase for it.
Completely agree. I think what you're also touching on - the shift from what was once deemed "entertainment" is not just "content" strips it of any value and inherent emotion. It's the commodification of storytelling.

Something something about late stage capitalism.
 

TheMaxRebo

Well-Known Member
“Safe” seems like what many around here keep calling for. “Pushing boundaries” (imagined) is what many are blaming for poor box office returns.

So Wish should be a huge success, right?

I think it should be better than some recent offerings but not Mario levels .... But we shall see
 

Rich Brownn

Well-Known Member
we shall see - if it does bomb then that is a huge issue for Disney as they really were marketing this one and putting a lot of stock in it (using it in shows already, having the main character do M&Gs, building it as the film for the 100th)

I will add Mario got really bad critics reviews too (was also "rotten" on RT) - so doesn't mean Wish will fail

I saw Wish this past weekend and thought it was rather good - good music, straight forward plot with clear good vs evil - plus a ton of nostalgia/easter eggs. Is it the best Disney animated movie ever? Definitely not, but worth seeing and with the holiday weekend coming up (and some iffy weather. at least in the North East) I can see it doing pretty well
Yes, but Marion wasn't going to Disney+ . There are already plenty of people posting saying they will wait for D+.
 

Cliff

Well-Known Member
How much should it cost to pivot your entire business to a new/emerging model? How long should it take to get to profitability? The parks were originally funded by the studios.

Disney+ has generated billions in revenue. They're building the business. It takes money to spend money, and Disney never intended for D+ to make any money until well into next year.
Even if Disney + finds some way to break even next year and begin to actually profit it's FIRST penny.....it will be a VERY long time for it to generate 15+ billion in actual profit. (minus whatever it has brought in...but we know it's losing 100's of million per quarter, every quarter) Maybe in 25 years, it will have profited enough get that investment back.

So what is the "real" year that Disney will get it's 15+ billion back? 2034...2044?

My prediction - Disney+ is thrown away and Disney content get's all placed into a menu tab in HULU and Disney + subscribers get rolled into HULU. (and creative tax write off's go into action)

I dunno,....just a prediction. We will find out next year.
 
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