EMH wristbands to be discontinued September 7th

[JonnyK]

I dont like the sound of this Idea.

The wristbands are better than having to show your resort id, (this is like a serious problem for those who have to keep showing it and could loose the card)

Lets hope they will reconsider this idea and keep the wristbands, maybe some other disney castmembers/employees would see this thread and would agree with us not to discontinue them.

Oh Well.

Doesnt hurt to try the new method.

 

[devoy1701]

If they're checking IDs at the tail end of the line, it's no big deal. Say there's 200 people ahead of you at the tail end of the line, before you get into the official queue. Those same 200 people would've still been in front of you INSIDE the official queue. If it takes a long amount of time to shift those 200 people in front of you from the EMH checkpoint to the "official queue," then there will be less of a wait inside the official queue.

In other words, it all balances out time-wise. The only exception would be if dillholes get to the checkpoint and then not have their IDs.

agreed. whether you're waiting just outside of the queue or in the queue, your wait will be the same. It's not as if the queue will magically grow while you're waiting for your ID to be checked. Ain't nobody gonna be gettin by you while you're impatiently waiting in line!

I guarantee guests who don't have their IDs out will be commonplace.

Also, any kind of bottlenecks increase the possibility that empty or partially filled rides/cars/etc. will be launched. This reduces the actual HRC, which does increase wait times. Basically if the queue is long, a bottleneck at the entrance will not do anything to wait times. If the queue is short or empty, the wait time will likely be increased for any guests held up at the entrance.

Thank you for inserting your HRC comments into every thread you comment on.

It'll only take an attraction or two for those ppl who HAVEN'T realized already that they'll need to have their KTTW out to enter an attraction. Most people will probably have read it before hand or seen sinage around the parks or heard a CM mention it. Fortunately, most people are smarter than you give them credit for.

 

[markjohns1]

Thank you for inserting your HRC comments into every thread you comment on.

It'll only take an attraction or two for those ppl who HAVEN'T realized already that they'll need to have their KTTW out to enter an attraction. Most people will probably have read it before hand or seen sinage around the parks or heard a CM mention it. Fortunately, most people are smarter than you give them credit for.

If it is relevant, it gets brought up. HRC being one of the two key components of wait time, it seems OK to bring it up in a discussion about wait times. The problem with guests backing up and the queue entrance is not just about wait times, either. Some areas are not very conducive to a large backup of guests and can cause general traffic flow problems. If you have a line of 50, 100, or more people backup up at the entrance to attractions in Fantasyland, for example, it will become difficult for guests to pass through. It's all about perception too. If the walkways are clogged with guests, it will seem that EMH is busier and may cause more complaints.

People who do not have their KTTW cards out really has nothing to do with the intelligence of people. As a CM, you are aware that you need to check IDs and expect guests to have them out because that is your job. As a guest, there may be 500 other things on your mind, and I doubt every guest will walk around thinking "I've got to have my room key out." Some will remember, some will not.

There will also inevitably be variance with how IDs are checked too. You will still have CMs who do not check at all. You will have some CMs who will allow a group who are together to go based on one or a couple room keys (which I think will be most common). You will also have CMs who check every single guest for a valid card. Now tell me, if you were a guest and you just went on an attraction without being checked, are you going to be ready with your KTTW card in hand at the next attraction you go to?

But really, the primary issue is this makes EMH more difficult for CMs, and really doesn't solve any of the EMH abuse issues.

 

[dreamfinder]

If they're checking IDs at the tail end of the line, it's no big deal. Say there's 200 people ahead of you at the tail end of the line, before you get into the official queue. Those same 200 people would've still been in front of you INSIDE the official queue. If it takes a long amount of time to shift those 200 people in front of you from the EMH checkpoint to the "official queue," then there will be less of a wait inside the official queue.

In other words, it all balances out time-wise. The only exception would be if dillholes get to the checkpoint and then not have their IDs.

Not necessarily. You are assuming that the CM can verify the KTTW for every person just as fast as if they were looking just for the wrist band. If a mythical Disney ride can handle 20 guests per minute, but the CM can only check in 10 per minute, your will suddenly have a line. And yes, this line will indeed be longer than before. It doesn't matter than the ride queue and the ride system themselves won't be affected if you cannot get into the queue itself. Think about it. If there are 100 people ahead of you, during normal hours you would get onto the ride in about 5 minutes. But, if our friendly CM can only check 10 KTTW/minute, then you have a 10 minute wait. Yes, once you get into the queue you should have no wait as the ride will have been dispatching empty vehicles, but you still have a longer wait.

Quoting the WDWMagic estimates for capacity on Space Mountain, Capacity: 900-1200 per hour; 2057-2500 if both sides open. Using the low end number for 1 track of 900 guests, it means that a single CM needs to check 15 KTTW per minute, or one every 4 seconds. I have been at EMH where the ride was full, and also others where there was practically no line. So this could be an issue.
Assuming the reports from CM's that they use 15-20 CM's to pass out wristbands, splitting those 15 CM's throughout the 14 attractions currently listed as being open during evening EMH's at MK would only give 1 CM per attraction to check KTTW, possibly forcing the 4 sec per guest check.

Now yes, if the ride isn't full, or the rides with less capacity it's not nearly as much of an issue - I.E. Dumbo should have more than enough time to check the KTTW for the next load cycle, but the people eaters definitely have the possibility to create bottlenecks at the ID check station.

It'll only take an attraction or two for those ppl who HAVEN'T realized already that they'll need to have their KTTW out to enter an attraction. Most people will probably have read it before hand or seen sinage around the parks or heard a CM mention it. Fortunately, most people are smarter than you give them credit for.

I wish people were smarter than we can give them credit for. But just look at the CS lines. How many times have you been stuck behind a guest at the register who still hasn't decided what they want? One would assume that after the first few times they would figure out they need to decide first, but that is apparently not the case.

 

[MousDad]

Kevin Yee touches on the wristbands in his new article: http://miceage.micechat.com/kevinyee/ky082608c.htm

He takes what I think is an interesting perspective. He views it as a positive for non-resort guests. In other words, he confirms (from his perspective) what I've been trying to get at in my posts in this thread - that is, Disney wants non-resort guests to stay in the parks during EMH.

Here's a quote from the article:

[Quote article]And you know what? I'm not against this move. It is good Guest service, after all, if you can get an extended visit to a Disney park even without staying at their hotels. True, you can't get onto the rides. But you can soak up the atmosphere, walk around to revel in the ambiance, and immerse yourself in the theming. And trust me, those are HUGE benefits to all travelers. Plus the parks are quite magical in the evening hours. And speaking just for myself, I'd rather like the idea of putting off my shopping until the late evening, so I wouldn't have to carry around the bags all day. Sounds like a win-win to me. I'd still rather they just kept all four parks open late anyway, but this is better than nothing.[endQuote]

If this is true, I have to admit it totally changes my perception of Extra Magic Hours. I've always in my mind viewed them as exclusive for resort guests. Now my thinking is becoming that they are extended hours for everybody.

I can definitely see it being enjoyable my next time at MK to save my shopping, strolling, eating, relaxing, etc. for the later hours while you resort guests fight over key cards at the attraction queues.

 

[DisneyJoe]

And speaking just for myself, I'd rather like the idea of putting off my shopping until the late evening, so I wouldn't have to carry around the bags all day.

Kevin, Kevin, Kevin.....I guess you never heard about sending packages to the front of the park so you don't have to carry around your packages all day???

http://disneyworld.disney.go.com/wd...etail?id=GuestServicesPackagePickUpDetailPage

 

[KingStefan]

Not necessarily. You are assuming that the CM can verify the KTTW for every person just as fast as if they were looking just for the wrist band. If a mythical Disney ride can handle 20 guests per minute, but the CM can only check in 10 per minute, your will suddenly have a line. And yes, this line will indeed be longer than before. It doesn't matter than the ride queue and the ride system themselves won't be affected if you cannot get into the queue itself. Think about it. If there are 100 people ahead of you, during normal hours you would get onto the ride in about 5 minutes. But, if our friendly CM can only check 10 KTTW/minute, then you have a 10 minute wait. Yes, once you get into the queue you should have no wait as the ride will have been dispatching empty vehicles, but you still have a longer wait.

Quoting the WDWMagic estimates for capacity on Space Mountain, Capacity: 900-1200 per hour; 2057-2500 if both sides open. Using the low end number for 1 track of 900 guests, it means that a single CM needs to check 15 KTTW per minute, or one every 4 seconds. I have been at EMH where the ride was full, and also others where there was practically no line. So this could be an issue.
Assuming the reports from CM's that they use 15-20 CM's to pass out wristbands, splitting those 15 CM's throughout the 14 attractions currently listed as being open during evening EMH's at MK would only give 1 CM per attraction to check KTTW, possibly forcing the 4 sec per guest check.

Now yes, if the ride isn't full, or the rides with less capacity it's not nearly as much of an issue - I.E. Dumbo should have more than enough time to check the KTTW for the next load cycle, but the people eaters definitely have the possibility to create bottlenecks at the ID check station.



I wish people were smarter than we can give them credit for. But just look at the CS lines. How many times have you been stuck behind a guest at the register who still hasn't decided what they want? One would assume that after the first few times they would figure out they need to decide first, but that is apparently not the case.

I agree with most of your argument here.

However, I don't think that they intend to deploy the 15-20 CMs currently handing out wristbands to the 14 open attractions. Those attractions already have greeters. Those 15-20 CMs will simply not get the extra time, in most cases (see exception below).

Furthermore, for rides like Dumbo, where only one greeter needs to be employed, then there is no problem using the existing greeter. For people eaters, where a possible <4 sec/guest is required, you simply put 2 or 3 greeters in parallel to achieve the desired checking speed.

Now, whether it is done that way or not remains to be seen. I hope somebody is thinking about this simple queuing theory problem, but who knows?

 

[Dwarful]

If this is true, I have to admit it totally changes my perception of Extra Magic Hours. I've always in my mind viewed them as exclusive for resort guests. Now my thinking is becoming that they are extended hours for everybody.

I can definitely see it being enjoyable my next time at MK to save my shopping, strolling, eating, relaxing, etc. for the later hours while you resort guests fight over key cards at the attraction queues. [/QUOTE]

I can also see this pushing people from onsite esp. the Values. If the perceived added bonus of EMH suddenly becomes available to everyone..then why pay twice as much when you could stay in a nicer hotel off property. Let's face it, with a common discount you could get a better room for half the price. Sure you won't be staying in "Andy's room"...but if you only use the room to shower and sleep what does it matter? I only use this as an example because you typically see on posts that most (including myself on numerous trips) people who stay at the values tend to spend more time in the parks..less time at the resort itself.

 

[KingStefan]

I can also see this pushing people from onsite esp. the Values. If the perceived added bonus of EMH suddenly becomes available to everyone..then why pay twice as much when you could stay in a nicer hotel off property. Let's face it, with a common discount you could get a better room for half the price. Sure you won't be staying in "Andy's room"...but if you only use the room to shower and sleep what does it matter? I only use this as an example because you typically see on posts that most (including myself on numerous trips) people who stay at the values tend to spend more time in the parks..less time at the resort itself.

The thing is, though, the vast majority of people want to be in the parks for the attractions. So even if they are allowed to stay in the parks, most will get bored after a while and leave. Many of the shops and eateries in the Lands are closed during EMH as well.

The next time I stay off-site, will I take advantage of this if it fits my plans? Of course! I'll leave my shopping and eating until after the park closes. Will I stay there three hours? Probably not.

Also keep in mind that you cannot ENTER the parks after closing unless you have a current KTTW card. (What are the parameters, I wonder? Can you enter just a few minutes before closing, etc.?)

And sometimes in the past, non-resort guests have not been allowed to cross INTO the Lands after closing (although they were not asked to leave the Lands if they were already there). I understand that they don't do this anymore, but they could if they wanted to.

So there is still a great value to EMH, even with non-resort guests allowed to stay in the parks.

I'd also like to point out that this is NOT a new policy. Non-resort guests have always been allowed to stay in the parks after closing during EMH. It's just not a well-known policy, and most stay up on Main Street.

Plus, there's still morning EMH to consider, which does not have these problems.

 

[jt04]

The thing is, though, the vast majority of people want to be in the parks for the attractions. So even if they are allowed to stay in the parks, most will get bored after a while and leave. Many of the shops and eateries in the Lands are closed during EMH as well.

The next time I stay off-site, will I take advantage of this if it fits my plans? Of course! I'll leave my shopping and eating until after the park closes. Will I stay there three hours? Probably not.

Also keep in mind that you cannot ENTER the parks after closing unless you have a current KTTW card. (What are the parameters, I wonder? Can you enter just a few minutes before closing, etc.?)

And sometimes in the past, non-resort guests have not been allowed to cross INTO the Lands after closing (although they were not asked to leave the Lands if they were already there). I understand that they don't do this anymore, but they could if they wanted to.

So there is still a great value to EMH, even with non-resort guests allowed to stay in the parks.

I'd also like to point out that this is NOT a new policy. Non-resort guests have always been allowed to stay in the parks after closing during EMH. It's just not a well-known policy, and most stay up on Main Street.

Plus, there's still morning EMH to consider, which does not have these problems.

I'd love it if every park offered EMH every morning. As you said that would solve the problem of guests having to show their cards at every attraction and non guests causing problems PLUS that would leave evenings open for more seperate ticket special events.

 

[surfsupdon]

I avoid EMH like the plague, especially at MK.

For some reason, it has always worked out for us at Animal Kingdom. Virtually zero minutes in line at Dinosaur and Everest, and Primevil Whirl!

 

[RedFoxRunner]

Last week during my trip an EMH Epcot night they did not give out wristbands to us, we just had to show our resort cards at each ride. I personally thought it was a nuisance.

The slow EMH nights I can see getting off and on rides over and over and having to show your ID card each time. :shrug:

 

[Dwarful]

Well we were there this summer July/August. Early EMH's were good, although MGM was a stampede to TSM. Evening EMH's were a not that much value. Even at 2 AM MK was still busy with lots of people, 30+min. lines at the big attractions (3 mountains, PPan, Pooh, etc).

 

[WDWBlaze]

I am a person that likes have a credit card connected to my room and KTTK card. I am not comfortable with basically taking my "credit card" out over and over. Too much of a chance to lose them. Seeing that KTTK cards get lost already I can see this being an big issues if someone charges items to the room before it is noticed it is going. The more you take the it out the better chance you have of losing it.

 

[MousDad]

Last week during my trip an EMH Epcot night they did not give out wristbands to us, we just had to show our resort cards at each ride. I personally thought it was a nuisance.

The slow EMH nights I can see getting off and on rides over and over and having to show your ID card each time. :shrug:

How was that handled at the attraction entrance? Did it seem to slow things up or bottleneck at all?

 

[jt04]

I am a person that likes have a credit card connected to my room and KTTK card. I am not comfortable with basically taking my "credit card" out over and over. Too much of a chance to lose them. Seeing that KTTK cards get lost already I can see this being an big issues if someone charges items to the room before it is noticed it is going. The more you take the it out the better chance you have of losing it.

Again if EMH were during the morning only people would only need to take their resort ID's out to get in. Think of all the benefits to guests and Disney that getting rid of evening EMH would bring. Seems like a no brainer to me.

 

[MousDad]

Again if EMH were during the morning only people would only need to take their resort ID's out to get in. Think of all the benefits to guests and Disney that getting rid of evening EMH would bring. Seems like a no brainer to me.

Yea, but is people having to get up at 6:00 AM every morning of their vacation to enjoy a perk really all that marketable?

 

[VillanovaBlue]

I am a person that likes have a credit card connected to my room and KTTK card. I am not comfortable with basically taking my "credit card" out over and over. Too much of a chance to lose them. Seeing that KTTK cards get lost already I can see this being an big issues if someone charges items to the room before it is noticed it is going. The more you take the it out the better chance you have of losing it.

Ain't that the truth...

 

[DisneyJoe]

Yea, but is people having to get up at 6:00 AM every morning of their vacation to enjoy a perk really all that marketable?

Before 2001, they ONLY had Extra Morning Hours, and they also had E-Ride nights.

It was great, and marketed very well.

We loved it....

 

[FigmentFreak]

I always thought they should give out wrist bands at the hotels. When you check in you get wristbands for each member of the party for each day. With different colored bands and dates printed on each band. You'd spend a little more on bands, but eliminate the need for "extra/pulled from other area" CMs handing them out at the parks (of course you'll always have people who forget theirs, but you could easily have them available at the shops in the parks for those people to get them. But that's just me thinking out loud (or in type as the case may be).

As for all the people worried about losing their KTTW, we just got back from "the darkside" aka-Universal and for FOTL you have to have your room keys. I got each of us a lanyard with a clear front, we slid our keys in it was no problem showing it for access and in 11 days none of us lost our cards.