Eddie Sotto's take on the current state of the parks (Part II)

ChrisFL

Premium Member
As you all know, EPCOT will be hitting 30, and so do any of YOU have great EPCOT stories or memories about your early or first visit? What made it feel different? Did you immediately compare it to the MK? What stood out? Did it meet up with your expectations? or a let down? Does it feel the same to you now?

I have a bit of a unique view of EPCOT Center as I was 4 years old when it first opened, and my father was working in the main computer area which could be seen in the Astuter Computer Revue/Backstage Magic show.

I was an EPCOT Center kid not a Magic Kingdom kid...EPCOT Center was practically my second home. It really influenced my childhood and I loved all of the futuristic things, especially Horizons. Growing up with that kind of optimism was really nice and helped me to study more science and technology than I might have otherwise.

I wish that more of that was still present in today's Epcot, but maybe things will improve.
 

Eddie Sotto

Premium Member
That's a great story. I was a DL kid and the lands (NOS, Mark Twain, Steam Trains) drove me to study history and transportation. If they only knew how these places affected us. Did WS inspire you to travel? I was always excited by the France film.
 

paulsboy

New Member
I was born in 1970, and we took a family trip to Florida every year on spring break. Every other year we would take a day and visit the Magic Kingdom. It was the greatest place in the world to me. I had never seen anything like it. As our family grew older, the spring break trips were tougher for us all to go on. We made one last family trip in December of 1989, and we went to EPCOT instead, since that was the first time we had been to Disney World since EPCOT had opened. I must admit, we didn't know what to expect, and we were a little disappointed. We just didn't know what to expect going in. The place was enormous, there seemed to be very few rides, and there were no characters anywhere. Going into innoventions seemed like going to school! Now, it's my favorite park. I still have those nostalgic memories of the Magic Kingdom, but if I only had one day in one park, it's EPCOT for me. Strolling through World Showcase after dark is as good as it gets for me. It's beautiful.
 

ChrisFL

Premium Member
That's a great story. I was a DL kid and the lands (NOS, Mark Twain, Steam Trains) drove me to study history and transportation. If they only knew how these places affected us. Did WS inspire you to travel? I was always excited by the France film.

Not so much early on, but definitely later in life it did. I also have to give mention to the American Adventure which is still a completely brilliant show and never gets old for me. It is really nice to have as a hint of history that people can learn more about on their own. Its only 30 minutes long, but covers things so well.

I still think of World Showcase as more catering to adults, despite the (quite good IMO) efforts that Disney has made it to be more appealing to kids
 

The MaD Hatter

Well-Known Member
It was 1990 and I was 10 years old the first time I can remember going to WDW (I was around 2 on my previous trip). Despite having 3 children ages 10 and under at the time, my mom decided to go to EPCOT Center on our first day, not MK or MGM. Remember, Epcot's reputation as an adult park was even stronger back then.

I remember being in awe the first time I saw Spaceship Earth (I'm still in awe every time I see it now) and recalling the television commercials from the 80s with Mickey standing on top of it. Once we got into the park, I remember being scared at first to enter Spaceship Earth thinking it was going to be similar to what I had read about Space Mountain (I hated coasters when I was younger). It immediately became my favorite attraction of all time, which still holds true to this day.

After Spaceship Earth, we proceeded to The Living Seas. At that moment, I decided I wanted to be a marine biologist. Although I did not grow up to join that profession, I remain fascinated with marine biology to this day.

Next we visited The Land. My mom was hesitant to take us in this pavilion because she had read that small children might find it boring. After much begging, she relented and I remember riding Listen to the Land. Although this attraction did not capture my imagination to the same extent as Spaceship Earth or Sea Base Alpha, I did enjoy it, and we always make time to ride Living With the Land every time we visit Epcot now.

After leaving The Land, we finally made it the attraction that I had we had all been waiting for: IMAGINATION! Similar to other "old timers" here, I loved the original Journey Into Imagination ride (although for some reason my mother did not). I also loved the original ImageWorks and would have spent the rest of the day there had my mom not finally dragged us out of there. I don't think we watched Captain EO on this trip, but we may have.

From there, we crossed Future World to ride World of Motion and Horizons, which as everyone knows were fantastically wonderful attractions. I believe my brother chose the desert ending to Horizons on our first trip, although I wanted to chose space.

Next up was Wonders of Life. Being the new pavilion at the time, that place was packed, especially Body Wars. I know we waited at least an hour to get on that ride, and being the first simulator I had ever ridden, I was blown away by the effects. I recall seeing Cranium Command and finding it hilarious, since I had just started watching SNL at the time. Similar to ImageWorks, my mom dragged us out of the pavilion before we had much to explore much else there. I wanted to ride the Wonder Cycles, but there was a long line for them.

We ended up skipping the Universe of Energy that trip, and I'm not sure if I ever did get to ride the pre-Ellen version. If so, it's not standing out in my mind.

As so many others do, we did all of Future World in the morning/afternoon and proceeded in to World Showcase that evening. We always started at Mexico and worked clockwise around the lagoon. I believe this was upon the advice of a guidebook my mom had read that said kids like Mexico and Norway the best because they're the only pavilions with rides. More often than not, I still start at Mexico whenever we visit World Showcase. Despite there only being two rides, I recall enjoying visiting all of the countries very much. Of course, I wanted to spend more time in the stores (especially China and Japan) than my mom would have liked. I also remember, that although I begged and begged to eat at the San Angel Inn, we ended up eating at the American counter service place because my brother was a very picky eating and would only eat a hamburger.

Our day ended, of course, with IllumiNations. I really loved all the lasers they used in that show.

So that's it, a rundown of my first trip to EPCOT, which forever cemented the park as my favorite place on earth. Even though, in my opinion, nearly every change they've made to Epcot since then has been for the worse, it is still my favorite park and likely always will be.
 

Pixiedustmaker

Well-Known Member
That's a great story. I was a DL kid and the lands (NOS, Mark Twain, Steam Trains) drove me to study history and transportation. If they only knew how these places affected us. Did WS inspire you to travel? I was always excited by the France film.

I really like the film in the France pavilion. The instrumental version of the musical score (which includes The Carnival of Animals: The Aquarium), is available online, and I have it on my iPod and everytime I listen to it I think of bicycle races, hot air balloons and the amazing castles in the film.

I also love all the stuff they sell in the French Pavilion gift shop, they used to have famous impressionistic photos stamped on everything. Once, during a solo trip, I was politely asked to vacate a table outside the Patisserie for customers who had food (I had finished mine and was just nursing a drink), so I think they should expand the France pavilion back. Add more "streets" and seating areas as the area can get pretty crowded.

A bit behind of France is the Boardwalk Villas, which look nice but if they had extended France back to this area, and built an authentic looking Parisian street where guests could stay, I think this would have been a better use of the land. Plus, you could walk from your hotel room through the streets to enter Epcot, giving you the feeling that you're staying inside the park.

I honestly don't get why they didn't extended any of worldshowcase backwards so that it connected with an appropriately themed hotel, instead we get these weird "boardwalk" and Vegas themed hotels like the Swan & Dolphin.
 

HMF

Well-Known Member
As you all know, EPCOT will be hitting 30, and so do any of YOU have great EPCOT stories or memories about your early or first visit? What made it feel different? Did you immediately compare it to the MK? What stood out? Did it meet up with your expectations? or a let down? Does it feel the same to you now?
EPCOT was actually the first Disney Park I visited. I still consider the day I first went there the happiest day of my life. I still can remember the tears of joy from the first time I saw IllumiNations.
 

Nemo14

Well-Known Member
I was an adult the first time we visited EPCOT, and I absolutely loved it. Future World was just so amazing with "rides" and attractions that my whole family could enjoy. There was a special room for teachers with lots of interesting resources, and one year they even had free admission for teachers. World Showcase was great too, but my kids much preferred Future World. Now, I really get annoyed and heartsick with what has become of it - the very unnecessary "dumbing down" of Epcot.
 

Daannzzz

Well-Known Member
Living in California all my life (and being terrified of flying) I did not get to Walt Disney World until 1996 when I was 40. I had been to Disneyland many, many times. Before I started planning the trip I really didn't know much about Walt Disney World at all. I knew Epcot existed but my conception of it's contents and layout were based on descriptions from my uncle who had been and loved it and bits and pieces on the Disney Channel in the 80's and 90's. Since I didn't think I would ever ghet there I paid no attention. I had seen lots of photos (and had a book about) WDW when it first opened and my impression was that Ecpot spread around the lake across form the Contemporary resort. I was sure the World Showcase section was directly across from the hotel and the Ball was off to the side. My uncle had told me about the traveling theater (that I was sure was in the Pavilion about agriculture) and the Seas pavillion where you rode through the water. As you can imagine my idea of Epcot was way off. MY idea of WDW was way off. When I decided to actually go, the first book I read was the Unnofficial Guide which explained everything in detail and made more excited than any other trip I had taken. I was most excited to see Epcot, because it was different from Disneyland and the MK and it did not disappoint me even though Universe of Energy was closed for updating asd was World of Motion. Everything was so big and impressive even though some of the Futureworld Architecture was becoming dated. It was dated in a nostalgiac way the reminded me of Disneyland's Tomorrowland 1967. I loved all the long huge attractions and how elaborate they were. We were there during the Flower and Garden festival and all the gardens were very impressive. Everything was so much bigger than in the photos and video I had scene. It seemed like there were people from all over the earth there to, working and visiting and most everyone was so friendly. While Epcot is starting to get pretty stale I think it is still my favorite park, perhaps not for the best of reasons (nostalgia) but I can still spend loads of time there. The remnants of the original Futurworld theme are fading slowly. Hopefully they can create new themes for that part of the park that will be in character and wow us all.
 

ChrisFL

Premium Member
I honestly don't think EPCOT really needs a lot of work to get back to its former glory.

Consider that Spaceship Earth, Universe of Energy, The Land are all pretty similar to how they were when the park opened.

The Seas with Nemo and Test Track already have (or upgrading) their relatively long-term setups, so that leaves us with Journey into Imagination, Innoventions, but I'll also add Universe of Energy as an attraction that really should be updated/changed. I also don't expect Mission:Space to go anywhere, but they could update the "mission" that you go on eventually.

Another Future World pavilion would be nice, since they no longer are using Wonders of Life. As often with the critique...the "future" seems to be missing from Future World. We need that back, and a few cartoons in Spaceship Earth and products you can find at your local Best Buy in Innoventions isn't going to do.
 

Pixiedustmaker

Well-Known Member
Another Future World pavilion would be nice, since they no longer are using Wonders of Life. As often with the critique...the "future" seems to be missing from Future World. We need that back, and a few cartoons in Spaceship Earth and products you can find at your local Best Buy in Innoventions isn't going to do.

Innoventions from decades ago (Communicore) was pretty neat, I remember they had some animatronic robotics and stuff. I assumed that it would be constantly upgraded with the latest and greatest displays. What happened (I think) was that the Imagineer who did Innoventions (on the cheap) sort of got some sort of street cred with Michael Eisner, and was tapped to do DCA 1.0 (on the cheap).

While a lot of Future World feels like Disney has "given up" trying to compete with the internet, and figuring that attractions will quickly become outdated, one thing Disney does great is specialized hardware. That in conjunction with the relatively old fashioned touch screens could be used to make some pretty great exhibits and attractions that would look very futuristic if dressed up.

I kinda miss the old educational slant to Epcot. Maybe they could build a futuristic "classroom" with views of outer space and animatronic aliens give a goofy presentation about how humans are messing up earth with global warming, or something like that.

Or, maybe the inside of one of the Innoventions buildings could be dressed up like the surface of Mars, and guests get to pilot Mars Rovers around, which also give them factoids about the red planet while they drive around.
 

trs518

Active Member
As you all know, EPCOT will be hitting 30, and so do any of YOU have great EPCOT stories or memories about your early or first visit? What made it feel different? Did you immediately compare it to the MK? What stood out? Did it meet up with your expectations? or a let down? Does it feel the same to you now?

My first impression of EPCOT? I was 8 in 1985 when my parents took me to Disney World. I was mad because they took me to EPCOT first. I was expecting the Magic Kingdom. I wish I had went on some of the classic rides and remembered them. I remember very little of EPCOT.
 

ChrisFL

Premium Member
Innoventions from decades ago (Communicore) was pretty neat, I remember they had some animatronic robotics and stuff. I assumed that it would be constantly upgraded with the latest and greatest displays. What happened (I think) was that the Imagineer who did Innoventions (on the cheap) sort of got some sort of street cred with Michael Eisner, and was tapped to do DCA 1.0 (on the cheap).

While a lot of Future World feels like Disney has "given up" trying to compete with the internet, and figuring that attractions will quickly become outdated, one thing Disney does great is specialized hardware. That in conjunction with the relatively old fashioned touch screens could be used to make some pretty great exhibits and attractions that would look very futuristic if dressed up.

I kinda miss the old educational slant to Epcot. Maybe they could build a futuristic "classroom" with views of outer space and animatronic aliens give a goofy presentation about how humans are messing up earth with global warming, or something like that.

Even Innoventions in 1994 when it was converted from Communicore was quite nice, they had a lot of exhibits and things to do, but overall Epcot has lost its luster as an advertising space for companies it seems. That is the big problem that doesn't seem to be getting resolved. I really wish I knew the specifics on sponsorship costs and Epcot's pavilions/innoventions areas.

Or, maybe the inside of one of the Innoventions buildings could be dressed up like the surface of Mars, and guests get to pilot Mars Rovers around, which also give them factoids about the red planet while they drive around.

Ah, like Mission:Space was supposed to have?

There's plenty that COULD be done, but Disney doesn't want to do it themselves when a sponsor EVENTUALLY might come along and pay for something...while we wait...
 

Pixiedustmaker

Well-Known Member
Ah, like Mission:Space was supposed to have?

Not sure what Mission Space was supposed to have, but I'm talking about using the *huge* acreage of Innoventions, ripping everything out and transforming it into a Martian landscape. Maybe you could have different "rooms", which show different climates on Mars, (and that you would pass from room to room via caves, but the artistic goal would be to do an indoor rock work type thing which has a lot of detail, and feels realistic. The track for the ride would have to reflect this, with hills and troughs and such, maybe even a section where you "tilt" over the edge of a crater or something.

If I remember correctly, Eddie Sotto said that they were considering something like this for Autopia in Paris. If done indoors, they could adjust the climate so that you drive through a Martian "sandstorm", or maybe different sections can be hotter or colder to reflect temperature on Mars. Plus, you could have maybe a surprise encouner with a crashed alien spaceship, or colony or something, and not have to worry about exposing animatronics to the elements.

If Spaceship Earth is, well, Earth, then maybe it would make sense that the Innoventions could be themed to different planets?
 

RandySavage

Well-Known Member
As you all know, EPCOT will be hitting 30, and so do any of YOU have great EPCOT stories or memories about your early or first visit? What made it feel different? Did you immediately compare it to the MK? What stood out? Did it meet up with your expectations? or a let down? Does it feel the same to you now?

Like others here, my boyhood memories and formative theme park experiences centered around 'vintage' EPCOT, especially the original Future World. That 1985-92 EPCOT FW that I experienced in my youth resonated with me, and the memory still does to this day. Among my all-time favorite theme park attractions: Horizons, World of Motion, Spaceship Earth and the original Living Seas. As a kid of that era, I appreciated that FW eschewed Disney characters, cohesively (relatively) presented a sophisticated vision (field: past->present->future) and avoided pandering to kids. The park was overwhelming in its scope. And its stark differences are what made it compliment the MK so well.

My strongest/fondest theme park memory may be when I was 11 or 12, wandering from pavilion to pavilion on a warm, foggy night, with the spell of background music and the illuminated, original symbology signs pointing the way... no specific event, just the atmosphere and the feeling that this was an extraordinary place... and the smell of orange groves in Horizons... and the future city of World of Motion... and the snake fountain at Imagination... and The Living Seas intro film and hydrolators ("We welcome you to take the first steps into that future. We welcome you to Sea Base Alpha.")...
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
I had fond memories of the reservation/info terminals... (setting the futurism in my mind)
I have found memories of the post-show area of SSE where they had the original Earth Station... as the seating area there was my meeting point with my parents when they would let me wander the park on my own. So I'd sit in the chairs there, watching it all, while waiting for my parents.

I loved Future World - and found no interest in World Showcase. My biggest score as a child was convincing my parents to buy the large figment plush. I wasn't a fan of World of Motion. I respect what it was in terms of scale of show now, but I wasn't really into it during the 80s. Loved Horizons, and when they opened The Living Seas.. I was hooked.

Loved the Sousa marches they used to have in the fireworks show.
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
EPCOT was actually the first Disney Park I visited. I still consider the day I first went there the happiest day of my life. I still can remember the tears of joy from the first time I saw IllumiNations.
Where does Epcot rank right now for you for stateside Disney parks?
 

EPCOTCenterLover

Well-Known Member
I love Epcot. Visited in 1983 for the first time at the age of 24. It is the only Disney park we spend at least two days at. In fact, I like it so much- site plug here- I'm covering it everyday next week with five new posts. Wish Westcot would have made the cut. Imagine!
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
I was actually bored and rather disappointed with Epcot on my first visit. I was familiar with EPCOT and somewhat familiar with EPCOT Center and WestCOT, whose replacement would open shortly. And while I have grown to more appreciate Epcot, I think it still severly lacks the sense of ambition and the epic that so defined EPCOT and the EPCOT Center.
 

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