Dreamfinder Returning??

[Captain Chaos]

Exactly. The original version needed updating and now the current version is failing to bring in the crowds. I think the entire pavilion needs to be re-thought and updated.

It needs to be Re-IMAGINED

 

[wannab@dis]

It needs to be Re-IMAGINED

:lol:

Good point!

 

[marni1971]

I can think of one change that overall has been problematic. But, the jury is still out on whether or not the everyday guest doesn't really like SGE.

Other that that one, it only appears to be the disneyphiles that have been disappointed. So, name some current changes that you think were 'bad' that you also HONESTLY think the general guests had issues with or caused a decrease in attendance.

I don`t think a lot of changes were `bad` - I think they could have been so much better. I`m all for change, otherwise as you rightly say we would live in a museum, but hardly any of Futureworlds updates have been as inspiring, thought provoking, as well designed or implemented as the original (up to and including 1989) pavilions.

As clever as they are as a standalone attraction, each with excellent individual merits, look at the following:

Ellens Energy Adventure

This could have been in 2 standard movie theatres, with the diorama inbetween. As good as they are, the films have none of the awe or stunning photography the original had (topic notwithstanding) - apart form the big bang sequence. The mystery of the original UoE as the turntable rotated at the end of the Theatre One film into darkness, lightning briefly illuminating something, then the curtains rising on what looks like a primeval world was showmanship at its best.

The transition from Theatre Two to Theatre One is such a wasted opportunity. Compare again the original - the shuttle lifts off, and -ooo- the screen rises with it. We move forward into another hole-that-wasn`t-there-before as a dramatic piece of music begins, and then were surrounded by spectacular imagery. The WHOLE pavilion was shaped as it is for the finale sequence - by using the 3 main and one apex screens, the mirrored walls were angled perfectly to give the impression the images were surrounding the theatre. As a first timer in `87, I didn`t even know we were back in Theatre One until the lights came up and the wall curtains dropped again. Ellen has none of this. It`s just a film.

Mission: Space

A few minutes of thrill ride. Not the success Disney hoped for - its apparent it won`t be cloned worldwide as they had hoped for. Cheap shed of a building (where have) the architectural wonders of Futureworld gone). Horizons - beautiful. Emmotive. Thought provoking. Story led. Minor stortyline threads running through the attraction. Stunning multi part music. Amazing attention to detail in beautiful sets. Maybe if M:S was Journeys in Space as planned it wouldn`t be so bad. Yes, M:S cost a lot, but it`s one ride duplicated 3 times.

Test Track - much the same as M:S. World of Motion had much of the points I raised for Horizons.

Imagination.... need I say it?

Soarin` - nice addition to Futureworld, but only for a few minutes as the short attraction it is. I`m not saying bring back Food Rocks (far from it) but again it`s just an Omnimax film with syncronised seats.

The Living Seas - the jurys still out. IMHO, cartoons mainly belong in the other parks (not including Tomorrowland), but each to there own on this one.

Innoventions - messy update of Communicore. Dark, confusing, wasted space (Backstage Magic and Futurecom in particular) and overpowering; Eisners hip and trendy idea for the cable watching, video game playing, mobile phone using youth of today. Made no use of the futuristic setting it is based in. Global Neighborhood was based on the same premise and look what happened there.

Epcot couldn`t, and shouldn`t have stayed as EPCOT Center. However, Futureworld could have moved forward as a whole, updating it`s image whilst keeping to it`s core messages and unity. Today we have a park that`s loosing it`s way, not knowing if it`s a theme park, world fair or science park due to it`s fragmented overall appearence. That is the main problem - EPCOTs Futureworld was greater than the sum of it`s parts, parts that gelled perfectly together. Todays Futureworld is a collection of great attractions that stand up on their own, but don`t a)surpass their predesessors or b)work together as one to create a unifying park.

IMHO, as always.

 

[wannab@dis]

Basically, you don't like anything that's been done at Epcot recently. Well, hate to break it to you, but you are in the minority. The guests are returning to Epcot and it's starting to lose some of the outdated feel. As more changes are made, they will eventually put the 80's doldrums behind them.

Honestly, it looks to me like you can't live in the present and I have to ask one thing.... Have you even been on M:S or Soarin or seen the changes at the Land? I don't think so based on the dates in your signature, yet you are bashing them. Sorry... but for me, that means your opinion of them has basically zero credibility.

 

[NoNoNoNoNo]

We love stitch.... sorry if the attraction hurts the feelings of some!

 

[jedimaster1227]

Basically, you don't like anything that's been done at Epcot recently. Well, hate to break it to you, but you are in the minority. The guests are returning to Epcot and it's starting to lose some of the outdated feel. As more changes are made, they will eventually put the 80's doldrums behind them.

Honestly, it looks to me like you can't live in the present and I have to ask one thing.... Have you even been on M:S or Soarin or seen the changes at the Land? I don't think so based on the dates in your signature, yet you are bashing them. Sorry... but for me, that means your opinion of them has basically zero credibility.

On this one, Wannab@dis, I disagree with you and agree with Marni. You are looking at what he is saying the wrong way. We all still think Epcot is great, but what we are trying to say is that it isn't as good as it could have been. We look at it for what we got and that is all. We talk about rumors and hopes because they sometimes come through. Thats basically it.

 

[wannab@dis]

On this one, Wannab@dis, I disagree with you and agree with Marni. You are looking at what he is saying the wrong way. We all still think Epcot is great, but what we are trying to say is that it isn't as good as it could have been. We look at it for what we got and that is all. We talk about rumors and hopes because they sometimes come through. Thats basically it.

No, I didn't look at it wrong. It appears, based on these posts, that things aren't as good as YOU think they should be or that YOU are not happy with the changes. You tend to leave out the fact that Epcot is finally showing growth instead of the stagnation that ocurred before these changes.

 

[HauntedPirate]

(Devil's advocate here) What happens when interest wanes in what they've put in? Do they cater to the thrill-of-the-moment mindset of teens (which is what I see going on), or try to create attractions in the mold of Pirates, Horizons, Splash Mountain, etc.?

Epcot has an image problem, and they need to define what it's going to be before going forward, I feel. MK keeps bringing in guests by the millions, and the last major attraction there was Splash Mountain in the early 90's. (I need to find attendance figures for the parks.... ) But Epcot keeps needing rehabs, and new attractions, it seems.

Soarin', while a nice attraction, doesn't really hold much "Gotta ride it again!" value. I like it, but my visit can still be complete without riding it, unlike "Living with the Land", which is a must-ride for us. M:S is definitely a thrill ride, and has it's audience, but it also alienates a lot of people. WoL and UoE are next on the list to rehab, and we all know why - they aren't putting butts in the seats, so to speak; they got stale.

I guess it boils down to a fine line that Disney must walk - do they try to keep up with trends, or make their own?

But, hey, I keep going there. I enjoy my time there. I can nitpick a few things, but the bottom line is, I keep going back. So they've succeeded on some level.

 

[Dragonrider1227]

Um, well I know the webmaster from Screamscape and he does have a whole bunch of sources. Some aren't always on spot but most of the time they are pretty reputable. I don't agree with this last rumor in ONE major way.

It doesn't make sense for Disney just to reinsert the Dreamfinder into a ride that no longer has room for him. My prediction is that he will return in the form of a meet and greet (the one that will replace the recently closed Figment's Place). If all goes well, then maybe in a couple of years we will see a major rehab of Imagination for a final redo to bring the Dreamfinder and Figment together again, and hopefully leave Eric Idle out of the equation...

What do you mean, "hopefully?" I like Eric Idle in the ride. Frankly, I think the ride is better this way. It has a faster pace, better acting, the entire pavilon is now linked together in one theme and frankly, though I miss the Dreamfinder, he WAS kinda creepy. :lookaroun

 

[HauntedPirate]

Oh, a suggestion for JIYI - have the smell chamber give off random scents. I can't stand the skunk smell every time! :lol: "JIYI - never the same smell twice!"

 

[wannab@dis]

(Devil's advocate here) What happens when interest wanes in what they've put in? Do they cater to the thrill-of-the-moment mindset of teens (which is what I see going on), or try to create attractions in the mold of Pirates, Horizons, Splash Mountain, etc.?

Soarin', while a nice attraction, doesn't really hold much "Gotta ride it again!" value. I like it, but my visit can still be complete without riding it, unlike "Living with the Land", which is a must-ride for us. M:S is definitely a thrill ride, and has it's audience, but it also alienates a lot of people. WoL and UoE are next on the list to rehab, and we all know why - they aren't putting butts in the seats, so to speak; they got stale.

I guess it boils down to a fine line that Disney must walk - do they try to keep up with trends, or make their own?

Good post. I think it come down to "what will bring people in the gates and keep them returning". For me, Soarin has great return value and I'm looking forward to seeing it again. It also has a ride system that can be updated with a new movie to have a new experience. I don't know when we'll see a new movie, but it is a very good possibility.

While I enjoy/enjoyed many of the old attractions, they have to think about it from a business perspective. They have to keep things progressing and changing or they will lose their capability of keeping the turnsystles turning.

The method they choose may not always be our personal favorite, but we're not "in the know" about statistics and survey results. Apparently they are doing something right, because Epcot appears to be enjoying a rejuvination that was much needed.

 

[Dragonrider1227]

Good post. I think it come down to "what will bring people in the gates and keep them returning". For me, Soarin has great return value and I'm looking forward to seeing it again. It also has a ride system that can be updated with a new movie to have a new experience. I don't know when we'll see a new movie, but it is a very good possibility.

While I enjoy/enjoyed many of the old attractions, they have to think about it from a business perspective. They have to keep things progressing and changing or they will lose their capability of keeping the turnsystles turning.

The method they choose may not always be our personal favorite, but we're not "in the know" about statistics and survey results. Apparently they are doing something right, because Epcot appears to be enjoying a rejuvination that was much needed.

Until last month, I hadn't been in the Imagination pavilion in years. The ride in its current state was funny and full of Figment. I was happy to even recognize the original music incorporated into the current incarnation. Upon exiting the ride, I was surprised to find interactive areas very similar to the old imageworks stuff that used to be housed upstairs. Imagination is as good as it ever was, it is just different. The original version, if it existed today, would not likely draw any larger line than the current one does, IMO. I have no complaints with the current design.

THANK YOU! I'M GLAD I'M NOT THE ONLY ONE! I love the old one through sheer nostalgia but to be honest with you, if it was still here today, I don't think I would've ridden it too often. After we rode the new version with my little sister, I showed her Martin's video of the original and she eventually left. She said she prefered the new one. So Disney must be doing SOMETHING right. Plus, if you notice in that video, there seems to be quite a few empty cars so interest must've been dying down.
Though I must say, if there's ANYTHING I want brought back from the old ride, it's the old Imageworks. Aside from the computer that lets you edit your image, the "What if Labs" seemed pretty seemed pretty ho hum to me.

 

[Shaman]

(Devil's advocate here) What happens when interest wanes in what they've put in? Do they cater to the thrill-of-the-moment mindset of teens (which is what I see going on), or try to create attractions in the mold of Pirates, Horizons, Splash Mountain, etc.?

Soarin', while a nice attraction, doesn't really hold much "Gotta ride it again!" value. I like it, but my visit can still be complete without riding it, unlike "Living with the Land", which is a must-ride for us. M:S is definitely a thrill ride, and has it's audience, but it also alienates a lot of people. WoL and UoE are next on the list to rehab, and we all know why - they aren't putting butts in the seats, so to speak; they got stale.

I guess it boils down to a fine line that Disney must walk - do they try to keep up with trends, or make their own?

I think they should start creating more somewhat-thrilling/dark ride hybrids...like say, Spidy over at IoA...if they go too thrill or too kiddie...they alienate people...

The current Imagination ride is eh, is all right I suppose...I ride it when I'm in the mood for it...I have noticed though that the little ones enjoy it. On my last trip though I was shocked when I had to wait 5 minutes to get on...I usually just walk on...

:lol:

 

[wannab@dis]

I think they should start creating more somewhat-thrilling/dark ride hybrids...like say, Spidy over at IoA...if they go too thrill or too kiddie...they alienate people...

The current Imagination ride is eh, is all right I suppose...I ride it when I'm in the mood for it...I have noticed though that the little ones enjoy it. On my last trip though I was shocked when I had to wait 5 minutes to get on...I usually just walk on...

:lol:

Yeah, my little girl really enjoyed JIYI in December. The fact that we had to wait a few minutes was also a nice surprise. :lol:

I would love to see a new dark ride hybrid, but I'm not sure the general public puts as much stock in the dark rides as some of us. I would LOVE to see WDI give it a good try, though!

 

[Shaman]

Yeah, my little girl really enjoyed JIYI in December. The fact that we had to wait a few minutes was also a nice surprise. :lol:

I would love to see a new dark ride hybrid, but I'm not sure the general public puts as much stock in the dark rides as some of us. I would LOVE to see WDI give it a good try, though!

Imagination sort of does it's job...I mean it is something for the little ones in a real "adult" park.

But to continue the drift...(I promise I'll set it back on course ) I think most in the general public want to see something unique. I was blown away by Spidy because it was like nothing I had NEVER seen before...the Universal folks took the dark ride concept to a whole new level.

While M:S is VERY unique...it does alienate a large group of guests. Soarin' is a clever attraction, but it really isn't all that unique....but it is a family friendly attraction, so it gets the lines.

There are all sorts of rumors out there about the different forms of technology Disney has created and/or is working with...and thats the first step...technology is key....

I just hope that since UoE, WoL and Timekeeper/Tomorrowland need new attractions...that they use some of the stuff they've been working on....the question is which park needs it more?

My vote goes to The Studios.

But coming back to the original topic (see I told you I would), I think the current Imagination ride is missing something....I don't think Dreamfinder is exactly it....maybe if they made the attraction longer....don't they have the space?

 

[jedimaster1227]

No, I didn't look at it wrong. It appears, based on these posts, that things aren't as good as YOU think they should be or that YOU are not happy with the changes. You tend to leave out the fact that Epcot is finally showing growth instead of the stagnation that ocurred before these changes.

I am not completely unhappy with the changes, as a child, I thought Epcot was dull and boring, except for Journey into Imagination and Horizons. With the changes that have been made, the park has become more family friendly but it still keeps its value. The reason I say the things that I do is because I see the ideas that the Imagineers presented for Epcot (like Journey into Space-the replacement for Horizons) for what they could have been. I see Epcot for what it could have been and what it still can be. I love Epcot, and it will always be my favorite park, but there are some things that I wish were there so that when I would bring my kids to Epcot they could experience the things that I did as a child. When looking at videos of older rides or rides that are no longer there, I feel a sense of nostalgia and a bit of sadness when knowing that my kids won't be able to meet the Dreamfinder or travel to the Alpha Centauri...

 

[EpcotServo]

:lol: "JIYI - never the same smell twice!"

:lol: ROFL! They need to add to the lobby "EvIl FiGMenT U r DoOmeD" :lol:

 

[GothMickey]

OBJR: My understanding is the current attraction is on the same track, just shortened... and a lot of the original track is wasting away.

 

[jedimaster1227]

OBJR: My understanding is the current attraction is on the same track, just shortened... and a lot of the original track is wasting away.

Basically, yes. They removed the turntable from the entrance scene and cut some corners off of the usage of the building.

Marni, if you have your sketch out the 3 ride's overlapping layouts that would come in handy right about now.

 

[Captain Chaos]

Basically, yes. They removed the turntable from the entrance scene and cut some corners off of the usage of the building.

Marni, if you have your sketch out the 3 ride's overlapping layouts that would come in handy right about now.

That would be awesome. Marni, if you can, please dust them off and let us see.