Do we lose track of the fact that WDW is really (in essence) for kids?

imagineer boy

Well-Known Member
WDW, for most of it's existence wasn't the Toddler Kingdom. I think most new fans don't get that. They go into Tomorrowland and see Stitch, Buzz, Monsters, Inc and don't understand why we whiners don't understand that WDW is for kids. The WDW I grew up with didn't have a single cartoon based attraction in Tomorrowland. It was Mission to Mars and later Alien Encounter. There was America The Beautiful that became Timekeeper, and If You Had Wings. No toons!

The y replaced the more edgy Mr. Toads with Pooh. And SWSA with Princess Fairytale Hall and 20K Leagues with Ariel.

And now the shallowing of Epcot. Replacing things that have the intellectual depth of Human History with the latest Disney cartoons.

WDW was not made for Toddlers. The current management did that. And since I am not a toddler I am far less interested in WDW than I used to be.

You win the thread!
 

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
This. Just this. For the budget and time it should have been as lavish and on a scale of BTM. Albeit with slower speeds maybe to qualify as kiddy friendly. BTM as built would cost around $55 million today without the red tape and burocracy wrapped around the kiddy coaster. For 100 million plus we should have gotten a gob smacking, family friendly E.

Internally FLE and the Dwarf Coaster have been acknowledged as not the stellar success that was hoped for. Good, but not great. Which is right on the money. Hence future projects of a large scale (Avland, SW) are being micromanaged to ensure FLE isn't repeated. Hopefully they'll have style and substance.
James Cameron is OCD with any project he takes on, so I have no doubt Pandora's two attractions will be great additions to AK. I only wish he was able to get TDO to do the speedbike coaster, also.

DHS needs a Star Wars Land with substance. Unlike MK, the rest of the park (5-7 attractions) can't compensate for an immersive environment with no headliners.

I would be fine with SDMT as it is, if they had the extra show scenes and the wait-times weren't 45 minutes+ at all times of the day.

NFL just felt half-finished. A B&TB dark ride, something of substance in SWSA's old space, a completed SDMT, something better than Storybook Circus (Wonderland mini-land would have been perfect. Dumbo could be in the back corner), and expanded capacity for Peter Pan (6 riders per RV instead of 2) would have made NFL perfect. Plus, if they managed the budget properly, the entire project would have been $500-600 million - roughly as much as Diagon Alley. With TDO budgets, it would cost $850-900 million.
 

CaptainAmerica

Premium Member
What definition did I make up? Thrill rides are about the thrill created by the ride system and that is the focus of Seven Dearfs Mine Train.
Every commonly understood usage of the term "thrill ride" is based on the level of physical intensity that the ride generates. Speed, heights, drops, loops, g-forces. The ride system is a means to those ends, but it's a complete red herring to suggest that ANY ride with some kind of unique ride system is a thrill ride.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Every commonly understood usage of the term "thrill ride" is based on the level of physical intensity that the ride generates. Speed, heights, drops, loops, g-forces. The ride system is a means to those ends, but it's a complete red herring to suggest that ANY ride with some kind of unique ride system is a thrill ride.
The big focus of the ride is its wild, swinging cars and the thrill they were supposed to generate. Thats the big gimmick. That focus on thrills, regardless of how tame they are to adults, is what places it into the category.
 

CaptainAmerica

Premium Member
The big focus of the ride is its wild, swinging cars and the thrill they were supposed to generate. Thats the big gimmick. That focus on thrills, regardless of how tame they are to adults, is what places it into the category.
How strangely will the tools of a tyrant pervert the plain meaning of words.

I'd wager big money that you're in the VAST minority on this one. I'd love to see a poll asking simply "is Mine Train a thrill ride?"
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
I'd wager big money that you're in the VAST minority on this one. I'd love to see a poll asking simply "is Mine Train a thrill ride?"
Because most people are going to base that assessment on how it compares to the top of that category, not how it functions as an experience. The whole reasons elements of thrills (speed, height, etc.) constantly get brought up is because people do (and it is often people looking to defend the ride) place it within that vein of rides built around the visceral sensation. It is defends as "thrilling for kids."
 

TXDisney

Well-Known Member
I went all growing up as a kid and loved WDW. I love it just as much as an adult. Partly bc I'm on my own budget, do the rides we like, etc. we've gone now so many times just my wife and I, that we can't wait to have kids and see it through there eyes. Yes we know we can't do full days just in WS drinking around the countries and eating nice dinners every night. But we're excited to see what new things we can do with kids. Yes there's more lines for characters and other rides but to see the look on their faves will be all worth it. We do plan on bringing my parents when we have kids though so we can do a nice dinner just the 2 of us a night or 2 a trip. But ultimately the trip is about the kids.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
What definition did I make up? Thrill rides are about the thrill created by the ride system and that is the focus of Seven Dearfs Mine Train.
Absolutely not... It is an element, but, the story of the Dwarfs, the mine and the Snow White is the focus, with a different approach to it. Who ever said that "thrill" was the purpose of the attraction. It's both story and excitement, I don't call it actual thrills.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Absolutely not... It is an element, but, the story of the Dwarfs, the mine and the Snow White is the focus, with a different approach to it. Who ever said that "thrill" was the purpose of the attraction. It's both story and excitement, I don't call it actual thrills.
Disney themselves have emphasized the thrill of the ride vehicles. The thrill of the coaster is also the elements repeatedly emphasized in defense of the attraction.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Disney themselves have emphasized the thrill of the ride vehicles. The thrill of the coaster is also the elements repeatedly emphasized in defense of the attraction.
First of all, it wasn't in defense, it was in promotion and for a Fantasyland attraction, it was thrilling. However, there are varying degrees of thrilling. There is fun to adrenalin inducing. There are no air sickness bags in those mine trains but, it did have a new element to them (the swaying) that added to the fun. Not everything is black and white. Not everything is defined by individual interpretations of a single word. A word that has many degrees of existence and not just black and white. Things can be thrilling without making one puke or be in danger of cardiac arrest. My Father in law used to consider fishing on the shore as thrilling. I would be hard pressed to call it that. But, I have ridden 7DMT and although not over the top, in it's own way it was thrilling and entertaining, albeit short. Being short doesn't in anyway take away from what is there accept on an individual level. So,why are we even arguing about it. It's a good ride that some people like and some people don't, just like every single attraction in any park in the world. One size does not necessarily fit all.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
First of all, it wasn't in defense, it was in promotion and for a Fantasyland attraction, it was thrilling. However, there are varying degrees of thrilling. There is fun to adrenalin inducing. There are no air sickness bags in those mine trains but, it did have a new element to them (the swaying) that added to the fun. Not everything is black and white. Not everything is defined by individual interpretations of a single word. A word that has many degrees of existence and not just black and white. Things can be thrilling without making one puke or be in danger of cardiac arrest. My Father in law used to consider fishing on the shore as thrilling. I would be hard pressed to call it that. But, I have ridden 7DMT and although not over the top, in it's own way it was thrilling and entertaining, albeit short. Being short doesn't in anyway take away from what is there accept on an individual level. So,why are we even arguing about it. It's a good ride that some people like and some people don't, just like every single attraction in any park in the world. One size does not necessarily fit all.
You just argued my point, that thrill is broader than the most extreme. Being "thrilling for a Fantasyland attraction" is the repeated argument that I have consistently pointed to as being the proof that the attraction is viewed primarily as being in the same vein as a thrill ride. It is a thrill ride whose audience is primarily little kids.
 

Seanual757

Well-Known Member
Remember WDW is a place for Families to enjoy together kids of all ages from new born kids to someone 100+. WDW is supposed to bring the kid out of everyone it’s a place to forget about the hustle of daily life. Unfortunately we live in the NOW NOW society where we want everything this split second. We (US and Disney) have lost focus IMHO on what it’s all about. This day in age for Disney it’s all about maximizing how much money they can squeeze out of guests and how much more they can do without doing more. For us it’s how much more we can fit into our busy schedules and since we live in the day of age of NOW NOW we are craving for more and more. Then we get upset when things don’t happen fast enough or why are they doing this and why are they doing that. Bottom line is if you do not like it you have several choice 1. Write to Disney and let them know, 2. Live with it, and 3. Don’t come back.
I am local in Central Florida my family are APH and DVC owners we go to Disney almost every weekend and stay 4-6 times a year onsite. For myself I enjoy the look on my kids’ faces each and every time we go to Disney it’s like this is the 1st time they have ever been. For me it’s priceless it’s all about our kids enjoyment, spending time with my family, and relaxing and forgetting about the daily grind of work and other stuff. When we are at Disney none of the daily stuff matters we get caught up in the fantasy land of Disney and we love it.
When I watch many people on this board it reminds me of watching parents at a little league baseball game getting worked up over nothing (remember little league is for the kids).
I see more and more people on this board complaining that it’s not like it used to be. Let me ask you this WHAT is “Like it used to be” everything in our daily lives have changed NOTHING is like it used to be. If you blink you will miss it that is how fast things are changing. I can remember back when we did not have smart phone and IMHO I kind of wish we could go back to those days things seemed so much easier back then.
 

216bruce

Well-Known Member
What I see is a lot of faithful fans intentionally ignoring obvious problems so that nothing rains on the multi thousand $$$$ vacation.
I get that. Really. I also appreciate the concern for the park and how important it obviously is to many people. But, concern can easily look like whining or worse- 'the park should have more (insert favorite type thing here)' or '(blank) is the worst ride ever because I don't like it.' That's really how a lot of folks come off...anonymous spoiled children. The truly concerned people also are tinged with a bit of reality in their concerns and usually write something intelligent. The spoiled whiners...not so much.
 

EnergyKing

Well-Known Member
Even the ones that have been there for decades?

Well, now that you mention it...

Pirates has become a Johnny Depp fangirl fiasco, The Haunted Mansion has lost some of its edge due to interactive madness, the Diamond Horseshoe isn't showing any performances (probably bc it hasn't produced a stuffed animal), the penny arcade is a great place to experience waiting in line for a whinnie the pooh doll, the jungle cruise is now slightly irritating with its tourguides' by-rote deliveries, the main street cinema...
 

blueboxdoctor

Well-Known Member
I'm not a kid and I can't wait to go back. People saying that MK has lost its way, I don't really see it. If its way was the boring Tom Sawyer Island and Hall of Presidents, well, fine, keep losing its way. I do understand how it's annoying for Frozen to be everywhere, and I do not agree with Hollywood Studios and EPCOT overly embracing Frozen, but I can't fault them for doing it, if I were in charge I'd likely try to do something similar (though, I wouldn't get rid of the backlot tour).

I think it's pretty easy to have fun there at any age. One thing I do miss, and just found out on this thread what they were called, are the seacabs. They were definitely better than the Nemo modification they did down there.
 

blueboxdoctor

Well-Known Member
WDW, for most of it's existence wasn't the Toddler Kingdom. I think most new fans don't get that. They go into Tomorrowland and see Stitch, Buzz, Monsters, Inc and don't understand why we whiners don't understand that WDW is for kids. The WDW I grew up with didn't have a single cartoon based attraction in Tomorrowland. It was Mission to Mars and later Alien Encounter. There was America The Beautiful that became Timekeeper, and If You Had Wings. No toons!

The y replaced the more edgy Mr. Toads with Pooh. And SWSA with Princess Fairytale Hall and 20K Leagues with Ariel.

And now the shallowing of Epcot. Replacing things that have the intellectual depth of Human History with the latest Disney cartoons.

WDW was not made for Toddlers. The current management did that. And since I am not a toddler I am far less interested in WDW than I used to be.

Nobody knows who Mr. Toad is, sorry, it's just not relevant anymore. Now, I do miss Snow White's ride, but that's mainly because I'm not blown away by the mine coaster. Ariel is a nice touch and fits the theme of the area, looks great from the outside, and fits in the with the princess section they added to Fantasyland.

And let's be real, Innoventions as about as dated as possible, it's kind of depressing to walk through there. Though, I am glad they still have Living With the Land, I always enjoy going through the greenhouse they have there. Test Track did become Tron the ride, except with really poor touch screen/car customization they added (now that Top Gear is basically done and grasping for life, they should get Jeremy and the guys to become part of TT). But in all honesty, showing off ABS in 2015 isn't as big a deal as it once was. The one thing I did like about TT that I think should be done more in EPCOT is getting big companies to sponsor parts of EPCOT and make it like a giant tech show. Yeah, it'll all be advertising, but if you want to have the latest tech you have to get the big players to come and show it off.
 

Raineman

Well-Known Member
What I see is a lot of faithful fans intentionally ignoring obvious problems so that nothing rains on the multi thousand $$$$ vacation.
What I see is people who have the ability to visit WDW multiple times per year, and see/experience the "obvious problems" only because they are so familiar with the place and every minute little change that is made. I have been to WDW twice, and I am in my early 40s. I was a teenager the first time I went, and I did not notice any issues, because I was just excited to be there. The second time I went was just last year and, having learned alot about WDW through websites and forums like this one, I definitely recognized some of the issues, but not all of them. Did it inhibit my enjoyment of the parks? Not one bit. Everything that I experienced, I took the positives and cherished them, and recognized the negatives but did not dwell on them-"accentuate the positive, hide the negative". Unless an issue at the parks is directly interfering with my ability to have fun or is harming me in some way, it doesn't matter to me. As I said above, people who have been to WDW hundreds of times will dwell on these things, whereas occasional visitors will tend to enjoy WDW for what it is and not over-analyze things.
 

Seanual757

Well-Known Member
Exactly bottom line go have fun don't let the little things bother you or ruin your experience. Folks spend a lot of $$$$ on Disney vacations and my suggestion to them is to go with an open mine and have a Plan A and a Plan B try not to get worked up over the little things.
 

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Back
Top Bottom