News Disney World Cast Member unions to begin week of negotiations for wage increases, healthcare costs and more

[flynnibus]

Its a really ugly sprawl. my cousins that lived in Middleburg moved last year to Winchester, WV to get away from the mess.

You sure you got that right? Winchester is a city where Middleburg is just really just a quaint village (that is known for its strong resistance to any development). Middleburg is an example of the rural towns that the Piedmont group was defending back in the Disney America era.. and is still pretty well defended. It's horse country known for its large farms many handed down from colonial times land grants. Winchester on the other hand is an incorporated city and while no 'city', its far more commercial and built out. Maybe they moved out in the sticks near winchester towards the WV line (its like less than 10miles from WV line). That pocket of WV is becoming commuter hell because everyone moved out to WV because you can't afford property here in Loudon.

 

[networkpro]

You sure you got that right? Winchester is a city where Middleburg is just really just a quaint village (that is known for its strong resistance to any development). Middleburg is an example of the rural towns that the Piedmont group was defending back in the Disney America era.. and is still pretty well defended. It's horse country known for its large farms many handed down from colonial times land grants. Winchester on the other hand is an incorporated city and while no 'city', its far more commercial and built out. Maybe they moved out in the sticks near winchester towards the WV line (its like less than 10miles from WV line). That pocket of WV is becoming commuter hell because everyone moved out to WV because you can't afford property here in Loudon.

I'm quite sure of that, but I did fail to specify that they moved into a 55+ community. So there's the need for sufficient medical, fire, and police. My cousins' wife was a realtor that did these horse farm estate sale transactions while he had an office park development company that his son took over.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Lol and I guess short term memory is in effect, last contract negotiations everyone swore 15-17 hour would do it. Now it's 20 an hour and in 2 years you'll be back saying it takes 25.00 hour.

The last contract negotiations a 1-day ticket to MK was much cheaper as well. I’m not sure why Disney can continue to up the price by $5-10 a year but a CM wanting $3 more every few years is such a problem.

It’s welfare paid through the company instead of through the government.

An employee working for a salary is NOT welfare in any definition.

they're getting ready to layoff thousands more, now not sure how many in the parks will be effected but last number I saw was they're laying off 7k

None. The parks are still extremely understaffed.

 

[kingdead]

Or flip the table... why not regulate costs? Why not regulate housing and fuel costs to keep living affordable?

Instead of trying to make it so rich companies pay people more, why not make it so all companies can have employees with more affordable living?

(Because that would look like economic drag... and optically that is bad)

The problem with 'just pay people more' is it's a self-defeating loop. Raising wages for everyone just raises inflation, undermining your raise.

Why CAN'T we have caps or regulation? (I have the same "loop" problem with universal basic income--what keeps your landlord from just raising costs to account for the extra money in your pocket? They know exactly how much is there, after all.)

 

[yensid67]

This whole money negotiations isBAD PR for Disney who just gave the WORST CEO IN COMPANY HISTORY a $25 MILLION severance/bonus THAT WAS NOT EARNED OR DESERVED NO MATTER WHAT A CONTRACT SAYS! Chapek put the company on a very bad situation. From the whole DeSantis "Don't Say Gay" to the MONSTROSIETY AND EXPENSIVE in the Epcot lagoon called Harmonious! to many other bad financial decisions that put the company on a spiral!

DISNEY SHOULD BE VERY ASHAMED OF THEMESELVES FOR EVEN OFFERING $16/HR WHEN THEY ARE AWARE THAT SOME CAST MEMBERS ARE LIVING OUT OF THEIR CARS AND EVEN HOMELESS!

Think about that one Cast Member you might have talked to that just made your day...they made you smile despite how they were feeling or whatever might be stressing them out in their life outside the DIsney bubble...
PLEASE FLOOD THE PHONES AND EMAILS AND MAIL WITH LETTERS IN SUPPORT OF THE CAST MEMBERS THAT MAKE YOUR VACATION MAGICAL!

 

[MR.Dis]

I've been texting with a high school classmate of mine that works for the union. There's negotiations going on behind the scenes, but he wouldn't say more.

Personally, we know that the CM's can't strike, but I wouldn't be surprised if a few protests start happening at the more visible areas off-property, adjacent to the property line (ie, where the Nazis have also been protesting), and if mass call-outs begin to happen.

Imagine that, in the middle of a contract negotiation that Dis and Union are like actually negotiating-- LOL. I have said from the beginning that Disney is trying to get the best deal for Disney and the Union is trying to get the best deal for their workers.

 

[Alanzo]

Why CAN'T we have caps or regulation? (I have the same "loop" problem with universal basic income--what keeps your landlord from just raising costs to account for the extra money in your pocket? They know exactly how much is there, after all.)

Allow me to break your loop.

1. Minimum wage increase/UBI
2. More money in low-wage workers' pockets.
3. Increased consumer spending (short term).
4. Increased demand for goods and services (short term).
5. Price increases occur if demand exceeds supply (short term).
6. Increased competition (long term) drives prices down.
7. Suppliers adjust their prices to stay competitive (long term).
8. Low-wage workers still have more money in their pockets, but prices are adjusted to reflect the new demand and increased supply (long term).

 

[Drdcm]

And yet somehow they along with the other norden countries are consistently ranked as the happiest countries in the world.

Know why? They adapt

Examples like... Alcohol sales are highly regulated... so the social patterns adapt around them. Car taxes shape car buying patterns. Housing is expensive, so housing is frugal. They are raised to believe in hard work, community and common good. People are expected to do their share.

None of them like the taxes - they are all the ones happy to buy big sports cars when they come to the US... or pack their suitcases full of cheap goods when visiting. But they accept that the taxes are necessary to do what they believe is common sense.

But the key is they act and follow-up with their words. It's an amazing place to live because for the most part, people are supportive and there is a communal good. It's far more about culture and expectations than it is about the social net. The social net is the outcome of the culture... not the other way around. We don't have that same culture in the US. We were born out of the 'leave me be' mentality.

So this is talked about in our training. The happiness rating is heavily influenced by the tendency towards conformity as a culture. Just like immigrants are expected to assimilate, everyone is expected to be happy.

This does two things. 1) it forces people into a positive psychology mindset, thereby actually improving MH outcomes. And 2) creates a self perpetuating sense of national pride in the happiness.

Interestingly, if you look at suicide rates their suite rates are quite high (top 3rd of all countries) despite the limited access to firearms. The reason the US is so high is because we have access to firearms thereby making attempts more successful. When you account for this, the suicide rates would be about equal.

 

[Ayla]

Or flip the table... why not regulate costs? Why not regulate housing and fuel costs to keep living affordable?

Instead of trying to make it so rich companies pay people more, why not make it so all companies can have employees with more affordable living?

(Because that would look like economic drag... and optically that is bad)

The problem with 'just pay people more' is it's a self-defeating loop. Raising wages for everyone just raises inflation, undermining your raise.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

How about pay your employees well regardless of the job it is. I've said it a few times the company I work for is a major retailer and one of the rules they follow is treat your employees well and pay them well and they will want to work for you. Somehow many here don't believe in that concept.

The problem is “well” is 100% subjective.

Floridas minimum wage is $11 an hour so to many people $15 (what Disney already pays) is paying well.

Others would say $20 is paying well because it is a wage that covers basic comforts.

Whose definition of “well” is the right one?

The beauty of a capitalist wage system is each individual decides for themself if the job pays well enough for them to take it. Nobody is forced to work anywhere so the pay has to meet individual thresholds of “well” (or at least “enough”) or nobody will take the job.

 

[Nubs70]

We're likely to move there because even with the higher taxes and cost of living compared to Orlando, putting my kid in a good public school there is cheaper than paying for a private school in Florida to give him an education of comparable quality.

And now that my wife's licensed to practice law in DC, she can try for jobs there which will undoubtedly pay her far more than she earns in Florida.

Why even move to DC?? set up an office in DC. Fly up when face to face meetings are required.

Work remote from FL. Keep child in private school, lower cost of living and make more money

 

[mkt]

Why even move to DC?? set up an office in DC. Fly up when face to face meetings are required.

Work remote from FL. Keep child in private school, lower cost of living and make more money

I've done the math. The cost to put my kid in a good nonreligious private school close to home is greater than the increased cost of living in the DC area.

 

[flynnibus]

Why CAN'T we have caps or regulation?

Because it's taboo to try to limit free enterprise. And people argue that if a market is capped, it disincentivizes people to produce for it. Example: If profits are limited on apartments, why would I build more apartments? I'll build something else that I can make more money on.

And in general policies that limit the price of goods hurt growth statistics so you find more resistance to that kind of thinking too. Most economics thinking want controlled, steady growth to show health. But that also means they want slow steady inflation, not deflation -- which is considered the devil.

The crux is what many people consider to be 'basic rights' like housing, food and transportation are all still provided through private, for profit enterprise. So you have people providing it because it makes business sense to do so... not because 'people need it'. Trying to wrangle that back to 'affordable' away from market forces is very difficult.

 

[flynnibus]

Allow me to break your loop.

1. Minimum wage increase/UBI
2. More money in low-wage workers' pockets.
3. Increased consumer spending (short term).
4. Increased demand for goods and services (short term).
5. Price increases occur if demand exceeds supply (short term).
6. Increased competition (long term) drives prices down.
7. Suppliers adjust their prices to stay competitive (long term).
8. Low-wage workers still have more money in their pockets, but prices are adjusted to reflect the new demand and increased supply (long term).

Except that's not how it works
The money spike fro workers isn't 'short term' - it's now baked into the system
Price increases from inflationary pressures are not short term
There isn't always new competition to drive down prices

It's no different than the fed pumping more money into the system... its just a matter of where it propagates from. Inflation doesn't go away due to new competition and suppliers adjusting to stay competitive.

 

[Lilofan]

1- Yep
2- Other than Covid, layoffs and furloughs at Disney have always salaried leadership, not front line cast. Disney is still hiring front line CMs for its parks.
3- Oh yeah. And Disney is taking notes of guest complaints and content criticizing the lack of perceived value and negative experiences.
4- Nope.

To me that's a sign that Disney's staffing shortages at the park are going to get worse. If people can't afford to live and work there, eventually they will leave.

Unless Disney intends to go 100% CP/IP for staffing. Which is both genius and evil.

If Disney goes to 100% CP/ICP staffing which won't happen that would bankrupt the unions. CP/ICP have no union representation .

 

[Nubs70]

Except that's not how it works
The money spike fro workers isn't 'short term' - it's now baked into the system
Price increases from inflationary pressures are not short term
There isn't always new competition to drive down prices

It's no different than the fed pumping more money into the system... its just a matter of where it propagates from. Inflation doesn't go away due to new competition and suppliers adjusting to stay competitive.

Once inflation ramps up, as it is now, companies increase selling price to maintain financial metrics due to increases in price of material and labor. This results in fantastic financial performance as we are seeing with 2022 earnings calls. Now when inflation subsides, do you think companies will lower prices?? Not a chance. Companies will have another round of spectacular earnings.

 

[flynnibus]

So this is talked about in our training. The happiness rating is heavily influenced by the tendency towards conformity as a culture. Just like immigrants are expected to assimilate, everyone is expected to be happy.

This does two things. 1) it forces people into a positive psychology mindset, thereby actually improving MH outcomes. And 2) creates a self perpetuating sense of national pride in the happiness.

I'm no MD - but that's not my experience with my 25+yrs of immersion in the people and culture. If anything I'd say people are pushed to have purpose - not happiness.

Interestingly, if you look at suicide rates their suite rates are quite high (top 3rd of all countries) despite the limited access to firearms.

More of an old stigma - when you look at their % of deaths and/or per 100k population their stats are pretty much avg.

Suicide and suicide attempts in Norway - Public Health Report

Two out of three who die as a result of suicide are men. Many relatives and close friends are affected by suicide every year.

www.fhi.no

 

[flynnibus]

Once inflation ramps up, as it is now, companies increase selling price to maintain financial metrics due to increases in price of material and labor. This results in fantastic financial performance as we are seeing with 2022 earnings calls. Now when inflation subsides, do you think companies will lower prices?? Not a chance. Companies will have another round of spectacular earnings.

Plus the government WILL NOT LET deflation take hold.

 

[Alanzo]

Eh, agree to disagree? I'm not an economist, but my basic understanding of supply and demand from Econ 100 20 years ago was what I am riding on. When demand goes up, the market will either raise prices to adjust and/or new sellers will enter the market until a new equilibrium is met. The hypothesis that prices will go up to capture exactly 100% of the demand relies on a perfectly functioning market that we've never had and never will.

I can't speak to one off stimulus events and how they mess up the market. I'm just talking about the basic principles of supply and demand.

 

[Lilofan]

Yes, quite cromulent isn't it? After all, every single rich person completely deserves their situation and every single poor person completely deserves theirs, right?

I would say some rich people deserve what they have, with some who took huge risks, sacrifice, blood , sweat and tears to get to where they are at. Ever hear the saying from rags to riches?