Disney Union Workers Rally for Better Pay

[englanddg]

As a Mom of 2 pretty recent college grads I agree. My DD was given an intern this last semester as they launched a new facility, others borrowed her to pick their kids up from the airport, put together furniture, be a bouncer. She was annoyed. My kids were fortunate and were paid (though poorly) unlike many before them, many being used for anything but what the actual internship was to be. Internships have turned into a Gal Friday or Jack of all Trades category and I wish it would be more closely monitored and more tightly regulated. Yet some firms do offer real internships, my DDs friend did an internship for NBC TV and it was an actual learning experiences verses chores nobody wanted to do.

Go Fer.

Go Fer Coffee...
Go Fer Lunch...
Go Fer Office Supplies...

List goes on.

Internships are stupid. If it's a trade, you should be a paid apprentice. If it's not, then it's a job, and you should collect an employees salary.

That being said...FLSA has rather vague wording of internships.

 

[ChrisFL]

Um...yes.

A very famous strike of the Animators. According to many who knew him, Walt took the strike quite personally, and it's why his interests started to shift away from animation to live action.

Writers Screen Guild went on a very prominent strike in 2007 (as I recall), which would effect their film and TV divisions.

Hotel workers have also had strikes, only a few years ago. 2011 I think?

I think workers at Disneyland Paris went on strike a few years ago as well

 

[Cesar R M]

I'd really like somebody to address the fact that Orlando has a $23,000 a year median income per capita…

Everything here is just a service job for the Tourists.. And it's all making some corporation rich. And that corporation is not reinvesting in the community that it is milking dry.

Reminds me of these graphs you find.
and the CEO vs WORKER insane widening gap of the past 20+ years.

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/05/03/475952/ceo-pay-faster-worker-pay/

 

[Lucky]

IMO this is a much bigger and more complex topic than we can discuss without expert economists

A lot of this comes down to different views on fairness and other issues that economists don't claim any special expertise in.

 

[Gabe1]

Because it's not necessarily that simple. Sometimes it can be something like

a. Gets a very good job.
b. Gets a family.
c. Economy tanks because, f'rinstance, maybe bankers were gambling with money that wasn't theirs.
d. Loses job, has to choose between a low end job because that's all that's hiring right now or going on unemployment or welfare and then being accused of being lazy and a drain on the system.

I tend to agree with that statement. Over simplification of the working poor. Yes they know the salary when hired but when that is all they can find I can't kick them for taking something. Orlando area has an abundance of low end employment opportunities. With the median income of $23k the cycle continues from one generation to the next. My DDs University was $32,000 without expenses per year. Not likely a median income of $23K is going to be able to send their children off to her University for better opportunities.

When my son was in the college program in 2007 he made $6.88 and hour out of that they deducted housing of $85 a week. He had 6 people in his 3 bedroom apartment, Disney was collecting $26,520 a year for his apartment from those college students and the housing costs have risen quite a bit since then. While my son had a plum position as a CP and had the time of his life, I did supplement his earnings while he was down there or he could not afford to do anything beyond eat food from Walmart.

One of the things he did learn was to go home, finish his degree 'cause there was little opportunities in Orlando without a degree and even then many under-employed people were all hoping to get out from under their low paying jobs and move up. Sadly there isn't enough opportunities for even the qualified to move out of the poverty level at a 40 hour a week job. Many of those full time workers are working many hours of overtime just to try and make ends meet and it is all that is out there in most cases in this vast tourist area. Same reason why you find on cruise ships employees from countries that are extremely poor. It is a way out. Not a wonderful life, not great wages, horridly long hours, but where they can earn something.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Have Disney employees in any section/department/whatever of the company ever gone on strike? Just curious...

Disney? Yes. Disney World? No.

The first provision of all Disney World contracts is a no-strike provision.

 

[Gabe1]

Go Fer.

Go Fer Coffee...
Go Fer Lunch...
Go Fer Office Supplies...

List goes on.

Internships are stupid. If it's a trade, you should be a paid apprentice. If it's not, then it's a job, and you should collect an employees salary.

That being said...FLSA has rather vague wording of internships.

Interns for both governmental jobs and private sector are becoming labor plugs. Our Village is hiring one after the next so they don't have to hire permanent employees & pay benefits to fill the positions that are needed. They give them the grunt work and they learn little to nothing about their field. What is happening is young 20 somethings that are smart enough to recognize they are being duped and come out bitter and cynical. If the intern complains their reference is not likely to be solid.

If I were the Empress of Interns, they all would be paid, there would be a job description and what they would be trained to do. Further, someone from HR would have to sign off weekly on their tasks making sure what they were hired as interns was exactly what they were doing. It should be a win for the intern and the employer.

 

[englanddg]

Interns for both governmental jobs and private sector are becoming labor plugs. Our Village is hiring one after the next so they don't have to hire permanent employees & pay benefits to fill the positions that are needed. They give them the grunt work and they learn little to nothing about their field. What is happening is young 20 somethings that are smart enough to recognize they are being duped and come out bitter and cynical. If the intern complains their reference is not likely to be solid.

If I were the Empress of Interns, they all would be paid, there would be a job description and what they would be trained to do. Further, someone from HR would have to sign off weekly on their tasks making sure what they were hired as interns was exactly what they were doing. It should be a win for the intern and the employer.

If I were the king of interns, there would be no such thing as internships.

 

[maxairmike]

I tend to agree with that statement. Over simplification of the working poor. Yes they know the salary when hired but when that is all they can find I can't kick them for taking something. Orlando area has an abundance of low end employment opportunities. With the median income of $23k the cycle continues from one generation to the next. My DDs University was $32,000 without expenses per year. Not likely a median income of $23K is going to be able to send their children off to her University for better opportunities.

When my son was in the college program in 2007 he made $6.88 and hour out of that they deducted housing of $85 a week. He had 6 people in his 3 bedroom apartment, Disney was collecting $26,520 a year for his apartment from those college students and the housing costs have risen quite a bit since then. While my son had a plum position as a CP and had the time of his life, I did supplement his earnings while he was down there or he could not afford to do anything beyond eat food from Walmart.

One of the things he did learn was to go home, finish his degree 'cause there was little opportunities in Orlando without a degree and even then many under-employed people were all hoping to get out from under their low paying jobs and move up. Sadly there isn't enough opportunities for even the qualified to move out of the poverty level at a 40 hour a week job. Many of those full time workers are working many hours of overtime just to try and make ends meet and it is all that is out there in most cases in this vast tourist area. Same reason why you find on cruise ships employees from countries that are extremely poor. It is a way out. Not a wonderful life, not great wages, horridly long hours, but where they can earn something.

1000x the bolded.

The amount of lower end jobs on the pay scale here creates a situation where even the typically higher pay positions a step or two up can be underpaid relatively because of the larger pool of excess supply for those positions (which are naturally progressively fewer). Of course, many will then say "Just move somewhere else where there is a job." Ok, the person making below that median income level of $23k (because those are the people we're really talking about, here, those making under $20k/year) is just going to be able to afford to job hunt in another city, including travel for interviews and the time off for the interviews (probably taking an unpaid personal day since they can't schedule an interview a few months in advance). And if their prospects aren't going to improve anywhere within a 2-3 hour radius...yeah, good luck with that. Those kinds of arguments fall apart so easily because they don't hold up in the real world for the vast majority of people in this kind of situation.

 

[Cesar R M]

1000x the bolded.

The amount of lower end jobs on the pay scale here creates a situation where even the typically higher pay positions a step or two up can be underpaid relatively because of the larger pool of excess supply for those positions (which are naturally progressively fewer). Of course, many will then say "Just move somewhere else where there is a job." Ok, the person making below that median income level of $23k (because those are the people we're really talking about, here, those making under $20k/year) is just going to be able to afford to job hunt in another city, including travel for interviews and the time off for the interviews (probably taking an unpaid personal day since they can't schedule an interview a few months in advance). And if their prospects aren't going to improve anywhere within a 2-3 hour radius...yeah, good luck with that. Those kinds of arguments fall apart so easily because they don't hold up in the real world for the vast majority of people in this kind of situation.

Not to mention the costs of moving if you are hired.
Renting a house or having to sell your older one(with the current weak but recovering house market), the move trip.. buy new things, furniture ..etc..
Worse when you have a family, as you have to move the children from their schools and other things.


People throw the "just get a new job, or go find other job somewhere else" way too easily.

 

[englanddg]

Median Per Capita.

Do not be blinded by lies and damned statistics. <grin>

Orlando (for the limited area surveyed which only includes Orlando city limits, not suburbs (like Windermere where the median household income is 85k and Pine Castle where the median household income is 63k, etc...etc...none of those areas are included in the BLS data, since they are not officially "Orlando"), indeed has a per capita MEDIAN (median != mean) income of ~23k.

But, it had a median household income of 40k.

Is that awesome? Not really. But, it's far from destitute. It's only 4k less than the statewide median (so, I don't think the issue is limited to "Orlando only having service jobs"...

Median numbers in Florida as a whole (and Orlando) are largely even with Idaho and a vast majority of the country and better than many states.

The only states that really buck this trend are...

NYC (Not the state, the city), New Jersey, Delaware, Maryland and Virginia (yep, not California, though I'm sure if California were broken down into smaller states the way the East Coast is, you'd see the same concentrations of wealth).

The point is, don't be emotionally blinded by a statistic without researching the numbers.

 

[englanddg]

Not to mention the costs of moving if you are hired.
Renting a house or having to sell your older one(with the current weak but recovering house market), the move trip.. buy new things, furniture ..etc..
Worse when you have a family, as you have to move the children from their schools and other things.


People throw the "just get a new job, or go find other job somewhere else" way too easily.

I don't. I am that guy. Been there, done that, walked the walk, and may have to again sometime.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Median Per Capita.

Do not be blinded by lies and damned statistics. <grin>

Orlando (for the limited area surveyed which only includes Orlando city limits, not suburbs (like Windermere where the median household income is 85k and Pine Castle where the median household income is 63k, etc...etc...none of those areas are included in the BLS data, since they are not officially "Orlando"), indeed has a per capita MEDIAN (median != mean) income of ~23k.

But, it had a median household income of 40k.

Is that awesome? Not really. But, it's far from destitute. It's only 4k less than the statewide median (so, I don't think the issue is limited to "Orlando only having service jobs"...

Median numbers in Florida as a whole (and Orlando) are largely even with Idaho and a vast majority of the country and better than many states.

The only states that really buck this trend are...

NYC (Not the state, the city), New Jersey, Delaware, Maryland and Virginia (yep, not California, though I'm sure if California were broken down into smaller states the way the East Coast is, you'd see the same concentrations of wealth).

The point is, don't be emotionally blinded by a statistic without researching the numbers.

Well 46k is the median income for the entire area.

 

[englanddg]

For comparison...

Albany, NY has a per capita income of 21k, and a household median of 37k.
Brooklyn, NY has a per capita income of 24k, and a household median of 43k.
Dallas, TX has a per capita income of 26k, and a household median of 41k.
Anaheim, CA (where Disneyland is) has a per capita income of 22k, and a household median of 57k.

Like I said...lies and damned statistics.

 

[englanddg]

Well 46k is the median income for the entire area.

So, the Orlando area median is 2k higher than the statewide average?

See what I just posted a minute ago comparing median incomes to other parts of the country and tell me how "poor" Orlando is again?

 

[PhotoDave219]

So, the Orlando area median is 2k higher than the statewide average?

See what I just posted a minute ago comparing median incomes to other parts of the country and tell me how "poor" Orlando is again?

Well if you take the islesworth & Windermere area out.... Then it drops in a hurry.

 

[englanddg]

Well if you take the islesworth & Windermere area out.... Then it drops in a hurry.

And if you toss in Lake Butter and Bay Hill it shoots right back up.

 

[Phil12]

For comparison...


Anaheim, CA (where Disneyland is) has a per capita income of 22k, and a household median of 57k.

I think the free love movement started there...

 

[Gabe1]

1000x the bolded.

The amount of lower end jobs on the pay scale here creates a situation where even the typically higher pay positions a step or two up can be underpaid relatively because of the larger pool of excess supply for those positions (which are naturally progressively fewer). Of course, many will then say "Just move somewhere else where there is a job." Ok, the person making below that median income level of $23k (because those are the people we're really talking about, here, those making under $20k/year) is just going to be able to afford to job hunt in another city, including travel for interviews and the time off for the interviews (probably taking an unpaid personal day since they can't schedule an interview a few months in advance). And if their prospects aren't going to improve anywhere within a 2-3 hour radius...yeah, good luck with that. Those kinds of arguments fall apart so easily because they don't hold up in the real world for the vast majority of people in this kind of situation.

So true. With this last recession I saw more people in my age group find out first hand after loosing a great job what it was like to go from upper middle class to grocery bagger in a years time or so. Kinda knocked the smug right out of some of them.

We have just seen our last kid graduate college, nine years of this with little Disney during this span. This April my DD and I went and the first restaurant we hit was Pecos Bill. Each line out the door, no empty tables and it wasn't Spring Break or Easter weeks. The amount of money churned per minute in that venue, it is difficult for me to comprehend why these workers earn as little as they do. And yet the fan base expects and demands the smiling happy CM or guests turn on them.

 

[PhotoDave219]

And if you toss in Lake Butter and Bay Hill it shoots right back up.

Interesting coincidence… I was just in Bayhill the other day from work…