Disney revises guns-to-work policy (myFOXOrlando)

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yankspy

Well-Known Member
Since you clearly had nothing to say, why did you even bother replying...or am I not allowed to even reply to a thread because you don't think my response is long enough?
Your reply was political in nature and so I believe it was against forum rules. Now I am not a Mod. but it just seemed funny how you believe that your extreme opinion trumps another extreme opinion. Extremists are bad on either side. I am not necessarily saying that you are one, I am simply saying that you seem to have a very authorative opinion about this matter, and have offered no real logical explanation for it. You said that guns were illegal at the founding of our country. What specifically are you refering to? BTW, no reason to bash me, I have plenty to say, I just try to never get personal, it clouds logic.
 

SleepingMonk

Well-Known Member
Not having read the ENITIRE thread, but I swear, some pro-gun people act as if they live in the middle of a war zone. The odds that the average person will need a gun for protection are lower in places with gun bans, and having one may end up being worse than not having one. That said the odds that the average person will need a gun for protection in places that allow guns isn't much higher than without. Either way the odds of the average person needing a gun for protection are pretty low. Arming "innocent" people isn't going to make anyone safer. It may cause petty crime to decrease, but won't have much affect on intentional violent crime (in other words, a mugger most likely wouldn't kill you unless provoked, so might not mug you if he thinks you are armed. But if you are specifically targeted, it won't stop him).

Pro-gun people act as if in the good 'ol days people walked around packing heat...well it was illegal at the founding of our country so it should be now. We had no national military...the average citizens needed weapons in case the country to went to war or there was an uprising. They had the added benefit of protecting ones home and hunting for food. The idea that you need to travel around the country with one is ridiculous, and you most certainly don't need to bring one with you to work.

Yes there are bad people out there. No gun bans won't stop them from using guns. But ordinary citizens cannot be trusted to do what is right. Unfortunately there are bad people in this world who are going to always do what they do. Arming the citizenry isn't going to stop them. How long before we hear about teachers shooting students in Texas because they were reaching for a cell phone but the teacher thought it was a gun?



Sorry but your facts are wrong, your stats are wrong and your opinion is contrary to both the constitution and basic civil liberties. Thank God the Supreme Court of the United States knows just a bit more about the issues than you and recently affirmed that fact.





... But ordinary citizens cannot be trusted to do what is right...

I'm sure Stalin, Lenin and Mao would agree with you 100%.
 

yankspy

Well-Known Member
Not having read the ENITIRE thread, but I swear, some pro-gun people act as if they live in the middle of a war zone. The odds that the average person will need a gun for protection are lower in places with gun bans, and having one may end up being worse than not having one. That said the odds that the average person will need a gun for protection in places that allow guns isn't much higher than without. Either way the odds of the average person needing a gun for protection are pretty low. Arming "innocent" people isn't going to make anyone safer. It may cause petty crime to decrease, but won't have much affect on intentional violent crime (in other words, a mugger most likely wouldn't kill you unless provoked, so might not mug you if he thinks you are armed. But if you are specifically targeted, it won't stop him).

Pro-gun people act as if in the good 'ol days people walked around packing heat...well it was illegal at the founding of our country so it should be now. We had no national military...the average citizens needed weapons in case the country to went to war or there was an uprising. They had the added benefit of protecting ones home and hunting for food. The idea that you need to travel around the country with one is ridiculous, and you most certainly don't need to bring one with you to work.

Yes there are bad people out there. No gun bans won't stop them from using guns. But ordinary citizens cannot be trusted to do what is right. Unfortunately there are bad people in this world who are going to always do what they do. Arming the citizenry isn't going to stop them. How long before we hear about teachers shooting students in Texas because they were reaching for a cell phone but the teacher thought it was a gun?

There are many valid arguments to this issue on both sides. You are not going to come up with the answer in three paragraphs.

Since you clearly had nothing to say, why did you even bother replying...or am I not allowed to even reply to a thread because you don't think my response is long enough?

Your reply was political in nature and so I believe it was against forum rules. Now I am not a Mod. but it just seemed funny how you believe that your extreme opinion trumps another extreme opinion. Extremists are bad on either side. I am not necessarily saying that you are one, I am simply saying that you seem to have a very authorative opinion about this matter, and have offered no real logical explanation for it. You said that guns were illegal at the founding of our country. What specifically are you refering to? BTW, no reason to bash me, I have plenty to say, I just try to never get personal, it clouds logic.

Sorry but your facts are wrong, your stats are wrong and your opinion is contrary to both the constitution and basic civil liberties. Thank God the Supreme Court of the United States knows just a bit more about the issues than you and recently affirmed that fact.







I'm sure Stalin, Lenin and Mao would agree with you 100%.

This is exactly the point that I was trying to make. Why is it impossible for adults to engage in the civil exchange of ideas. It turns into bashing and then it becomes a useless conversation where no one learns anything. :shrug:
 

dox

New Member
This thread is now going on 9 pages and it is just a rehash of prior arguments from months past. Disney has not...repeat has not...changed their no guns at work policy with respect to the WDW property. The rule change was only about property off of WDW property.

This thread is getting nastier by the moment with folks calling others communists or fascists. Enough already. Just because you disagree with someone there is no need to lower the discourse solely because you feel safe hiding behind the anonymity of the internet.
 

yankspy

Well-Known Member
Understood.

Perhaps I should have simply asked for cites with research statistics to confirm the various "odds are" statements in his post.
No worries. It is actually an interesting conversation. I for one am curious as to what is meant by the "guns being illegal at the founding" statement.
 

dox

New Member
Well, when you think someone's opinion is wrong, sure...go ahead and state your response. But when you respond by lobbing an insult you are being nasty and you are bashing someone.

Plus not sure where you (or anyone for that matter) would get the gaul to call anyone's opinion on this issue whether pro or anti gun control "ill informed" given the incredible amount of litigation on this issue and no clear direction on the issue from the papers of the framers of the Constitution. Even the founding fathers disagreed as to the intent of the 2nd amendment. Plus the Supreme Court decision was a 5 - 4 decision and even among the majority there were areas of disagreement.

All i am asking is for you not to lower the level of discourse. There have been plenty of other posts by pro-gun supporters on this thread who have not stooped to the level of calling the pro-gun control crowd the names of communists dictators who each slaughtered their own people. Those aren't names to exactly throw about on a Disney World message board.

Have a magical day!
 

SleepingMonk

Well-Known Member
...Plus not sure where you (or anyone for that matter) would get the gaul to call anyone's opinion on this issue whether pro or anti gun control "ill informed"...



I used the term ill-informed in reference to these statements....

...The odds that the average person will need a gun for protection are lower in places with gun bans....

...the odds that the average person will need a gun for protection in places that allow guns isn't much higher than without...

...the odds of the average person needing a gun for protection are pretty low....

...Arming "innocent" people isn't going to make anyone safer. It may cause petty crime to decrease, but won't have much affect on intentional violent crime...



I welcome Fosse to provide us with credible research to support those claims.
 

SleepingMonk

Well-Known Member
...All i am asking is for you not to lower the level of discourse. There have been plenty of other posts by pro-gun supporters on this thread who have not stooped to the level of calling the pro-gun control crowd the names of communists dictators who each slaughtered their own people...



I didn't call anyone a name, I simply said there were other historic figures who held similar opinions.

For example...

"We don't let them have ideas. Why would we let them have guns?"
Joseph Stalin, 1949
 

kimmychad

Member
I meant that if you didn't know how to handle a gun properly (and check to make sure it isn't loaded) you should notify a professional, such as a police officer, so that he/she could take it away safely.

The NRA also has a list of certified instructors who would also be able to check the gun for you, if it weren't an emergency. I'm thinking more in terms a deceased, ill, etc family member has guns in the house, and you want to remove them.

oh ok excellent points mom
 

Fordlover

Active Member
What a great model for us all... holding the gun next to his head, with his finger on the trigger, untrained idiot. At least he's not pointing it at his audience, but I feel bad for the lighting guy up in the catwalk...

Say hello to sweetness ;)

SweetnessWhispersSweetNothings.jpg
 

fosse76

Well-Known Member
Sorry but your facts are wrong, your stats are wrong and your opinion is contrary to both the constitution and basic civil liberties. Thank God the Supreme Court of the United States knows just a bit more about the issues than you and recently affirmed that fact.

Nope. You are wrong. While the Supreme Court upheld the right to own guns, they also affirmed that it is not an absolute right and can be regulated. Anyone with any basic understanding of history (which you clearly don't have) knows that many states would not ratify the Constitution unless there was a provision for gun ownership. Since there wasn't a police force as we know it nor was there a national military, the Second Amendment was added. There was much debate about it back then as there is now. For a complete history, check out http://www.guncite.com/journals/vandhist.html#fn* It's pretty informative.


SleepingMonk said:
I welcome Fosse to provide us with credible research to support those claims.

Here you go:
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/guns.htm
 

yankspy

Well-Known Member
Not having read the ENITIRE thread, but I swear, some pro-gun people act as if they live in the middle of a war zone. The odds that the average person will need a gun for protection are lower in places with gun bans, and having one may end up being worse than not having one. That said the odds that the average person will need a gun for protection in places that allow guns isn't much higher than without. Either way the odds of the average person needing a gun for protection are pretty low. Arming "innocent" people isn't going to make anyone safer. It may cause petty crime to decrease, but won't have much affect on intentional violent crime (in other words, a mugger most likely wouldn't kill you unless provoked, so might not mug you if he thinks you are armed. But if you are specifically targeted, it won't stop him).

Pro-gun people act as if in the good 'ol days people walked around packing heat...well it was illegal at the founding of our country so it should be now. We had no national military...the average citizens needed weapons in case the country to went to war or there was an uprising. They had the added benefit of protecting ones home and hunting for food. The idea that you need to travel around the country with one is ridiculous, and you most certainly don't need to bring one with you to work.

Yes there are bad people out there. No gun bans won't stop them from using guns. But ordinary citizens cannot be trusted to do what is right. Unfortunately there are bad people in this world who are going to always do what they do. Arming the citizenry isn't going to stop them. How long before we hear about teachers shooting students in Texas because they were reaching for a cell phone but the teacher thought it was a gun?

Nope. You are wrong. While the Supreme Court upheld the right to own guns, they also affirmed that it is not an absolute right and can be regulated. Anyone with any basic understanding of history (which you clearly don't have) knows that many states would not ratify the Constitution unless there was a provision for gun ownership. Since there wasn't a police force as we know it nor was there a national military, the Second Amendment was added. There was much debate about it back then as there is now. For a complete history, check out http://www.guncite.com/journals/vandhist.html#fn* It's pretty informative.




Here you go:
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/guns.htm
I am confused. That article does not say anything about your first bolded statement. As far as your second statement, I do not know if Sleepingmonk has an understanding of history or not. Before you answer my post, please realize that you talking to a U.S. historian who wrote extensively about the founding period. So I would love to have a civil discussion on the matter and how it involves Disney. However, if you intend to just say "Your wrong" or "you do not know what you are talking about" then forget about it. My point is not to argue, only to exchange ideas.
 

SleepingMonk

Well-Known Member
Nothing regarding the recent Heller case supports your skewed view that...

...But ordinary citizens cannot be trusted to do what is right...


And nothing from the DOJ supports the "odds are" statements in your previous post. Take another week or two to gather your thoughts and try again.
 
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