News Disney mask policy at Walt Disney World theme parks

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bdearl41

bdearl41

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Florida Man

Active Member
I stopped watching the news back in mid December when omnicron was announced (I couldn’t take it anymore). But by judging from the post on this thread the latest thing is N95 masks?
 
bdearl41

bdearl41

Well-Known Member
DISNEYRULES!!! said:
I stopped watching the news back in mid December when omnicron was announced (I couldn’t take it anymore). But by judging from the post on this thread the latest thing is N95 masks?
Click to expand...
Yea basically that they’re the only masks that work against Omicromi
 
CaptainAmerica

CaptainAmerica

Premium Member
durangojim said:
I know I’m wasting breath, but I still don’t get it. Why are people so opposed to wearing a mask or having kids wear one? The CO2 myth is garbage and has been debunked. The psychological affects are dubious at best, the idea that masks do nothing is nonsense. To break it down in simple terms - we cover our mouths when we cough or sneeze to DECREASE the transmission of germs. Not prevent any spread. According to antimaksers’ logic we shouldn’t be doing that because it doesn’t completely stop the spread, we also shouldn’t wash our hands because there’s still a fraction of a percent of germs that are missed. When my patients tell me that they can’t wear a mask, unless the have significant respiratory disease, I let them know that they are able to and explain why. If they tell me I’m wrong I tell them to put their masks on anyway.
Click to expand...
How old are your kids?

I'm on the board of directors at a preschool and the language development of our students with mandatory masking is shockingly bad. Try teaching a four year old the difference in pronunciation of "thirteen" and "fourteen" without them being able to see your mouth or you see theirs.

The biggest thing I have a problem with is the age. If the minimum age for masking was 5, I wouldn't like it but it wouldn't bother me AS much. Masking 2 year olds is completely insane and is disconnected from what the entire rest of the world does.
 
dovetail65

dovetail65

Well-Known Member
CaptainAmerica said:
The only way it's going to spread through droplets is like... if you're standing under a tall guy or someone sneezes directly in your face. Respiratory droplets fall to the ground/floor almost immediately.
Click to expand...
AH NO! This is typical taking one thing, but applying it wrong, just because the large droplet fall does not mean the virus falls.

Only the large particles fall. Possibly you read or saw what I saw made up by a right wing publication that made all these scientific statements about droplets falling to the ground, but they never mentioned what happen to the smaller particles they never even said there were smaller particles.

We may have knowledge gaps, but we need use common sense. Since we were 5 years old mom said hey they are sick or they have a cold cover your mouth or stay away from them, but do not let them breathe on you. Why all of a sudden in 2022 is it that grown adults would say the air droplet's out of the mouth fall right to the ground making an inference that no one next to me or I can not get sick from being breathed on. For over 100 years we have known that a sick person can infect another from being near them. All of a sudden in 2022 people are arguing that for some reason only Covid can not be transmitted that way and that for some reason though we Dr's and other fields wear mask for filtration, that for Covid is just doesn't work? This is weird, it is strange, it is ridiculous and even disconcerting that people believe today believe that if one person is infected with anything transmissible that both people wearing a mask is not better than no masks. Even though we know that things like the flu and many other virus etc travel through the breath infecting others like dominoes infecting everyone near them, some in 2022 believe that for some reason that Covid does not do that or that. Anti maskers and anti vaxxers seem to believe they have right, like cigarette smokers once thought they had, that they should be be allowed to breath on others when they can "potentially " get another sick. Forget the science, let's just think a minute.

Despite these knowledge gaps, the available evidence continues to demonstrate that existing recommendations to prevent SARS-CoV-2 transmission remain effective. These include physical distancing, community use of well-fitting masks (e.g., barrier face coverings, procedure/surgical masks), adequate ventilation, and avoidance of crowded indoor spaces. These methods will reduce transmission both from inhalation of virus and deposition of virus on exposed mucous membranes.

FROM the CDC:

1) aerosol particles formed when these fine droplets rapidly dry, are small enough that they can remain suspended in the air for minutes to hours.

2) The droplets or aerosol particles vary across a wide range of sizes – from visible to microscopic(these DO NOT DROP RIGHT TO THE GROUND)

3)Transmission of COVID-19 from inhalation of virus in the air can occur at distances greater than six feet.

From the EPA:

Spread of COVID-19 occurs via airborne particles and droplets. People who are infected with COVID can release particles and droplets of respiratory fluids that contain the SARS CoV-2 virus into the air when they exhale (e.g., quiet breathing, speaking, singing, exercise, coughing, sneezing). The droplets or aerosol particles vary across a wide range of sizes – from visible to microscopic(these DO NOT DROP RIGHT TO THE GROUND). Once infectious droplets and particles are exhaled, they move outward from the person (the source). These droplets carry the virus and transmit infection. Indoors, the very fine droplets and particles will continue to spread through the air in the room or space and can accumulate.

Since COVID-19 is transmitted through contact with respiratory fluids carrying the infectious SARS-CoV-2 virus, a person can be exposed by an infected person coughing or speaking near them. They can also be exposed by inhaling aerosol particles that are spreading away from the infected person. Transmission of COVID-19 from inhalation of virus in the air can occur at distances greater than six feet.

FROM the CDC:

SARS-CoV-2 is transmitted by exposure to infectious respiratory fluids

The principal mode by which people are infected with SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19) is through exposure to respiratory fluids carrying infectious virus. Exposure occurs in three principal ways: (1) inhalation of very fine respiratory droplets and aerosol particles, (2) deposition of respiratory droplets and particles on exposed mucous membranes in the mouth, nose, or eye by direct splashes and sprays, and (3) touching mucous membranes with hands that have been soiled either directly by virus-containing respiratory fluids or indirectly by touching surfaces with virus on them.


People release respiratory fluids during exhalation (e.g., quiet breathing, speaking, singing, exercise, coughing, sneezing) in the form of droplets across a spectrum of sizes.1-9 These droplets carry virus and transmit infection.

  • The largest droplets settle out of the air rapidly, within seconds to minutes.
  • The smallest very fine droplets, and aerosol particles formed when these fine droplets rapidly dry, are small enough that they can remain suspended in the air for minutes to hours.

Infectious exposures to respiratory fluids carrying SARS-CoV-2 occur in three principal ways (not mutually exclusive):

  1. Inhalation of air carrying very small fine droplets and aerosol particles that contain infectious virus. Risk of transmission is greatest within three to six feet of an infectious source where the concentration of these very fine droplets and particles is greatest.
  2. Deposition of virus carried in exhaled droplets and particles onto exposed mucous membranes (i.e., “splashes and sprays”, such as being coughed on). Risk of transmission is likewise greatest close to an infectious source where the concentration of these exhaled droplets and particles is greatest.
  3. Touching mucous membranes with hands soiled by exhaled respiratory fluids containing virus or from touching inanimate surfaces contaminated with virus.

The risk of SARS-CoV-2 infection varies according to the amount of virus to which a person is exposed

Once infectious droplets and particles are exhaled, they move outward from the source. The risk for infection decreases with increasing distance from the source and increasing time after exhalation. Two principal processes determine the amount of virus to which a person is exposed in the air or by touching a surface contaminated by virus:


  1. Decreasing concentration of virus in the air as larger and heavier respiratory droplets containing virus fall to the ground or other surfaces under the force of gravity and the very fine droplets and aerosol particles that remain in the airstream progressively mix with, and become diluted within, the growing volume and streams of air they encounter. This mixing is not necessarily uniform and can be influenced by thermal layering and initial jetting of exhalations.
  2. Progressive loss of viral viability and infectiousness over time influenced by environmental factors such as temperature, humidity, and ultraviolet radiation (e.g., sunlight).

Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 from inhalation of virus in the air farther than six feet from an infectious source can occur​


With increasing distance from the source, the role of inhalation likewise increases. Although infections through inhalation at distances greater than six feet from an infectious source are less likely than at closer distances, the phenomenon has been repeatedly documented under certain preventable circumstances.10-21 These transmission events have involved the presence of an infectious person exhaling virus indoors for an extended time (more than 15 minutes and in some cases hours) leading to virus concentrations in the air space sufficient to transmit infections to people more than 6 feet away, and in some cases to people who have passed through that space soon after the infectious person left. Per published reports, factors that increase the risk of SARS-CoV-2 infection under these circumstances include:


  • Enclosed spaces with inadequate ventilation or air handling within which the concentration of exhaled respiratory fluids, especially very fine droplets and aerosol particles, can build-up in the air space.
  • Increased exhalation of respiratory fluids if the infectious person is engaged in physical exertion or raises their voice (e.g., exercising, shouting, singing).
  • Prolonged exposure to these conditions, typically more than 15 minutes.



Top of Page

References​


  1. Stadnytskyi V, Bax CE, Bax A, Anfinrud P. The airborne lifetime of small speech droplets and their potential importance in SARS-CoV-2 transmission. Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. Jun 2 2020;117(22):11875-11877. doi:10.1073/pnas.2006874117
  2. Alsved M, Matamis A, Bohlin R, et al. Exhaled respiratory particles during singing and talking. Aerosol Science and Technology. 2020;54(11):1245-1248. doi:10.1080/02786826.2020.1812502
  3. Echternach M, Gantner S, Peters G, et al. Impulse Dispersion of Aerosols during Singing and Speaking: A Potential COVID-19 Transmission Pathway. Am J Respir Crit Care Med. Dec 1 2020;202(11):1584-1587. doi:10.1164/rccm.202009-3438LE
  4. Asadi S, Wexler AS, Cappa CD, Barreda S, Bouvier NM, Ristenpart WD. Aerosol emission and superemission during human speech increase with voice loudness. Sci Rep. Feb 20 2019;9(1):2348. doi:10.1038/s41598-019-38808-z
  5. Asadi S, Wexler AS, Cappa CD, Barreda S, Bouvier NM, Ristenpart WD. Effect of voicing and articulation manner on aerosol particle emission during human speech. PLoS One. 2020;15(1):e0227699. doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0227699
  6. Morawska L., Johnson GR, Ristovski ZD, et al. Size distribution and sites of origin of droplets expelled from the human respiratory tract during expiratory activities. Aerosol Sci. 2009;40(3):256-269.
  7. Buonanno G, Stabile L, Morawska L. Estimation of airborne viral emission: Quanta emission rate of SARS-CoV-2 for infection risk assessment. Environment international. May 11 2020;141:105794. doi:https://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.envint.2020.105794external icon
  8. Papineni RS, Rosenthal FS. The size distribution of droplets in the exhaled breath of healthy human subjects. J Aerosol Med. Summer 1997;10(2):105-16. doi:10.1089/jam.1997.10.105
  9. Edwards DA, Ausiello D, Salzman J, et al. Exhaled aerosol increases with COVID-19 infection, age, and obesity. Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. Feb 23 2021;118(8)doi:10.1073/pnas.2021830118
  10. Bae S, Kim H, Jung TY, et al. Epidemiological Characteristics of COVID-19 Outbreak at Fitness Centers in Cheonan, Korea. J Korean Med Sci. Aug 10 2020;35(31):e288. doi:10.3346/jkms.2020.35.e288
  11. Brlek A, Vidovic S, Vuzem S, Turk K, Simonovic Z. Possible indirect transmission of COVID-19 at a squash court, Slovenia, March 2020: case report. Epidemiol Infect. Jun 19 2020;148:e120. doi:10.1017/S0950268820001326
  12. Cai J, Sun W, Huang J, Gamber M, Wu J, He G. Indirect Virus Transmission in Cluster of COVID-19 Cases, Wenzhou, China, 2020. Emerging infectious diseases. Mar 12 2020;26(6):12. doi:https://dx.doi.org/10.3201/eid2606.200412external icon
  13. Shen Y, Li C, Dong H, et al. Community Outbreak Investigation of SARS-CoV-2 Transmission Among Bus Riders in Eastern China. JAMA Intern Med. Dec 1 2020;180(12):1665-1671. doi:10.1001/jamainternmed.2020.5225
  14. Groves LM, Usagawa L, Elm J, et al. Community Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 at Three Fitness Facilities — Hawaii, June–July 2020. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. Feb 24 2021;70(Early Release)
  15. Hamner L, Dubbel P, Capron I, et al. High SARS-CoV-2 Attack Rate Following Exposure at a Choir Practice – Skagit County, Washington, March 2020. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. May 15 2020;69(19):606-610. doi:10.15585/mmwr.mm6919e6
  16. Jang S, Han SH, Rhee JY. Cluster of Coronavirus Disease Associated with Fitness Dance Classes, South Korea. Emerg Infect Dis. Aug 2020;26(8):1917-1920. doi:10.3201/eid2608.200633
  17. Lendacki FR, Teran RA, Gretsch S, Fricchione MJ, Kerins JL. COVID-19 Outbreak Among Attendees of an Exercise Facility — Chicago, Illinois, August–September 2020. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. Feb 24 2021;70(Early Release)
  18. Li Y, Qian H, Hang J, et al. Probable airborne transmission of SARS-CoV-2 in a poorly ventilated restaurant. Build Environ. Jun 2021;196:107788. doi:10.1016/j.buildenv.2021.107788
  19. Lu J, Gu J, Li K, et al. COVID-19 Outbreak Associated with Air Conditioning in Restaurant, Guangzhou, China, 2020. Emerging infectious diseases. Apr 2 2020;26(7)doi:10.3201/eid2607.200764
  20. Katelaris AL, Wells J, Clark P, et al. Epidemiologic Evidence for Airborne Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 during Church Singing, Australia, 2020. Emerg Infect Dis. Apr 5 2021;27(6)doi:10.3201/eid2706.210465
  21. Charlotte N. High Rate of SARS-CoV-2 Transmission Due to Choir Practice in France at the Beginning of the COVID-19 Pandemic. J Voice. Dec 23 2020;doi:10.1016/j.jvoice.2020.11.029
  22. Shi J, Wen Z, Zhong G, et al. Susceptibility of ferrets, cats, dogs, and other domesticated animals to SARS–coronavirus 2. Science. 2020:eabb7015. doi:10.1126/science.abb7015
  23. Kim YI, Kim SG, Kim SM, et al. Infection and Rapid Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 in Ferrets. Cell host & microbe. Apr 5 2020;doi:10.1016/j.chom.2020.03.023
  24. Kutter JS, de Meulder D, Bestebroer TM, et al. SARS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2 are transmitted through the air between ferrets over more than one meter distance. Nat Commun. Mar 12 2021;12(1):1653. doi:10.1038/s41467-021-21918-6
  25. Klompas M, Baker MA, Rhee C, et al. A SARS-CoV-2 Cluster in an Acute Care Hospital. Ann Intern Med. Feb 9 2021;doi:10.7326/M20-7567
 
Last edited:
King Panda 77

King Panda 77

Thank you sir. You were an inspiration.
Premium Member
dovetail65 said:
AH NO! This is typical taking one thing, but applying it wrong, just because the large droplet fall does not mean the virus falls.

Only the large particles fall. Possibly you read or saw what I saw made up by a right wing publication that made all these scientific statements about droplets falling to the ground, but they never mentioned what happen to the smaller particles they never even said there were smaller particles.

We may have knowledge gaps, but we need use common sense. Since we were 5 years old mom said hey they are sick or they have a cold cover your mouth or stay away from them a but, do not let them breathe on you. Why all of a sudden in 2022 is it that grown adults would say the air droplet out of my mouth fall right to the ground making an inference that no one next to me or I can not get sick from being breathed on. Even though for over 100 years we have known that a sick person can infect another from being near them , all of a sudden in 2022 only Covid can not be transmitted that way. This though is weird, it is strange, it is ridiculous and even disconcerting that people can actually believe in current times that if one person is infected that both people wearing a masks have a far less likely chance of getting the sickness than if both do wear a mask. Even though we know that things like the flu and many other virus etc travel through the breath infecting others like dominoes infecting everyone near them that Covid does not do that. Forget the science, let's just think a minute.


Despite these knowledge gaps, the available evidence continues to demonstrate that existing recommendations to prevent SARS-CoV-2 transmission remain effective. These include physical distancing, community use of well-fitting masks (e.g., barrier face coverings, procedure/surgical masks), adequate ventilation, and avoidance of crowded indoor spaces. These methods will reduce transmission both from inhalation of virus and deposition of virus on exposed mucous membranes.

FROM the CDC:

1) aerosol particles formed when these fine droplets rapidly dry, are small enough that they can remain suspended in the air for minutes to hours.

2) The droplets or aerosol particles vary across a wide range of sizes – from visible to microscopic(these DO NOT DROP RIGHT TO THE GROUND)

3)Transmission of COVID-19 from inhalation of virus in the air can occur at distances greater than six feet.

From the EPA:

Spread of COVID-19 occurs via airborne particles and droplets. People who are infected with COVID can release particles and droplets of respiratory fluids that contain the SARS CoV-2 virus into the air when they exhale (e.g., quiet breathing, speaking, singing, exercise, coughing, sneezing). The droplets or aerosol particles vary across a wide range of sizes – from visible to microscopic(these DO NOT DROP RIGHT TO THE GROUND). Once infectious droplets and particles are exhaled, they move outward from the person (the source). These droplets carry the virus and transmit infection. Indoors, the very fine droplets and particles will continue to spread through the air in the room or space and can accumulate.

Since COVID-19 is transmitted through contact with respiratory fluids carrying the infectious SARS-CoV-2 virus, a person can be exposed by an infected person coughing or speaking near them. They can also be exposed by inhaling aerosol particles that are spreading away from the infected person. Transmission of COVID-19 from inhalation of virus in the air can occur at distances greater than six feet.

FROM the CDC:

SARS-CoV-2 is transmitted by exposure to infectious respiratory fluids

The principal mode by which people are infected with SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19) is through exposure to respiratory fluids carrying infectious virus. Exposure occurs in three principal ways: (1) inhalation of very fine respiratory droplets and aerosol particles, (2) deposition of respiratory droplets and particles on exposed mucous membranes in the mouth, nose, or eye by direct splashes and sprays, and (3) touching mucous membranes with hands that have been soiled either directly by virus-containing respiratory fluids or indirectly by touching surfaces with virus on them.


People release respiratory fluids during exhalation (e.g., quiet breathing, speaking, singing, exercise, coughing, sneezing) in the form of droplets across a spectrum of sizes.1-9 These droplets carry virus and transmit infection.

  • The largest droplets settle out of the air rapidly, within seconds to minutes.
  • The smallest very fine droplets, and aerosol particles formed when these fine droplets rapidly dry, are small enough that they can remain suspended in the air for minutes to hours.

Infectious exposures to respiratory fluids carrying SARS-CoV-2 occur in three principal ways (not mutually exclusive):

  1. Inhalation of air carrying very small fine droplets and aerosol particles that contain infectious virus. Risk of transmission is greatest within three to six feet of an infectious source where the concentration of these very fine droplets and particles is greatest.
  2. Deposition of virus carried in exhaled droplets and particles onto exposed mucous membranes (i.e., “splashes and sprays”, such as being coughed on). Risk of transmission is likewise greatest close to an infectious source where the concentration of these exhaled droplets and particles is greatest.
  3. Touching mucous membranes with hands soiled by exhaled respiratory fluids containing virus or from touching inanimate surfaces contaminated with virus.

The risk of SARS-CoV-2 infection varies according to the amount of virus to which a person is exposed

Once infectious droplets and particles are exhaled, they move outward from the source. The risk for infection decreases with increasing distance from the source and increasing time after exhalation. Two principal processes determine the amount of virus to which a person is exposed in the air or by touching a surface contaminated by virus:


  1. Decreasing concentration of virus in the air as larger and heavier respiratory droplets containing virus fall to the ground or other surfaces under the force of gravity and the very fine droplets and aerosol particles that remain in the airstream progressively mix with, and become diluted within, the growing volume and streams of air they encounter. This mixing is not necessarily uniform and can be influenced by thermal layering and initial jetting of exhalations.
  2. Progressive loss of viral viability and infectiousness over time influenced by environmental factors such as temperature, humidity, and ultraviolet radiation (e.g., sunlight).

Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 from inhalation of virus in the air farther than six feet from an infectious source can occur​


With increasing distance from the source, the role of inhalation likewise increases. Although infections through inhalation at distances greater than six feet from an infectious source are less likely than at closer distances, the phenomenon has been repeatedly documented under certain preventable circumstances.10-21 These transmission events have involved the presence of an infectious person exhaling virus indoors for an extended time (more than 15 minutes and in some cases hours) leading to virus concentrations in the air space sufficient to transmit infections to people more than 6 feet away, and in some cases to people who have passed through that space soon after the infectious person left. Per published reports, factors that increase the risk of SARS-CoV-2 infection under these circumstances include:


  • Enclosed spaces with inadequate ventilation or air handling within which the concentration of exhaled respiratory fluids, especially very fine droplets and aerosol particles, can build-up in the air space.
  • Increased exhalation of respiratory fluids if the infectious person is engaged in physical exertion or raises their voice (e.g., exercising, shouting, singing).
  • Prolonged exposure to these conditions, typically more than 15 minutes.



Top of Page

References​


  1. Stadnytskyi V, Bax CE, Bax A, Anfinrud P. The airborne lifetime of small speech droplets and their potential importance in SARS-CoV-2 transmission. Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. Jun 2 2020;117(22):11875-11877. doi:10.1073/pnas.2006874117
  2. Alsved M, Matamis A, Bohlin R, et al. Exhaled respiratory particles during singing and talking. Aerosol Science and Technology. 2020;54(11):1245-1248. doi:10.1080/02786826.2020.1812502
  3. Echternach M, Gantner S, Peters G, et al. Impulse Dispersion of Aerosols during Singing and Speaking: A Potential COVID-19 Transmission Pathway. Am J Respir Crit Care Med. Dec 1 2020;202(11):1584-1587. doi:10.1164/rccm.202009-3438LE
  4. Asadi S, Wexler AS, Cappa CD, Barreda S, Bouvier NM, Ristenpart WD. Aerosol emission and superemission during human speech increase with voice loudness. Sci Rep. Feb 20 2019;9(1):2348. doi:10.1038/s41598-019-38808-z
  5. Asadi S, Wexler AS, Cappa CD, Barreda S, Bouvier NM, Ristenpart WD. Effect of voicing and articulation manner on aerosol particle emission during human speech. PLoS One. 2020;15(1):e0227699. doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0227699
  6. Morawska L., Johnson GR, Ristovski ZD, et al. Size distribution and sites of origin of droplets expelled from the human respiratory tract during expiratory activities. Aerosol Sci. 2009;40(3):256-269.
  7. Buonanno G, Stabile L, Morawska L. Estimation of airborne viral emission: Quanta emission rate of SARS-CoV-2 for infection risk assessment. Environment international. May 11 2020;141:105794. doi:https://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.envint.2020.105794external icon
  8. Papineni RS, Rosenthal FS. The size distribution of droplets in the exhaled breath of healthy human subjects. J Aerosol Med. Summer 1997;10(2):105-16. doi:10.1089/jam.1997.10.105
  9. Edwards DA, Ausiello D, Salzman J, et al. Exhaled aerosol increases with COVID-19 infection, age, and obesity. Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. Feb 23 2021;118(8)doi:10.1073/pnas.2021830118
  10. Bae S, Kim H, Jung TY, et al. Epidemiological Characteristics of COVID-19 Outbreak at Fitness Centers in Cheonan, Korea. J Korean Med Sci. Aug 10 2020;35(31):e288. doi:10.3346/jkms.2020.35.e288
  11. Brlek A, Vidovic S, Vuzem S, Turk K, Simonovic Z. Possible indirect transmission of COVID-19 at a squash court, Slovenia, March 2020: case report. Epidemiol Infect. Jun 19 2020;148:e120. doi:10.1017/S0950268820001326
  12. Cai J, Sun W, Huang J, Gamber M, Wu J, He G. Indirect Virus Transmission in Cluster of COVID-19 Cases, Wenzhou, China, 2020. Emerging infectious diseases. Mar 12 2020;26(6):12. doi:https://dx.doi.org/10.3201/eid2606.200412external icon
  13. Shen Y, Li C, Dong H, et al. Community Outbreak Investigation of SARS-CoV-2 Transmission Among Bus Riders in Eastern China. JAMA Intern Med. Dec 1 2020;180(12):1665-1671. doi:10.1001/jamainternmed.2020.5225
  14. Groves LM, Usagawa L, Elm J, et al. Community Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 at Three Fitness Facilities — Hawaii, June–July 2020. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. Feb 24 2021;70(Early Release)
  15. Hamner L, Dubbel P, Capron I, et al. High SARS-CoV-2 Attack Rate Following Exposure at a Choir Practice – Skagit County, Washington, March 2020. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. May 15 2020;69(19):606-610. doi:10.15585/mmwr.mm6919e6
  16. Jang S, Han SH, Rhee JY. Cluster of Coronavirus Disease Associated with Fitness Dance Classes, South Korea. Emerg Infect Dis. Aug 2020;26(8):1917-1920. doi:10.3201/eid2608.200633
  17. Lendacki FR, Teran RA, Gretsch S, Fricchione MJ, Kerins JL. COVID-19 Outbreak Among Attendees of an Exercise Facility — Chicago, Illinois, August–September 2020. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. Feb 24 2021;70(Early Release)
  18. Li Y, Qian H, Hang J, et al. Probable airborne transmission of SARS-CoV-2 in a poorly ventilated restaurant. Build Environ. Jun 2021;196:107788. doi:10.1016/j.buildenv.2021.107788
  19. Lu J, Gu J, Li K, et al. COVID-19 Outbreak Associated with Air Conditioning in Restaurant, Guangzhou, China, 2020. Emerging infectious diseases. Apr 2 2020;26(7)doi:10.3201/eid2607.200764
  20. Katelaris AL, Wells J, Clark P, et al. Epidemiologic Evidence for Airborne Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 during Church Singing, Australia, 2020. Emerg Infect Dis. Apr 5 2021;27(6)doi:10.3201/eid2706.210465
  21. Charlotte N. High Rate of SARS-CoV-2 Transmission Due to Choir Practice in France at the Beginning of the COVID-19 Pandemic. J Voice. Dec 23 2020;doi:10.1016/j.jvoice.2020.11.029
  22. Shi J, Wen Z, Zhong G, et al. Susceptibility of ferrets, cats, dogs, and other domesticated animals to SARS–coronavirus 2. Science. 2020:eabb7015. doi:10.1126/science.abb7015
  23. Kim YI, Kim SG, Kim SM, et al. Infection and Rapid Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 in Ferrets. Cell host & microbe. Apr 5 2020;doi:10.1016/j.chom.2020.03.023
  24. Kutter JS, de Meulder D, Bestebroer TM, et al. SARS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2 are transmitted through the air between ferrets over more than one meter distance. Nat Commun. Mar 12 2021;12(1):1653. doi:10.1038/s41467-021-21918-6
  25. Klompas M, Baker MA, Rhee C, et al. A SARS-CoV-2 Cluster in an Acute Care Hospital. Ann Intern Med. Feb 9 2021;doi:10.7326/M20-7567
Click to expand...
So taking into account all of this,
When will Disney change their mask mandate ?
 
Incomudro

Incomudro

Well-Known Member
bdearl41 said:
Yea basically that they’re the only masks that work against Omicromi
Click to expand...
They're the only mask that works against virus's.
"Face coverings," surgical masks with huge gaps around them have vert likely been essentially useless in doing what we were asking them to do, in the way that the public was wearing them.
 
Incomudro

Incomudro

Well-Known Member
CaptainAmerica said:
How old are your kids?

I'm on the board of directors at a preschool and the language development of our students with mandatory masking is shockingly bad. Try teaching a four year old the difference in pronunciation of "thirteen" and "fourteen" without them being able to see your mouth or you see theirs.

The biggest thing I have a problem with is the age. If the minimum age for masking was 5, I wouldn't like it but it wouldn't bother me AS much. Masking 2 year olds is completely insane and is disconnected from what the entire rest of the world does.
Click to expand...
It's not a part of natural development for children to not see full human faces.
What we are doing to them is sick and sadistic.
 
CaptainAmerica

CaptainAmerica

Premium Member
dovetail65 said:
AH NO! This is typical taking one thing, but applying it wrong, just because the large droplet fall does not mean the virus falls.

Only the large particles fall. Possibly you read or saw what I saw made up by a right wing publication that made all these scientific statements about droplets falling to the ground, but they never mentioned what happen to the smaller particles they never even said there were smaller particles.

We may have knowledge gaps, but we need use common sense. Since we were 5 years old mom said hey they are sick or they have a cold cover your mouth or stay away from them a but, do not let them breathe on you. Why all of a sudden in 2022 is it that grown adults would say the air droplet out of my mouth fall right to the ground making an inference that no one next to me or I can not get sick from being breathed on. Even though for over 100 years we have known that a sick person can infect another from being near them , all of a sudden in 2022 only Covid can not be transmitted that way. This though is weird, it is strange, it is ridiculous and even disconcerting that people can actually believe in current times that if one person is infected that both people wearing a masks have a far less likely chance of getting the sickness than if both do wear a mask. Even though we know that things like the flu and many other virus etc travel through the breath infecting others like dominoes infecting everyone near them that Covid does not do that. Forget the science, let's just think a minute.


Despite these knowledge gaps, the available evidence continues to demonstrate that existing recommendations to prevent SARS-CoV-2 transmission remain effective. These include physical distancing, community use of well-fitting masks (e.g., barrier face coverings, procedure/surgical masks), adequate ventilation, and avoidance of crowded indoor spaces. These methods will reduce transmission both from inhalation of virus and deposition of virus on exposed mucous membranes.

FROM the CDC:

1) aerosol particles formed when these fine droplets rapidly dry, are small enough that they can remain suspended in the air for minutes to hours.

2) The droplets or aerosol particles vary across a wide range of sizes – from visible to microscopic(these DO NOT DROP RIGHT TO THE GROUND)

3)Transmission of COVID-19 from inhalation of virus in the air can occur at distances greater than six feet.

From the EPA:

Spread of COVID-19 occurs via airborne particles and droplets. People who are infected with COVID can release particles and droplets of respiratory fluids that contain the SARS CoV-2 virus into the air when they exhale (e.g., quiet breathing, speaking, singing, exercise, coughing, sneezing). The droplets or aerosol particles vary across a wide range of sizes – from visible to microscopic(these DO NOT DROP RIGHT TO THE GROUND). Once infectious droplets and particles are exhaled, they move outward from the person (the source). These droplets carry the virus and transmit infection. Indoors, the very fine droplets and particles will continue to spread through the air in the room or space and can accumulate.

Since COVID-19 is transmitted through contact with respiratory fluids carrying the infectious SARS-CoV-2 virus, a person can be exposed by an infected person coughing or speaking near them. They can also be exposed by inhaling aerosol particles that are spreading away from the infected person. Transmission of COVID-19 from inhalation of virus in the air can occur at distances greater than six feet.

FROM the CDC:

SARS-CoV-2 is transmitted by exposure to infectious respiratory fluids

The principal mode by which people are infected with SARS-CoV-2 (the virus that causes COVID-19) is through exposure to respiratory fluids carrying infectious virus. Exposure occurs in three principal ways: (1) inhalation of very fine respiratory droplets and aerosol particles, (2) deposition of respiratory droplets and particles on exposed mucous membranes in the mouth, nose, or eye by direct splashes and sprays, and (3) touching mucous membranes with hands that have been soiled either directly by virus-containing respiratory fluids or indirectly by touching surfaces with virus on them.


People release respiratory fluids during exhalation (e.g., quiet breathing, speaking, singing, exercise, coughing, sneezing) in the form of droplets across a spectrum of sizes.1-9 These droplets carry virus and transmit infection.

  • The largest droplets settle out of the air rapidly, within seconds to minutes.
  • The smallest very fine droplets, and aerosol particles formed when these fine droplets rapidly dry, are small enough that they can remain suspended in the air for minutes to hours.

Infectious exposures to respiratory fluids carrying SARS-CoV-2 occur in three principal ways (not mutually exclusive):

  1. Inhalation of air carrying very small fine droplets and aerosol particles that contain infectious virus. Risk of transmission is greatest within three to six feet of an infectious source where the concentration of these very fine droplets and particles is greatest.
  2. Deposition of virus carried in exhaled droplets and particles onto exposed mucous membranes (i.e., “splashes and sprays”, such as being coughed on). Risk of transmission is likewise greatest close to an infectious source where the concentration of these exhaled droplets and particles is greatest.
  3. Touching mucous membranes with hands soiled by exhaled respiratory fluids containing virus or from touching inanimate surfaces contaminated with virus.

The risk of SARS-CoV-2 infection varies according to the amount of virus to which a person is exposed

Once infectious droplets and particles are exhaled, they move outward from the source. The risk for infection decreases with increasing distance from the source and increasing time after exhalation. Two principal processes determine the amount of virus to which a person is exposed in the air or by touching a surface contaminated by virus:


  1. Decreasing concentration of virus in the air as larger and heavier respiratory droplets containing virus fall to the ground or other surfaces under the force of gravity and the very fine droplets and aerosol particles that remain in the airstream progressively mix with, and become diluted within, the growing volume and streams of air they encounter. This mixing is not necessarily uniform and can be influenced by thermal layering and initial jetting of exhalations.
  2. Progressive loss of viral viability and infectiousness over time influenced by environmental factors such as temperature, humidity, and ultraviolet radiation (e.g., sunlight).

Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 from inhalation of virus in the air farther than six feet from an infectious source can occur​


With increasing distance from the source, the role of inhalation likewise increases. Although infections through inhalation at distances greater than six feet from an infectious source are less likely than at closer distances, the phenomenon has been repeatedly documented under certain preventable circumstances.10-21 These transmission events have involved the presence of an infectious person exhaling virus indoors for an extended time (more than 15 minutes and in some cases hours) leading to virus concentrations in the air space sufficient to transmit infections to people more than 6 feet away, and in some cases to people who have passed through that space soon after the infectious person left. Per published reports, factors that increase the risk of SARS-CoV-2 infection under these circumstances include:


  • Enclosed spaces with inadequate ventilation or air handling within which the concentration of exhaled respiratory fluids, especially very fine droplets and aerosol particles, can build-up in the air space.
  • Increased exhalation of respiratory fluids if the infectious person is engaged in physical exertion or raises their voice (e.g., exercising, shouting, singing).
  • Prolonged exposure to these conditions, typically more than 15 minutes.



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References​


  1. Stadnytskyi V, Bax CE, Bax A, Anfinrud P. The airborne lifetime of small speech droplets and their potential importance in SARS-CoV-2 transmission. Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. Jun 2 2020;117(22):11875-11877. doi:10.1073/pnas.2006874117
  2. Alsved M, Matamis A, Bohlin R, et al. Exhaled respiratory particles during singing and talking. Aerosol Science and Technology. 2020;54(11):1245-1248. doi:10.1080/02786826.2020.1812502
  3. Echternach M, Gantner S, Peters G, et al. Impulse Dispersion of Aerosols during Singing and Speaking: A Potential COVID-19 Transmission Pathway. Am J Respir Crit Care Med. Dec 1 2020;202(11):1584-1587. doi:10.1164/rccm.202009-3438LE
  4. Asadi S, Wexler AS, Cappa CD, Barreda S, Bouvier NM, Ristenpart WD. Aerosol emission and superemission during human speech increase with voice loudness. Sci Rep. Feb 20 2019;9(1):2348. doi:10.1038/s41598-019-38808-z
  5. Asadi S, Wexler AS, Cappa CD, Barreda S, Bouvier NM, Ristenpart WD. Effect of voicing and articulation manner on aerosol particle emission during human speech. PLoS One. 2020;15(1):e0227699. doi:10.1371/journal.pone.0227699
  6. Morawska L., Johnson GR, Ristovski ZD, et al. Size distribution and sites of origin of droplets expelled from the human respiratory tract during expiratory activities. Aerosol Sci. 2009;40(3):256-269.
  7. Buonanno G, Stabile L, Morawska L. Estimation of airborne viral emission: Quanta emission rate of SARS-CoV-2 for infection risk assessment. Environment international. May 11 2020;141:105794. doi:https://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.envint.2020.105794external icon
  8. Papineni RS, Rosenthal FS. The size distribution of droplets in the exhaled breath of healthy human subjects. J Aerosol Med. Summer 1997;10(2):105-16. doi:10.1089/jam.1997.10.105
  9. Edwards DA, Ausiello D, Salzman J, et al. Exhaled aerosol increases with COVID-19 infection, age, and obesity. Proc Natl Acad Sci U S A. Feb 23 2021;118(8)doi:10.1073/pnas.2021830118
  10. Bae S, Kim H, Jung TY, et al. Epidemiological Characteristics of COVID-19 Outbreak at Fitness Centers in Cheonan, Korea. J Korean Med Sci. Aug 10 2020;35(31):e288. doi:10.3346/jkms.2020.35.e288
  11. Brlek A, Vidovic S, Vuzem S, Turk K, Simonovic Z. Possible indirect transmission of COVID-19 at a squash court, Slovenia, March 2020: case report. Epidemiol Infect. Jun 19 2020;148:e120. doi:10.1017/S0950268820001326
  12. Cai J, Sun W, Huang J, Gamber M, Wu J, He G. Indirect Virus Transmission in Cluster of COVID-19 Cases, Wenzhou, China, 2020. Emerging infectious diseases. Mar 12 2020;26(6):12. doi:https://dx.doi.org/10.3201/eid2606.200412external icon
  13. Shen Y, Li C, Dong H, et al. Community Outbreak Investigation of SARS-CoV-2 Transmission Among Bus Riders in Eastern China. JAMA Intern Med. Dec 1 2020;180(12):1665-1671. doi:10.1001/jamainternmed.2020.5225
  14. Groves LM, Usagawa L, Elm J, et al. Community Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 at Three Fitness Facilities — Hawaii, June–July 2020. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. Feb 24 2021;70(Early Release)
  15. Hamner L, Dubbel P, Capron I, et al. High SARS-CoV-2 Attack Rate Following Exposure at a Choir Practice – Skagit County, Washington, March 2020. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. May 15 2020;69(19):606-610. doi:10.15585/mmwr.mm6919e6
  16. Jang S, Han SH, Rhee JY. Cluster of Coronavirus Disease Associated with Fitness Dance Classes, South Korea. Emerg Infect Dis. Aug 2020;26(8):1917-1920. doi:10.3201/eid2608.200633
  17. Lendacki FR, Teran RA, Gretsch S, Fricchione MJ, Kerins JL. COVID-19 Outbreak Among Attendees of an Exercise Facility — Chicago, Illinois, August–September 2020. MMWR Morb Mortal Wkly Rep. Feb 24 2021;70(Early Release)
  18. Li Y, Qian H, Hang J, et al. Probable airborne transmission of SARS-CoV-2 in a poorly ventilated restaurant. Build Environ. Jun 2021;196:107788. doi:10.1016/j.buildenv.2021.107788
  19. Lu J, Gu J, Li K, et al. COVID-19 Outbreak Associated with Air Conditioning in Restaurant, Guangzhou, China, 2020. Emerging infectious diseases. Apr 2 2020;26(7)doi:10.3201/eid2607.200764
  20. Katelaris AL, Wells J, Clark P, et al. Epidemiologic Evidence for Airborne Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 during Church Singing, Australia, 2020. Emerg Infect Dis. Apr 5 2021;27(6)doi:10.3201/eid2706.210465
  21. Charlotte N. High Rate of SARS-CoV-2 Transmission Due to Choir Practice in France at the Beginning of the COVID-19 Pandemic. J Voice. Dec 23 2020;doi:10.1016/j.jvoice.2020.11.029
  22. Shi J, Wen Z, Zhong G, et al. Susceptibility of ferrets, cats, dogs, and other domesticated animals to SARS–coronavirus 2. Science. 2020:eabb7015. doi:10.1126/science.abb7015
  23. Kim YI, Kim SG, Kim SM, et al. Infection and Rapid Transmission of SARS-CoV-2 in Ferrets. Cell host & microbe. Apr 5 2020;doi:10.1016/j.chom.2020.03.023
  24. Kutter JS, de Meulder D, Bestebroer TM, et al. SARS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2 are transmitted through the air between ferrets over more than one meter distance. Nat Commun. Mar 12 2021;12(1):1653. doi:10.1038/s41467-021-21918-6
  25. Klompas M, Baker MA, Rhee C, et al. A SARS-CoV-2 Cluster in an Acute Care Hospital. Ann Intern Med. Feb 9 2021;doi:10.7326/M20-7567
Click to expand...
Screen_Shot_2020-07-24_at_11.33.38_AM.jpg


But seriously, everything you said proves my point.

True, only the larger droplets fall rapidly to the ground.

However... cloth facemasks only block those same large droplets. Ergo, (cloth, retail or homemade, poorly fitted, improperly worn) masks are useless.
 
Incomudro

Incomudro

Well-Known Member
JoeCamel said:
When was shaving a thing? Up to ww1 and king Gillette most men had facial hair.
You would have a hard time reading Sam Elliott's lips
Click to expand...
This goes far beyond that.
All through human development, seeing faces has been a huge part of that process.
It's why we see face in inanimate objects - face pareidolia.
Now, we have removed two years of key psychological development across a range of ages for children.
No smiles, no noses.
Just eyes, staring at them like they are about to undergo surgery.
 
correcaminos

correcaminos

Well-Known Member
Incomudro said:
This goes far beyond that.
All through human development, seeing faces has been a huge part of that process.
It's why we see face in inanimate objects - face pareidolia.
Now, we have removed two years of key psychological development across a range of ages for children.
No smiles, no noses.
Just eyes, staring at them like they are about to undergo surgery.
Click to expand...
You're acting like they never see faces eve and that eyes don't show emotion. Come on..... I get a level of what you are saying but masks are not on 24/7 and there are ways to read outside of just mouth. Plus many places don't require for super young. Just because the CDC says it doesn't mean all do it. I have many friends with toddlers. They aren't as bad off as you imply.
 
dovetail65

dovetail65

Well-Known Member
Mr Ferret 88 said:
So taking into account all of this,
When will Disney change their mask mandate ?
Click to expand...
Who knows I think maybe 2023? Never?

WDW is a private business and over and over again the courts and as recent as May 2021(Supreme court ruling) have stated that private business can do as they like as long as they do not discriminate.

Masks inside will end at WDW most likely when Disney feels there is more upside then downside to the mask rule. Right now there is no upside for a business like WDW to eliminating the masks inside, in my opinion of course.

I just read another right wing article my dad pointed me to disguised as a main stream article, I am a conservative after all. In HUGE FONT it states ONE IN FOUR people don't want mask inside. They go on and on about rights and all that crap that make little sense in regards to a contagious virus, but get people like my elderly father all hyped up. So I say dad read that again, that means 75% of people do want masks right? 1 in 4 don't, but 3 in 4 do. He grumbles to himself.

So it is up to Disney and I agree with that, let the business decide. For me if businesses get fed money or are a corporation both those type entities should be under the Feds rule, not the states. I say that for a variety of reasons, the main being a virus has no borders and state rules simply do not make sense when planes fly in and out and cars drive over the border hour by hour, but that is another discussion. And for me it is a huge reason I believe we won't ever beat this thing. If the feds can't blanket the same rules across the country how can we beat it(again another discussion)? Anyhow, If WDW changed the indoor mask rules right now with the way the cases are some guests will still go and people like me, yes a 30 year Republican, will not go. I will vote with my 15 K trip, or not.

Fact is WDW is jammed packed with the mask rules right now so again what is the upside to eliminating the mask rules now?
 
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