Disney Giveth, and Disney Taketh Away

[Patricia Melton]

I respect your view. Please understand that I'm a businessman and know what is required to keep a company profitable. I also know how to read an annual report, listen to customer feedback, and observe trends within an organization well enough to recognize what is happening within the upper echelons at WDW. Rather than investing and innovating in order to attract new theme park business (something that Disney was once the undisputed world leader in) Disney corporate leadership is following an old, tired model tried by many once-great corporations; raise prices while providing a product of ever declining standards. Focus on quarterly statements rather than on the long-term health of the company.

What's happening today at Disney echoes the American automotive industry. If Disney's senior leadership continues to set direction based on a balance sheet rather than provide real leadership that looks towards the future, they eventually will become the GM of the future.

Therefore, yes, as a businessman, I think it takes a lot of "gall" (as well as demonstrates poor corporate leadership) to charge more for less.

I think a lot of the problems rest with the MBAs that are being graduated from business schools: I think these guys engage in a lot of group-think and that they're being taught incorrectly. They graduate thinking that the way to make their way up and be successful in companies is by tearing down what was there before they came. They really don't know of anything better to replace it with though. They just want to be the one who made the big changes. Makes them feel like big shots.

That's why I've noticed in the last few decades that the big innovations in the world are coming from small companies, freelancers, and start-ups. Bigger companies sometimes take these ideas and run with them, but I think the MBAs that are pulling the giant salaries at large companies really have no idea what they are doing sometimes.

I think "One Disney" is a good example of that.

 

[Patricia Melton]

Some of the things on this list just bother me. I don't understand how you can include Magic Carpets on the "Thematic Intrusions" but not the Tiki Room roof, which is just as much, if not even more visible from frontierland. By the way, there is also a Princess Castle at the end of the turn of the century american Street.

Come on guys. I know you're angry, but try to use some common sense with some of these.

I think the castle in the middle of the park is the parks' central icon...so it never bothers me that it's at the end of Main Street.

Actually, I feel like I'm walking down Main Street toward the dream of the castle...like the magic is calling me. I get so happy seeing it get closer and closer and then I leave Main Street behind at the hub and approach the castle.

The only time I ever see the castle as part of Fantasyland is when I'm in Fantasyland and see it from that side. From the rest of the park, I just see it as the towering icon of the park and it kind of blends into things for me because a magical castle in the distance is always the stuff of dreams for me.

 

[Gt2BtheGoodLife]

How does reducing the Monorail operation by an hour or two on certain nights (that it really doesn't need to be running any longer than it does) equate to rides and entire parks being shut down for half the day? The monorail is open all day long, not really sure where you're making this connection. I'm just not sure why you need hours to leave a closed park that was probably mostly empty to start with?

Besides THAT...

As for Water Country, wasn't it shut down because of deadly viruses in its water source? So, sure... let's reopen it. Good luck with that. I'll stick to the two real water parks.

And oh man... Disney is actually enforcing return times on Fast Pass! Let's complain all day about having to follow the rules! Again, good luck with that.

Ridiculous.

There are many many many things that need to change at WDW. Very few of the points brought up here are among them. Rehashing the same petty gripes every three threads is not going to change that. Just like making tired Stitch jokes every three posts in every other thread has never caused SGE to go away.

And to sit there and discourage a first-timer from visiting WDW? Shameful. What has become of this community?

Also, for what it's worth... this contains neither news or rumors, so (par for the course these days) it wasn't really even in the right section to start with. General Discussion is where these belong from the beginning.These endless complaint threads are getting so old and just keep cluttering up the News and Rumors section. Mods shouldn't have to keep moving them for members.

This isn't necessarily a dig at anybody specific, just a general feeling.

This. You are amazing. As someone who has been going to the parks for basically 21 years this thread is a bit crazy, let the magic still exist for the young, the young at heart, and those who are just experiencing it all for the first time. That's what Disneyland and WDW were founded on, the creation of magic for everyone every single time they visited the parks, no matter if they were there on their first (and possibly only) visit or are annual passholders who are just spending a few hours in the park that day, magic is magic, and this thread sure isn't. (crazy run on sentence whoooa.) Step back and just breathe for a moment and look around you and see how many happy smilling faces you see on main street (unless it's 3pm or there is an upset child.) how many of them are complaining? Very few. Because they are enjoying the experience for what it is, a vacation, a fun time. Just that.

 

[Bolna]

From what I understand, there seemed to have been a large chorus of angry guests who didn't like that gratuity was included in the dining plan. They complained that they were being "charged" for the tips when they wanted to decide what to tip. My husband was in the restaurant business and there was never any louder howling than when people saw an automatic gratuity added to a check (for parties of 8 or more, and they were told that when they sat down to eat).

This is pretty much nonsense, I never saw a large chorus of angry guests complaining abuot the gratuity being included (especially since you had not to pay for it on your check), but instead I witnessed the large chorus of angry people on different forums about the change to the dining plan when they stopped including the gratuity. It was done at the same time as when the appetizer for the table service meal was cut. And fur cutting the included gratuity and the appetizer Disney even reduced the price for the Dining Plan - by ONE Dollar!

I am sure that this was exactly what the guests wanted...

 

[ParentsOf4]

This. You are amazing. As someone who has been going to the parks for basically 21 years this thread is a bit crazy, let the magic still exist for the young, the young at heart, and those who are just experiencing it all for the first time. That's what Disneyland and WDW were founded on, the creation of magic for everyone every single time they visited the parks, no matter if they were there on their first (and possibly only) visit or are annual passholders who are just spending a few hours in the park that day, magic is magic, and this thread sure isn't. (crazy run on sentence whoooa.) Step back and just breathe for a moment and look around you and see how many happy smilling faces you see on main street (unless it's 3pm or there is an upset child.) how many of them are complaining? Very few. Because they are enjoying the experience for what it is, a vacation, a fun time. Just that.

Your viewpoint is completely valid. The magic can still exist for those who either want to ignore what's happening at WDW or who view the changes as relatively unimportant in the grand scheme of things.

However, other viewpoints are completely valid as well. Walt Disney founded DL (according to Disney legend) because he took his family to an amusement park and was sure he could do better. Most of those (including his wife) thought he was crazy to want to create a theme park. Disney was a visionary and moved ahead anyway. We have many top-quality theme parks (more than just DL) today because of Walt's innovation.

Walt was into details, the small things. He made plenty of mistakes with DL but he was always looking to improve on them, to make things better. This issue with Disney today is that it's run by a bunch of business people too focused on the bottom line. They continue to make petty short-term decisions rather than think grand and look towards the future. Much of this is caused by the compensation structure at most major U.S. companies. Huge bonuses and stock options are handed out based on annual performance. This encourages corporate leadership to think small, to not think beyond the next 12 months. It encourages leadership to make relatively small cuts to reap immediate increased profits rather than plan for long-term success.

 

[RSoxNo1]

From what I understand, there seemed to have been a large chorus of angry guests who didn't like that gratuity was included in the dining plan. They complained that they were being "charged" for the tips when they wanted to decide what to tip. My husband was in the restaurant business and there was never any louder howling than when people saw an automatic gratuity added to a check (for parties of 8 or more, and they were told that when they sat down to eat).

Having the tip included made some people angry because for some reason they twisted things to think that they were being charged for the tip without their ability to say "no tip!" if they wanted. So that's why that is gone.

This business about the "quality of food" always gets me as restaurants are being hard-hit these days across the board in terms of food costs. I'm glad we got out of the business years ago, because I'd hate to have to meet the bottom line running a restaurant today. Just another example of this appeared in the news today about the drastically increased price of corn (which affects everything that is raised for food using corn): http://buzz.money.cnn.com/2012/07/30/corn-soybean-prices/

There are those who like to make the claim that Disney is a villain for "reducing costs" with "declining in the quality of food" but it's not just a phenomenon with Disney. Every restaurant in the country is having to make the hard choice between eliminating more expensive ingredients or raising the menu prices to keep pace with surging food and gasoline costs (which the shipping companies place on the purchasers of products that end up in restaurants).

Glad my husband is retired so we don't have to fret over this stuff anymore by being involved with franchises.

Food prices have increased, but not to the extent that Disney has inflated the Dining Plan.

They toned down dinosaur!? How? When?

There have been several changes to Dinosaur from when it first opened. Many effects that were running during testing were turned off. A few more have been turned off in the last few years.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Some of the things on this list just bother me. I don't understand how you can include Magic Carpets on the "Thematic Intrusions" but not the Tiki Room roof, which is just as much, if not even more visible from frontierland. By the way, there is also a Princess Castle at the end of the turn of the century american Street.

Come on guys. I know you're angry, but try to use some common sense with some of these.

Magic Carpets has a cartoonized feel. Nothing else in the land does.
Soarin' [Over California] is a loose fit at best in The Land pavilion
Splash Mountain doesn't fit in chronological with Frontierland

As for the Tiki Room roof, can't you only see that from Splash Mountain?

 

[RSoxNo1]

This. You are amazing. As someone who has been going to the parks for basically 21 years this thread is a bit crazy, let the magic still exist for the young, the young at heart, and those who are just experiencing it all for the first time. That's what Disneyland and WDW were founded on, the creation of magic for everyone every single time they visited the parks, no matter if they were there on their first (and possibly only) visit or are annual passholders who are just spending a few hours in the park that day, magic is magic, and this thread sure isn't. (crazy run on sentence whoooa.) Step back and just breathe for a moment and look around you and see how many happy smilling faces you see on main street (unless it's 3pm or there is an upset child.) how many of them are complaining? Very few. Because they are enjoying the experience for what it is, a vacation, a fun time. Just that.

I wish I could turn a blind eye to this stuff, I really do. Going through Splash Mountain is tough for me now because I'm looking for broken effects. The issue here is that Disney World is something that we all love, and we want it to be better. We can't go in an physically repair the broken effects, but we can call attention to them in hopes that someone with that power can do something about it.

 

[Bairstow]

I'm not sure if it's accurate to call Dinosaur "toned down."
As I understand it, these are effects that simply broke, and as usual Disney is too cheap to repair them or to build additional Animal Kingdom attracts to permit a lengthy refurb.
That ride was only about 60% finished when it opened anyway.

 

[flynnibus]

I like to think Disney probably just refers to them as 'retired effects'

 

[EpcoTim]

I like to think Disney probably just refers to them as 'retired effects'

Well they can only call them that if they admit that they once existed in the first place.

 

[tink65]

I just saw this thread and only read a few pages and someone may have already said this but just in case: If you don't like it then don't go.... If you went once and it wasn't up to your standards then don't go back. I'm not being mean & absolutely am not trying to be rude, just trying to understand why? If you continue to go to Disney and continute to be dissatisfied then stop going! There are tons of vacation destinations around the world that can be visited! It's like that old saying: "Fool me once shame of you, Fool me twice shame on me!"

As far as price increases go....sure I don't like paying more for less, who does? But let me ask this: Where can you go or what can you buy today that isn't relevant to that point? When you go to the grocery store the sizes & weights of the products we buy have been reduced but the price has increased..............

Just my point of view!

 

[ParentsOf4]

I just saw this thread and only read a few pages and someone may have already said this but just in case: If you don't like it then don't go....

Yes, what you write has been suggested many times before on similar threads. The usual response is, "If you don't like what people are writing, then stop reading it." I don't mean to be disrespectful but I do think the response is fair.

Please realize that people can be passionate about WDW and still have issues with it. It's not much different than sports talk radio. Some of a team's biggest fans are also its biggest critics.

 

[tink65]

Yes, what you write has been suggested many times before on similar threads. The usual response is, "If you don't like what people are writing, then stop reading it." I don't mean to be disrespectful but I do think the response is fair.

Please realize that people can be passionate about WDW and still have issues with it. It's not much different than sports talk radio. Some of a team's biggest fans are also its biggest critics.

That's why I said I only read a few pages of it..................

 

[The Empress Lilly]

I just saw this thread and only read a few pages and someone may have already said this but just in case: If you don't like it then don't go.... If you went once and it wasn't up to your standards then don't go back. I'm not being mean & absolutely am not trying to be rude, just trying to understand why? If you continue to go to Disney and continute to be dissatisfied then stop going! There are tons of vacation destinations around the world that can be visited! It's like that old saying: "Fool me once shame of you, Fool me twice shame on me!"

As far as price increases go....sure I don't like paying more for less, who does? But let me ask this: Where can you go or what can you buy today that isn't relevant to that point? When you go to the grocery store the sizes & weights of the products we buy have been reduced but the price has increased..............

Just my point of view!

I love WDW! I love it for the whole, but resent it in parts. I then nag and complain about those. And sometimes, I just really don't like present WDW but go there for the memories, such as FW east, and sometimes even in the MK.

If we guests articulate our likes and dislikes, WDW can improve itself accordingly.

 

[Bairstow]

I just saw this thread and only read a few pages and someone may have already said this but just in case: If you don't like it then don't go.... If you went once and it wasn't up to your standards then don't go back. I'm not being mean & absolutely am not trying to be rude, just trying to understand why? If you continue to go to Disney and continute to be dissatisfied then stop going! There are tons of vacation destinations around the world that can be visited! It's like that old saying: "Fool me once shame of you, Fool me twice shame on me!"

As far as price increases go....sure I don't like paying more for less, who does? But let me ask this: Where can you go or what can you buy today that isn't relevant to that point? When you go to the grocery store the sizes & weights of the products we buy have been reduced but the price has increased..............

Just my point of view!

Not all opinions of a corporate product must be as extreme as you seem to indicate.

There are many things that the Disney has done that have disappointed me, but not to the point that they have lost my business. When I have the chance to go to Orlando I do spend money at the non-Disney parks, but that has more to do with wanting to see what the theme park business as a whole has to offer rather than wanting to avoid Disney altogether.
I don't see why I need keep my mouth shut until we reach that point.
The thing about Disney is that while they tend to make the same mistakes more than once, they rarely make them at all the their locations or at the same time. This gives me hope that the company is capable of fixing what I perceive as problems with its product, and why I'm interested in reading and posting in threads such as this one.

If you, by contrast, divine no satisfaction from reading criticism from customers who have not yet reached their breaking point, you really ought to stop reading this thread.

 

[prberk]

Weekly church services at the Polynesian. They were cut as of the week following December 25, 2002. They did have Christmas services that day at the Contemporary's Fantasia Ballroom, but weekly services following it were cut. They had occurred weekly (usually two Catholic masses, officiated by local priests, and one Protestant service, officiated by rotating ministers) at the Polynesian Luau since 1975. I attended one of the Protestant ones, and it was nice. The offering went to a local homeless shelter.

They say that it was cut in part due to priest shortage but mostly in order to be more "fair" (not that they didn't have multiple locations to offer services to others in a similar fashion if asked). They said that the population of churches had grown around Disney property since 1975, and could accommodate worshipers.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...l1PAAAAIBAJ&sjid=DwQEAAAAIBAJ&pg=6306,2485343

The Luau Cove was a beautiful place for such a service, and with Disney now taking so many people directly to its property from the airport (Magical Express), it would be nice to have that option again. I saw no problem with it, and it beautifully juggled two different styles of worship, with offerings going to a wonderful use (and not to a single church).

No reason that they could not continue this in some form. There were nice places to do it. And it even keeps worshipers on property (and maybe ready for lunch afterwards, as opposed to at the restaurant next to the church...).

 

[menamechris]

Magic Carpets has a cartoonized feel. Nothing else in the land does.
Soarin' [Over California] is a loose fit at best in The Land pavilion
Splash Mountain doesn't fit in chronological with Frontierland

As for the Tiki Room roof, can't you only see that from Splash Mountain?

You can see the tops of all the roofs in Frontierland and Adventureland from Splash unfortunately.

 

[FigmentJedi]

Some of the things on this list just bother me. I don't understand how you can include Magic Carpets on the "Thematic Intrusions" but not the Tiki Room roof, which is just as much, if not even more visible from frontierland. By the way, there is also a Princess Castle at the end of the turn of the century american Street.

Come on guys. I know you're angry, but try to use some common sense with some of these.

The Tiki Room roof was designed so the water buffalo atop it could be read as longhorns while in Frontierland.

 

[asianway]

WOW! The list is getting long! This would be awesome to attach dates and pics to make a cool decay timeline.

I dont think Grad Nites have been mentioned