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Disney confirms 'Frozen' makeover coming to Epcot's Norway Pavilion
- Thread starter wdwmagic
- Start date
phi2134
Well-Known Member
How about more quality rides in future world, which is where they used to be.
BrianV
Well-Known Member
Sure. We have the same number if not more than when it opened in future world. Why does it have to be an either or?
But a fraction of the amount today from say 1990.
BrianV
Well-Known Member
Really? Imagination, universe of energy, motion, spaceship earth are all net 0. The land is +1. Health is -1. And space replaced horizons.
Now some rides like imagination are not as good as they used to be. Am I missing any rides? Really not trying to be argumentative.
Mike S
Well-Known Member
I might as well come out and say that cartoon characters can have a place in Epcot with the right placement. Key examples being: Imagination, Cranium Command, Goofy About Health, Circle of Life, Turtle Talk, M&Gs, and how Snow White/Mickey Mouse used to appear in the Cinema scene in Spaceship Earth. What makes these all work? Besides Imagination and Cranium Command, which use characters made specifically for the park so are perfectly fine, none of them were the main focus of their whole pavilion (Turtle Talk opened while it was still The Living Seas and not all Nemo). Now how could Frozen have worked in Norway? Simple. How about booting all the other princesses who have no business being in Akershus in the first place in favor of Anna, Elsa, and maybe Olaf too? Or having them be hosts of a new Norway film? Of course Maelstrom would also have to get an update because it was in need of one.
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sedati
Well-Known Member
It was a park of commercial properties.
I agree EPCOT Center was always ambiguous about rides, simulators, shows and attractions. I was doing a count of queue to enter attractions and overall space. I won't even bring exhibits in both Communicores, Transcenter, Life or Imagination.
SSE
Energy
Body Wars
Cranium Command
Making of Me
Horizons
World of Motion
Bird and the Robot
The Water Engine
Future choice Theatre
Backstage Magic
Journey into Imagination
Magic Eye Theatre
Kitchen Kabaret
Listen to the Land
Symbiosis
The Living Seas
Spaceship Earth
Energy
Mission Space
Test Track
Sun of All Thrills
Storm Struck
Imagination
Soarin'
Living with the Land
Circle of Life
Seas with Nemo
Turtle Talk
(And the majority of the above are shorter and have less capacity than their predecessors)
jt04
Well-Known Member
The U.S. turned its back on growth economic policies in the late eighties for some reason. Now branding is needed for economic viability. Hopefully Capitalism returns and this is just a negative cycle we are surviving.
BrianV
Well-Known Member
Your point is well taken. I just wish they still had the listen to the land song.
Is anything playing in the movie theater any more. Captain EO was my last visit. I preferred magic journeys...
flynnibus
Premium Member
People were trained that amusement was the traveling and seaside carnies when Disney decided to build Disneyland and no one knew what it was. The idea that you should constrain yourself to what customers already know or expect is a top formula for mediocre and run of the mill. Epcot was neither of those and no Disney park or project should be.
AEfx
Well-Known Member
I applaud you for admitting that it's a matter of opinion. Seriously. I may disagree with your opinion, but it moves past what holds this conversation (beginning with the "NO CHARACTERS IN EPCOT!" like it's some law of nature or religious dogma).
It's funny when you follow the conversation about this topic, how the goal post has been moved so many times. The knee-jerk was "Characters do not belong and have never been in Epcot!" and then it was "Well, characters don't belong and have never been in WS!" to "Well, characters don't belong in attractions in WS..." as folks really stopped and examined the actual history and realized that their statements were overly broad.
It comes down to what is relevant or not - which is purely a matter of opinion. I'm totally cool with disagreeing about relevancy - everyone has different brains wired different ways, and what's relevant to one may be completely different to another. If we could just stop pretending that there are these golden tablets hidden somewhere underneath the swamp that contain these absolute rules that only a chosen few are bound to protect.
Mike S
Well-Known Member
My post is actually nothing new, it's how I always felt. You can look back in my history and see that I've said before that I didn't mind the M&Gs in Epcot much. They're small, off to the side, and offer a chance to learn where the stories come from without distracting from the overall pavilions (except Aladdin not being from Morocco or Snow Queen from Norway, but whatever). I just thought people would get what I meant with my points against Frozen being put as an attraction in Norway.
Pumbas Nakasak
Heading for the great escape.
there are things I wish wouldn't survive a cycle, regardless of its charge.
There may not be golden tablets to protect, but there needs to be some voice of sanity when people begin to binge on lazy armchair imagineering ideas such as "Mulan ride in China", "Marry Poppins ride in England", "Ratatouille ride in France". Its all about 'rides, rides, and more rides', for that crowd. When given reasons as to why those are all bad ideas (for World Showcase), and WILL water down the experience and blur the lines of park diversity, you get the exact same retorts EVERY TIME. "Your stuck in the past", "Epcot will never be Walts vision", "The parks are different now" and the classic, "World Showcase is boring for my kids". Now, what do all those responses have in common? They all lack any shred of logic or intelligent rebuttal as to why Epcot should not be MK 2.0. Suggesting to that crowd that Epcot could use a few rides, just not IP based, automatically makes you a "purist stuck in the past".
Even when told by well respected members such as @marni1971 (oh sweet Marni, I miss you, LOL) who has dedicated a large amount of time and effort to documenting WDW history and progress, they could care less. They know what they want and they want Disney to give it to them. They dont even consider the idea that there may be better or even unimaginable possibilities to make Epcot better without the aid of IP's. Their very own unimaginative, lazy and simple way of thinking is the very thing that blinds them from being able to understand that what they want, is not what the park needs. But they are empowered by TWDC who birthed all this by invading Norway Pavilion with Frozen, so they march forward toward the slow dismantling of proper theme and placement that was designed by brilliant men and women of the past who were actually allowed to dream and create their visions, not the vision of an executive and their bonus check.
Matt_Black
Well-Known Member
When's the last time UNI did anything without IPs? Everyone's so high on how UNI has the old Disney spirit, but they rarely mention THAT.
Yes, it is mentioned a lot. I did so yesterday. So I guess you're wrong.
And as I said yesterday Uni is a park about IPs. Always has been.
Anyway so what?
BrianV
Well-Known Member
Universal is great. But really, not part of this discussion.
Indeed.
Universal STUDIOS is just that...a Studio theme park. IP's actually fit in there. They have the "old Disney spirit" in the sense that they are creating amazing attractions on a large and small scale in a timely fashion. They are not short changing their customers, they are adding, not eliminating and charging more. Regardless of how anybody feels about screen based attractions or IP's, Uni is putting in a great effort to make more profits, but also giving guests something in return for those profits, not just cupcake parties and promises of lands to be built in ten years.