Disney CMs calling guests " Friends"?

[_caleb]

Calling a person you do not know “friend” is not the same thing as calling them “a friend.” Literally the second definition in the dictionary is “one that is not hostile“ (as opposed to “foe”).

It might not be as common as whatever people in Boston call each other, but it’s clear to me that no other suggestion offered here thus far is as inclusive, welcoming, or as “Disney” as friend.

 

[_caleb]

you left out "forced" and "awkward".

I find it hard to have sympathy for anyone who’d resist the adoption of broader phrasing in deference to people not like them simply because it’s forced and awkward.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I find it hard to have sympathy for anyone who’d resist the adoption of broader phrasing in deference to people not like them simply because it’s forced and awkward.

Again, it is the misuse and the misunderstanding of positioning and context. "Hello Friends" to a group of people is absolutely doable. The fake and awkward part happen because of the use and the tone. Instead of Hello friend, stay behind the rope which is extremely awkward and forced sounding even saying, excuse me, my friend, please stay behind the rope, would be better. That is just as jarringly ungenuine in usage, but doesn't sound so forced if said with the proper tone. Dropping the friend out and just saying Excuse me, please stay behind the rope, is not personal but is still instructional to everyone that it applies too. In reality any personal salutation in these situations is totally unnecessary and insincere. For all the rest if whatever accidental misidentifying incident is concerned there is an old saying that goes like this... If one looks like a duck, acts like a duck and sounds like a duck, don't be surprised if somebody calls them a duck. People are not mind readers and shouldn't be expected to correctly identify in every instance.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

I’m referring to what people here themselves have posted. 1. We had a mother share the experience of her teenage daughter, who was repeatedly misgendered and felt very embarrassed as a result. 2. Contrast that with the complaints about “friend”—that it’s fake, creepy, etc. One of those perspectives—the one involving a person’s actual happiness—matters much more to me than the other, which boils down to an inconsequential gripe.

We are all equal, but some are more equal than others.

1 = worthy of happy
2 = not worthy of happy

That is it in a nutshell.

But why not find a way to make everyone happy?

To WDW's credit, they often do try to find creative solutions. On Buzz for example, riders are called recruits and Junior Space Rangers. And on BTMRR we are called folks. Neither is gendered.

 

[Californian Elitist]

I would rather someone assume my gender than assume we are friends.

Disney CMs aren’t calling you their actual friend when they refer to you as such. Or do you honestly believe CMs now consider you an actual friend that they’ve known and have had a relationship with for some time?

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

People are not mind readers and shouldn't be expected to correctly identify in every instance.

Which is exactly why it’s best to NOT use gender specific terms when greeting someone.

 

[Prince-1]

Disney CMs aren’t calling you their actual friend when they refer to you as such. Or do you honestly believe CMs now consider you an actual friend that they’ve known and have had a relationship with for some time?

Wait when John, the guy that sold me my popcorn the other day, called me friend he didn't mean it?? Are you serious!?! I mean I invited him to join my family for Thanksgiving.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

The only announcement I can really think of that has been changed is the old magic kingdom “ladies and gentlemen boys and girls” - all of the other announcements have always been gender neutral I think?

 

[_caleb]

For some reason, this thread reminds me of Thanksgiving dinner with extended family.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Calling a person you do not know “friend” is not the same thing as calling them “a friend.” Literally the second definition in the dictionary is “one that is not hostile“ (as opposed to “foe”).

It might not be as common as whatever people in Boston call each other, but it’s clear to me that no other suggestion offered here thus far is as inclusive, welcoming, or as “Disney” as friend.

The problem is really with the English language itself.

But citing one definition of friend is incomplete. Under antonyms you will find the word stranger.

The list of Merrium Webster synonyms includes: buddy, chum, compadre, comrade, crony, musketeer, and pal.


To use the example posted a few posts back, "Hello, comrade, please stand behind the yellow line."

 

[_caleb]

The problem is really with the English language itself.

But citing one definition of friend is incomplete. Under antonyms you will find the word stranger.

The list of Merrium Webster synonyms includes: buddy, chum, compadre, comrade, crony, musketeer, and pal.


To use the example posted a few posts back, "Hello, comrade, please stand behind the yellow line."

I’m sure most people who speak English understand that words have different uses and meanings. I cited this definition because it seemed like the one you couldn’t imagine.

I’ve kept up with the thread, no need to repeat anything. There are lots of words besides “friend” they could use. But those words all also have meanings and associations attached that seem to be less relevant/helpful to CMs addressing guests at a theme park.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

I’m sure most people who speak English understand that words have different uses and meanings. I cited this definition because it seemed like the one you couldn’t imagine.

I’ve kept up with the thread, no need to repeat anything. There are lots of words besides “friend” they could use. But those words all also have meanings and associations attached that seem to be less relevant/helpful to CMs addressing guests at a theme park.

Then perhaps you haven't been reading the last few pages?

A comical aspect of word discussions is that earlier when I cited the official definition of a word, that was described as, "playing semantic games."

But if you are going to cite the dictionary, we need to include the context under which friend means "not foe." It is in this specific context:
"Is he a friend or an enemy?" https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/friend#other-words

I would hope WDW does not see MK as a battlefield, because that is the context where one would use the word friend to mean, "not foe."

 

[Californian Elitist]

Yes, the term is disingenuous.

It’s not, as it’s never actually meant to be taken literally or genuinely.

The black or white takes here have been absurd.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

It’s not, as it’s never actually meant to be taken literally or genuinely.

The black or white takes here have been absurd.

I was agreeing with you that it is not literal or genuine.

I think the point people keep making is whether they care.

And it is a little comical that some forum members keep posting over and over - for 2 years!- that they don't care.

 

[LittleBuford]

But why not find a way to make everyone happy?

That’s precisely what they tried to do by using “friend(s)”. Who would have thought that one of the nicest, most innocuous words in the English language could irk so many?

 

[Californian Elitist]

I was agreeing with you that it is not literal or genuine.

I think the point people keep making is whether they care.

And it is a little comical that some forum members keep posting over and over - for 2 years!- that they don't care.

I’m saying it’s not necessarily fake. Not sure if that’s what you were sayin, but I thought I’d mention it anyway.

They don’t care about what?

 

[LittleBuford]

Then perhaps you haven't been reading the last few pages?

A comical aspect of word discussions is that earlier when I cited the official definition of a word, that was described as, "playing semantic games."

But if you are going to cite the dictionary, we need to include the context under which friend means "not foe." It is in this specific context:
"Is he a friend or an enemy?" https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/friend#other-words

I would hope WDW does not see MK as a battlefield, because that is the context where one would use the word friend to mean, "not foe."

There is no such thing as an “official definition” of a word; the English language has no regulatory body. Dictionaries simply record usage, regardless of whether people like that usage or not. The most comprehensive dictionary out there is the Oxford English Dictionary, from which I have already quoted (below). You will see that the definition of friend you so dislike has been in continual use in our language for about a millennium.

For those interested, here are the OED's entries for this use of "friend", which goes back to the Middle Ages:

Spoiler

5. An acquaintance, an associate; a stranger whom one comes across or has occasion to mention again. Frequently used as a polite or (sometimes) ironic form of address. Cf. sense A. 2.
OE West Saxon Gospels: Matt. (Corpus Cambr.) xx. 13 Ða cwæð he andswarigende hyra anum, Eala þu freond [L. amice], ne do ic þe nænne teonan.
OE On Epacts (Calig. A.xv) in P. S. Baker & M. Lapidge Byrhtferth's Enchiridion (1995) 430 Nim, leofa freond, nigonteoða geares þæt þu do twelf to þam ehtatynum epacten.
c1275 Doomsday (Calig.) in C. Brown Eng. Lyrics 13th Cent. (1932) 45 (MED) Comeþ her, mine freond [c1250 Trin. Cambr. mine frents], oure sunnes forto lete.
c1300 St. Dunstan (Laud) l. 83 in C. Horstmann Early S.-Eng. Legendary (1887) 21 ‘Mine leue frend,’ seide þis holie Man.
▸ c1384 Bible (Wycliffite, E.V.) (Douce 369(2)) (1850) Matt. xxvi. 50 Frend, wherto art thou comen?
a1400 (▸a1325) Cursor Mundi (Vesp.) l. 3229 ‘Frend,’ he said, ‘þou wend in hij vntil mesopotani.’
1488 (▸c1478) Hary Actis & Deidis Schir William Wallace (Adv.) (1968–9) ii. l. 89 Gud freynd, pray I the, The schirreffis serwand thow wald lat him be.
1508 J. Fisher Treat. Penyt. Psalmes sig. aa.ii Frendes this day I shall not declare to you ony parte of the epystle.
1523 Ld. Berners tr. J. Froissart Cronycles I. f. cclxiii Frende appease yourselfe, thou shalte be well payed or this day be ended; kepe the nere me.
a1625 F. Beaumont & J. Fletcher Coxcombe ii. iii, in Comedies & Trag. (1647) sig. Nn4v/1 Stand further friend, I doe not like your roperunners.
1677 P. A. in R. Cary Palæologia Chronica sig. hv Even so our studious Friend..is intent On Books and Reading.
1757 Bp. W. Warburton Lett. (1809) xcvi. 229 Pray ask our friend of St John's whether my..philosophy be right.
1767 J. O'Keeffe She Gallant ii. i. 23 So, friend, you're pimping for your master; well, I'll reward you a little for your trouble.
1830 Fraser's Mag. 1 209 Our friend the Intoxicator is an Irishman.
1884 Sheffield & Rotherham Chron. 20 May 8/2 I should like to exchange a word with my friend ‘Spectator in Hallamshire’ who, I regret to say, is not as reliable in fact and argument as he is pleasant in wit or humour.
1901 R. Kipling Kim xii. You mustn't bang about as though Delhi station belonged to you, my friend.
1916 R. Kay Go ahead Boys & Mysterious Old House 79 The third is our mysterious friend, the tramp, that I saw in the old Meeker House.
1956 M. Dickens Angel in Corner x. 181 Jin, this is Ed Morris, a business friend of mine.
1965 N. Mailer Amer. Dream i. 15 ‘Ain't you got any consideration?’ he asked. ‘Up your , friend.’
2000 Light Feb. 11/1 If our friend the QS [sc. quantity surveyor] were more knowledgeable about lighting, then he or she would..study in more depth the alternatives being put forward.

 

[_caleb]

I would hope WDW does not see MK as a battlefield, because that is the context where one would use the word friend to mean, "not foe."

Not a battlefield, but lots of people have a hard time with authority. When a Disney CM needs to call the attention of a specific guest or group of guests, ”friend” can be a way to communicate “I’m on your side” or “I mean you no harm.”

 

[_caleb]

“You’re silly for debating this for two years” seems like a strange take for a fan message board. Especially when the subject at hand continues to be in the “news” as it’s implemented across the parks.

 

[Californian Elitist]

There is no such thing as an “official definition” of a word; the English language has no regulatory body. Dictionaries simply record usage, regardless of whether people like that usage or not. The most comprehensive dictionary out there is the Oxford English Dictionary, from which I have already quoted (below). You will see that the definition of friend you so dislike has been in continual use in our language for about a millennium.

Correct.