mickEblu
Well-Known Member
I would definitely pick DL especially if it’s cheaper. With that said, I’m not sure I want to see DL until things are back to “normal.”
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Disney California Adventure to launch food experience in March
- Thread starter DCBaker
- Start date
I would definitely pick DL especially if it’s cheaper. With that said, I’m not sure I want to see DL until things are back to “normal.”
CaptinEO
Well-Known Member
Sounds like a fun time : )
CaptinEO
Well-Known Member
I always laugh when people excuse the red tape for Disney, or excuse Disney for being slow to resond.
If you're a giant media conglomerate with billions of dollars, it shouldn't take 2 months to approve a banner to be put up.
Six Flags and Knotts created offerings this Summer and Fall and it took Disney nearly a year to respond.
Disney is reactive, not proactive, and they're painfully behind their competition when it comes to their speed with getting any task done.
People need to acknowledge that the company's own policies are failing them when competition can out maneuver the Walt Disney Company.
CaptinEO
Well-Known Member
I also wanted to add that Knotts within 3 weeks of their closure, announced that all their pasholders got another year in addition to 2020.
Meanwhile Disneyland gave little to no information on what they were doing. People who held onto their passes were promised an extension and instead almost a year later the whole program was cancelled.
They also haven't even properly managed the refunds despite sitting on people's money (in a high yield bank account) since March.
Now my problem is besides the Chicken Restaraunt and the Log Ride, I don't really care for Knotts Berry Farm. But I can acknowledge that they seem to actually care about their customers and have it together more than Disneyland.
When Cedar Fair and Six Flags are setting an example for Disney, you know there's an issue. 10 years ago I could never imagine it being this way.
Meanwhile Disneyland gave little to no information on what they were doing. People who held onto their passes were promised an extension and instead almost a year later the whole program was cancelled.
They also haven't even properly managed the refunds despite sitting on people's money (in a high yield bank account) since March.
Now my problem is besides the Chicken Restaraunt and the Log Ride, I don't really care for Knotts Berry Farm. But I can acknowledge that they seem to actually care about their customers and have it together more than Disneyland.
When Cedar Fair and Six Flags are setting an example for Disney, you know there's an issue. 10 years ago I could never imagine it being this way.
Darkbeer1
Well-Known Member
But around 20 years ago....
Re: DCA: AN interesting look back at the last 4+ years
Somebody was kind enough to send me an internal PointPoint presentation file from over 5 years ago. I totally trust this person in the fact that this is the real Mc Coy, and not a fake. If I could share my source, I am sure you would agree that it is a true document.
Sorry, guys I will not post the file, nor will I share it. I am sorry, but you are going to have to trust me on this one. I will clearly identify my comments with brackets [like this]. I am also only going to post selected information, mainly related to the infamous comment, and other points discussed over the last few years.
I received a 10 slide presentation, based on the wording, is an internal WDI presentation.
The first slide is the title slide...
THE "OFF THE SHELF" DECISION
Slide 2 is titled "1995 Company Mentality", which had 7 points.
Point 2 is "Can we do a "E" attraction for $70M?"
Point 6 is "With Paul Pressler's arrival our client became the "parks", not MDE."
Slide 3 is
1996 KEY TO A CHEAPER PARK
Facility, Show or Ride - Pick any 2.
Capitalize on an improving ride industry.
Take known technology & theme it with paint color, lighting & graphics.
Take advantage of engineering already spent by others.
"Direct Lifts"
If it's good enough for Six Flags ....
The "Guiding Principles"
As to the second point of Capitalizing, [To me, this is looking at outside companies, such as S&S Power, since the outside vendors have been making better products in the last decade or so]
And the fifth point, "Direct Lifts" [and as described in a later slide, this is taking attractions from other Disney parks, such as Muppets 3-D (the example they used)]
Slides 4 and 5 talks about the Guiding Principles.
The 4th slide is titled "How can Disney's California be realized for less than traditional practice?"
Then we have 11 points for the sub-category "Park Planning/Design/Theming" (the next slide has the other sub-category).
Point 1 is "No berm around the park", other points mention outside visual intrusions are OK, themed facades are faux, show-like, not immersions or period reproductions, that only the entries and front facades are to be themed, and to keep the Monorail as is.
Slide 5 contains 5 "Backstage Philosophy" points, including "First cost before life cycle savings"
Slide 6 is titled "Embracing the Industry... Their way"
5 points, my favorite is "We don't have any lawyers & we don't want to get any."
Slide 7 is titled "Our Experience", with the category of "good" and 11 points
Slide 8 is the category "Lessons Learned" and 6 points.
Slide 9 is just a title slide, "Would we do it again?" and nothing else.
Slide 10 starts with "Yes" in large letters, and then the sentence "The pros far out weigh the cons. But..."
Then we have 5 points, my favorite on this page is, "Have attractions partners sign(underlined) in advance of the buy." [I read this as get the prospective sponsor to pay up before spending the money, or at least be guaranteed that they will pay for it]
[OK, this is the end of the PowerPoint presentation. So what have we learned, that the statement "If it's good enough for Six Flags..." was actually made at a meeting inside the Disney company, and not made up, as some folks wanted us to believe! That Disney had serious cost control issues while designing and building DCA. That Disney made the decision to use "Off the Shelf" rides instead of designing and building their own. That Disney is looking to keep the costs down on new "E" attractions (the $70 million comment, and now the LA Times report of DCA's ToT costing $75 million). That Disney purposely cut back on the theming at DCA.]
CaptinEO
Well-Known Member
Wow! What a great piece of information. Thanks so much for sharing this! How sad to think that Six Flags sets the bar in Disney's eyes. They definitely made good on all these points in this presentation, especially the one about themed facades and that's it.
Now it's weird where Disney overthemes some rides and cheaps out on others. The fact that Pixar Pier and Galaxy's Edge were being worked on at the same time by the same company is proof of Disney's complete lack of consistency.
I used to feel this way about Knott's, but lately they have added a lot of entertainment while Disney has been cutting entertainment even prior to COVID. Considering we go more for the entertainment than the rides, that is a big deal. Add in bringing back the mission models and little details like that and then Knott's Berry Tales return (updated version) was the icing on the cake. And then they updated their rapids ride and the train is pretty cool as I'd the mine ride, especially after they updated it. They truly keep doing these little things that make it better and better.
The food is exceptional and their dining plan is an incredible value.
So needless to say I feel much different about Knott's now than I used to.
LukaLand
Active Member
The portions surprised us, too. Expected the corn on the cob to be a mini cob on a stick but it was a full cob. Full sized drinks and desserts, as well. We went for Halloween and it felt like a full experience, not just a stopgap measure. We were impressed.
CaptinEO
Well-Known Member
Wow, that sounds like a great time.
Wow! I get in to Knott's for free around Veteran's Day, so I went many years ago. The rides were dirty, the place kind of tired, not a big funnel cake fan. I haven't been back-even for free. I think I'll have to give it another try with all I've read on this site these last few years.
Definitely do, it has definitely improved the last few years and the tasting events have kept the park even cleaner.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
Agreed. And I honestly wasn't trying to pick on @el_super personally. But I read his post three separate times trying to find the reason why TDA took a full year to get a food festival into one of their closed theme parks, and each time I carefully read each statement all I could read was excuses.
There was no challenge that TDA couldn't have worked around, but there was plenty of excuses why they didn't.
Yes. This specific issue that clearly sets up an obvious comparison between how the two companies run their Orange County theme parks makes it crystal clear.
TDA is drowning in red tape and bureaucracy and PowerPoints. And during a crisis like this, that's exactly what you don't need.
It also doesn't help that TDA can't keep the same President for more than 6 or 8 months, but even if whats-her-name had stuck around for a full year I'm sure they'd be in the same position they are now; drowning in red tape and excuses.
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TP2000
Well-Known Member
I was in the same boat as you. Knott's had fallen off my radar by the 2000's. But a few years ago I went for their Boysenberry Festival and I was impressed. I now try to get to Knott's once every year, if only for Ghost Town shopping and some boysenberry pie and a ride on the Mine Train and a visit to Mystery Lodge. It's a very pleasant place to spend a long afternoon.
truecoat
Well-Known Member
On the other hand, I can buy a full cob of sweet corn in season for a quarter sometimes 5 for a buck.
Jiggsawpuzzle35
Well-Known Member
So if the eateries are open, are they additional charge on top of the food booths? I’d rather have the whole park open to everyone with shops and eateries opened.
Stevek
Well-Known Member
Have not heard. Could be very much like Knotts where you can use your “tickets” for an item at any eatery. I could see them having separate alcohol purchase options if that’s allowable.
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Wow all great news! We're not going try to buy any tickets yet until we see how its handled but if it's anything like Knotts event it will probably be fine. Now that I know this even will involve BVS, might try and do it one more time (only done it once) before we have to pay to enter again.
George Lucas on a Bench
Well-Known Member
This one spent months posting exclusively in threads about keeping Disneyland shut down and now can't wait to buy tickets when we're still in a Pandemic.