Disney (and others) at the Box Office - Current State of Affairs

[Disney Irish]

Yup. I was at Opening Day for Star Wars: Rise Before Dawn, remember?

I don't live in SoCal any longer, so I don't have a Magic Key. Last summer no one in my family wanted to drive up to Disneyland, so we didn't go. I may go this summer with some friends, but not sure yet. There's nothing new, so....

Over in the Disneyland thread, we just did a comparison of the new Pixar Fest Better Together Parade vs. the old Pixar Play Parade. Better Together has 68% of the human performers and 70% of the floats that Pixar Play Parade has (92 performers and 10 floats in 2008-2018 vs. 63 performers and 7 floats in 2024). So not only aren't they investing in the Parks, they are slashing the payroll and downsizing even their premiere summer entertainment offerings that they do have.

That is bad. And your standards for this expensive entertainment should be far higher than they appear to be.

Yes I remember you went to GE, hence my question. So you haven't stepped foot in any Disney Park in ~5 years, presumably because you don't like anything they are offering, which is your prerogative. So again the question still remains, why are you even still a Disney Fan since its clear this company is never going to change to meet your expectations. That just seems like your setting yourself up for disappointment, and more complaining (which may be the point).

Also you don't know what my standards are as you haven't asked. I've made zero, none, zilch comments on Pixar Fest or its parades. So you don't even know how I feel about any of it. So your comments on my standards are based on nothing but something you've made up.

 

[TP2000]

Yes I remember you went to GE, hence my question. So you haven't stepped foot in any Disney Park in ~5 years, presumably because you don't like anything they are offering, which is your prerogative.

Hello, Covid? Disneyland was forced to close for over 13 months by order of the Governor of the State of California.

I went to Disneyland in January, 2020 and went on Rise Before Dawn. Six weeks later Disneyland was closed.

Disneyland wasn't allowed to reopen by order of the Governor until May 1st, 2021. I went to Disneyland twice with friends/family in 2022, plus a couple visits to Downtown Disney for dinners, before I moved out of California in 2023.

I was supposed to go to Japan in the Fall of 2021, purposely after the Olympics, and would have spent 3 days at Tokyo Disneyland. But Japan was still closed to foreign visitors into 2023, so that trip was cancelled. I will be going to the Osaka World's Fair next year, and intend to visit Tokyo Disneyland as part of that trip.

I will be spending at least six weeks in La Jolla again this summer, but it is currently unclear if my social group has Disneyland on their radar for this summer. My sister's kids already said no thanks. There's nothing new there since 2020, so...

 

[Disney Irish]

Hello, Covid? Disneyland was forced to close for over 13 months by order of the Governor of the State of California.

I went to Disneyland in January, 2020 and went on Rise Before Dawn. Six weeks later Disneyland was closed.

Disneyland wasn't allowed to reopen by order of the Governor until May 1st, 2021. I went to Disneyland twice with friends/family in 2022, plus a couple visits to Downtown Disney for dinners, before I moved out of California in 2023.

I was supposed to go to Japan in the Fall of 2021, purposely after the Olympics, and would have spent 3 days at Tokyo Disneyland. But Japan was still closed to foreign visitors in 2022, so that trip was cancelled. I will be going to the Osaka World's Fair next year, and intend to visit Tokyo Disneyland as part of that trip.

I will be spending at least six weeks in La Jolla again this summer, but it is currently unclear if my social group has Disneyland on their radar for this summer. My sister's kids already said no thanks. There's nothing new there since 2020, so...

Good, so you visited 2 years ago, I don't count DTD visits as that isn't the actual Disney Park. And I hope you go this summer.

But you require something new as the primary reason to go? I guess nostalgia does nothing for you. The reason why many guests return to a Disney Park, including myself, is because of what is already existing in spite of there not being anything new. As I remember the time between 1995 and 2016 when Disneyland proper didn't get anything actually new (I don't count Buzz or even Rocket Rods) until PtN debuted. So that was two decades of nothing new at Disneyland proper yet I still visited a bunch. So my expectations and desires to go to the Parks aren't driven by what is "new". Talking and speculating about the new stuff that is coming is nice when posting on this forum, but it doesn't drive my desire to visit the Parks. But hey I guess everyone is different.

But lets bring this back to movies, Studios, D+, or any other division, aren't the reason why the domestic Parks didn't get investments the last 3-5 years. So we can put an end to that right now. They didn't get investment because Disney didn't want to invest, they could have but they didn't, they have been investing in the foreign Parks and the domestic Parks took a backseat. This is why I know Disney isn't going to invest in something new every year for every Park and I set my expectations accordingly.

 

[TP2000]

But you require something new as the primary reason to go? I guess nostalgia does nothing for you. The reason why many guests return to a Disney Park, including myself, is because of what is already existing in spite of there not being anything new. As I remember the time between 1995 and 2016 when Disneyland proper didn't get anything actually new (I don't count Buzz or even Rocket Rods) until PtN debuted.

This. Is. Hysterical!

Off the top of my head...

1997 = Light Magic (It was tragic!), Hercules Victory Parade, It's A Small World Holiday
1998 = Animazement
1999 = Tarzan's Treehouse
2000 = 45th Anniversary: Magic In the Stars fireworks, Parade of Stars
2001 = DCA, Downtown Disney, MSEP returns, Haunted Mansion Holiday
2002 = Well, nothing really
2003 = The Many Adventures of Winnie The Pooh, Cynthia Harriss Fired Resigned To Spend More Time With Family
2004 = Tower of Terror
2005 = 50th Anniversary: Parade of Dreams, Remember fireworks, Buzz Lightyear dark ride, Monsters Inc. dark ride
2006 = 50th Continued
2007 = Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage, Pirate's Lair on Tom Sawyer Island
2008 = Toy Story Midway Mania
2009 = Fantasmic! 2.0 upgrade, Magical fireworks
2010 = World of Color, Glow Fest, Paradise Pier upgrades, Captain EO returns
2011 = Voyage of the Little Mermaid, Star Tours The Adventures Continue, Mickey's Soundsational Parade, Trader Sam's
2012 = DCA 2.0 Debut: Buena Vista Street, Red Car Trolley, Carthay Circle Restaurant, Cars Land
2013 = Princess Fantasy Faire, Mickey & The Magical Map
2014 = Well, nothing really
2015 = 60th Anniversary: Paint The Night, Disneyland Forever!, Grizzly Peak Airfield and HD Soarin'
2016 = Luigi's Rollickin' Roadsters
2017 = Guadians of the Galaxy: Mission Breakout!, Reimagined and rebuilt Rivers of America
2018 = Pixar Pier and Incredicoaster (meh, the Chapek era was underway)
2019 = Star Wars Land except Star Wars: Rise Before Dawn
2020 = Star Wars: Rise Before Dawn and then... a 13 month forced closure of the entire Resort

They haven't yet recovered from 2020, except for that Spiderman version of Midway Mania they built. But it is now 2024: No new rides under construction, no night parade, and their new parade has 66% of the performers and 70% of the floats that the same basic parade had back in 2008.

Meanwhile, and directly on topic, Inside Out 2 opens next month with a $200 Million budget. Why?

 

[Disney Irish]

This. Is. Hysterical!

Off the top of my head...

1997 = Light Magic (It was tragic!), Hercules Victory Parade, It's A Small World Holiday
1998 = Animazement
1999 = Tarzan's Treehouse
2000 = 45th Anniversary: Magic In the Stars fireworks, Parade of Stars
2001 = DCA, Downtown Disney, MSEP returns, Haunted Mansion Holiday
2002 = Well, nothing really
2003 = The Many Adventures of Winnie The Pooh, Cynthia Harriss Fired Resigned To Spend More Time With Family
2004 = Tower of Terror
2005 = 50th Anniversary: Parade of Dreams, Remember fireworks, Buzz Lightyear dark ride, Monsters Inc. dark ride
2006 = 50th Continued
2007 = Finding Nemo Submarine Voyage, Pirate's Lair on Tom Sawyer Island
2008 = Toy Story Midway Mania
2009 = Fantasmic! 2.0 upgrade, Magical fireworks
2010 = World of Color, Glow Fest, Paradise Pier upgrades, Captain EO returns
2011 = Voyage of the Little Mermaid, Star Tours The Adventures Continue, Mickey's Soundsational Parade, Trader Sam's
2012 = DCA 2.0 Debut: Buena Vista Street, Red Car Trolley, Carthay Circle Restaurant, Cars Land
2013 = Princess Fantasy Faire, Mickey & The Magical Map
2014 = Well, nothing really
2015 = 60th Anniversary: Paint The Night, Disneyland Forever!, Grizzly Peak Airfield and HD Soarin'
2016 = Luigi's Rollickin' Roadsters
2017 = Guadians of the Galaxy: Mission Breakout!, Reimagined and rebuilt Rivers of America
2018 = Pixar Pier and Incredicoaster (meh, the Chapek era was underway)
2019 = Star Wars Land except Star Wars: Rise Before Dawn
2020 = Star Wars: Rise Before Dawn and then... a 13 month forced closure of the entire Resort

They haven't yet recovered from 2020, except for that Spiderman version of Midway Mania they built. But it is now 2024: No new rides under construction, no night parade, and their new parade has 66% of the performers and 70% of the floats that the same basic parade had back in 2008.

Meanwhile, and directly on topic, Inside Out 2 opens next month with a $200 Million budget. Why?

Thank you for doing what I knew you would do, I'm glad you listed it out.....

So before I get into what I want to say, it should be pointed out that a majority of that list is DCA. I specifically said Disneyland proper, as in Disneyland Park, not Disneyland Resort so wasn't specifically talking about DCA. And really you know this was about attractions and not parades or fireworks or other entertainment. So yeah Disneyland Park didn't get much between IJA and GE (at least in my opinion), but I digress....

Anyways you forgot Runaway Railway on that list which opened in 2023, and later this year we get Tiana for 2024 since you're counting rethemes too. And if they announce something and break ground later this year or early next year that means there will be very little gap between any construction stopping and starting on the next project at DLR. And so there will only be a few years gap between the time the last thing opens and the next new thing opens. Which means its not as dire as you make it seem. Plus with the 70th next year I anticipate they will do something for the celebration, such as maybe bring back PtN or other touches like they did for the 60th.

Anyways as fun as this is we should probably direct this conversation over to the DLR forum....

 

[Tha Realest]

Even if Sidekick Tightpants announces 2 new E Tickets for each coast to begin construction this October, they won't open until 2027 or 2028.

And the DisneylandForward plan is a 40 year plan. Four Oh years. That's 2064, for those who can't scroll that fast on their phone's calendar.

They should have been building rides on both coasts 5 years ago solely based on 2019 attendance levels, to open in quick succession every year from 2022 to 2026. Just re-opening all of their existing yet closed pavilions and 2,000 seat theaters and entire buildings and complexes in forgotten lands should have been happening years ago.

If your expectations are so low that you can look forward to yet another hazy Blue Sky Proposal! on the big screen at the next D23 Expo, then so be it. My expectations for Disney theme parks were honed in the 20th century, so my expectations are far higher than yours apparently are. I feel badly that you think they're doing something nice for you, when they clearly aren't. They're laughing at you, while they drop another $200 Million on Inside Out 2.

They refuse to do that, because the studios and D+ made the books look so bad they had to squeeze out profitability wherever they could - meaning, cutting live entertainment and additional park CMs wherever possible

 

[BuddyThomas]

I want to see it at some point, but I'm not in a rush. That seems to be the sentiment for a lot of movies these days.

Deadpool and Wolverine looks to be the only movie with "I have to see this now" hype.

I saw it on Saturday and it is fantastic.

 

[Willmark]

That's my main concern; how much longer can Disney keep dumping hundreds of millions down the drain on these movies? And how much longer can the parks keep propping the entire company up without any real investment?

I don't think there is going to be an answer to that this year.

Reason being Disney caught a break with the strikes to reshuffle the deck as it were. Smart move on their part as it staunches the bleeding. Rather than a repeat of 2023 they have a good chance with Deadpool 3. I think it’s going to do well and the usual suspects will say “see the MCU isn’t dead!”

IMO Deadpool is almost stand alone from the MCU really. Its success or even if it fails (which I don’t think it will do poorly); either way it doesn’t really tell us anything about the current state of MCU going forward which is not good.

The problem with Disney’s overall strategy for 2024 doesn’t do anything to address the underlying issues. It appears they are hoping to get through 2024 and thing will be better in 2025?

Add to this SW isn’t coming back to the big screen until 2027 or so?

I just don’t see what gives them that idea. It’s not like they have a lot upcoming that people are clamoring for like Marvel at its zenith and no SW in the next few years.

 

[TalkingHead]

Wonder what the odds are that Apes underperforms. Looking at the AMC app, there’s a lot of available seats on Thurs and Fri. Very curious if the general audience is going to show up for this or if they’ll wait for streaming.

 

[BuddyThomas]

Wonder what the odds are that Apes underperforms. Looking at the AMC app, there’s a lot of available seats on Thurs and Fri. Very curious if the general audience is going to show up for this or if they’ll wait for streaming.

Lots of seats already sold for Thursday in midtown Manhattan, and it doesn’t open for days.

 

[TP2000]

Wonder what the odds are that Apes underperforms. Looking at the AMC app, there’s a lot of available seats on Thurs and Fri. Very curious if the general audience is going to show up for this or if they’ll wait for streaming.

Apparently the website Box Office Pro that used to do great weekend predictions no longer does that. But a few sources from the Google are claiming a $50-ish Million opening weekend for this Apes movie.

The budget is being reported as a relatively modest $120 Million, so it will need about $360 Million globally to break even.

I hope it's a hit with the kids, because I'd love to see lots of apes and gorillas at my front door this Halloween!

 

[DKampy]

I saw it on Saturday and it is fantastic.

Agreed… anyone who is deciding to wait is missing out… this was a fun time at the cinema

 

[Miss Rori]

On a visually impressive film that has garnered appreciably more positive critical responses and higher audience scores than Kung Fu Panda 4.

That applies to Elemental, granted, but not to Wish. (Or Strange World before that.) There just seems to be horrible waste going on with Disney film budgets in general these days.

 

[LittleBuford]

That applies to Elemental, granted, but not to Wish. (Or Strange World before that.) There just seems to be horrible waste going on with Disney film budgets in general these days.

Neither of those films would have been any better had Disney spent less money on them. And whatever else may be said about it, Wish has generally received recognition for its distinctive art style, which is the sort of thing Disney’s budgets make possible.

 

[TP2000]

That applies to Elemental, granted, but not to Wish. (Or Strange World before that.) There just seems to be horrible waste going on with Disney film budgets in general these days.

Wouldn't you just love to know what they spend all that money on? Like to see an itemized list for what the $200 Million for Wish actually went to?

How much for daily catering? How much for chauffer driven Cadillac Escalades to the Burbank campus for top-line talent? How much for flowers and chocolates and wine in the green rooms on taping days? How much went to needless white-collar overhead? What about chair massages? You can't have a Hollywood studio without chair massages on tap.

Wish: Production $200, Marketing $100, Domestic B.O. Take $39, Overseas B.O. Take $70 = $191 Million Loss

 

[Minnesota disney fan]

Apparently the website Box Office Pro that used to do great weekend predictions no longer does that. But a few sources from the Google are claiming a $50-ish Million opening weekend for this Apes movie.

The budget is being reported as a relatively modest $120 Million, so it will need about $360 Million globally to break even.

I hope it's a hit with the kids, because I'd love to see lots of apes and gorillas at my front door this Halloween!

Last Halloween the majority of the kids dressed up as Mario!!! No disney characters were seen by us. There were also ghosts and ghouls. I hope that apes don't show up at my door - I have a big fear of apes, monkeys, etc.

 

[BuddyThomas]

Wouldn't you just love to know what they spend all that money on? Like to see an itemized list for what the $200 Million for Wish actually went to?

How much for daily catering? How much for chauffer driven Cadillac Escalades to the Burbank campus for top-line talent? How much for flowers and chocolates and wine in the green rooms on taping days? How much went to needless white-collar overhead? What about chair massages? You can't have a Hollywood studio without chair massages on tap.

Wish: Production $200, Marketing $100, Domestic B.O. Take $39, Overseas B.O. Take $70 = $191 Million Loss

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You’ve been going on about this since at least November. I believe your point has been made. Time to give it a rest?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

You’ve been going on about this since at least November. I believe your point has been made. Time to give it a rest?

The minute people stop trying to “reframe”it in any other way than a complete disaster.

Then we all can move on

 

[brideck]

Weekend showings have been posted in my market, and it looks like Apes is being given a pretty hefty amount for its opening, so we'll see if it can crack that $50m figure.

Recent large openings, # of screenings at local AMCs in ()
Kung Fu Panda 4 (87) - $58m
Godzilla x Kong (85) - $80m
Apes (75) - ??
Civil War (57) - $25.5m
The Fall Guy (55) - $27.7m

That MonsterVerse opening is such an anomaly. If people are coming out for CG fests, maybe that'll spill over into Apes, too? Who knows anymore.

 

[Disney Analyst]

What the Hell Do People Want Out of Movies?

‘The Fall Guy’ had all the makings of a massive summer blockbuster. So what went wrong? And why don’t audiences actually go to the sorts of movies they claim they want?

t.co

Some interesting discussion happening. Matching what a few of us have been saying and thinking.