Disney (and others) at the Box Office - Current State of Affairs

[Casper Gutman]

Non-sense. Hollywood pumps out hundreds of new stories and properties every year. Your arguing success of re-use makes it somehow a reliance to their existence? And then somehow saying we must force this diversity initiative into the other... or be against diversity fundamentally? This is some next level hoop jumping.

This year, 1 of the top 10 American-made films is not based on a pre-existing IP -Disneys Elemental. In 2022, 2019, 2018 none were. This is not coincidence. The function of the studios have shifted multiple times in their century long history as they respond to changing markets and other economic realities. For the last 20 years, they have functioned as IP silos. This is a stage in a process that began in the 80s and intensified in the following decades as the entire entertainment industry reformed itself on a corporate level. Reliance on IPs is fundamental to the studios economic logic. This is not a new or controversial idea, it’s well documented in both the industrial and academic literature.

Sometimes seemingly benign ideas have negative consequences. Arguing that those seeking diversity should just make new stories is (unknowingly or otherwise) arguing against diversity because the industry is not structured to produce blockbusters with “new stories.” That’s simply the reality.

 

[TP2000]

This year, 1 of the top 10 American-made films is not based on a pre-existing IP -Disneys Elemental.

Just a friendly point of correction, but Elemental is not in the Top 10 movies at the box office this year.

Elemental is currently in 16th place, with six weeks left of 2023 to go.

 

[Casper Gutman]

Just a point of correction, but Elemental is not in the Top 10 movies at the box office this year.

Elemental is currently in 16th place, with six weeks left of 2023 to go.

View attachment 755025

Worldwide. The box office that matters. It’s 9.

 

[TalkingHead]

This year, 1 of the top 10 American-made films is not based on a pre-existing IP -Disneys Elemental. In 2022, 2019, 2018 none were. This is not coincidence. The function of the studios have shifted multiple times in their century long history as they respond to changing markets and other economic realities. For the last 20 years, they have functioned as IP silos. This is a stage in a process that began in the 80s and intensified in the following decades as the entire entertainment industry reformed itself on a corporate level. Reliance on IPs is fundamental to the studios economic logic. This is not a new or controversial idea, it’s well documented in both the industrial and academic literature.

Sometimes seemingly benign ideas have negative consequences. Arguing that those seeking diversity should just make new stories is (unknowingly or otherwise) arguing against diversity because the industry is not structured to produce blockbusters with “new stories.” That’s simply the reality.

You forgot Oppenheimer

 

[flynnibus]

This year, 1 of the top 10 American-made films is not based on a pre-existing IP -Disneys Elemental.

And how many movies did they release? How many of those were only existing IP? Clearly they can, and do, often chose to make films with new characters.

Sometimes seemingly benign ideas have negative consequences. Arguing that those seeking diversity should just make new stories is (unknowingly or otherwise) arguing against diversity because the industry is not structured to produce blockbusters with “new stories.” That’s simply the reality.

Sometimes people will try to make things about something they aren't -- because of their own biases.

Remake Romeo and Juliet - I don't care. But don't be upset if I don't get interested in your version the same as another or worse, blanket accuse people of things simply because they didn't jump on your wagon. If the film isn't interesting to me, I'm not going to invest in it. And reworking characters out of initiative, instead of story, doesn't really inspire me to see something. Creating conflicting characters REALLY is distracting. And it's not because of people harboring hidden feelings... sometimes its you just MISSED!

 

[TP2000]

Worldwide. The box office that matters. It’s 9.

It is? The Numbers website has it in 12th place globally.

But look out, because it's only $600,000 above that laugh-riot romcom Xiao Shi De Ta that everyone is talking about.

Top 2023 Movies at the Worldwide Box Office

This chart contains the total worldwide box office for the movies released in 2023.

www.the-numbers.com

 

[Casper Gutman]

You forgot Oppenheimer

That’s a pre-existing IP - not just the man, but it was based on a book. You think the folks complaining about Silver Surfer would be happy with gender/ ethnicity swaps in Oppenheimer?

 

[Casper Gutman]

It is? The Numbers website has it in 12th place globally.

But lookout, because it's only $600,000 above that laugh-riot romcom Xiao Shi De Ta that everyone is talking about.

View attachment 755026

Top 2023 Movies at the Worldwide Box Office

This chart contains the total worldwide box office for the movies released in 2023.

www.the-numbers.com

Box Office Mojo.

 

[Tha Realest]

But look out, because it's only $600,000 above that laugh-riot romcom Xiao Shi De Ta that everyone is talking about.

I just spit out my afternoon smoothie.

 

[Disney Irish]

It is? The Numbers website has it in 12th place globally.

But look out, because it's only $600,000 above that laugh-riot romcom Xiao Shi De Ta that everyone is talking about.

View attachment 755026

Top 2023 Movies at the Worldwide Box Office

This chart contains the total worldwide box office for the movies released in 2023.

www.the-numbers.com

The Numbers adds Chinese releases that technically don't have a worldwide release, only releasing in several markets in APAC.

So that list is skewed and doesn't really reflect worldwide releases. This is why you should really use Box Office Mojo, which is the industry used standard.

2024 Worldwide Box Office

www.boxofficemojo.com

 

[Disstevefan1]

The Numbers adds Chinese releases that technically don't have a worldwide release, only releasing in several markets in APAC.

So that list is skewed and doesn't really reflect worldwide releases. This is why you should really use Box Office Mojo, which is the industry used standard.

View attachment 755029

2024 Worldwide Box Office

www.boxofficemojo.com

Hey look, Guardians edged out Fast X

 

[Disney Irish]

Hey look, Guardians edged out Fast X

And also shows how really messed up the theatrical market continues to be.

As even though they under performed, Disney still had 4 of the top 10 movies worldwide this year.

 

[TP2000]

Hey look, Guardians edged out Fast X

Never mind that, Meg 2: The Trench beat Indiana Jones 5!

 

[Disstevefan1]

And also shows how really messed up the theatrical market continues to be.

As even though they under performed, Disney still had 4 of the top 10 movies worldwide this year.

I liked Fast X, as well as the previous 9.
They are silly, fun, impossible, but you know exactly what are getting!

Yes, lets not talk about how many of these films actually lost money...

 

[Disney Irish]

I liked Fast X, as well as the previous 9.
They are silly, fun, impossible, but you know exactly what are getting!

Yes, lets not talk about how many of these films actually lost money...

There are quite a few on that list, even outside of Disney, that lost money. Again it shows how messed up theatrical continues to be.

 

[TP2000]

The Numbers adds Chinese releases that technically don't have a worldwide release, only releasing in several markets in APAC.

So that list is skewed and doesn't really reflect worldwide releases. This is why you should really use Box Office Mojo, which is the industry used standard.

Ah, well if Box Office Mojo is ignoring the racist and evil Communist dictatorship, then I'm certainly all for that!

I still maintain that Iger going all in and building the Chinese Communist Party a Disneyland to call their own, so Disney could release movies to its 1.4 Billion convicts citizens, was a very, very bad idea. It's not going to end well.

Iger's decision to build in China was a huge mistake morally, and it will end up sooner than later as a huge mistake financially.

 

[Disstevefan1]

There are quite a few on that list, even outside of Disney, that lost money. Again it shows how messed up theatrical continues to be.

Even though the movie tickets are ridiculously high, modern movie budgets are out of control. In the old days it was a battle between cost and art and somehow the got it done.

There is no excuse for these out of control budgets today.

 

[TalkingHead]

That’s a pre-existing IP - not just the man, but it was based on a book. You think the folks complaining about Silver Surfer would be happy with gender/ ethnicity swaps in Oppenheimer?

What are you even talking about? It wasn’t marketed as “based on the book” like Killers of the Flower Moon was.

 

[Disney Irish]

Ah, well if Box Office Mojo is ignoring the racist and evil Communist dictatorship, then I'm certainly all for that!

I still maintain that Iger going all in and building the Chinese Communist Party a Disneyland to call their own, so Disney could release movies to its 1.4 Billion convicts citizens, was a very, very bad idea. It's not going to end well.

Iger's decision to build in China was a huge mistake morally, and it will end up sooner than later as a huge mistake financially.

No, they are ignoring movies that really didn't have a worldwide release. My guess is that a movie has to be released in certain markets to be considered really a worldwide release.

 

[Disney Irish]

Even though the movie tickets are ridiculously high, modern movie budgets are out of control. In the old days it was a battle between cost and art and somehow the got it done.

There is no excuse for these out of control budgets today.

I don't disagree in the aggregate. Many of the films we've been talking about were in production for years and had their budgets approved back in 2018/2019. So its going to take awhile for budgets to get reigned in.

I suspect anything releasing in the next 6-9 months will still have high budgets and anything after that we'll start to see a decrease in the budgets.

Its also cyclical, we'll get into an era of lower budget blockbusters, and then it'll swing back the other way and we'll be talking about high budget losers again in 5-7 years.