Cuts coming to every area of parks and resorts - thanks to Shanghai and Paris

[dreamscometrue]

An easy way to compare hours and parade times from this year and last year
http://www.wdwmagic.com/calendar.htm

That actually makes me feel better. As I noted in my earlier post, these cuts are not cool, but I don't think they are earth shattering or will have much of an effect on the guest experience. Quickly comparing last May (as a random example) to May, 2016...the park hours all almost exactly the same across the board. And in terms of entertainment, The Main Street Electrical Parade and Fantasmic! show nightly, instead of sometimes twice per night. Not necessary, but I don't think it'll change the quality of my vacation.

One strange thing though...DAK hours this May, currently show 6 pm closing often. Won't these hours be updated for evening Rivers of Light performances and the night safari? It's not dark until about 8:30pm in Orlando in May

 

[Next Big Thing]

I don't think it does.

In my opinion, the whole point of HKDL was for Disney to get their foot in the door with the Chinese government. To get an initial resort built on a shoestring budget, run it for a bit, and then negotiate with them for a larger and more elaborate resort (Shanghai). It was just to get the blood going between the two parties. It wasn't meant to innovate or jaw-drop... It was to introduce the Disney style park to the culture, learn from it for a while, and determine what to change for the real goal of Shanghai.

HKDL is a quaint, attractive resort. But it's simply one park that until fairly recently was extremely tiny. @WDW1974 and I disagree on this topic (it's one of the few!), but for me HK was by far my least favorite Disney resort on the planet. Now, I'll admit I haven't been since the expansion. But when I could walk from the exit of Autopia in Tomorrowland to the opposite corner of the park in Adventureland near the treehouse and Jungle Cruise in well under a minute... That's a problem. When the park guide is listing ridiculous stuff as "attractions" just to pad the numbers, that's a problem. When I was there, I got there at rope drop, and sometime shortly after lunch was already repeating attractions because I had done it all.

I'm sure the Chinese economy played a bit of a role in the lost visitors, but I'm also quite sure that just the size of the park and lack of a large roster of rides and attractions effects it too. And don't forget... Chinese Disney Parks fans are well aware Shanghai is close to opening. It makes good sense that some portion of those people are waiting to visit there rather than another visit to HKDL.

By all accounts, Shanghai looks to be innovative, new, impressive, and DIFFERENT. I'd venture to say there's more discussions going on about how to fix HKDL than there are about worry about Shanghai.

Well by all accounts there's a push for a 2nd gate by the Chinese gov't currently.

 

[No Name]

With the current business structure, how can we expect any P&R leader to not make cuts, and instead, approve any projects? These additions cost $$$ and usually take anywhere from 3-5 years to complete. Jay Rasulo led the parks for 4 years. Tom Staggs for 5 years. Do you see how this is problematic? Execs want to make money as quickly as possible because they don't know when Bob Iger's Final Judgement will come, and when that day hits, they want to look as good as possible with the best numbers they could have. History shows that most of these execs don't stay in their position for more than 5 years. So when a project takes 5 years to build, that's money being sucked from the current guy's profits and helping the next guy's. This isn't a team sport anymore. It hasn't been a team sport for a long time. Therefore, when the CEO is one of those guys who looks at pie charts and line graphs to decide who's doing the best job, long-term investments don't make sense for P&R leaders.

Chapek, a guy with no theme park experince or interest, is likely itching to get out of his role when the ladder shifts again. So he's looking to post great results ASAP at all costs. And the easiest, quickest way to do this is through cuts. Now, what happens if these cuts and lack of additions lower attendance in the long term? Chappie could care less! Again, if he's not going to be leading the parks for more than a few years, it'll be the next guy's problem.

Good, qualified leaders need to be found and put in charge of P&R for a least a decade, so that they can be responsible for the results of their actions. If a guy knew he was going to be in one position for a decade, I'm sure he'd care about how his decisions will affect the parks ten years from now.

 

[marni1971]

Have the budgets been unrealistic from the outset simply because of the way WDI has been run? It seems like this has been the case for awhile, and Weis was put there to fix that. Yes?

I'd say yes. Hundreds of millions should get you your money's worth. If a particular land is several hundred million over budget it makes you wonder a) how it can happen and b) how the original not small budget can't be properly utilised and c) how other companies can do so much for the same - or less.

 

[ford91exploder]

Tokyo Disney proves otherwise on a daily basis.

Tokyo Disney is not RUN by Disney, It's run by a private corporation which has owners not 'Institutional Shareholders' who only care about increasing short term profit not long term viability of the the company.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

The Main Street Electrical Parade and Fantasmic! show nightly, instead of sometimes twice per night. Not necessary, but I don't think it'll change the quality of my vacation.

I totally disagree... F! is the perfect example of how it absolutely WILL effect my vacation. Even with two showings of F! during Spring Break periods, you have to get there 60-90 minutes ahead of time just to get a seat, and sometimes even then it's a battle. Now cut the showings in half.

Now I've got to make a decision. Miss seeing F!, or commit to an even longer wait than I already commit to.

And heaven forbid I had 6PM dinner reservations with plans to stand in line for F! after dinner... Because now I have to choose between missing F! and skipping my Sci-Fi reservation because since people have been choosing their meal locations and times for 5 months now, there are no other table service locations left for me as an option.

Waiting at least 90 minutes for a seat for F!, or eating ANOTHER order of chicken strips or a cheesburger.

A Disney Parks Sophie's Choice.

 

[marni1971]

Well by all accounts there's a push for a 2nd gate by the Chinese gov't currently.

Debatable at the moment.

 

[Next Big Thing]

Debatable at the moment.

I think it's more the gov't that wants it... Disney a bit opposed if I remember, correct?

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Well by all accounts there's a push for a 2nd gate by the Chinese gov't currently.

I'm not surprised. They can't be happy with the HKDL resort when compared to the other Disney resorts around the world.

I'm sure it was sold as a way to test the market initially. To minimize risk. To build it at a size that would make it virtually impossible to fail. They likely even guaranteed bailing the resort out if needed (Disney, not the government). HKDL was going to be a test ballooon that wouldn't fail. It would be a lot harder to prop up multiple parks, hotels, etc than to prop up a single, small park.

 

[ford91exploder]

Avatar land blowing its budget, mymagic blowing its budget, Shanghai blowing its budget.

But who's really to blame? And should blame lie in unrealistic budgets or budgets that are syphoned off into the historic hierarchy?

In short Bob Iger is to blame because he created the environment which allowed those budget overruns, Sorry he did not exercise appropriate supervision of his VP's

 

[asianway]

Curbside greeters at the resorts are disappearing after this week.

Fantasmic and DEP will be one time nightly, including during the spring break period.

Popular meet and greets are getting the ax on an almost daily basis.

Its not like running a second F! or MSEP costs 2x as much as one. Theres a lot better ways to save some coin.

 

[ChrisFL]

Tokyo Disney is not RUN by Disney, It's run by a private corporation which has owners not 'Institutional Shareholders' who only care about increasing short term profit not long term viability of the the company.

Tokyo Disney also has the advantage of being in a country that LOVES Disney and all things cute....I can't say the same for Paris or possibly HK or Shanghai

 

[ford91exploder]

Tokyo Disney also has the advantage of being in a country that LOVES Disney and all things cute....I can't say the same for Paris or possibly HK or Shanghai

Very true I'd like to get more TDL time but trips to asia are work related and usually only get a half or full day on my own.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I don't think it does.

In my opinion, the whole point of HKDL was for Disney to get their foot in the door with the Chinese government. To get an initial resort built on a shoestring budget, run it for a bit, and then negotiate with them for a larger and more elaborate resort (Shanghai). It was just to get the blood going between the two parties. It wasn't meant to innovate or jaw-drop... It was to introduce the Disney style park to the culture, learn from it for a while, and determine what to change for the real goal of Shanghai.

I think the notion of cultural practice is greatly overstated when it comes to Hong Kong Disneyland. The cultural similarities are incredibly lacking (the local media warned Hong Kongers to avoid the Mandarin lines even if it is the shortest) and negotiations were not with Mainland officials, so there was no start to a working relationship. To add to that, the Mainland is not the top-down unitary system Americans envision. Even if Hong Kong was part of the Mainland administrative system, there would still not be this centralized cooperation radiating out of Beijing.

 

[asianway]

Looks like Mr Corless picked up on the story. If only that lazy **** at the Slantinel would steal this one

 

[yepitsandy]

This is all disheartening.

We are going for a family trip in July. It will be my five year old's first trip. Yes, July is a horrible time, but she's out of school and it is the only time my wife could get off work. I know it isn't going to be perfect or without long waits. I know it will be crowded and hot, neither of which are management's fault. I have been dozens of times in every month, I know what to expect... I just hope things aren't so cut back that it is an added level of horrible onto what is already expected.

We'll see, I guess. We are taking 2017 off from doing trips unless we have some amazing financial windfall, but 2018 could be different than the "yep, we're going to Disney World" usual answer if they can't get things together. Granted, there is a chance we could try the cruise line instead so they still get our money, but if they aren't going to make the experience great for guests, why go to the parks?

It's the same argument I have at work with upper management as a store-level management. We operate on 700 or so employee hours a week, but we are having to cut hours to make up for lower-performing stores. Cutting our store down to 500 hours every month or two only hurts us and makes us not be able to make sales or give decent customer service. It might save you money, but it doesn't make you money.

 

[RSoxNo1]

So let's recap. Several people on these boards stated from the outset that My Magic+ would be an economic wasteland that wouldn't generate additional money. Several other (and similar people) stated that Shanghai is a very volatile market and not exactly Anaheim circa 1955 as it was advertised. It seems that a handful of our smarter posters could have been hired for far less than $6 billion dollars.

 

[rioriz]

I'd wager a guess that had these cuts not been announced but carried through, most of those with future trips would not have known much of a difference with "In Park" experience. The operating hours are more presently noticed but still are not vacation killers. If you have a trip planned during this time forget you read this and take the experience you have for what it is.

Yes, Disney blows at managing a budget but so does the Federal Gov't on a yearly basis. Why, because both lack any accountability and somehow the people want more of it. Too big to fail and too big for the general pop to care. Not saying its right and a good model by any means but spending time question why or how is fruitless. Just focus on the what you can do to make sure you have the best vacation yet. Usually that means a change of perspective or perception is needed.

 

[dreamscometrue]

I totally disagree... F! is the perfect example of how it absolutely WILL effect my vacation. Even with two showings of F! during Spring Break periods, you have to get there 60-90 minutes ahead of time just to get a seat, and sometimes even then it's a battle.

Okay, I'll give you that during Spring Break...when crowd levels are insane. So, sure.

What I meant was that if the most significant thing I'll experience because of these these cuts will be F! and MSEP going to once nightly for awhile, it's not the end of the world.

 

[71jason]

Myopically viewing this only from an immediate guest perspective misses a larger point. A lot of CMs basically count on overtime (even "part-time" CMs). If they are really held to 32 hours even during Spring Break, many will seek work elsewhere. The decline in quality in WDW staff is about to become exponential.