Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

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ToTBellHop

Well-Known Member
Yeah, the headlines all shout about how after 4 weeks there isn't any better protection against **infection**.

BUT... they all bury the lede: The second booster is still protecting against serious disease (more so than with just one booster) even up to six weeks. And it's only been widely in use for six weeks, so, we don't know when or if the protection against hospitalization will wane.
Right. It’s probably unnecessary in America for the boosted at this point given that so many of us also had BA.1, BA.2, or will meet their bouncing baby boy. But antibodies are like money. There reaches a point where more antibody is unnecessary.

Still, immunity will wane. And one of the most significant features of mRNA vaccines is their adaptability. By fall, it will be past time for updated vaccines closer to current strains. They manage yearly turnaround for flu and those aren’t mRNA vaccines (yet).
 

correcaminos

Well-Known Member
Right. It’s probably unnecessary in America for the boosted at this point given that so many of us also had BA.1, BA.2, or will meet their bouncing baby boy. But antibodies are like money. There reaches a point where more antibody is unnecessary.

Still, immunity will wane. And one of the most significant features of mRNA vaccines is their adaptability. By fall, it will be past time for updated vaccines closer to current strains. They manage yearly turnaround for flu and those aren’t mRNA vaccines (yet).
My dad and I talked about it. With the timing of his booster, he said he'd rather hold off and see when cases drive again if there's a more specialized for more recent strain boosters or just another one heading into like fall. For immunocompromised or those even more fragile in health, I see maybe doing it now.

For me? Not happening unless Pfizer asks me to since I don't qualify anyway.
 

mmascari

Well-Known Member
Is the text better than the graphics?

I skimmed all the graphics, and they were quite terrible. I mean, I expect very little from the NY Times, but this was ridiculous.

Cases per 100K per Day.
Cases raw count in 2019.
Percentage of Tested Specimens.
Cases raw count per year.
Cases raw count per month.
Cases raw count per week.
Deaths per 100K per year.

There's no comparison of COVID to anything else on any of the charts and no chart with COVID uses the same metrics as any of the others. From the graphics, it's impossible to tell how COVID relates to the others on any metric. Is it less, the same, more, by a little, by orders of magnitude, by many orders of magnitude. Who knows, the NY Times, in an article about what Endemic comparison would be isn't saying. 🤷‍♂️ :mad:

PS: The Headline Graphic seems to compare them, but it's got no scale at all. It's as useful as random squiggles.
 

Vegas Disney Fan

Well-Known Member
My dad and I talked about it. With the timing of his booster, he said he'd rather hold off and see when cases drive again if there's a more specialized for more recent strain boosters or just another one heading into like fall. For immunocompromised or those even more fragile in health, I see maybe doing it now.

For me? Not happening unless Pfizer asks me to since I don't qualify anyway.
We came to a similar conclusion for the second booster, we are both vaxxed and boosted and at this point we are more concerned with potential immunity fatigue than the current case counts.

If another wave hits we’ll likely jump in the booster line again, hopefully for a shot adjusted to the new variants, but until then we don’t see the need right now.
 

correcaminos

Well-Known Member
We came to a similar conclusion for the second booster, we are both vaxxed and boosted and at this point we are more concerned with potential immunity fatigue than the current case counts.

If another wave hits we’ll likely jump in the booster line again, hopefully for a shot adjusted to the new variants, but until then we don’t see the need right now.
Sounds smart to me. Obviously I'm known to be super pro-vax but I think looking to future isn't bad at all. I love my dad and he qualifies for 4th dose but by the time he can get it, spacing is just meh and he has to work around a shingles vaccine too. If things change I'll chat with him. For noe, he's done good.
 

mattpeto

Well-Known Member
We came to a similar conclusion for the second booster, we are both vaxxed and boosted and at this point we are more concerned with potential immunity fatigue than the current case counts.

If another wave hits we’ll likely jump in the booster line again, hopefully for a shot adjusted to the new variants, but until then we don’t see the need right now.

I got vaccinated as soon as I possibly could...

I finally got Covid around NYE. It was mild and I was thankful I got vaccinated - it certainly could have contributed to my quick recovery.

I'd honestly like to hold off to get a 3rd (or further) boosters from the 2019 strand. Unfortunately if you say that in some circles, you're anti-vaxer or conspiracy theorist. Your post is full of nuance and I'm with your perspective completely.

We are in unchartered times and obviously if people want to boost quarterly and you're able to, I get it too.
 

Disney4Lyfe

Well-Known Member

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
Is the text better than the graphics?

Is This What Endemic Disease Looks Like?​

By Eleanor Lutz and Amy Schoenfeld WalkerApril 7, 2022

For months, some American and European leaders have foretold that the coronavirus pandemic would soon become endemic. Covid-19 would resolve into a disease that we learn to live with. According to several governors, it nearly has.

But we are still in the acute phase of the pandemic, and what endemic Covid might look like remains a mystery. Endemic diseases can take many forms, and we do not know yet where this two-year-old disease will fall among them.

The coronavirus pandemic continues​


Global Covid-19 cases​


1649355026823.png



At its most basic, an endemic disease is one with a constant, predictable or expected presence. It’s a disease that persists. Beyond that, there is no fixed definition.

Endemic diseases infect millions of people around the world each year, and some endemic diseases kill hundreds of thousands. Some we can treat and vaccinate against. Yet they can also cause unexpected outbreaks and significant suffering.

Interviews with two dozen scientists, public health experts and medical historians suggest the rush to recast Covid as endemic may be missing the point.

“There’s been a political reframing of the idea of endemic as something that is harmless or normal,” said Lukas Engelmann, a historian of medicine and epidemiology at the University of Edinburgh. But epidemiologists use endemic to mean something we should watch carefully, he said, because an endemic disease can become epidemic again.

Endemic diseases can be mild or deadly

When people think of endemic disease, they often think of the common cold. Upper respiratory infections, including colds, are estimated to infect billions of people worldwide every year but kill several thousand. Other endemic diseases can be much more lethal. Malaria killed more than 600,000 people globally in 2019, and flu killed more than 200,000, though estimates suggest these tolls could be much higher.

Endemic diseases are not without suffering​


1649355086289.png


Many scientists predict that endemic Covid may have a similar burden to other respiratory viruses.

“It will be no more deadly than seasonal flu, or may be mild like one of the cold-causing coronaviruses,” said Lone Simonsen, the director of the PandemiX Center at Roskilde University in Denmark.

“The reason for this is that we have a lot of immunity and we keep getting boosted from the infections that we run into,” she said.

Some scientists warn that immune protection from vaccination and infection may wane over time, and future variants might sidestep those defenses. And mutations are random, so there is always a chance a variant that causes more severe disease could arise in the future.

Endemic diseases can have epidemic periods

The common cold and the flu are widespread endemic diseases that persist year round, but their levels are not constant. Instead they cause seasonal epidemics, where infections rise beyond baseline endemic levels, often in the winter when people gather indoors.

Influenza has seasonal epidemics​


Percentage of tested specimens in the U.S. positive for influenza Type A​

1649355135037.png


These patterns are predictable, but people can change them: The control measures used to blunt the Covid pandemic dampened flu and cold waves in recent years, too.

Scientists say that endemic Covid could be seasonal, but it could also have irregular and significant epidemic waves.

“Covid is much, much more transmissible than the flu,” said Jeffrey Shaman, an infectious-disease modeler at Columbia University. “Only a small portion of the population needs to be susceptible for an outbreak to foment, and that can happen at any time of year.”

The burden of endemic disease is unequal

One community’s experience with endemic disease can be vastly different from another’s, often depending on who is getting sick and whether they have access to tests, treatments and health care.

H.I.V., which has persisted across the globe for more than 40 years, is one example, though scientists and public health workers use both “epidemic” and “endemic” to describe the virus.

“One definition of endemic is defined by geographic location,” said Dr. Diane Havlir, an infectious disease specialist and professor of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco. “Through that lens, H.I.V. is endemic in the United States, where approximately 1.2 million persons are living with H.I.V.”
“But H.I.V. is epidemic in subpopulations in the U.S.,” she added.

H.I.V. disproportionately affects certain groups​


Estimated H.I.V. incidence in the United States by race and ethnicity​


1649355169441.png


Infectious diseases often remain in communities where poverty or discriminatory systems prevent access to health care, Dr. Havlir said.

“Disease disparities increase over time unless they are addressed at the outset,” she said. “And that raises the question: Are we addressing those disparities with Covid or are we on that same trajectory?”

With one-third of the global population unvaccinated against Covid and life-saving treatments not available to all, the virus’s burden will likely continue to be unequal, experts say, even as parts of the world decide their levels are endemic.

Endemic disease is all about control

Among the many forms endemic disease can take, one thing is clear: Endemic does not mean the end of the disease.

Instead, it means living with, and often managing, a disease that has not been, or cannot be, stamped out. Health experts say that countries must use control measures, like testing, treatments and vaccinations, to keep endemic diseases in check.

Countries with endemic malaria aspire to eradicate the mosquito-borne disease and rely on interventions like insecticides and preventative treatments to reduce its incidence. These control measures can drastically alter the course of endemic malaria, as they have in South Africa.

Malaria control programs can reduce disease transmission​


New malaria case notifications in KwaZulu-Natal, South Africa​

1649355198977.png


In addition to environmental controls, vaccination programs can reduce cases and deaths. But when communities do not adhere to vaccination recommendations, outbreaks can happen.

Measles, for example, remained endemic in the United States for 40 years after the introduction of vaccines. During that period, unvaccinated people remained vulnerable, fueling occasional outbreaks. In 2019, two decades after the disease was declared eliminated in the United States, several outbreaks, many associated with unvaccinated travelers, infected more than a thousand people.

Outbreaks can happen even after a disease reaches endemic levels​


New measles cases reported in the U.S.​

1649355241386.png


Unlike malaria or measles, public health experts say that Covid cannot be eradicated, so control measures will help determine the size and course of future waves. (We have eradicated just one human disease: smallpox, which behaved quite differently from Covid.)

Keeping up with Covid means staying focused on vaccinating, treating and updating vaccines, said Dr. Monica Gandhi, an infectious disease specialist and professor of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco. “It’s going to take constant vigilance to keep it — not to eradicate it, which would be what humans want — but to keep it under control.”

When will we know what Covid’s endemic phase looks like?

Probably not for a while. Scientists usually determine a disease’s endemic pattern after observing it for many years.

Pandemics can take years to settle, and the consequences of widespread illness can last long after new infections fade.

Much of what we know about the transition out of pandemics comes from flu — humans have witnessed four influenza pandemics in the last 100 years. The 1918-19 pandemic, which killed more than 50 million people globally, dwarfs them all.

Pandemics take time to resolve and can return again​


Estimated influenza deaths in the U.S.​

1649355275628.png


It took the 1918 flu pandemic three years to settle into a more regular pattern, and the United States had a significant 1920 wave that killed more people in some cities than previous waves had. In the years that followed, some seasonal outbreaks were larger than others.

The assumption about Covid’s endemic period is that it will look meaningfully different from the pandemic of the last two years. But endemic Covid, in the worst-case scenario, could look something like where we’ve been.

“You can imagine a situation where Omicron-like events happen every year,” said Trevor Bedford, a virologist at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center in Seattle.

“That can be the endemic state,” Dr. Bedford said. “And it doesn’t mean that it’s mild, and it doesn’t mean that it’s easy to deal with.”


Sources for top graphic: U.S. National Notifiable Disease Surveillance System via Project Tycho (measles); Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (influenza); South Africa National Department of Health, Barnes et al (malaria); New York Times database of reports from state and local health agencies (Covid-19)
Marco Hernandez contributed reporting.
 

mmascari

Well-Known Member

Is This What Endemic Disease Looks Like?​

But we are still in the acute phase of the pandemic, and what endemic Covid might look like remains a mystery. Endemic diseases can take many forms, and we do not know yet where this two-year-old disease will fall among them.

Interviews with two dozen scientists, public health experts and medical historians suggest the rush to recast Covid as endemic may be missing the point.

Endemic diseases can be mild or deadly

Many scientists predict that endemic Covid may have a similar burden to other respiratory viruses.

“It will be no more deadly than seasonal flu, or may be mild like one of the cold-causing coronaviruses,” said Lone Simonsen, the director of the PandemiX Center at Roskilde University in Denmark.

Endemic diseases can have epidemic periods

“Covid is much, much more transmissible than the flu,” said Jeffrey Shaman, an infectious-disease modeler at Columbia University. “Only a small portion of the population needs to be susceptible for an outbreak to foment, and that can happen at any time of year.”

The burden of endemic disease is unequal


Endemic disease is all about control

Among the many forms endemic disease can take, one thing is clear: Endemic does not mean the end of the disease.

Instead, it means living with, and often managing, a disease that has not been, or cannot be, stamped out. Health experts say that countries must use control measures, like testing, treatments and vaccinations, to keep endemic diseases in check.

Keeping up with Covid means staying focused on vaccinating, treating and updating vaccines, said Dr. Monica Gandhi, an infectious disease specialist and professor of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco. “It’s going to take constant vigilance to keep it — not to eradicate it, which would be what humans want — but to keep it under control.”

When will we know what Covid’s endemic phase looks like?

Probably not for a while
. Scientists usually determine a disease’s endemic pattern after observing it for many years.

Pandemics can take years to settle, and the consequences of widespread illness can last long after new infections fade.

The assumption about Covid’s endemic period is that it will look meaningfully different from the pandemic of the last two years. But endemic Covid, in the worst-case scenario, could look something like where we’ve been.

“You can imagine a situation where Omicron-like events happen every year,” said Trevor Bedford, a virologist at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center in Seattle.

“That can be the endemic state,” Dr. Bedford said. “And it doesn’t mean that it’s mild, and it doesn’t mean that it’s easy to deal with.”
Sorry, I didn't mean I couldn't read it. I clicked through and skimmed, mostly looking at the graphics. I found them very lacking. I was commenting on the quality of the article, which I found lacking. Thanks for posting the text though, just in case.

I read through it now instead of just the graphics. It didn't help. It's still a trash article that doesn't really tell us anything about COVID.

I bolded what I see as some of the informative bits. But, essentially the whole broke down to "We've got no idea what endemic COVID will look like". With one opinion that it'll be no worse than the flu, because reasons. And another showing that it's not the flu. Not in this article, but in other opinions from doctors, I've heard more than once that if COVID ends up like the flu every year, we're going to be trouble. It's both more infectious and has a larger impact. Meaning, have a yearly lifecycle like the flu would be very bad.

The summary at the bottom kind of summed it up. We've got no idea what endemic COVID will look like or mean and we're not going to know for a long time still.
 

Dreaming of Disney World

Well-Known Member
Recombinant strains have happened without much ado. Given that BA.1 and .2 are coexisting in a lot of places this isn't surprising.


Mostly. There are some regions not following and have some increases but nothing like when omicron first hit. Much like European regions some seem to be following different curves. Since spring break my school district has reported 0 cases. This yucky sore throat and fever with hacking cough virus seems to be more worrisome at the moment.
I live in Southern Maine, and cases started rising again. Fortunately they're now decreasing again for a few days. If they get below 10 cases per 100,000 people i might let my kids stop wearing masks at school.
 

GimpYancIent

Well-Known Member

Is This What Endemic Disease Looks Like?​

By Eleanor Lutz and Amy Schoenfeld WalkerApril 7, 2022

For months, some American and European leaders have foretold that the coronavirus pandemic would soon become endemic. Covid-19 would resolve into a disease that we learn to live with. According to several governors, it nearly has.

But we are still in the acute phase of the pandemic, and what endemic Covid might look like remains a mystery. Endemic diseases can take many forms, and we do not know yet where this two-year-old disease will fall among them.

The coronavirus pandemic continues​


Global Covid-19 cases​


View attachment 631457


At its most basic, an endemic disease is one with a constant, predictable or expected presence. It’s a disease that persists. Beyond that, there is no fixed definition.

Endemic diseases infect millions of people around the world each year, and some endemic diseases kill hundreds of thousands. Some we can treat and vaccinate against. Yet they can also cause unexpected outbreaks and significant suffering.

Interviews with two dozen scientists, public health experts and medical historians suggest the rush to recast Covid as endemic may be missing the point.

“There’s been a political reframing of the idea of endemic as something that is harmless or normal,” said Lukas Engelmann, a historian of medicine and epidemiology at the University of Edinburgh. But epidemiologists use endemic to mean something we should watch carefully, he said, because an endemic disease can become epidemic again.

Endemic diseases can be mild or deadly

When people think of endemic disease, they often think of the common cold. Upper respiratory infections, including colds, are estimated to infect billions of people worldwide every year but kill several thousand. Other endemic diseases can be much more lethal. Malaria killed more than 600,000 people globally in 2019, and flu killed more than 200,000, though estimates suggest these tolls could be much higher.

Endemic diseases are not without suffering​


View attachment 631458

Many scientists predict that endemic Covid may have a similar burden to other respiratory viruses.

“It will be no more deadly than seasonal flu, or may be mild like one of the cold-causing coronaviruses,” said Lone Simonsen, the director of the PandemiX Center at Roskilde University in Denmark.

“The reason for this is that we have a lot of immunity and we keep getting boosted from the infections that we run into,” she said.

Some scientists warn that immune protection from vaccination and infection may wane over time, and future variants might sidestep those defenses. And mutations are random, so there is always a chance a variant that causes more severe disease could arise in the future.

Endemic diseases can have epidemic periods

The common cold and the flu are widespread endemic diseases that persist year round, but their levels are not constant. Instead they cause seasonal epidemics, where infections rise beyond baseline endemic levels, often in the winter when people gather indoors.

Influenza has seasonal epidemics​


Percentage of tested specimens in the U.S. positive for influenza Type A​

View attachment 631459

These patterns are predictable, but people can change them: The control measures used to blunt the Covid pandemic dampened flu and cold waves in recent years, too.

Scientists say that endemic Covid could be seasonal, but it could also have irregular and significant epidemic waves.

“Covid is much, much more transmissible than the flu,” said Jeffrey Shaman, an infectious-disease modeler at Columbia University. “Only a small portion of the population needs to be susceptible for an outbreak to foment, and that can happen at any time of year.”

The burden of endemic disease is unequal

One community’s experience with endemic disease can be vastly different from another’s, often depending on who is getting sick and whether they have access to tests, treatments and health care.

H.I.V., which has persisted across the globe for more than 40 years, is one example, though scientists and public health workers use both “epidemic” and “endemic” to describe the virus.

“One definition of endemic is defined by geographic location,” said Dr. Diane Havlir, an infectious disease specialist and professor of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco. “Through that lens, H.I.V. is endemic in the United States, where approximately 1.2 million persons are living with H.I.V.”
“But H.I.V. is epidemic in subpopulations in the U.S.,” she added.

H.I.V. disproportionately affects certain groups​


Estimated H.I.V. incidence in the United States by race and ethnicity​


View attachment 631460

Infectious diseases often remain in communities where poverty or discriminatory systems prevent access to health care, Dr. Havlir said.

“Disease disparities increase over time unless they are addressed at the outset,” she said. “And that raises the question: Are we addressing those disparities with Covid or are we on that same trajectory?”

With one-third of the global population unvaccinated against Covid and life-saving treatments not available to all, the virus’s burden will likely continue to be unequal, experts say, even as parts of the world decide their levels are endemic.

Endemic disease is all about control

Among the many forms endemic disease can take, one thing is clear: Endemic does not mean the end of the disease.

Instead, it means living with, and often managing, a disease that has not been, or cannot be, stamped out. Health experts say that countries must use control measures, like testing, treatments and vaccinations, to keep endemic diseases in check.

Countries with endemic malaria aspire to eradicate the mosquito-borne disease and rely on interventions like insecticides and preventative treatments to reduce its incidence. These control measures can drastically alter the course of endemic malaria, as they have in South Africa.

Malaria control programs can reduce disease transmission​


New malaria case notifications in KwaZulu-Natal, South Africa​

View attachment 631461

In addition to environmental controls, vaccination programs can reduce cases and deaths. But when communities do not adhere to vaccination recommendations, outbreaks can happen.

Measles, for example, remained endemic in the United States for 40 years after the introduction of vaccines. During that period, unvaccinated people remained vulnerable, fueling occasional outbreaks. In 2019, two decades after the disease was declared eliminated in the United States, several outbreaks, many associated with unvaccinated travelers, infected more than a thousand people.

Outbreaks can happen even after a disease reaches endemic levels​


New measles cases reported in the U.S.​

View attachment 631462

Unlike malaria or measles, public health experts say that Covid cannot be eradicated, so control measures will help determine the size and course of future waves. (We have eradicated just one human disease: smallpox, which behaved quite differently from Covid.)

Keeping up with Covid means staying focused on vaccinating, treating and updating vaccines, said Dr. Monica Gandhi, an infectious disease specialist and professor of medicine at the University of California, San Francisco. “It’s going to take constant vigilance to keep it — not to eradicate it, which would be what humans want — but to keep it under control.”

When will we know what Covid’s endemic phase looks like?

Probably not for a while. Scientists usually determine a disease’s endemic pattern after observing it for many years.

Pandemics can take years to settle, and the consequences of widespread illness can last long after new infections fade.

Much of what we know about the transition out of pandemics comes from flu — humans have witnessed four influenza pandemics in the last 100 years. The 1918-19 pandemic, which killed more than 50 million people globally, dwarfs them all.

Pandemics take time to resolve and can return again​


Estimated influenza deaths in the U.S.​

View attachment 631464

It took the 1918 flu pandemic three years to settle into a more regular pattern, and the United States had a significant 1920 wave that killed more people in some cities than previous waves had. In the years that followed, some seasonal outbreaks were larger than others.

The assumption about Covid’s endemic period is that it will look meaningfully different from the pandemic of the last two years. But endemic Covid, in the worst-case scenario, could look something like where we’ve been.

“You can imagine a situation where Omicron-like events happen every year,” said Trevor Bedford, a virologist at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center in Seattle.

“That can be the endemic state,” Dr. Bedford said. “And it doesn’t mean that it’s mild, and it doesn’t mean that it’s easy to deal with.”


Sources for top graphic: U.S. National Notifiable Disease Surveillance System via Project Tycho (measles); Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (influenza); South Africa National Department of Health, Barnes et al (malaria); New York Times database of reports from state and local health agencies (Covid-19)
Marco Hernandez contributed reporting.
Now that is an exhaustive post to read. Whew. Now for a drink.
 

Mark52479

Well-Known Member
I got vaccinated as soon as I possibly could...

I finally got Covid around NYE. It was mild and I was thankful I got vaccinated - it certainly could have contributed to my quick recovery.

I'd honestly like to hold off to get a 3rd (or further) boosters from the 2019 strand. Unfortunately if you say that in some circles, you're anti-vaxer or conspiracy theorist. Your post is full of nuance and I'm with your perspective completely.

We are in unchartered times and obviously if people want to boost quarterly and you're able to, I get it too.
Same exact thing with me. I am vaccinated and Finally got Covid at the end of January. Was also very mild 4 days and done. I did my antibody test and the results showed OVER 2,500. At this time I am not going to get the booster until my antibodies come down.
 

Chomama

Well-Known Member
Same exact thing with me. I am vaccinated and Finally got Covid at the end of January. Was also very mild 4 days and done. I did my antibody test and the results showed OVER 2,500. At this time I am not going to get the booster until my antibodies come down.
Same here. Vaccinated. Boasted in November. Got 1/1 and AGAIN 3/5!!! First time unpleasant cold and sore throat for a week. Second time one day of feeling fluish and sleepy. Fine now. I will get a booster again if they adjust for variants but at this point I am living my life. 3 shots followed by 2 infections. This thing. Isn’t going away and I am very comfortable with my level
Of immunity and the degree of illness I had. Waaaay better than the flu I had last spring (and yes, I got my flu shot). Without a vaccine I would still be very careful. At this point I wave my flag. We all have a very easy way to protect ourselves from what we saw in 2020. We have forgotten how many people
Suffered and died very quickly. But that is over and we need to love while we can.
 

Tom P.

Well-Known Member
Same here. Vaccinated. Boasted in November. Got 1/1 and AGAIN 3/5!!! First time unpleasant cold and sore throat for a week. Second time one day of feeling fluish and sleepy. Fine now. I will get a booster again if they adjust for variants but at this point I am living my life. 3 shots followed by 2 infections. This thing. Isn’t going away and I am very comfortable with my level
Of immunity and the degree of illness I had. Waaaay better than the flu I had last spring (and yes, I got my flu shot). Without a vaccine I would still be very careful. At this point I wave my flag. We all have a very easy way to protect ourselves from what we saw in 2020. We have forgotten how many people
Suffered and died very quickly. But that is over and we need to love while we can.
As I've mentioned in one of these threads before, I am personally vaccinated with the original two doses of Moderna. A few weeks after the second dose, I had a heart attack. At age 45. Now, could that be coincidental? Absolutely. Is the vaccine to blame? Probably not. Nonetheless, the timing of those events is such that I have made the personal judgment that I will never again, under any circumstances, receive a dose of any Covid vaccine. My wife has made the same decision. And we have made that decision for our children as well.

Am I an anti-vaxxer? Not at all. My wife, my kids and myself have all had all the regular childhood vaccinations plus many years of getting flu shots. And we were originally on-board with the Covid vaccine. But, rightly or wrongly, personal experience changed that.

We have made the judgement that we are okay with the risk level for Covid for everyone in our family. We have also made the judgment that if there is even an infinitesimal chance that the vaccine contributed to the heart attack, we are not willing to accept even that tiny risk for the benefit the vaccine provides.

That is us. And I condemn no one for getting vaxxed or boosted. As always, YMMV.
 

Nubs70

Well-Known Member
Same here. Vaccinated. Boasted in November. Got 1/1 and AGAIN 3/5!!! First time unpleasant cold and sore throat for a week. Second time one day of feeling fluish and sleepy. Fine now. I will get a booster again if they adjust for variants but at this point I am living my life. 3 shots followed by 2 infections. This thing. Isn’t going away and I am very comfortable with my level
Of immunity and the degree of illness I had. Waaaay better than the flu I had last spring (and yes, I got my flu shot). Without a vaccine I would still be very careful. At this point I wave my flag. We all have a very easy way to protect ourselves from what we saw in 2020. We have forgotten how many people
Suffered and died very quickly. But that is over and we need to love while we can.
Sounds better than my 5 day vacation to Cancun, contracted norovirus. 2 wonderful.days of drinking, sun and fun. Then 3 days of colonoscopy prep.
 

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
Sounds better than my 5 day vacation to Cancun, contracted norovirus. 2 wonderful.days of drinking, sun and fun. Then 3 days of colonoscopy prep.
I cringe just by reading this. Lived by the toilet for 2 days after getting sick in South America.
 

correcaminos

Well-Known Member
I cringe just by reading this. Lived by the toilet for 2 days after getting sick in South America.
One of my friends cruised with another friend. That friend didn't realize ice water was bad along with the salads on their last day before heading back to sea home port. Said it was a miserable day or so back to port after being stuck in a room with their friend at sea....
 
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