Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Disney Analyst]

So Europe in general is far worse still, but as a single country count, USA is #1.

 

[MrPromey]

I understand the concerns about government intervention though, lives are being destroyed as we speak..millions of them. Not from coronavirus, but from government imposed shut downs. Yes, we are doing this for the greater good, so people live and our hospitals aren’t overwhelmed... but that doesn’t change the unfortunate fact that we have tanked on our economy, one that was going quite strong.. None of us can know the correct answers, even those who continually parrot the WHO and pretend to be sudden medical and disease experts. As I said earlier, this is unchartered waters.. we can look at other countries and make an educated guess, but the only thing we know for sure is that we don’t have the proper data to know what is happening and what will happen. The lack of data is creating fear, disdain, and so many questions. I admit that I am more frightened than I have ever been in my lifetime, I don’t know what the other side looks like, not for the company I work for, not for me, not for my child, not for millions of Americans, adults and this country’s youth.

Leave the economy aside for a second. Think about all of the kids in grades 1-12. What’s happening to their education, their grades- will they be artificially inflated, pass when shouldn’t? What about 7th and 8th graders who are trying to get scholarships to high school, or on a high school sports team? What about high school kids who are trying to get scholarships?
There are so, so, many factors to all of these shut downs. Some people are having a harder time justifying it, others are saying “close for as long as need be”... I think a lot of us are questioning extended shut downs.

And I totally agree with what you've said. You're making an excellent argument.

I don't believe he is, though, even if he's trying to say sort of the same thing. (I don't quite think he is)

I have an elderly parent that I'm worried about. I also have a job and a child I'm worried about.

 

[Andrew C]

So Europe in general is far worse still, but as a single country count, USA is #1.

Not surprising, considering our population size and how we did not go down the road of using the "measures" that China did (although I am not sure I buy China's numbers).

 

[RobWDW1971]

Trust who you want but they are making drastic (and quite possibly unconstitutional) decisions based upon incomplete data. I don't agree that a country (or the world) should be shut down and turned into a police state when nobody even knows how many people have been infected.

My favorite part are these ubiquitous "experts" - considering every country, state, county, and city has their own ever evolving policies from countless "experts" on how they should be handling this situation, it is not a simple answer nor should any one "expert" be blindly listened to vs. the countless others. We should be analyzing what we hear from every government and medical resource and balance that against the facts and the broader societal and economic implications (which health experts, BTW, would be the first to admit they are not prepared to address).

Also, the WHO and CDC have not given any specific direction to shut down cities or states and close all businesses, but then again, I guess they are not "experts".

 

[21stamps]

In a macro economic sense do you think the economy would not have been severely impacted by the virus alone no matter what the government did? Even if allowed to continue doing business, a lot of companies would have had people working from home. People would have been avoiding the mall and crowded places like bars and restaurants. The travel industry as a whole would be in the toilet. The economy wouldn’t have gone to virtually zero but it’s not like it would have been healthy in any way. I don’t really think it’s fair to say we chose to tank the economy. It’s more like we helped it hit rock bottom a little faster With these decisions.

No, we would not have seen this type of loss to businesses, nor this insane amount of unemployment claims. We also wouldn’t be putting millions of parents in an impossible situation. We did it, there was supposed to be a time frame... Many states have already announced extensions to their original time frames. Many have not made those announcements, but they’re looking more likely.

I don’t know the answers, I do know that no one here knows them either. No matter how many medical experts they choose to refer to.

 

[Andrew C]

I have said this in the past but it is probably worth mentioning again. Most people will accept strict lockdowns that last a few weeks. They will not accept strict lockdowns that last months, that is not a viable solution. So there has to be decisions made that avoid that...

 

[21stamps]

I have an elderly parent that I'm worried about. I also have a job and a child I'm worried about.

I wanted to quote this so I could acknowledge it separately, only because I couldn’t ‘like’ the totality of your comment.
I understand.

 

[MrPromey]

There are going to be high risk people everywhere. I was just pointing out the obvious flaw of over simplifying this and just saying that we could have isolated the high risk people by having them quarantine and then the rest of us could have continued life as normal and the economy would be saved. Many people whether high risk or not would choose to self quarantine anyway to avoid the virus. There would be a major economic downturn either way. It’s a false narrative that we were somehow choosing between saving some old people who were going to die soon and saving the economy. A large portion of the economic damage would have been done no matter what governments did.

And that I think is the point. People would have all started to hunker down on their own once they started seeing the effects around them but by that time, it would have been too late.

There really was/is no good call to make, here.

People don't want to trust those in charge. They don't want to trust the "experts" who they believe don't know what they're talking about.

Maybe the experts are shooting from the hip using largely the educated guesses they can make based on their experience in their respective fields and are getting some things wrong. Maybe the politicians are only doing what politicians do.

I don't think anyone, regardless of who they are has the magic answer we're all looking for because we are dealing with too many unknowns and I think that uncertainty frightens a lot of people.

I know it frightens me.

But I fail to understand what the alternatives are at this point. Let everyone do what they want and decide for themselves?

For something like this, I don't see how that would have ever created a positive outcome.

I don't believe that there is anything that could have been done to prevent the economic effects of this sooner or later and while it may not be apparent to people who haven't yet fully grasped the potential severity of this situation, I think that current measures are intended to protect people's health as well as the future economic hope of our country rather than letting it all just unravel over time on it's own in a more piecemeal fashion while letting widespread panic kick in.

That doesn't mean every job gets saved. It doesn't mean my job gets saved but just maybe, there is a better chance of having an economy to come back to after this.

If my local grocery shelves are any indication based on how things have gone up to this point, I'd hate to see what it could have devolved to going the other way.

It sucks. Everything about this sucks. Like everyone else, I wish it didn't suck, too but I don't understand how it was ever going to not suck once this thing made it to our shore.

The hope is that we collectively buckle up now and deal with the imposed hit so we can avoid what has been anticipated to be a much bigger hit that would have come along later if we don't.

As I said before, if we avoid it, we'll never know for sure if it was there to begin with but that's the paradox - when preventive measures work, it can be hard to tell if they were needed at all.

It doesn't look like we'll be completely avoiding it, though.

 

[flynnibus]

With the possible exception of New York City, COVID-19 patients aren't doing that anywhere else in the USA.

You still don't understand the flaw in your argument...

It's not about relativity to numbers we already cope with. It's about what this situation will do NOW in addition to the world as we know it.
Your retort is like the guy saying "well my house isn't on fire..." as the wildfire rages down the hill consuming all the other houses... as if 'yet' isn't even in their comprehension.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

Philly 57

Philly 57

www.google.com

This I hope they are wrong on. Mid May? They are thinking because of the close proximity to NY. If true, could be hunkered down for a long time.

 

[21stamps]

To lighten things up.., especially for those who are old enough to remember Vanilla Ice..

 

[Andrew C]

Dr Birx is talking about how UK had to readjust their early predictions based on models. From 500k getting it down to 20K. She said Models have not matched the reality of what we are seeing.

 

[trainplane3]

So Europe in general is far worse still, but as a single country count, USA is #1.

We did it everyone! We're number one! On top! All is right in the world!!




...wait what do you mean this is bad?!

 

[Andrew C]

We did it everyone! We're number one! On top! All is right in the world!!




...wait what do you mean this is bad?!

Per capita is a thing.

 

[21stamps]

had to readjust their early predictions based on models.

Hmm. It’s almost like some of us might have been right by saying that models could be wrong, even when experts are making them.
Because we are dealing with predictions, not complete data after the fact.

 

[MrPromey]

You still don't understand the flaw in your argument...

It's not about relativity to numbers we already cope with. It's about what this situation will do NOW in addition to the world as we know it.
Your retort is like the guy saying "well my house isn't on fire..." as the wildfire rages down the hill consuming all the other houses... as if 'yet' isn't even in their comprehension.

Because a few weeks ago, this wasn't a problem in New York, either and a month ago, this was apparnetly only something some other part of the world had to worry about.

 

[disney4life2008]

Louisiana is now experiencing a surge in infection stemming from the influx of visitors to NO for Mardi Gras in mid February. Vegas will only know if it is "out of the woods" from travelling infection 3 or 4 weeks after the casino closure dates and the shut down of tourist gamblers.

If you know anything about Atlanta and it's history, it's next.

 

[Andrew C]

Hmm. It’s almost like some of us might have been right by saying that models could be wrong, even when experts are making them.
Because we are dealing with predictions, not complete data after the fact.

To be honest, I’m not interested in right or wrong around here. I’m more interested in listening to what Dr. Birx says. She has impressed me since the beginning and seems to be very data driven. She knows her stuff. Very level headed.

 

[GoofGoof]

No, we would not have seen this type of loss to businesses, nor this insane amount of unemployment claims. We also wouldn’t be putting millions of parents in an impossible situation. We did it, there was supposed to be a time frame... Many states have already announced extensions to their original time frames. Many have not made those announcements, but they’re looking more likely.

I don’t know the answers, I do know that no one here knows them either. No matter how many medical experts they choose to refer to.

Forget medical experts I’m talking purely about economics.

I am pretty sure there still would have been a major impact to the economy without any government action. No way to know for sure because we can’t go back in time, but the writing was on the wall. By Mach 9th before most if not all schools and businesses were shut down the Dow was already down almost 20% and we were pretty much in a Bear market. As of March 1st most airlines were waiving change fees amid a major drop in bookings. I’m sure hotels and cruise lines were also hurting. Same goes for retail, bars and restaurants.

If schools remained open we would have seen one off closings anyway. The first school to close near me had a student who lived with someone who tested positive. They shut the school for 2 weeks. Now it’s closed anyway. I get that certain businesses would have remained open so wouldn’t be at zero but there still would have been layoffs and bankruptcies. Every major US airline went bankrupt or got bailed out after 9/11 when air traffic was grounded for 4 days. It wasn’t the 4 days loss of business that bankrupted them.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Coronavirus in the U.S.: Latest Map and Case Count

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www.nytimes.com

Watch How the Coronavirus Spread Across the United States (Published 2020)

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www.nytimes.com

Coronavirus World Map: Tracking the Global Outbreak (Published 2023)

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Coronavirus Deaths by U.S. State and Country Over Time: Daily Tracker (Published 2020)

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See Which States and Cities Have Told Residents to Stay at Home (Published 2020)

In an attempt to stop the spread of the coronavirus, a vast majority of states and the Navajo Nation have given directives, affecting more than nine in 10 U.S. residents.

www.nytimes.com