correcaminos
Well-Known Member
It wasn't that I saw. Just that one story doesn't mean boosters are bad. As a whole mandating healthcare is something I am for.
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Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion
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danlb_2000
Premium Member
Maybe I am misreading these charts but they seem to be showing there are far more deaths amongst the vaccinated then the unvaccinated.
The flu shot this year was 16% effective.....why bother? https://www.cdc.gov/flu/vaccines-work/2021-2022.html
Of course you assume that nothing can ever go wrong with a flu shot?
Joesixtoe
Well-Known Member
From my understanding you subtract the unvaccinated from the totals column and the rest is the vaccinated, unless I read that wrong too
. For example you have 183 deaths in 50-59 yr Olds; 30 of those deaths are in the unvaccinated. Here are 2 articles, one from 5 months ago in a science magazine talking about how the "vaccines provide considerable protection from severe disease and death." This echoes the same thing you told me. Now the same author writes in the Guardian yesterday that "vaccine protection wanes in a matter of months, mostly against infection, but also against severe disease and death."Why is the UK seeing near-record Covid cases? We still believe the three big myths about Omicron | Coronavirus | The Guardian
People are desperate to return to life as normal, but the rising number of infections is a reminder that this pandemic isn’t over, says Christina Pagel, the director of UCL’s Clinical Operational Research Unit
amp.theguardian.com
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
This year’s flu shot was particularly weak, but unfortunately you have to get the shot before you know that.
And there are any number of products we use on a daily basis where we are assuming nothing can go wrong.
There is a non-zero chance that my car will malfunction and kill me today.
correcaminos
Well-Known Member
We don't always know efficacy and this year very hard given the pandemic keeping flu low. I'll say it again. I originally took the flu shot at 16 to protect my mother, not myself, who was dying of cancer. To question a doctor's orders for someone actively dying is really uncool.
I live around others who are high risk with other lifelong diseases. My nearly 30 years of taking it was never about me. Your comment was super insensitive and I have little patience for anti-vaxxers. Please leave my family out of your agendas in the future. Thanks.
KrzyKtty
Well-Known Member
Not that this is even remotely on topic, but back when I could donate blood, comma I used to make sure I got the flu shot all the time. I'm not sure if this is true since I don't work in the medical industry, but someone at the Red Cross told my mother before that only those who donate blood and have never had the flu can have their blood be used for babies. It was for this reason I continued to get the flu shot to try to make sure that I never actually got the flu. I figured even if I had a reaction, I still had a better chance than whatever caused that premature baby to need blood. And my family is lucky enough that we have never had the flu.
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
If you get the flu shot, it would be hard to actually know you’ve never had flu. In any event, that’s not true. Babies cannot receive blood from anyone who has had Cytomegalovirus. That produces flu-like symptoms, but it isn’t flu. They test blood for CMV antibodies since most adults have had CMV. If you are CMV-negative, they would tell you and keep asking you to donate.
KrzyKtty
Well-Known Member
Maybe that's what they told my mother and she got a confused then. I was just repeating what the red cross person told her.But I did stipulate that I had no idea if it was true or not. I know my medical record does show that I have never had the flu.
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
Looks like we‘ve passed our #BigStealthCovidSurge. Cases as back to falling. Have to squint to see the surge…
If another 300 hospital patients are discharged (no reason to expect that not to happen soon), we will be at our lowest hospitalization number since the pandemic started.
KrzyKtty
Well-Known Member
At the end of the day, I think it would have to take one hell of a special surge to convince Disney, universal, and most general people to go back to what life was like over the last 2 years. No one in my family has touched a mask in a month or 2, and my kids are so much happier for it. My whole family always followed the rules, and wore masks even when things in our state were relaxed, but they are so much happier now just going to school like normal kids. I get that there is a whole lot of shared trauma about about this virus, and a lot of people are still affected. But 2 years later, I'm glad that there is a light at the end of the tunnel. I've always said from the beginning that covid was never going away. There will always be surges now and the virus will always be around. What's really going to be key is how much the much those viruses cause hospitalizations and death above normal/manageable levels. But I think it will take an act of God to make Disney go back to the height of covid restrictions.
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GimpYancIent
Well-Known Member
I scratch my head in wonder after all the 5000 + pages of posts and all the data presented that folk's still believe getting vaccinated for anything will prevent the "catching" of an illness. Though vaccinated a person can definitely "catch" the illness. The vaccination preps the body to fend off the illness, in some cases the person will not exhibit symptoms at all in others a person will still get sick, hopefully the severity of the sickness is reduced. In the end vaccination is no guarantee, it is another tool in the chest to combat infection.
DisneyCane
Well-Known Member
From my understanding you subtract the unvaccinated from the totals column and the rest is the vaccinated, unless I read that wrong too
Why is the UK seeing near-record Covid cases? We still believe the three big myths about Omicron | Coronavirus | The Guardian
People are desperate to return to life as normal, but the rising number of infections is a reminder that this pandemic isn’t over, says Christina Pagel, the director of UCL’s Clinical Operational Research Unit
In order to be able to analyze this data, we need to know the percentage vaccinated in each age group (data that I assume is available). If we take the deaths within 60 days chart, and make the assumption (which is almost certainly wrong) that the deaths within 60 days of a positive COVID test are all due to COVID and look at the 60-69 year old cohort is says that there were 330 deaths in the vaccinated and 43 in the unvaccinated (88.5% in the vaccinated).
If more than 88.5% of 60-69 year old people are vaccinated then it would suggest some level of efficacy. Like I said, I don't think this data can really be used for efficacy analysis because it doesn't seem to me like they are breaking down which deaths were actually caused by COVID.
Maybe if we used a younger age group where the people are far less likely to die from a random cause it could be more accurately estimated from this data. For the 18-29 year old group it shows 13 vaccinated deaths and 6 unvaccinated (68.4%). I'd still need the data for percentage vaccinated to do the calculation.
correcaminos
Well-Known Member
Vaccines are about reducing chances. Less chance to get sick or pass on is the end goal. Vaccinating reduces chances to spread to vulnerable too which has been my sticking point for vaccinating low risk. It also reduces chances of it being severe if you do catch it and show symptoms. No guarantee and I don’t think I've seen anyone say it was, but it sure can help.
TikibirdLand
Well-Known Member
Especially true if you're driving a Hyundai or Kia! But, I drive my 60 year old antiques regularly. I KNOW about living dangerously!
Andrew C
You know what's funny?
zoom in!!!
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
I can make an ant hill look like Everest!
danlb_2000
Premium Member
From my understanding you subtract the unvaccinated from the totals column and the rest is the vaccinated, unless I read that wrong too
Why is the UK seeing near-record Covid cases? We still believe the three big myths about Omicron | Coronavirus | The Guardian
People are desperate to return to life as normal, but the rising number of infections is a reminder that this pandemic isn’t over, says Christina Pagel, the director of UCL’s Clinical Operational Research Unit
Where did those charts come from? One of the things that needs to be considered is that we know there will be breakthrough infections and deaths, and as the number of people vaccinated increases, logically you will see more of those deaths in that group since it is larger.
Heppenheimer
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure if anyone posted this previously (I've been paying less attention to this forum recently... war in Ukraine is more interesting to me right now than the COVID-related policies of a resort I'm not planning to visit in the near future), but here's some interesting data on the BA-2 subvariant of omicron. It now constitutes about 55% of all US cases. The good news is that at least for now, this new variant doesn't seem to causing any increase in numbers. Total cases are down 9%, hospitalizations are down 34%, ICU cases by 41% and deaths by 42%. That would imply to me that BA-2 is no more infectious or serious than B.1.1.529, and there likely is very good cross-immunity between the two sub-strains.
The bad news is that sotrovimab infusions don't seem to work against BA-2, but oral paxlovid still shows really good efficacy. Now that our supplies of the latter medication are more robust, this should be the preferred treatment. Pairing this with the flood of home tests, we can now much more easily diagnose and treat COVID within the therapeutic window for the medications.
So, looks like we probably won't see a BA-2 driven spike in cases, hospitalizations or deaths.
The bad news is that sotrovimab infusions don't seem to work against BA-2, but oral paxlovid still shows really good efficacy. Now that our supplies of the latter medication are more robust, this should be the preferred treatment. Pairing this with the flood of home tests, we can now much more easily diagnose and treat COVID within the therapeutic window for the medications.
So, looks like we probably won't see a BA-2 driven spike in cases, hospitalizations or deaths.
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
I think we are seeing elsewhere that BA.2 is indeed more easily transmitted, which is why it has outcompeted Omicron, so it’s likely latent protective immunity from previous infection or immunization that is preventing serious illness. Locally, it seemed COVID was far more prevalent in the community this winter than even the numbers suggested. Everyone I know had a respiratory illness with COVID’s unique symptoms around Christmas but most people no longer test.
We are lucky flu never really showed up this winter.
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