Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[disneygeek90]

He was making a funny

Yes I know my reply was tongue in cheek as well.

 

[Trauma]

Yes I know my reply was tongue in cheek as well.

Shows how dumb I am

 

[DisneyFan32]

is NJ will returning indoor masks mandate soon?

 

[danlb_2000]

is NJ will returning indoor masks mandate soon?

The Governor wants to get re-elected, so probably not.

 

[Archie123]

The cruise companies can boycot FL and sail out of other ports of states and countries that are willing to "play ball." Something tells me FL will only listen if Money is involved, or the loss of it.

There will be a lot states willing to allow cruises to do what they want to do when it comes to their Covid policies if it means departing from their ports.

 

[Disney Experience]

So you are saying the NJ officials are falsifying the numbers?

I think they are not doing the math correctly for the claim of how effective the vaccines are vs being unvaccinated. But they may be trying to communicate something else.

For effectiveness the current data ( Not NJ , I do not have enough info to calculate it with what i know)…but current data from Israel is 64% effectiveness against symptomatic covid in respect to Delta.

The Pfizer research site ( I am part of the Phase 3 trials) Told me ( not counting my case) since vaccine release the vaccine was 90+ good against symptomatic covid, and that those vaccinated who got covid ( symptomatic or not) 91% ( i think) only got mild or asymptomatic. At the time they mentioned this I was fully vaccinated as part of the trial long ago but had moderate covid in June ( likely delta).

Delta cases will likely skew those numbers. Though adding a booster trial and using Phase 3 subjects in that trial will conflate the results if those results are included with those who are not in the booster trial.

 

[DisneyFan32]

I think they are not doing the math correctly for the claim of how effective the vaccines are vs being unvaccinated. But they may be trying to communicate something else.

For effectiveness the current data ( Not NJ , I do not have enough info to calculate it with what i know)…but current data from Israel is 64% effectiveness against symptomatic covid in respect to Delta.

The Pfizer research site ( I am part of the Phase 3 trials) Told me ( not counting my case) since vaccine release the vaccine was 90+ good against symptomatic covid, and that those vaccinated who got covid ( symptomatic or not) 91% ( i think) only got mild or asymptomatic. At the time they mentioned this I was fully vaccinated as part of the trial long ago but had moderate covid in June ( likely delta).

Delta cases will likely skew those numbers. Though adding a booster trial and using Phase 3 subjects in that trial will conflate the results if those results are included with those who are not in the booster trial.

is NJ and NY is doing way better than other states?

 

[Jenny72]

Yes, I think the way that NJ did the math, you could also say, there are 150 million unvaccinated Americans (just for sake of argument). 600,000 unvaccinated people have died of Covid. Therefore, the efficacy of *un-vaccination* is (600K / 1.5M = .004) 99.6% effective against dying from Covid. Wow, that's really effective!

So, it's technically true but essentially a meaningless number. We don't need to manipulate data to show that vaccination is worthwhile. I don't want my 85 year old relative kissing strangers in an area with high transmission. Let's hope she can get back to that soon, though. (j/k)

 

[Trauma]

Someone help me out here.

I have watched expert after expert say in the last few days that people have made their choice and that if they where going to get vaccinated they would have done it.

They also say that if you are not vaccinated you WILL catch covid due to how contagious delta is.

That means no matter what we do the non vaccinated will catch it at some point.

So why worry about slowing the spread unless
hospitals are overwhelmed.

Only two true outcomes left.

1. You are vaccinated and have highly reduced risk of covid and severe outcomes.

2. You catch covid.

We can not mitigate away these outcomes.

One of these two things will happen.

Today tomorrow next April.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Someone help me out here.

I have watched expert after expert say in the last few days that people have made their choice and that if they where going to get vaccinated they would have done it.

They also say that if you are not vaccinated you WILL catch covid due to how contagious delta is.

That means no matter what we do the non vaccinated will catch it at some point.

So why worry about slowing the spread unless
hospitals are overwhelmed.

Only two true outcomes left.

1. You are vaccinated and have highly reduced risk of covid and severe outcomes.

2. You catch covid.

We can not mitigate away these outcomes.

One of these two things will happen.

Today tomorrow next April.

Because further spread = more chances for the virus to mutate and more chances for a mutation that isn't in our favor.

Not to mention we're still at risk for hospitals being overwhelmed.

And supply line issues.

And having large numbers of people missing work and others having to work harder to make up for them.

 

[Trauma]

Because further spread = more chances for the virus to mutate and more chances for a mutation that isn't in our favor.

Not to mention we're still at risk for hospitals being overwhelmed.

And supply line issues.

And having large numbers of people missing work and others having to work harder to make up for them.

It’s going to spread to them eventually no matter what.

Those chances at mutation will occur regardless.

Supply chain issues are a direct result of the mitigation’s the first time.

They started long before delta existed.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

It’s going to spread to them eventually no matter what.

Those chances at mutation will occur regardless.

Supply chain issues are a direct result of the mitigation’s the first time.

They started long before delta existed.

The shortages of Tyson chicken were a direct result of outbreaks in their plants because they weren't making any efforts at safety with regards to COVID.

Over 10,000 Tyson Employees Reportedly Test Positive For Covid

A new study found nearly 50,000 meat processing workers have contracted Covid-19 since the start of the pandemic.

www.forbes.com

ETA: There was a big to-do about it...employees complaining about working conditions, etc.

 

[Trauma]

The shortages of Tyson chicken were a direct result of an outbreak in their plant because they weren't making any efforts at safety with regards to COVID.

We can go back and forth about supply chain issues with examples proving our points.

Let’s focus on the main point you made, the mutations.

You know that I respect your opinion and that I truly think about what you say, so at least consider my point.

If the non vaccinated will catch covid no matter what, as has been stated by multiple experts over the last few days, how does slowing the spread reduce the opportunities for mutation?

 

[ImperfectPixie]

We can go back and forth about supply chain issues with examples proving our points.

Let’s focus on the main point you made, the mutations.

You know that I respect your opinion and that I truly think about what you say, so at least consider my point.

If the non vaccinated will catch covid no matter what, as has been stated by multiple experts over the last few days, how does slowing the spread reduce the opportunities for mutation?

It doesn't...it delays it, hopefully giving us more time to get more shots into more arms.

 

[Disney Experience]

Those chances at mutation will occur regardless.

That is only true if all of the following:

1. Future vaccination rate is zero ( or below population growth rate) or vaccines are not updated against winning mutation when efficacy drops enough.

2. We never get to herd immunity ( Worldwide) ( combined vaccination and post covid adjusted for mutations)

Less virus in the wild less chances for mutations. Less mutations means that it will take longer for a bad for us mutation to happen. That would then give us more time to try to get herd immunity.

 

[Trauma]

That is only true if all of the following:

1. Future vaccination rate is zero ( or below population growth rate) or vaccines are not updated against winning mutation when efficacy drops enough.

2. We never get to herd immunity ( Worldwide) ( combined vaccination and post covid adjusted for mutations)

Less virus in the wild less chances for mutations. Less mutations means that it will take longer for a bad for us mutation to happen. That would then give us more time to try to get herd immunity.

How do we get herd immunity ?

Experts are saying we need 95% vaccination rate now thanks to Delta.

That was posted a few days ago in this thread.

Your basically saying we need to buy time for something that is never going to happen.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

How do we get herd immunity ?

Experts are saying we need 95% vaccination rate now thanks to Delta.

That was posted a few days ago in this thread.

Your basically saying we need to buy time for something that is never going to happen.

We need to take any and all available steps we can to limit spread and to try to vaccinate as many as humanly possible. It's very unfortunate that there are some people out in the world purposely trying to hinder those efforts, but the reality is that the COVID situation is constantly evolving...we don't know what leaders may do next month or even tomorrow that may make a world of difference. In the interim...we can't afford to just throw our hands up and not try.

 

[danlb_2000]

We can go back and forth about supply chain issues with examples proving our points.

Let’s focus on the main point you made, the mutations.

You know that I respect your opinion and that I truly think about what you say, so at least consider my point.

If the non vaccinated will catch covid no matter what, as has been stated by multiple experts over the last few days, how does slowing the spread reduce the opportunities for mutation?

The statement that "everyone will catch covid is hyperbole IMHO.

 

[Trauma]

We need to take any and all available steps we can to limit spread and to try to vaccinate as many as humanly possible. It's very unfortunate that there are some people out in the world purposely trying to hinder those efforts, but the reality is that the COVID situation is constantly evolving...we don't know what leaders may do next month or even tomorrow that make make a world of difference. In the interim...we can't afford to just throw our hands up and not try.

So your belief is that leaders will do something eventually to “encourage” vaccination.

So how much death and hospitalization do they need?

They have projections, they have a good idea of what is coming.

I don’t understand any of this.

If mandates are needed to deal with Delta they should have been back two weeks ago.

Am I suppose to believe that we have a better idea of where this thing is headed than the CDC and Fauci?

Some game is being played here.

I won’t pretend to know what it is , or who is playing , but something is not right.

 

[Trauma]

The statement that "everyone will catch covid is hyperbole IMHO.

Ok that’s an answer I can respect and I hope
your right.