Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[deeevo]

No one said they live in a dumpster. But providing two documents that satisfy the requirements is not as easy as you think for many of these people. There are charities trying to work with these people and find ways around it, but it would be much easier if the stupid requirement didn't even exist. It's not needed at this point, but DeathSantis is going to DeathSantis and most Floridians are just fine with that 'cause they've never been in the shoes of an illegal alien.

Yes... I am fine with that.

 

[ABQ]

In fact, for responsible citizens, the restrictions are now totally different -- If you're vaccinated, you can have small gatherings indoors without masks, with other vaccinated households. If you're vaccinated, you can now have smallish gatherings outdoors without masks.
So reality is, for those that actually have been following the rules and recommendations -- It no longer is the same restrictions. For those that have followed the recommendations and now have gotten vaccinated, the restrictions are dramatically different!
The rules only seem the "same" for those that have been minimally compliant and have refused to follow the rules the most.

I know this news seems to be coming out fast, but I can't find in their guidance where it states that fully vaccinated folks can attend smallish gatherings indoors with other vaccinated folks without masks.

 

[Incomudro]

I actually think that could work at WDW. You could submit proof of vaccination ahead of time when you make your park reservation and if you are verified vaccinated then you are flagged with your park ticket. At the gate you show your vaccination status (linked to the ticket or the paper copy) and you get a wrist band like a 21+ person in an 18 to get in 21 to drink club. Anyone remember the wrist bands from the PI days? Then if you have a wrist band no need to wear a mask or distance. If a CM sees you don’t have a wrist band on and you don’t have a mask on they approach you and tell you to mask up. It’s a lot of enforcement but it’s doable. It avoids Disney having to exclude the 2/3 of adults who aren’t vaccinated yet.

Bingo.

 

[MrMcDuck]

Yes... I am fine with that.

I figured.

 

[havoc315]

Ok let me clear this up:

if fully vaccinated let us make our own decisions as to whether or not we want to wear a mask and social distance and the risk is extremely low and will always be there anyways

if not vaccinated let them make their own decisions as to whether or not they want to wear a mask and social distance

all assume the risks and make our own decisions as to what to or not to do and where to go

Yes, I know that's your position. Nothing to clear up. And thus, no incentive whatsoever to get vaccinated.

Basically... your logic is simply, "no restrictions, ever" --

It's the next step in the logic of:
March 2020 -- "Covid is a hoax, therefore we don't need any restrictions!"
April 2020 -- "Covid is just the flu, we don't need restrictions for the flu, so no restrictions!"
May-June 2020 -- "The disease can't be worse than the cure... people are going to commit suicide and get addicted to drugs due to the restrictions, so lift all the restrictions!"
July-August 2020 -- "Herd immunity should be the cure, so lift all the restrictions so we can get to herd immunity!"
September-2020 -- "Cases are low, nobody will talk about Covid after the election, so lift all the restrictions!"
October-November 2020 -- "We can't live this way forever, so lift all the restrictions!"
December-January 2021 -- "Vaccines have been approved, we will never reach herd immunity anyway, so lift all the restrictions!"
Feb-March -- "It's been a year, it's time to lift all the restrictions!"
April-- "People aren't getting vaccinated because of the restrictions, If you want people to get vaccinated, lift all the restrictions!"

So yes, we have heard this argument before. "Lifting restrictions" is always the solution, restrictions are never necessary.

Sorry, this argument has lost all credibility.

I know that won’t happen and we are going to go into 2022 because of media constantly pushing doom and gloom but here we are. I just wonder how long vaccinated people are going to accept having to be restricted basically the same as before getting the shot

I got vaccinated and I'm no longer restricted "basically the same." I saw my parents indoors and close up for the first time in 12 months. My kids got to hug their grandparents for the first time in a year. I'm planning to travel outside of the state for the first time in a year. I've gotten together with friends that I haven't seen in a year. I've eaten indoors in a restaurant for the first time in a year.

So I certainly feel I've been substantially freed by getting the vaccine.

 

[DavidNoble]

Ok let me clear this up:

if fully vaccinated let us make our own decisions as to whether or not we want to wear a mask and social distance as the risk is extremely low and will always be there

if not vaccinated let them make their own decisions as to whether or not they want to wear a mask and social distance

all assume the risks and make our own decisions as to what to or not to do and where to go

I know that won’t happen and we are going to go into 2022 with restrictions because of media constantly pushing doom and gloom but here we are. I just wonder how long vaccinated people are going to accept having to be restricted basically the same as before getting the shot

Fully vaccinated means being less of a risk to people, because transmission is significantly lower and potentially non-existent except in rare cases. In addition, fully vaccinated people are highly unlikely to get COVID-19 (some 5,000 people have gotten COVID out of 97 million people who have been vaccinated). Fully vaccinated is lessening the burden on our healthcare system and are able to lead productive lives without the risk of others becoming ill.

Unvaccinated means being a risk to people such as kids, those who are unable to get vaccinations for medical reasons, and one another. These people continue to transmit the virus, are more susceptible to variants, and are putting themselves and others at risk. Unvaccinated means being a burden on the healthcare system and others.

Choosing to be unvaccinated doesn't give you the right to recklessly ruin other people's lives.

 

[SamusAranX]

As if not continuing them* won't. Just with different collateral damage. Cases will rise, even if not exponential, which means poor outcomes will rise, even if they aren't the severe outcomes. It's all just more, "I'm okay with your consequences, as long as I have none."

*For this record, I am only advocating continued restrictions (and not necessarily all of them) through whatever the 2021 winter "cold / flu / COVID season" might be like. This time in 2022, I expect nothing if winter went well. It's definitely NOT a lifetime thing.

I get that; but to expect the same people who refuse to get vaccinated due to the "conspiracy theory of the week", to also continue to respect mask guidelines in public, distancing etc...yeah. Would be a miracle. I invite to you to Florida anytime to see that in action.

 

[havoc315]

I know this news seems to be coming out fast, but I can't find in their guidance where it states that fully vaccinated folks can attend smallish gatherings indoors with other vaccinated folks without masks.

Fully vaccinated people can:

• Visit with other fully vaccinated people indoors without wearing masks or physical distancing

COVID-19 Vaccination

COVID-19 vaccines protect against COVID-19. Get safety info and more.

www.cdc.gov

View attachment 552418

 

[deeevo]

 

[FormerMember]

As if not continuing them* won't. Just with different collateral damage. Cases will rise, even if not exponential, which means poor outcomes will rise, even if they aren't the severe outcomes. It's all just more, "I'm okay with your consequences, as long as I have none."

*For this record, I am only advocating continued restrictions (and not necessarily all of them) through whatever the 2021 winter "cold / flu / COVID season" might be like. This time in 2022, I expect nothing if winter went well. It's definitely NOT a lifetime thing.

Unless winter doesn’t go “well.” Well being a subjective moving goal line that you set. Then we gotta keep it up. Right?

 

[havoc315]

The EO prevents businesses from denying access to someone based on vaccination status. An unvaccinated person would have all of the same access they would just have to wear a mask. There’s no difference in level of service.

As a lawyer-- I can tell you that requiring some people to wear masks but not other people is definitely a different level of service.

They have access to the same rides, shows, restaurants and entertainment.

That's akin to black people are allowed on the same bus, but they have to sit in a different section. They still have access to the bus, they can still take the bus to the same destinations. (The EO uses similar language found in Civil Rights Law about businesses cannot give different service based on race).

It would be somewhat more difficult to enforce due to the wristbands. Outside of that the conflict is the same. Someone without a mask has to be told to wear one. If 60% of the people are vaccinated that’s 60% less people to have potential conflict with.

Those are the people who overall, generally weren't going to be creating the conflict in the first place.

You really believe that if the crowd was mixed between masked and unmasked, there would be 60% fewer conflicts per day for cast members?!?!

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Fully vaccinated means being less of a risk to people, because transmission is significantly lower and potentially non-existent except in rare cases. In addition, fully vaccinated people are highly unlikely to get COVID-19 (some 5,000 people have gotten COVID out of 97 million people who have been vaccinated). Fully vaccinated is lessening the burden on our healthcare system and are able to lead productive lives without the risk of others becoming ill.

Unvaccinated means being a risk to people such as kids, those who are unable to get vaccinations for medical reasons, and one another. These people continue to transmit the virus, are more susceptible to variants, and are putting themselves and others at risk. Unvaccinated means being a burden on the healthcare system and others.

Choosing to be unvaccinated doesn't give you the right to recklessly ruin other people's lives.

It's the same with masks.

I don't know why this is so difficult for some people to grasp.

 

[MrMcDuck]

Yes, we should all want as many adults as possible, regardless of health or residency or whatever, to get vaccinated as soon as possible. It benefits EVERYONE, not just those that get the vaccine.

 

[Patcheslee]

1) Fearful of COVID? I don't think people are fearful of COVID. I think they are fearful of what can happen if you get COVID.

2) I don't think anyone likes wearing masks.

Cicadas supposed to be here in a few weeks, masks sound like a good idea lol.

I know this news seems to be coming out fast, but I can't find in their guidance where it states that fully vaccinated folks can attend smallish gatherings indoors with other vaccinated folks without masks.

View attachment 552418

Oddly enough no one has pointed out vaccinated people aren’t recommended to wash hands. There will be a Karen somewhere refuse to use hand sanitizer before riding now.....

 

[Archie123]

To some extent... do you realize how people become experts in various fields? They often read books and articles with big words. That's the process of education.

Yes, I suppose all those epidemiologists and scientists could have just read articles and had the same depth of knowledge. Makes sense to me.

 

[disneygeek90]

Oddly enough no one has pointed out vaccinated people aren’t recommended to wash hands. There will be a Karen somewhere refuse to use hand sanitizer before riding now.....

Disney has never required sanitizer before attractions, only Universal. However, I think Disney does a better job with the number of sanitizing stations before and after exits.

 

[GoofGoof]

Those are the people who overall, generally weren't going to be creating the conflict in the first place.

You really believe that if the crowd was mixed between masked and unmasked, there would be 60% fewer conflicts per day for cast members?!?!

What do you consider a conflict? Today CMs who are frequently reminding people to mask up at the parks. It’s not viral video worthy. Do you think people who resist masks aren’t going to the parks today? They go and they try to get away with pulling their masks down or not wear them at all. The same would be true in that plan. I don’t think there would be an increase in the number of conflicts. It would be harder to enforce because as a CM you would need to take the extra step of checking for a wrist band first. There’s no higher level of conflict though, they would just politely ask the person to put on their mask and if they didn’t comply they kick them out. Same as today.

The benefit of that plan over straight vaccine passports is you defeat the EO without getting dragged into court and Disney doesn’t have to exclude a large portion of people from coming.

 

[hopemax]

I get that; but to expect the same people who refuse to get vaccinated due to the "conspiracy theory of the week", to also continue to respect mask guidelines in public, distancing etc...yeah. Would be a miracle. I invite to you to Florida anytime to see that in action.

I wouldn't expect them too. The restrictions aren't for them, but for the people who would comply, even while complaining about it. If you tell all of those people to drop the restrictions too, than the logical conclusion would be the numbers would be higher than when it was just Florida man and his friends. I don't get the logic of "1000 people won't follow the rules, and this will make 2000 people not follow the rules" as somehow being better management than 5000 people not having rules.

 

[GoofGoof]

Oddly enough no one has pointed out vaccinated people aren’t recommended to wash hands. There will be a Karen somewhere refuse to use hand sanitizer before riding now.....

I hope people don’t interpret that to include after using the rest rooms

 

[hopemax]

Unless winter doesn’t go “well.” Well being a subjective moving goal line that you set. Then we gotta keep it up. Right?

Always something, isn't it. I thought we had pretty much determined that "well" = akin to a typical influenza season. If we spike up to 2 or 3 times that, then yeah, I expect the masks to stick around.