Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[DisneyCane]

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This is a link to 70 studies, going back to 2004, that support the use of face masks in preventing the transmission of respiratory viruses.

No, not all masks work equally. No, it does not prevent transmission in all situations and in all cases. There are straw men that can be advanced in any such discussion... but this community, the overwhelming majority of the scientific community, and the world at large has sided with 'masks work' for a reason.

I applaud the instinct to question and do your own independent research, however if the conclusions reached run contrary to such a well established base of fundamental medical principle, then personally I would question my own methods in coming to those conclusions.

On a quick skim during my lunch, the basic pattern of conclusion is properly fitted N95s are extremely effective, surgical masks are somewhat effective and cloth face coverings are widely varied and range from completely useless to not as good as surgical masks depending on materials, construction and fit. Therein lies my biggest issue with the "mask cult." There is no standard or minimum effectiveness required so everybody running around with a random piece of fabric on their face will not have very much effect.

I also just want to point out (not specifically in reference to you), that many people that point to the "science" of masks preventing spread don't accept the science that transmission generally requires prolonged, close contact with an infected person in a space with poor ventilation.

 

[SamusAranX]

I don't think it's about filtering out the virus itself, but rather keeping it from getting to you or others in the first place. As you said, masks appear to help prevent spread via droplets. I think marginally effective undersells the growing body of evidence in favor of them.

For what it's worth, masks do appear to help prevent asymptomatic spread (pre-symptomatic really). Here's a study that looked at the impact of masks (and other measures) on reducing transmission within families. Masks were more effective before symptoms emerged. If people are infectious pre-symptoms, then by the time symptoms do show up it will be too late (given the contact frequency in families).

Thanks for the info will definitely be reading up.

I think my point is this; let's play devils advocate and say cloth masks were only effective 20 percent of the time; that's still a reduction in transmission! So regardless of how effective or not effective it is, is it really an inconvenience to wear one? Just wear it even if they have mixed results. If i wear a mask and it prevents me from spreading it to at least one person I am near, I am gonna wear it. Better then zero

 

[SamusAranX]

On a quick skim during my lunch, the basic pattern of conclusion is properly fitted N95s are extremely effective, surgical masks are somewhat effective and cloth face coverings are widely varied and range from completely useless to not as good as surgical masks depending on materials, construction and fit. Therein lies my biggest issue with the "mask cult." There is no standard or minimum effectiveness required so everybody running around with a random piece of fabric on their face will not have very much effect.

I also just want to point out (not specifically in reference to you), that many people that point to the "science" of masks preventing spread don't accept the science that transmission generally requires prolonged, close contact with an infected person in a space with poor ventilation.

See my post above. I agree some false "comfort' can be produced and that studies are a mixed bag; but some effectiveness is better then none, especially with how little effort it takes. Just my two cents.

FWIW, I got tired of washing my reusable mask, so I switched to disposable surgical ones. I see so many people, anecdotally, just wearing the mask then putting it in their pocket, throwing it on the car seat, etc; behaviors like that are no bueno. and even if you are not being that careless, the masks need to be disinfected regularly.

 

[Ldno]

I re use the disposable surgical ones for a max of 2-3 days and I use an UV bacteria light killer on the mask after use. The problem is buying masks since they are harder to come by. To Be honest after a while the disposable mask Starts shredding to the point it tickles, but the problem with cloth masks is the frequent cleaning has made them start to fade.

I cannot wear the disposable mask all day but I’d prefer the cloth one for comfort. It’s a double edge sword.

 

[Lilofan]

To be fair, this person did not make the comparison, but made a joke about another user making the comparison. People make jokes on the forum all the time, many around serious topics. Some hit. Some miss. Maybe benefit of the doubt is in order all around here.

Socially distance fighting wars is an offensive statement. My good friends Marine sons did not come home alive from Iraq.

 

[Miss Bella]

Socially distance fighting wars is an offensive statement. My good friends Marine sons did not come home alive from Iraq.

I thought it was offensive comparison that’s why the joke. I think we should just move on.

 

[Chi84]

many people that point to the "science" of masks preventing spread don't accept the science that transmission generally requires prolonged, close contact with an infected person in a space with poor ventilation.

I agree that this seems to be the case - too many people are focused on briefly walking past someone.

I actually have changed my stance on masks over the past 6 months. I still believe people think they do more than they actually do and that they tend to create a false sense of security that can lead to less distancing, but there is greater agreement now that the benefits outweigh the risks. There were recent reports that, in addition to protecting others, masks can prevent a person who gets COVID from getting a more severe case by limiting the initial viral load.

My issue has always been with sensationalized headlines/articles. There is one making the rounds now saying a CDC study shows that people are twice as likely to get COVID if they eat in a restaurant. The actual study involved 314 people, didn't distinguish between indoor and outdoor dining, didn't focus on whether/what precautions were in place at the restaurants involved, and I don't believe it even asked the participants if they were dining with members of their own households or meeting up with other acquaintances. I don't think the actual study justifies the conclusions that are being drawn, to the detriment of the restaurant industry. The same type of thing was happening with masks early on, and it led to a lot of skepticism.

 

[GoofGoof]

You all can do what you want, but there’s really zero point in having the same tired discussion on masks. The same people saying the same stuff over and over. Everyone knows where everyone stands. What’s the point?

 

[Phil12]

These are the ones to buy and use:

 

[Miss Bella]

You all can do what you want, but there’s really zero point in having the same tired discussion on masks. The same people saying the same stuff over and over. Everyone knows where everyone stands. What’s the point?

Very true. I think we all know where everyone stands on every issue regarding Covid. I’m not sure how much left there is to debate on the topic.

 

[Heppenheimer]

Very true. I think we all know where everyone stands on every issue regarding Covid. I’m not sure how much left there is to debate on the topic.

Just wait until the vaccine comes out...

 

[GimpYancIent]

These are the ones to buy and use:
View attachment 497764

Sure.

 

[Miss Bella]

Just wait until the vaccine comes out...

Hasn’t that already been debated in this thread multiple times?

 

[Heppenheimer]

Hasn’t that already been debated in this thread multiple times?

We don't even know any of the specifics of the presumptive vaccines yet, so it couldn't have been a particularly informed debate.

 

[danlb_2000]

Masks should be worn, but people need to recognize they are marginally effective at helping curb spread

Scientific studies have shown they are much more the "marginally" effective"

 

[MissingDisney]

This is a discussion forum, not a debate forum. There is actually a difference between the two.

 

[danlb_2000]

They can't filter alot of it out;

The Size of SARS-CoV-2 and its Implications

The size of SARS-CoV-2 virus particles can provide a useful insight into how they infect host cells and how to protect against them.

www.news-medical.net

COVID particles are small. So cloth masks really work well against expelling of large droplets, etc. but for an asymptomatic spreader who isn't coughing or sneezing, it's marginal.

Yes, most mask won't block a single particle of the virus, but even with normal breathing and speaking the virus is transmitted in small droplets of water that the mask may be able to block, so they are helpful in reducing transmission from asymptomatic people.

 

[danlb_2000]

We don't even know any of the specifics of the presumptive vaccines yet, so it couldn't have been a particularly informed debate.

We have had 1000's of pages of debates about rides that haven't even started construction yet.

 

[GoofGoof]

Scientific studies have shown they are much more the "marginally" effective"

People are dug in. A study comes out that goes against the narrative so just attack the study. Not enough people, not the right subset of subjects, not enough details of the results, the group running the study is biased...pick your plan of attack. The truth is no matter how many “studies” are done or how much “proof” there is nobody is going to change their minds.

 

[rowrbazzle]

Thanks for the info will definitely be reading up.

I think my point is this; let's play devils advocate and say cloth masks were only effective 20 percent of the time; that's still a reduction in transmission! So regardless of how effective or not effective it is, is it really an inconvenience to wear one? Just wear it even if they have mixed results. If i wear a mask and it prevents me from spreading it to at least one person I am near, I am gonna wear it. Better then zero

Right on. You don't need perfect prevention if enough people are using them. And when you're looking across a population even small reductions can add up. One article estimated 200,000 fewer infections based on reduced growth rates in states after their mandates.

I actually have changed my stance on masks over the past 6 months. I still believe people think they do more than they actually do and that they tend to create a false sense of security that can lead to less distancing, but there is greater agreement now that the benefits outweigh the risks. There were recent reports that, in addition to protecting others, masks can prevent a person who gets COVID from getting a more severe case by limiting the initial viral load.

Me too! We're still learning so I think it's still worth discussing. The recent study that found bandanas and gaiters seemed to actually increase the spread of droplets was interesting. That kind of information is helpful. I know Southwest has changed their policy to no longer allow those.