Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Casper Gutman]

Argue with him, go find him on twitter and tell him he’s an idiot.

Nah. I listened to exactly what he was saying, which is always a good idea. He wasn't lying and he's not an idiot. He was spinning.

Lockwood also apparently explicitly said he wouldn't go to Disney World right now on the Eleventh Hour show on July 10, but the transcript of that program hasn't been released yet, so I can't personally verify it. If he didn't say that, I'll acknowledge it here.

 

[xdan0920]

Nah. I listened to exactly what he was saying, which is always a good idea. He wasn't lying and he's not an idiot. He was spinning.

Lockwood also apparently explicitly said he wouldn't go to Disney World right now on the Eleventh Hour show on July 10, but the transcript of that program hasn't been released yet, so I can't personally verify it. If he didn't say that, I'll acknowledge it here.

Why would he be “spinning”? I think he’s just saying what he knows, and what he thinks based on what he knows.

 

[lisa12000]

The argument about schools is raging over here in the uk as well - the govt have mandated schools to go full time in September yet many schools are going their own way in the advice of the unions with many starting terms later and only bringing back students in a staggered fashion - also the give have said no assemblies, no physical education, no field trips, no experiments in science or other practical subjects, no playing outside your bubble etc - that’s not normal schooling

the govt have said no mandate to social distancing but schools have decided they’re keeping it - also if there is one positive case in the school (whether teacher or student) some schools are closing the whole school down for a week or more - the govt are not saying that they’re stating two or more cases and a particular bubble stops off and gets tested and isolates -problem with regulations is that buisnesses will take them and make them harsher

 

[Casper Gutman]

School is really, really important - it needs to be a top priority. But we need to take steps to make it safe to open, not just shout, "schools open!" Places where cases have exploded need to lockdown. Messaging needs to be coherent at every level of society. Contact tracing would be great, though there are a lot of difficulties with that.

And, to bring it back to this thread, major theme parks in one of the world's top virus hotspot should be closed.

 

[xdan0920]

The argument about schools is raging over here in the uk as well - the govt have mandated schools to go full time in September yet many schools are going their own way in the advice of the unions with many starting terms later and only bringing back students in a staggered fashion - also the give have said no assemblies, no physical education, no field trips, no experiments in science or other practical subjects, no playing outside your bubble etc - that’s not normal schooling

the govt have said no mandate to social distancing but schools have decided they’re keeping it - also if there is one positive case in the school (whether teacher or student) some schools are closing the whole school down for a week or more - the govt are not saying that they’re stating two or more cases and a particular bubble stops off and gets tested and isolates -problem with regulations is that buisnesses will take them and make them harsher

We are going to doom an entire generation. And we are setting a tragic precedent on pandemic response. Devastating.

 

[xdan0920]

School is really, really important - it needs to be a top priority. But we need to take steps to make it safe to open, not just shout, "schools open!" Places where cases have exploded need to lockdown. Messaging needs to be coherent at every level of society. Contact tracing would be great, though there are a lot of difficulties with that.

And, to bring it back to this thread, major theme parks in one of the world's top virus hotspot should be closed.

But it’s not the flu. These kids aren’t in danger. We let kids die from the flu, and pass it to each other Every. Single. Year. Now, we have a virus that is far less impactful to the u17 age group, and we are destroying their futures. It’s a tragedy of epic proportions.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

But it’s not the flu. These kids aren’t in danger. We let kids die from the flu, and pass it to each other Every. Single. Year. Now, we have a virus that is far less impactful to the u17 age group, and we are destroying their futures. It’s a tragedy of epic proportions.

Thankfully, all of the teachers, administrators, and support staff are also children so there's no risk to anyone's health.

 

[Casper Gutman]

But it’s not the flu. These kids aren’t in danger. We let kids die from the flu, and pass it to each other Every. Single. Year. Now, we have a virus that is far less impactful to the u17 age group, and we are destroying their futures. It’s a tragedy of epic proportions.

It is absolutely a tragedy, and one that could have been averted - and can still be mitigated - if we act responsibly.

Kids seem to be in less danger, though we're learning more all the time. But staff, teachers - they're in danger. If you reopen unwisely, despite all the precautions you can take, you're going to start seeing schools have clusters of sick teachers. And then parents and teachers will start to balk. And the schools will shut down. And this will take place all over the country.

Look at Israel. They seemed to have the situation firmly under control. They reopened schools. And then there were outbreaks. And the schools closed again.

We had months and months to prepare for this very important moment. To innovate. To plan. And we didn't. We have to start now.

 

[Casper Gutman]

Thankfully, all of the teachers, administrators, and support staff are also children so there's no risk to anyone's health.

Lord of the Flies is an awesome pedagogical model!

 

[lisa12000]

It is absolutely a tragedy, and one that could have been averted - and can still be mitigated - if we act responsibly.

Kids seem to be in less danger, though we're learning more all the time. But staff, teachers - they're in danger. If you reopen unwisely, despite all the precautions you can take, you're going to start seeing schools have clusters of sick teachers. And then parents and teachers will start to balk. And the schools will shut down. And this will take place all over the country.

Look at Israel. They seemed to have the situation firmly under control. They reopened schools. And then there were outbreaks. And the schools closed again.

We had months and months to prepare for this very important moment. To innovate. To plan. And we didn't.

To be fair for one example such as Israel you have plenty in Europe where schools have opened with no issues at all - you will always have cases it’s how it is dealt with is the important issue

 

[The Mom]

Floridian here, and that statement is not true. Our area has just consolidated the various testing sites in the county, leaving us with only (1) location (hospital) that is open until 11am daily, and can conduct 200 tests. The line is “full” as soon as that site opens every day.

And, it is still taking 9-14 days to receive results back, which does nothing “stop the spread” as contact tracing efforts don’t start until you receive a positive diagnosis. Ideally, the testee would isolate that whole time, but that’s not the case, ESPECIALLY if they were only being sent to get a test because they had an exposure to someone, yet aren’t showing symptoms.

So...I believe the correct phrase would be: we are flying by the seat of our pants.

The state of Florida is as large as some European countries, so county by county experiences differ. My county has just closed a major testing site while opening multiple testing sites throughout the county - making testing more convenient for people in different areas. This is in addition to the private labs which offer testing. But I agree that there is a lag because the emphasis was put on increasing testing without increasing lab personal to actual conduct the tests.

The numbers of cases, hospitalizations, etc are also different per county. Dade county has more cases in some zipcodes than most counties have for the whole county! So a "hotspot" state has multiple "hotspots." However, I would be hesitant to travel here - if I didn't live here.

I still limit my excursions to what is essential.

 

[xdan0920]

Thankfully, all of the teachers, administrators, and support staff are also children so there's no risk to anyone's health.

So we can risk the kids every year? Lots of kids die from the flu. Orders of magnitude more then of Covid. Those are acceptable risks? But these aren’t? I guess that makes sense.

 

[Casper Gutman]

To be fair for one example such as Israel you have plenty in Europe where schools have opened with no issues at all - you will always have cases it’s how it is dealt with is the important issue

It's my understanding that Germany has been having students attend class in-person only part-time, so that class sizes can be small. That's the sort of innovation America should be looking at at every level. And even with that, some schools have been closing due to outbreaks.

 

[kong1802]

Nah. It’s not. It’s a far greater health risk for kids to be out of school then in it. Open the schools. Do not ask the youth of this country to sacrifice their education and emotional development. It’s wrong.

Edit to add....

“Slams trump” aka says he shouldn’t withhold funding from schools.

I think they should open.

However it’s up to the local authorities to make their own plans on how that occurs.

Not sure you are reading what I’m writing....

Wait, you think Wyoming and FL aren’t different?
It’s all starting to make sense now.

 

[xdan0920]

Wait, you think Wyoming and FL aren’t different?
It’s all starting to make sense now.

They aren't different in that schools should be open in both states. All states. So we agree.

 

[Heppenheimer]

It's my understanding that Germany has been having students attend class in-person only part-time, so that class sizes can be small. That's the sort of innovation America should be looking at at every level. And even with that, some schools have been closing due to outbreaks.

That might be an easier adjustment for Germany to begin with, since their school day is generally much shorter, and kids rarely live beyond walking or cycling distance from their school.

 

[Casper Gutman]

They aren't different in that schools should be open in both states. All states. So we agree.

Ideally, yes. But you have to take local conditions into account. You open with numbers similar to those in Florida, its meaningless. They'll be closed again in two or three weeks. Its just like the economy - its not a separate issue - controlling the virus is at the core of everything right now, and pretending it can be treated as a separate issue isn't productive.

It will require trade-offs. For instance, if we want schools in Florida to be open in September, WDW should be closed - and the state locked down - right now.

 

[kong1802]

They aren't different in that schools should be open in both states. All states. So we agree.

Yes, but as local authorities plan for them to be open, not anyone else....

Now to the thread..........

FL, where WDW is, is having a heck of a time with Covid, huh?

 

[Casper Gutman]

That might be an easier adjustment for Germany to begin with, since their school day is generally much shorter, and kids rarely live beyond walking or cycling distance from their school.

Also, Germany is apparently operating without about 20% of their teachers, who are high risk and thus staying home. In America over a third of educators are vulnerable - how well do schools operate without 37% or so of their teaching staff? Because that's the scenario for schools in risky areas like Florida.

 

[mickeymiss]

I just want to know what the plan is. It's safe to say that no state is declining enough that this won't be part of life now. We sit home looking out our windows waiting for a vaccine that may never come? Kids miss out on education? Parents quitting their jobs to enable remote learning? Many working families have felt pressure to rely on family members to watch their kids. Those family members are often in risk categories. I was so relieved when masks and distancing were implemented for businesses. It is working out well and it's the best we can do. Some people still want to put the brakes on businesses that have turned themselves inside out for safety.

This was never supposed to be permanent lockdowns. There is nothing to indicate that it's necessary to close down every business whenever cases spike. It's going to do more harm than good ultimately.