Changes to table service dining cancellation policy - credit card requirement expands

[Computer Magic]

Yep. There were always exceptions and times when you might struggle, but not like now where you can show up at EPCOT during only moderate crowds and be told ... 'we can get you into Morrocco at 8:50 ... or how about China at 8:45?' if you're lucky.

It has come to the point where it just isn't worth it to me.

Want great meals without leaving Disney property (and all the MAGIC) without making reservations most of the year?

Here's some suggestions:

You want steak? Substitute Shula's or Outback for Le Cellier or Yachtsman.

You want seafood? Substitute Fulton's or Kimono's for Flying Fish or Coral Reef.

You want Italian? Substitute Il Mulino or Andiamo for Tutto Italia or Via Napoli.

You want high end/top culinary experience? Substitute Bluezoo for California Grill.

You want Japanese teppanyaki? Substitute Benihana for Tepan Edo.

You want a character meal? Substitute Garden Grove for Chef Mickey's.

You want more? ... I can go on here ...

All without ever leaving MAGICal WDW property. Think about it next time you wake up 180 days out to make a dinner meal when you don't even know what you are having that night.

And realize that Disney only gets away with what consumers are willing to let it.

~GFC~

Good idea which we are doing in March.

Yes, we got the free DDP and will use it. We have an out of pocket meal and going to Il Mulino or Andiamo. We want Italian but don't like Tutto Italia or Via Napoli.

However, I'm hoping for a room only rate. If that happens, we might skip the DDP. However, if we do want WDW meals, I'll have to purchase the DDP because it does save us money. Yes, I'm feeding the bear, but Disney has a way to keep the bear from going hungry.

 

[poocher]

Another explanation for the policy change

I think you're overlooking the "real?" reason for the policy change and part of the basis for the DDP: Disney has told the shareholders that when guests book rooms, tickets, and meals before they arrive, the guests spend more time and money in the parks. When they show up with unbooked time, they wander off to SeaWorld, Universal, and shopping the outlets.

So, by introducing the DDP which must match your room stay, you are punished if you stray. As has been well-noted before, the DDP has caused a host of problems, and the policy change for cancellations is just an attempt to fix one of them.

My suggestion is that if you have a car, you visit the myriad restaurants on highway 192 or Int'l Drive and get some actual value. They're not as flexible if you have a gluten-intolerant vegan to feed, but for most folks, they're great. And every chef or entrepreneur who thinks they have a great dining concept has opened a restaurant in Orlando, so the competition is fierce.

I used to have Tables of Wonderland, I used to eat at Le Cellier, I used to enjoy Disney restaurants and chefs. Now I just enjoy Orlando. Try it; you'll like it.

 

[Dads 2 Boys]

I love how everyone wants to blame the DDP for this. Why not blame Meg Crofton too while you are at it? :lookaroun

I'm not saying the DDP doesn't have an effect on this but it's NOT the only problem nor the primary problem. This is primarily about people not showing up for reservations. If someone doesn't want to make a committment to a restaurant and makes 4 reservations for Sunday @ 6:00 and use (maybe) one, how is the DDP to blame for this? Spare me that the 180 day window is only because of the DDP.

Also, Walt Disney World does not nor should not cater to locals only. It is the no. 1 travel destination in the world! TDO's main focus is on the tourist....that's what's good for business. This means locals are not going to be the sole focus. To the person who said, "locals kept the lights on from 2001-2003", does that entitle locals forever? Disney lives thru the windshield while too many "fanboys" live out the rearview mirror and it appears many locals are the same way regarding this .

 

[WDW1974]

Good point, poocher.

But some folks don't have cars ... and some folks are afraid to venture off Disney property because there's no pixie dust once you leave the land that Walt picked.



~GFC~

 

[lebeau]

My nutritionist, GP and dentist have a sign that says "We will charge you $25.00 for a missed appointment". I have completely by accident missed an appointment at all three. However, it has been few and far between and I have never been charged. I have a feeling this is how the ADR charge will work. If you call them and tell them you have an emergency, stomach flu, etc. They most likely will not charge you. If you pull a no call/ no show, they most likely will charge you.

It is a policy so therefore they need to put forth rules. They cannot say "miss a reservation or cancel an hour before and we may or may not charge you, depending on your reason". Therefore they say something along the lines of "cancel 24 hours before".

I am sure there is a gray area. I think this system can be a positive thing.

That has not been my personal experience. Missed one reservation. Called hours before hand. Got charged the full amount. Including the baby who would not have eaten.

I know I'm repeating myself. But don't fool yourself that you'll get some kind of exception should this ever happen to you. If Disney makes lots of exceptions, this policy will have no teeth.

 

[menamechris]

I think all this talk of Disney creating this situation is a bit off. To start, Disney will make policies to try and keep the restaurants fully booked all day long, or come as close to that as they can. This new policy is not to make reservations easier to get (tho it will do that), it's to make the reservation mean something again; a commitment that yes, I will be eating at your establishment at this time. Sadly, I guess too many people abused it and now a credit card replaces your word.

Okay - it's not a doctor's appointment. I am sure Cheesecake Factory doesn't take and charge a credit card if you don't cancel within 24 hours, do they?

 

[goofysgurl]

Good point, poocher.

But some folks don't have cars ... and some folks are afraid to venture off Disney property because there's no pixie dust once you leave the land that Walt picked.

(

~GFC~

The nice about the WDW resort is that we don't need a car...or so we think:veryconfu

 

[lebeau]

I've been to WDW a bunch of times and have made my ADR's at the maximum amount of time out before the trip, changed a few from time to time up to the trip but I have never, ever missed and ADR or have gone past a 24 hour window of cancellation. Yes, I have two children and they get sick just like all other kids. My wife is somewhat accident prone. We have never missed an ADR but if we did then I would just have to chalk it up to a crappy experience. As a pp said, you get charged fee's for missed appointments at other places. Why should this be any different?


And exactly how is someone going to cheat the system? You make the ADR and miss it or do not cancel it until the same day then you get charged. Where is the cheating?

You get charged a fee for missing a doctor's appointment. Not a dinner reservation. There's a big difference.

People will continue to "cheat" by double booking. They will just be sure to call to cancel the extra appointments with a cc hold. This won't have much impact at all on double booking, if that's what people are expecting.

 

[Computer Magic]

The nice about the WDW resort is that we don't need a car...or so we think:veryconfu

Disney knows what it's doing. Keeping you on property by providing transportation. Increasing the food prices so you need DDP. Increasing the retail resort prices you need DVC.

However, the quality isn't what is was in the 90's which is opening the door for outside activity.

 

[WDW1974]

I love how everyone wants to blame the DDP for this. Why not blame Meg Crofton too while you are at it? :lookaroun

Why not? She is the top manager of WDW.

Also, Walt Disney World does not nor should not cater to locals only. It is the no. 1 travel destination in the world! TDO's main focus is on the tourist....that's what's good for business. This means locals are not going to be the sole focus. To the person who said, "locals kept the lights on from 2001-2003", does that entitle locals forever? Disney lives thru the windshield while too many "fanboys" live out the rearview mirror and it appears many locals are the same way regarding this .

Why don't you read what is written. I never said locals should be the sole focus. My point is no one should. WDW is creating a caste system (just wait until people start booking a March 24th 4:15 ride on Space Mountain from their iPhone six months out!) where people are not created equally and where locals (and anyone who has the gall to not know what they want -- or where/when -- a meal six months out) are screwed.

EVERY guest is a VIP (you don't hear that PR line anymore, do you? could it be that Disney no longer believes it?)

Too many 'newbies' (or anyone who basically became a WDW regular post Y2K) seem to think they have a clue as to how the resort is best managed and, despite their protestations to the opposite, what's at the heart of it is a good old-fashioned desire to get special treatment. When you can dine anywhere and others can't, based upon a system that caters to WDW resort guests who book far in advance, use the DDP etc, then things are not even close to an even playing field. Many folks aren't even in the stadium when the game is starting.

I don't want special treatment. But I do want the ability to dine at WDW without making a reservation six months out. There have to be multiple better ways ...

~GFC~

 

[lebeau]

Oh, I understand what you mean. But I think for Disney it is a case of "d***ed if you and d***ed if you don't" with this. But by canceling 4 of their bogus ADRs those people will not in fact be cheating anyone but those that want to make an ADR for the same time. By canceling even just 24 1/2 hours out they still give the walk up people a chance to eat faster. I'll be willing to bet that if Disney starts getting hammered by guests on this then they'll back off and we'll see another policy change, fast.

I don't see this helping walk-ups. Disney will have more time to fill those tables. If anything, walk-ups could get harder to get.

 

[WDW1974]

Okay - it's not a doctor's appointment. I am sure Cheesecake Factory doesn't take and charge a credit card if you don't cancel within 24 hours, do they?

They didn't when I dined there with (GASP:drevil:) another member of this MAGICal forum last weekend.

We should convince them to do that since we did have to wait 45 minutes at prime dinner time!

~GFCers love shakes!~

 

[lebeau]

Why not? She is the top manager of WDW.



Why don't you read what is written. I never said locals should be the sole focus. My point is no one should. WDW is creating a caste system (just wait until people start booking a March 24th 4:15 ride on Space Mountain from their iPhone six months out!) where people are not created equally and where locals (and anyone who has the gall to not know what they want -- or where/when -- a meal six months out) are screwed.

EVERY guest is a VIP (you don't hear that PR line anymore, do you? could it be that Disney no longer believes it?)

Too many 'newbies' (or anyone who basically became a WDW regular post Y2K) seem to think they have a clue as to how the resort is best managed and, despite their protestations to the opposite, what's at the heart of it is a good old-fashioned desire to get special treatment. When you can dine anywhere and others can't, based upon a system that caters to WDW resort guests who book far in advance, use the DDP etc, then things are not even close to an even playing field. Many folks aren't even in the stadium when the game is starting.

I don't want special treatment. But I do want the ability to dine at WDW without making a reservation six months out. There have to be multiple better ways ...

~GFC~

I've been in enough FP discussions to know that the majority don't care if a systems is fair or not as long as they are the ones that benefit from it.

 

[Disaddict]

You get charged a fee for missing a doctor's appointment. Not a dinner reservation. There's a big difference.

So you've never seen this before:

"This restaurant requires a credit card in order to make this reservation. This restaurant reserves the right to charge a cancellation fee according to its cancellation policy. Please note that online cancellations will only be accepted prior to 5PM two days before reservation. Thank you!"

Hmmm. You must not eat out very often. I've seen messages like that one quite a few times. Heck, I found that one by Googling and selecting my first hit.

Found at: http://www.seriouseats.com/2009/04/should-restaurants-charge-no-show-fees.html

Per Se in New York City charges $175 per seat for a booking canceled less than three days in advance; Momofuku Ko, with an online battle waged over every seat, charges $150 per person for less than 24 hours notice.

------

People will continue to "cheat" by double booking. They will just be sure to call to cancel the extra appointments with a cc hold. This won't have much impact at all on double booking, if that's what people are expecting.

Even if they do double book (I'm sure Disney will auto track the CC number to prevent this anyway) they will still be canceling in enough time for you to get a walk up in that spot they vacated. That is unless you intend on sitting outside the place all night.

 

[disneyrcks]

That has not been my personal experience. Missed one reservation. Called hours before hand. Got charged the full amount. Including the baby who would not have eaten.

I know I'm repeating myself. But don't fool yourself that you'll get some kind of exception should this ever happen to you. If Disney makes lots of exceptions, this policy will have no teeth.

If you do not mind my asking, which restaurant at Disney did this? If you do not want to post here I understand but I am curious to know which restaurant on property charged you and if, by any chance, you had another reservation (or ate) at another restaurant on property during that time?

I did not even realize they started charging for missed ADR's already, forgive me, I did not read through the entire thread.

 

[menamechris]

Also, Walt Disney World does not nor should not cater to locals only. It is the no. 1 travel destination in the world! TDO's main focus is on the tourist....that's what's good for business. This means locals are not going to be the sole focus. To the person who said, "locals kept the lights on from 2001-2003", does that entitle locals forever? Disney lives thru the windshield while too many "fanboys" live out the rearview mirror and it appears many locals are the same way regarding this .

First of all, he was being kind stating that locals only kept the lights on from 2001-2003. More like any slow period during the year. Or how about the latest economic downturn that brought tourism to a halt. Guess what? The locals were there. And cast members are locals too, and most contribute to the resort - whether it be dining, merchandise, Food & Wine, or even just drinks at a hotel bar after work. Disney would like to deny it but - the local dollar is still very important to the resort being able to run year round.

And as a local, I feel I need to clarify something. There is no entitlement issue. Central Florida/Orlando is the tourist destination, not just Walt Disney World. People enjoy hundreds of attractions and destinations here while on vacation. Whenever you visit (whether you stay solely at WDW or off property somewhere else) you are visiting someone else's city. Our taxes don't go to WDW or Universal, but our city and tax dollars contribute in other ways that helps these tourist areas prosper. And make Orlando a nice place for you to visit. So, no, I don't think its unreasonable for locals to be upset when changes are implemented that affect our experience at the resort (i.e. DDP, or this new cancellation policy). No one is asking for favortism, just fairness.

 

[disneyrcks]

Do people honestly read anymore, or do they just skim a post to find the points they dislike?

The doctors appointment reference is meant to show why a policy is put into place. A business that takes appointments finds that they are losing money when people do not show up for said appointment. Therefore they put a policy in place that states "You will pay x if you do not show up for your appt".
It is a blanket statement, but will they take specific circumstances into consideration? Most likely, they will. That is what this charge is all about. If you call and say my kid, me, my wife is sick and we just cannot make it, most likely they will not charge you. However, if you happen to have an ADR at another restaurant at the same time; maybe they will charge you.

Point is, they have to lay out a stern policy. I am sure you can discuss your real issues for canceling when you call them and they will decide from there if it is legit or not. However, like I said before.....if you are going to create a policy it cannot state "hey we will charge you if you miss your ADR but if you give us a good reason, we probably won't". The policy will have a firm statement with exceptions decided by staff.

What is so wrong with that?

 

[menamechris]

That has not been my personal experience. Missed one reservation. Called hours before hand. Got charged the full amount. Including the baby who would not have eaten.

I know I'm repeating myself. But don't fool yourself that you'll get some kind of exception should this ever happen to you. If Disney makes lots of exceptions, this policy will have no teeth.

Exactly. I had to cancel a tour with my little nephew because he got sick and couldn't go. I called the night before, explained the situation, and basically was told "sorry to hear that" and was quickly read the policy I had agreed to about being charged for not calling within 24 hours. Maybe some CM's... (are they CM's? I think they are in Tampa or something)... may cut a break for excuses, but I am sure there will be some who will enjoy the new power...

 

[menamechris]

Point is, they have to lay out a stern policy. I am sure you can discuss your real issues for canceling when you call them and they will decide from there if it is legit or not. However, like I said before.....if you are going to create a policy it cannot state "hey we will charge you if you miss your ADR but if you give us a good reason, we probably won't". The policy will have a firm statement with exceptions decided by staff.

What is so wrong with that?

That the staff member probably makes minimum wage? That's like leaving it to the stock boy to make customer service decisions at your local grocery store.

In all seriousness, I understand your point - and I have a feeling we will see very quickly how this situation is handled. I have a feeling the customer won't always be right anymore tho...

 

[disneyrcks]

Exactly. I had to cancel a tour with my little nephew because he got sick and couldn't go. I called the night before, explained the situation, and basically was told "sorry to hear that" and was quickly read the policy I had agreed to about being charged for not calling within 24 hours. Maybe some CM's... (are they CM's? I think they are in Tampa or something)... may cut a break for excuses, but I am sure there will be some who will enjoy the new power...

What do you mean by "enjoy the new power"? It is unfortunate to get charged for something you do not get to experience. And while illness, travel delays, etc. does happen, the fact that you commited to being there should hold. Like I said, they may take specific issues into account. Most likely they will and not charge you if your kid is sick, you are sick, etc. It sounds as if they are only looking to charge those who do not cancel at all or maybe do not cancel but have a ressie across property at the same time.