News Cars-Themed Attractions at Magic Kingdom

[James Alucobond]

Are we confident that these things will be built? There was an awful lot in the EPCOT 2.0 plan that was a Go and was quietly cancelled... I am afraid they will level the land and tear out all of TSI and the river and then realize the demo was more expensive than anticipated and they no longer have the budget to build what they intended.... and all that beautiful set dressing for Frontierland will just become a tree berm in order to keep most of the Cars attraction intact....

Of course it's possible that things will change. They usually do in one way or another, though EPCOT is an especially unusual outlier due to numerous extenuating circumstances. We haven't even seen renderings detailed enough to know exactly what they intend to do along the current riverfront from all angles. The point is that there's no reason to believe that they physically can't when it's basically already been done with Grizzly Peak.

 

[mickEblu]

Water features (streams, waterfalls, geysers) are kinetic elements that will exist outside the tree and rock barrier. I don't think they were talking about the cars.

Also, there would be sightline and thematic issues regardless of where it was situated as long as it was Big Thunder-adjacent.

I can’t see all that much in the way of significant water features that will be enjoyed by as many people Not around or riding the attraction. Not to the level of the ROA for sure.

No there wouldn’t. If they put it beyond BTMRR the sight line issues would be at a minimum and much more out of the way. The impact between where they decided to put it and BeyonD BTMMR are so vast that I’m not even sure what the point of that comment was.

 

[mickEblu]

Well - judging before you even know what it will be... is on brand.

You not liking a point that shuts down your argument is also on Brand.

 

[James Alucobond]

No there wouldn’t. If they put it beyond BTMRR the sight line issues would be at a minimum and much more out of the way. The impact between where they decided to put it and BeyonD BTMMR are so vast that I’m not even sure what the point of that comment was.

IMO, potentially seeing Cars from Big Thunder is the major thematic sightline issue in either scenario. With either plan, you won't see them from the main areas of Frontierland or Liberty Square. The change is about whether the backdrop is cascadian wilderness or a Mississippi basin river.

 

[Bocabear]

Of course it's possible that things will change. They usually do in one way or another, though EPCOT is an especially unusual outlier due to numerous extenuating circumstances. We haven't even seen renderings detailed enough to know exactly what they intend to do along the current riverfront from all angles. The point is that there's no reason to believe that they physically can't when it's basically already been done with Grizzly Peak.

no one is saying they can't do it... I have seen Grizzly Peak...and the absolutely fantastic Radiator Springs at DCA...they are epic and monumental...They also were not built right next to the Haunted Mansion in Disneyland Park...across from Pirates Of The Caribbean.... My concern is from what I have seen them do in the last decade.... Do you risk completely demolishing the heart of this park knowing that it can never be restored, and that for sure "things can change"? I am concerned they will get into it, cost overruns and all...and then it's a railroad tie and dirt berm with visible show buildings on the backside facing Frontierland and the sounds of a cartoon off road rally race echoing through Liberty Square....

 

[James Alucobond]

I mean, even in dire times, they have never done rockwork and horticulture poorly. It doesn't seem like a productive use of one's energies to become immediately anxious about imagined terrible outcomes when there's really no precedent with the type of work proposed here.

 

[Disstevefan1]

I mean, even in dire times, they have never done rockwork and horticulture poorly. It doesn't seem like a productive use of one's energies to become immediately anxious about imagined terrible outcomes when there's really no precedent with the type of work proposed here.

The anxiety for me, is about what we will see as the end product after all the cost cutting has occurred.

There is precedent for cost cutting, see Toy Story Land, see the EPCOT renovation, see the starting then closing the Play pavilion, see Communicore and so on.

 

[mickEblu]

The anxiety for me, is about what we will see as the end product after all the cost cutting has occurred.

There is precedent for cost cutting, see Toy Story Land, see the EPCOT renovation, see the starting then closing the Play pavilion, see Communicore and so on.

The anxiety for me is seeing a beautiful river/ vista go away for a Cars D ticket.

 

[James Alucobond]

The anxiety for me, is about what we will see as the end product after all the cost cutting has occurred.

There is precedent for cost cutting, see Toy Story Land, see the EPCOT renovation, see the starting then closing the Play pavilion, see Communicore and so on.

As always, 85-90% of the examples people can dredge up lately to justify concerns are related to a historically troubled time for the entire world that happened to overlap with EPCOT's renovation. The remaining 10-15% are related to the few cuts of supporting facilities (shopping, dining), implied entertainment options, or incidental attraction decorations that have accompanied basically every build in the history of the company.

 

[Disstevefan1]

As always, 85-90% of the examples people can dredge up lately to justify concerns are related to a historically troubled time for the entire world that happened to overlap with EPCOT's renovation. The remaining 10-15% are related to the few cuts of supporting facilities (shopping, dining), implied entertainment options, or incidental attraction decorations that have accompanied basically every build in the history of the company.

You're right. I am worrying over nothing.
I am sure the cars project will be inline with Disney's new sixth key value -

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

plus you had things like the canoes up until not too long ago.

Are they permanently gone?

 

[flynnibus]

You not liking a point that shuts down your argument is also on Brand.

More like I don't bother with debates over things that are made up...

We can be critical all we want when there is something actually there to judge with. This kind of critique based on what you think it will be... well.. pointless.

 

[flynnibus]

Are they permanently gone?

Who knows...

 

[Incomudro]

Of course it's possible that things will change. They usually do in one way or another, though EPCOT is an especially unusual outlier due to numerous extenuating circumstances. We haven't even seen renderings detailed enough to know exactly what they intend to do along the current riverfront from all angles. The point is that there's no reason to believe that they physically can't when it's basically already been done with Grizzly Peak.

They could.
They certainly would have in the past.
I think about how nice it is in the back of Canada at Epcot with all of the water.
I'm at a point now where I expect that kind of work about much as I expect a good Star Wars series out of Disney.
And that's a shame.
It's a shame that they broke me.

 

[October82]

They could.
They certainly would have in the past.
I think about how nice it is in the back of Canada at Epcot with all of the water.
I'm at a point now where I expect that kind of work and much as I expect a good Star Wars series out of Disney.
And that's a shame.
It's a shame that they broke me.

A very succinct summary of my feelings towards Disney at this point.

 

[Tha Realest]

Pirates at DL hasn't been a big winner. Disney hasn't put in a real 'play area' in a lifetime... and putting a few more low motion deer or wildlife figures hasn't been sufficient either.

Since the Parks division was taken over by merchandise/consumer products so many years ago, you know they view the parks as sales “heat maps” - setting aside all other considerations, especially nebulous ones like place setting and coherent theming - what does that square footage get you in terms of an investment? “Sales per square foot” is a very real thing; it’s why a land like SWGE has twice as many restaurants/dining/refreshment options as attractions, and twice as many shopping/retail options as restaurants/dining/refreshment options. Two rides + four dining/refreshment + eight shops is their Golden ratio.

TSI/ROA has none of these things, with the added cost of CM staffing and transportation staffing.

 

[Steamboat71]

This hasn't been discussed in a while, but have there been any talks to keep the bottom island?

 

[flynnibus]

Since the Parks division was taken over by merchandise/consumer products so many years ago, you know they view the parks as sales “heat maps” - setting aside all other considerations, especially nebulous ones like place setting and coherent theming - what does that square footage get you in terms of an investment? “Sales per square foot” is a very real thing; it’s why a land like SWGE has twice as many restaurants/dining/refreshment options as attractions, and twice as many shopping/retail options as restaurants/dining/refreshment options. Two rides + four dining/refreshment + eight shops is their Golden ratio.

Well... the parks as Malls goes back to long before consumer products was brought into the same org. Really goes back to Pressler/Harris when they started really focusing metrics that way.

And I don't really subscribe to the evil behind such ratios. 1) They are needed 2) They need more because they aren't as big as a 1800 pph ride 3) They want to sell F&B and merch... not a shock. I'm not naive enough to believe it's gonna be a park full of rides and nothing else.

Guests already can't do everything... why would you double up spending on rides even more?

 

[ᗩLᘿᑕ ✨ ᗩζᗩᗰ]

This hasn't been discussed in a while, but have there been any talks to keep the bottom island?

No.

 

[Quietmouse]

Not when they are adding a ring of trees around the attraction because they don't feel cartoon cars jive with the rest of Frontierland and Liberty Square. That alone should tell them, "you know what? Maybe we should put this Beyond Big Thunder where we originally said."

But cartoonish bears singing folk songs do?