News Cars-Themed Attractions at Magic Kingdom

[Haymarket2008]

This art was originally for DL Paris. The perimeters represent nonsense at this point.

Weren’t there just a few Paris elements used in the art? I don’t think the art was designed for Paris as well. Big Thunder occupies the Tom Sawyer spot.

The walkways in the art seem quite deliberate/not Blue Sky to me.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Weren’t there just a few Paris elements used in the art? I don’t think the art was designed for Paris as well. Big Thunder occupies the Tom Sawyer spot.

The walkways in the art seem quite deliberate/not Blue Sky to me.

There shouldn't be any Paris elements. That there are, just goes to the idea that concept art isn't exactly what we'll get. Who knows the amount of fudging is in it?

Cf. SDD's below-grade segment and Big Al's story.

 

[WoundedDreamer]

I've been trying to find the right words. Walt Disney Imagineering and Disney Experiences are maddening. But let's back it up...

A theme park is not a random collection of rides. It's a story told through physical environments. The entire park has a story or message. And the parts of the park, whether rides or environments, tell the story of the park. That means that each ride, restaurant, and show matter.

To tell a story, you need to intentionally plan and execute the scenes. It takes intentionality. It takes planning. It takes discipline. Consider the universally lauded Toy Story 2. The scenes feel organic, but they actually took lots of hard work to put together. The film had to be refined through writing, rewrites, and the elimination of gratuitous content. Toy Story 2 has a message. Themes in that film include the importance of being emotionally open, accepting loss and mortality, seeing the best in one's friends, and living life to the fullest.

The Magic Kingdom has a message too. Just like the best films, books, and plays. It is speaking to you. What is it saying? Roy O. Disney told us. He said of Walt Disney World (and more particularly the Magic Kingdom):

"Walt Disney World is a tribute to the philosophy and life of Walter Elias Disney... and to the talents, the dedication, and the loyalty of the entire Disney organization that made Walt Disney's dream come true."

The Magic Kingdom is a celebration of the philosophy and life of Walt Disney. Thus, everything in the park must teach us about who he was and what he believed. Not through an animatronic talking Walt giving us a lecture. No. That's too obvious and unrefined. Instead, the Magic Kingdom would do it through the stories and experiences that guests encountered.

Go through the list of opening day attractions and those that opened in the 1970s. You'll learn something about Walt Disney. On Main Street USA we learn about where he came from. It preserves his childhood and youth. The optimism and hope for the future that he had. Go down Main Street USA to Cinderella Castle. It represents his journey from humble origins to master storyteller. He invites you into the fantasy worlds he created in Fantasyland. But Walt Disney had other passions too. He loved America and its founding story. He loved nature and adventure. And he believed in an optimistic view of the future. One where difficult problems could be solved and human ingenuity could triumph.

We learn about Walt Disney. But that's not all that we do at the Magic Kingdom. Walt's story becomes our story. We walk the same path of obscurity to our castle and our own Fantasyland. We get to be witness to the founding of America, explore the possibility of tomorrow, and journey into adventure. This is the genius of the Magic Kingdom. Walt Disney's beliefs and passions are not blandly communicated. We get to see, taste, smell, hear, and touch. The Magic Kingdom makes them real.

What a beautiful place.

But much like Toy Story 2, this takes discipline and careful planning. The Magic Kingdom can only communicate the philosophy and life of Walter Elias Disney if his philosophy and life are inculcated into every aspect of its design. When elements are added to the park that are not in harmony with the rest of The Magic Kingdom, it's like a sour note being played in an otherwise beautiful piece of music. It feels like there have been more and more sour notes. Too many sour notes.

As I watched the D23 presentation, I was furious.

While I have been sad to see Hollywood Studios decay into bleak meaninglessness, it is not nearly as meaningful to me. Epcot's decay is painful, but I never saw it in heyday. It's been eroded for 30 years. Animal Kingdom has been fighting for its life since its inception. It appears that its own individuality and message are being snuffed out. I've seen which way the wind is blowing since Pandora. While it made the best of a bad situation, it signaled an irreversible decline. We are seeing the fruit of that now. It will only get worse.

The Magic Kingdom's decline is perhaps most painful to me personally. The injustice of it. This is the number one park in the world. This is the park that a brother and devoted team created to honor someone they loved. Not someone perfect, but someone that is worthy of celebration. It told a story that deserved to be told. The story of Walt Disney.

This brings us to the present. My frustration with the poor design has been growing. The Walt Disney story is becoming more obscured. A new generation of Imagineers is emerging that don't seem to understand what the Magic Kingdom is. I worry that these Imagineers might not know that the Magic Kingdom is a celebration of the philosophy and life of Walt Disney. I worry that they think the Magic Kingdom is an amusement park with a castle in the middle and random lands surrounding it. That's about as complete a description as the following description of Toy Story 2, "Toy Story 2 is a film with talking toys that do stuff." And obviously this failure to understand extends to the executives.

This D23 presentation represents a turning point. One of my favorite areas is going to be destroyed. Starting at Columbia Harbor House, there is a story that stretches all the way to Big Thunder. Starting in the east (of the Magic Kingdom) is a New England town in the time of the Revolution. As you journey west in the park, you journey in time and in geography to the American west in the 1800s. If you journey southward from Big Thunder you find yourself by Southwestern Spanish architecture. And if you walk further south you eventually end up in a Spanish fort in the Caribbean.

Do the Cars team realize they're destroying this progression? Do they care?

I don't know anymore. It feels like Walt Disney Imagineering and Disney Experiences are impulsive. They have no grand vision for the Magic Kingdom. They have no editorial direction. According to the wise professor (credit to @Advisable Joseph for sharing this) who helped consult on this project:

"Cars makes ridiculous financial and demographic sense. It sells merchandise like no other franchise..."

If that's how decisions are being made, it's no wonder that the Magic Kingdom is in decline. It had nothing to do with what made sense to the story of the park. Unfortunately, that's not how Disney theme parks are developed anymore. And that means every addition will be a subtraction to the story of the park. And Walt Disney will become less and less present in the park dedicated to his philosophy and life. But who needs Walt Disney when you have Bob Iger? As he triumphantly explained:

“The IP that we’re mining, including all the sequels that we’re doing, is second to none.”

The Imagineers have got to get mining!

 

[Ice Gator]

Hey everyone, I want to apologize for being snappy to members over in the "Cars Land at MK" thread earlier this week reading this. If I came off as rude in some of my remarks, I'm sorry. I really love this community and don't want to come off as negative regarding my takes on the parks.

I'm very upset with the news too, but after *certain rethemes* I've settled on the idea that things could be much worse, and I'm trying to stay optimistic about an expanded version of "New Frontierland" (with or without the talking automobiles, the National Park scenery looks cool, but it's no ROA). I hope there's more than just Cars there- because I think that wilderness setting could bring a lot to the area.

Anyways, I try to avoid sounding snobbish on here especially if its over personal opinion about a theme park we all love, and I guess I'm just trying to stay positive about this project since it'll completely change MK in a unique way compared to the other "Castle" parks, and I know kids will love it. Plus, two new rides unique to the other Cars land is exciting- I like the off-road mountain vibe they showed in the concept. I dunno, I'll judge it when it happens.

Maybe it's just irony- the villains actually did a good thing for once by softening that blow.

 

[Figments Friend]

So an observation…..

And perhaps food for thought :

We are losing a unique experience most Guests can only ever experience at a Disney Theme Park - a ride on a steam powered paddle boat ‘river Queen’ in an authentic recreation of another time period….

For a very commonplace experience every Guest experiences on their way to said theme Park and almost every day -
Riding in a car / SUV over various terrain in the present day.

Right on Disney.
Got it….


Idiots.


-

 

[Sir_Cliff]

I've been on the Riverboat a few times. But never on TSI. I keep telling myself to go there, but when in the park, I never think about it with so much other stuff I want to do.

So, this October when I go, I'll go see what TSI is all about.

And maybe I'll get it. Maybe I'll drop to my knees sobbing and punching the ground with my fists, scream, "You Maniacs! You're blowing it up! Ah, damn you! God damn you all to hell!"

Or... right after the trip back from TSI, I'll look back on it and shudder and mumble, "Ew. Dirty."

You are really burning through good will here. We all know there is some reason behind the tone you take on these forums defending Disney's moves with the selective critical remark that you always underline to enhance your credibility.

This makes me think that if they took out Haunted Mansion you'd start making jokes about how clunky all the figures looked.

 

[Quietmouse]

I’m currently not a passholder to either WDW or DL (which is a weird thing for me to say / type! Haha) - I have been in the past - I’m not a local though so visiting either required the same travel / lodging expenses as anyone else, even when I had a pass.

My last trip to MK was before tron opened (it was testing and doing previews) - i only had a 1 day ticket and yes, I rode the riverboat.

personally - I have no desire to ever ride the guardians tower again - and yet other guests want to ride it over and over again.

I also think the average guests enjoy seeing the steam boat - they always wave from the boardwalk and over by big thunder. Seems to bring them a smile!

It’s one of the only places in the country you can see and ride a steam powered paddle wheel.

I don’t disagree with what you’re saying. But I still think that the average just

So an observation…..

And perhaps food for thought :

We are losing a unique experience most Guests can only ever experience at a Disney Theme Park - a ride on a steam powered paddle boat ‘river Queen’ in an authentic recreation of another time period….

For a very commonplace experience every Guest experiences on their way to said theme Park and almost every day -
Riding in a car / SUV over various terrain in the present day.

Right on Disney.
Got it….


Idiots.


-

eh, so yes and no.

If you live in the Midwest by a river city then these steam boats are pretty accessible still. I’m from Ohio and there are quite a few options as far as river tours or dining cruise options on the Ohio river.

Likewise, I never get to experience true mountains/wilderness because the Midwest doesn’t really have that.

So for me, personally speaking, if this was themed to a scenic western mountain scape this would be a new experience for me because I don’t get to experience that unless I’m flying out west to Colorado.

 

[happymom25]

I saw a YouTube video of Disneyland and the canoe experience. The main cast member was cracking jokes about how once you do this you will never do it again. This kind of sums up tsi and the boat in a nutshell. You will ride the boat once. You will visit tsi once. You will paddle the canoes once. But realistically, will you do it again on a repeat visit?

Yes.
Those caves? They are like a controlled danger zone. Dark, uneven, winding paths, longer than you expect… your kids run ahead and you panic slightly until you hear their voices echoing again. They run around going through again before you’ve even made it out…thrilled with their independence.

We have such a fun time there. Playing tag at the fort and using secret escape exits to dodge whoever is “it”…the screams you can hear from across the river each time a train goes around the loop on the wildest ride in the wilderness…navigating the trails and trying to figure out how to get back to the dock…watching your teenage son laughing while he jumps as hard as he can on the barrel bridge, trying to create a splash big enough to soak his shoes…and the instant flash back to when you were seven years old, scared to cross, but watching your mom and dad laugh and jump, then holding their hands which makes you brave enough to join in.

There is something wild and pure about that part of the park. Open ended fun. A place to play with your kids and have as much fun as they are having. Which is exactly what Walt was going for when he created his theme parks. I wish my kids would be able to go back someday when they are grown and have their own flash back to childhood…jumping on the barrel bridge, laughing with their family.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

In my opinion, this is the worst decision ever in the history of Disney Parks. It’s the most naturally beautiful part of the world’s most popular theme park — and it’s going to be destroyed.

I find it so depressing how many fans don't care about this because it is apparently all about the rides, which was never what Disney theme parks were supposed to be.

That said, this seems to be what a lot of Disney fans think naturally beautiful means

 

[MisterPenguin]

You are really burning through good will here. We all know there is some reason behind the tone you take on these forums defending Disney's moves with the selective critical remark that you always underline to enhance your credibility.

This makes me think that if they took out Haunted Mansion you'd start making jokes about how clunky all the figures looked.

I'm on record on these forums pointing out clunky things in HM such as the cardboard shadow of the pianist that jumps between two positions, the 13 o'clock, the rubber ghoul mask on a janky piston. And yet, I love riding the HM. I'm also on record for removing RoA for more capacity, although, my main pitch was to move IaSW (a much better version) to Epcot.

But, nice try trying to pigeonhole a personality type for me because my opinions don't match yours.

Or trying to psychoanalyze me because I don't fall into the category of unquestioning love of all things Disney or raging hate.

So go ahead and throw that good will into the fire. I don't care. Let it burn.

Oh, one more thing... "We all know..." LOL You got a secret club in which you talk about me? It's flattering.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

If you live in the Midwest by a river city then these steam boats are pretty accessible still.

There is a difference between riverboats and steam powered paddle wheels.

Some you are referring to might be steam - Louisville and New Orleans both have them, but many are just decorative.

The riverboat experience you can still enjoy on the seven seas lagoon until they fill that in for a DVC tower cause it’s wasted space haha.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

I'm on record on these forums pointing out clunky things in HM such as the cardboard shadow of the pianist that jumps between two positions, the 13 o'clock, the rubber ghoul mask on a janky piston. And yet, I love riding the HM. I'm also on record for removing RoA for more capacity, although, my main pitch was to move IaSW (a much better version) to Epcot.

But, nice try trying to pigeonhole a personality type for me because my opinions don't match yours.

Or trying to psychoanalyze me because I don't fall into the category of unquestioning love of all things Disney or raging hate.

So go ahead and throw that good will into the fire. I don't care. Let it burn.

Oh, one more thing... "We all know..." LOL You got a secret club in which you talk about me? It's flattering.

I'm not your enemy. I'm just saying that justifying this by suggesting those who are upset are being histrionic and that Tom Sawyer Island is gross may not be the way to go.

 

[Quietmouse]

I find it so depressing how many fans don't care about this because it is apparently all about the rides, which was never what Disney theme parks were supposed to be.

That said, this seems to be what a lot of Disney fans think naturally beautiful means

View attachment 809491

Grizzly peaks is quite pretty at dca. If it looks anything like that then then, yes, it will still be a pretty addition to the park.

 

[Quietmouse]

There is a difference between riverboats and steam powered paddle wheels.

Some you are referring to might be steam - Louisville and New Orleans both have them, but many are just decorative.

The riverboat experience you can still enjoy on the seven seas lagoon until they fill that in for a DVC tower cause it’s wasted space haha.

Gotcha, had no idea, they all look the same to me.

 

[MisterPenguin]

I'm not your enemy. I'm just saying that justifying this by suggesting those who are upset are being histrionic and that Tom Sawyer Island is gross may not be the way to go.

That was just me saying I have no strong feelings either way.

If you have strong feelings about TSI, then I'm sorry for your disappointment.

 

[Sir_Cliff]

That was just me saying I have no strong feelings either way.

If you have strong feelings about TSI, then I'm sorry for your disappointment.

I don't have strong feelings about TSI. I also won't call it "ew", though.

I'm with those who think there were more elegant solutions to expanding the park that may have involved losing Rivers of America and TSI but also wouldn't have meant shoving Cars front and centre as the focal point of one of the MK lands.

We would be having a very different discussion on here if the front section of ROA was maintained with space allowed for a walkway alongside the Haunted Mansion queue and something like Santa Cecilia was going into what was previously the back half of ROA.

 

[TP2000]

I'm not up to speed (get it?) on this WDW version of this discussion. But I just posted this over on the Disneyland version of this dicsussion and I thought maybe someone here might appreciate it....

You know how we know that Josh D'Amaro and Bruce Vaughn and all the other losers know this was a bad decision?...

They didn't admit to it in front of 12,000 fans at D23 Expo. Instead, they fudged the details and buried the plot and told a few white lies. Because they know in their heart of hearts that this is a dumb and cheap way to run a theme park.

Instead of Josh D'Amaro being honest and saying at D23 Expo in a packed house at the Honda Center...

"We'll say goodbye to the Rivers of America and much of Frontierland in order to tell the immersive story of Cars!"

He actually said (exact transcript from D23 Expo Horizons presentation at the Honda Center)...

"I'm happy to announce we're inviting Mater and Lightning McQueen to a re-imagined section of Frontierland!"

And then Mr. D'Amaro said nothing about some sudden problem with maintaining a 53 year old body of water in water-logged central Florida. Nor did he even mention the following words... "Rivers Of America" or "Riverboat" or "Tom Sawyer Island".

D'Amaro just forged ahead, and made it sound like this was an addition to the existing park, instead of an erasure of the existing park. It wasn't until hours later when fans started realizing what was happening. And what all this actually meant.

That proves that even Josh D'Amaro, with his winning smile and runner's physique and Cool Dad wardrobe, knows that he is not making the correct decision about Magic Kingdom's future.

 

[MrPromey]

You joke, but Disney doesn’t realize the real cash cow - alcohol. High profit margins on alcohol and intoxicated guests = more loose spending.

I know they were anti alcohol for a while, but in all honestly it’s a huge money maker that they never truly tapped into.

You have to be joking... Or you've never done anything on property outside of the MK.

They have fully "tapped into" this everywhere on property but the MK (which, for a while was a completely sacred cow) and they've even started finding ways to inch it into there. It's only a matter of time until they sell it there like the other three parks and all over the rest of property but they've been working on getting that pot of frogs up to boil slowly to avoid the blow-back from the fans who still think this is actually Walt Disney's Walt Disney World.

 

[Quietmouse]

I will say; the oddest thing is the urgency to get this done.

If I was a Disney executive with financial purse strings, i would be genuinely curious why we aren’t tearing out the tomorrow land speed way to create expansion space. Or utilize the space next to adventure land for a new e ticket attraction.

To hear that draining and tearing out tsi being the most costlier option is bizarre because it seems Disney would want the path of least resistance, at least financially speaking.

Now they have to worry about draining the river, regrading the entire land, they have to figure out how to dismantle and remove the river boat and only then begin to build upon the land for a new attraction and theme.

Just seems like a lot of work and hoops to jump thru and feels like this goes against how Disney would operate in the sense they want the easy way out with the least resistance.

This seems like a heavy duty project and I’m curious why the urgency? Was the steam boat and island operating at that much of a loss? Was there we didn’t know about the condition of the island and the steam boat? Was there something about the river water quality?

I’m just trying to piece the puzzle together, because if Disney wanted the easy way out this was not the route to take.

 

[Quietmouse]

You have to be joking... Or you've never done anything on property outside of the MK.

They have fully "tapped into" this everywhere on property but the MK (which, for a while was a completely sacred cow) and they've even started finding ways to inch it into there. It's only a matter of time until they sell it there like the other three parks and all over the rest of property but they've been working on getting that pot of frogs up to boil slowly to avoid the blow-back from the fans who still think this is actually Walt Disney's Walt Disney World.

I’m talking more so magic kingdom. I realize you can drink pretty freely else where.

I’m just surprised they haven’t tapped into themed distilleries and breweries. Parents love going to Disney world but honestly a drink helps with the chaos.