Club Cooloholic
Well-Known Member
One of these days we will see that better plan....I mean right?
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Bob Chapek's response to Florida's 'Don't Say Gay' bill
- Thread starter Disney Analyst
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TP2000
Well-Known Member
It seems as though you haven't actually read the bill. The curriculum in later grades covering sexual identity should be "age appropriate according to state standards". As with all good government bureaucracies, there's an entire army of bureaucrats in the Florida Department of Education who determine when and how sex and sexuality get discussed in public schools.
School curriculum developed by education board's changes and evolves, even in Florida; obviously the curriculum in 2022 is very different from 1985's curriculum, and might as well be from a different planet compared to 1964's curriculum.
This bill prohibits the discussion of sexual orientation in school curriculum until after the 3rd grade. Which begs the question; who the heck thinks it's a good idea to discuss sexual orientation with 2nd graders anyway?
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TP2000
Well-Known Member
A few thoughts now that this story has faded from the national media in today's (3/14/22) news cycle...
- Universal Studios and NBCUniversal have stayed completely out of it. I can't find a mention of Universal in any of the media stories. It's all about Disney World and Bob Chapek. The executives at Universal, plus Sea World and Legoland, are probably all breathing a sigh of relief that no one cared to ask them and Chapek took the bullet for them all.
- There's not a snowball's chance in Miami that Disney will reverse it's move of thousands of CM's, Imagineers and Studio employees from California to Florida. Newsom can send out his snotty Tweets, but Newsom refuses to lower his insanely high taxes. So Florida still wins and will still get thousands of good paying white collar jobs moving to Orlando this year and next.
- Governor DeSantis really is doubling down on this and isn't budging one bit. If anything, he's become more foreceful about it with the press over this past weekend. Interesting. Election Day is in 7 months.
- If a majority of Florida voters do disagree with this, the timing of this bill only 7 months before Election Day is fortuitous for them. A majority of Florida voters can vote for and democratically elect a majority of state legislators and a new Governor to represent them and rescind or rewrite this bill in 2023. Democracy!
Quinnmac000
Well-Known Member
Age appropriate is subject and someone can argue that the topic of sex isn't appropriate until someone is 16 whereas someone will argue 11. Again, this will be determined by who is in charge of the FDOE.It seems as though you haven't actually read the bill. The curriculum in later grades covering sexual identity should be "age appropriate according to state standards". As with all good government bureaucracies, there's an entire army of bureaucrats in the Florida Department of Education who determine when and how sex and sexuality get discussed in public schools.
School curriculum developed by education board's changes and evolves, even in Florida; obviously the curriculum in 2022 is very different from 1985's curriculum, and might as well be from a different planet compared to 1964's curriculum.
This bill prohibits the discussion of sexual orientation in school curriculum until after the 3rd grade. Which begs the question; who the heck thinks it's a good idea to discuss sexual orientation with 2nd graders anyway?
So lets say that its not sexual orientation talk isn't appropriate until the age of 15-16. Most gay people know they are gay starting at 12-14 meaning they would not be getting the education they deserve.
Secondly, earlier you stated parents should have access and teachers/admin would not tell abusive parents.
There have been hundreds of cases in which schools have failed to protect students from abusive parents and ended up with the students dead or in bad situations. Your assumption as well that the same admin care about the students more so than their political beliefs is also not healthy for society and we should have learned by now to expect the worst outcome rather than the best especially in this country.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
There are none. That’s the whole point. A parent can take any little thing as a violation and sue. They just need to convince an agreeable judge which will still involve costs for the district unless they start aggressively counter suing to recover costs which also costs money and isn’t exactly a great look.
Disney4Lyfe
Well-Known Member
Does the Florida DOE have guidelines set up? Because if they do, then this bill isn't quite as vague as people are acting.
ImperfectPixie
Well-Known Member
You don't think conservative moms will attack the curriculum now that the door has been opened for different interpretations and lawsuits? Have you watched any of the videos of the man behind the bill talking about this topic? He sounds like he's talking about a disease.
Nubs70
Well-Known Member
Judge shopping is now bad?
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
This doesn’t reference those guidelines that already exist and weren’t a problem. The law doesn’t direct the Department of Education to remove or review a problematic part of its curriculum. It doesn’t direct the Department to engage more parents in developing certain part of the curriculum. The entire standard for seeking damages is up to an individual parent, no reference to standards or consensus which is the whole point.
jasminethecat
Well-Known Member
Of course they will, just like new bills proposed in other states where teachers can be sued or fired if parents don't like the curriculum. If this passes, I guarantee the next bill in FL will allow for either firing or suing of teachers by individual parent complaints.
If I was going to distract the USA, convincing everyone that elementary schools are teaching critical race theory and indoctrinating young children with LGBTQ+ sex education (with no proof at all) is an excellent way to do it. I would just go on Fox News and OAN and repeat the same lies over and over until conservative moms get completely riled up and explode during school board meetings, causing those boards to panic and eventually cave in to crazy conspiracies just to keep their jobs. Many of the recent proposed bills have been based on single alleged complaints which are impossible to corroborate. John Oliver did a piece on this recently with critical race theory, I recommend anyone with HBO to check it out. Of course, you'd have to trust journalists to believe in his reporting, which means you probably already are prone to understanding and agreeing with me on this. I don't understand how conservatives can say they don't trust journalists yet they so blindly follow people like tucker carlson. He doesn't even pretend to have integrity when he won a defamation case because fox news argued that no reasonable person would believe him, yet his fans keep watching and repeating his words as gospel. It's called "the tucker carlson defense" and if anyone is really on the independent fence about cable news, you should read up on it. Everyone else has already picked their side.
The GOP has been very keen on keeping conservatives focused on abortion, fighting against gay rights and race wars. Those are hot topic items which cause conservatives to keep voting and donating money. It's a brilliant and evil strategy to convince people that you have a monopoly on the moral high ground and basically keep our country divided. I am sure that if I sat in person, one-on-one with anyone here, I could come to some middle ground on lots of topics, and we could civilly agree to disagree on the rest. But on forums and in in the news, we all desperately have a need to win the argument instead of working to a common ground, myself included. May God (or the flying spaghetti monster) help us all.
Disney4Lyfe
Well-Known Member
Oh...
"Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards."
Seems like it's not really what you are saying.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
If this was about state standards there would be a specific standard that would be called out for change. The governor himself could direct the Department to change the standard. There would be no need for parents filing lawsuits because they could just complain to the state who could take action against the district.
Disney4Lyfe
Well-Known Member
I am having trouble following you. The bill is pretty clear. No sexual instruction for K-3 and then it defers to state guidelines. But you say, there are no guidelines? Pls explain.
The bill allows for lawsuits. Technically true, but the lawsuits are in regards to a school not responding to a parents concern. So you can sue the school for ignoring you. Not for disagreeing with you.
"the school district must either resolve the concern or provide a statement of the reasons for not resolving the concern."
I miss the politics forum. This thread brings back fond memories. The accusations of conspiracy. Righteous indignation.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
No, the author has made the intent clear and language that would better meet such a definition (and the supposed aim) was rejected.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
People often take disagreeing as ignoring.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
No, because that is not the author’s explicit, publicly stated intent.
Disney4Lyfe
Well-Known Member
Well. Luckily for us, words matter. Especially when it comes to legislation.
ImperfectPixie
Well-Known Member
They're even more insidious than just that...they openly attack and ridicule education, smearing those who are educated as "elites" and they have a long history of being anti-intellectualism. The less educated people are, the more easily they can be manipulated. The sad and scary part is that it works.
ImperfectPixie
Well-Known Member
There are videos of the man behind this bill speaking about his intent posted in this very thread, as well as links to direct quotes of him saying that merely changing the verbiage from "sexual orientation and gender identity" to "human sexuality or sexual activity" would "gut the bill".
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