Another PR written post (with the requisite fawning comments about how wonderful it is). Verbal diarrhea without an iota of substance.
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News Big changes coming to EPCOT's Future World?
- Thread starter djkidkaz
- Start date
Squishy
Well-Known Member
The benches were what Walt Disney himself wanted for Epcot! <Insert Walt Disney quote out of context>
Creathir
Well-Known Member
Zach’s enthusiasm for materials and textures is really unsurpassed by anyone really.
His travels to extreme examples during his annual 2 month sabbatical have enabled him to really become aware of what defines a paving surface. This past spring he spent countless hours roaming the parking lot of the Mall of America and Dodger Stadium in search of the perfect balance of support, yet springiness within the asphalt to minimize the negative reinforcement of exertion.
He even ruined several pairs of shoes with the amount of gum they picked up during his travels! His dedication is truly inspiring.
Sir_Cliff
Well-Known Member
I guess, for me, the posts are what they are: PR aimed at fans designed to drum up interest in an upcoming project. The fan sites are, after all, full of extensive photo essays of the smallest developments that can be glimpsed over construction fences. Regarding the content, I also honestly don't think they're claiming that much. This one, for example, just shows some samples of the paving for the area and has text stating that, while they don't necessarily want you to notice it, a lot of consideration goes into the color, materials, and texture of the pavement.
In terms of hyping projects before they open, they've always done that, haven't they? It was just that with something like the original EPCOT Center they had to produce their own newsletter and feed information to the press. I also think they've played up the attention to detail and creative process prior to opening attractions rather than waiting several decades to see if they have been successful.
I'm sure my comments on this are just as tiring for everyone, but when I see the chorus of groans and eyerolls that greet Zach's every post I just feel like I've read just as grand if not grander claims about the far more mundane painted slurry you mention over the years. The same goes for the selection of colors for structures, etc. If Zach had of included Hench's point about making people's photos look better, I suspect the eye rolling competition would have been amped up yet further along with commentary about what's wrong with the kids these days.
Perhaps it's the messenger and the tone that provokes so much ire, or perhaps people are primed to hate everything about this project. Either way, I will be interested to know if WDI persist with Zach as the face of their social media PR. If this board is anything to go by, people seem to have an allergy to him.
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Bocabear
Well-Known Member
"We wanted warm grays in a range of hues to complement the silvers and off-whites of Spaceship Earth and many of our new World Celebration facades."
The new facades are just the original facades with years of misguided additions and horrific paint schemes... The original Hench buildings were simple, modern and timeless.
While I like the pavement sample, like so many others have pointed out, this is a stupid substance-free post...
The new facades are just the original facades with years of misguided additions and horrific paint schemes... The original Hench buildings were simple, modern and timeless.
While I like the pavement sample, like so many others have pointed out, this is a stupid substance-free post...
Communicora
Premium Member
For me, the issue is that his posts feel inauthentic. I would imagine he's an interesting person to talk to but his posts feel like they were crafted by a committee.
mightynine
Well-Known Member
For those who want to compare Hench's EPCOT pavement story vs. Zach's Epcot pavement post - there's a big difference between the two that comes across, at least to me.
Hench's story about the process has a payoff that is to the guest's benefit - what was chosen would help make guest's pictures look better. Could be true, could be BS, but ultimately what was put forward was that they wanted to make the guest's experience the best it could be.
Zach and the PR posse's post is very much about us, not you. These pavement samples compliment OUR buildings, OUR works, and whether or not there's any benefit to the guest, subminimal or otherwise, does not appear to come across. And that thread goes through pretty much all the posts he's made so far about the gift shop, Club Cool or whatever - it's a lot of "Look at what we did" and not "Here's why we did it for you".
And I still think it's funny that his posts on things like pavement and parti have more details than his one about the upcoming nighttime spectacular.
Hench's story about the process has a payoff that is to the guest's benefit - what was chosen would help make guest's pictures look better. Could be true, could be BS, but ultimately what was put forward was that they wanted to make the guest's experience the best it could be.
Zach and the PR posse's post is very much about us, not you. These pavement samples compliment OUR buildings, OUR works, and whether or not there's any benefit to the guest, subminimal or otherwise, does not appear to come across. And that thread goes through pretty much all the posts he's made so far about the gift shop, Club Cool or whatever - it's a lot of "Look at what we did" and not "Here's why we did it for you".
And I still think it's funny that his posts on things like pavement and parti have more details than his one about the upcoming nighttime spectacular.
kevlightyear
Well-Known Member
Just for kicks, here's Joe Rohde's pavement post from 2015:
trainplane3
Well-Known Member
I think the differences here are its a quick paragraph just saying "people know we had to make up a fortress that looks real but isn't. People don't know this actually isn't asphalt as they'd expect" with a single picture showing it. Quick and to the point.
Zach on the other hand is really dressing it up. He really could've posted the last two bits of his Insta post and it would've been nice. Quick, to the point, and some pictures to show what they're doing.
You all are really making me want to pull out Hench's Designing Disney book now... 
FerretAfros
Well-Known Member
I'm glad that they're finally discussing the extensive changes they've slowly but surely been making to the pavement throughout the park since the renovations began. With various parts of Future World, the main entrance, and now the World Showcase promenade near Morocco all getting new styles of pavement, it's clear they have bigger (if subtle) changes in mind for the entire park.
One of the biggest project management challenges of the park's original build was the huge amount of concrete pavement that had to be poured after construction equipment was gone, but cured before the park opened to guests. It's typically one of the last steps in construction, but due to the scale of the project it had to be done in a patchwork style as construction wrapped up in individual areas. Placing many acres of pavement is difficult in a park that's under construction, but even more challenging in one that's open daily for guests.
When the first changes to the pavement appeared at the newly-expanded walkway next to Imagination, I posted the following in the old Rosewalk thread:
So many of the changes they're making are fine in their own right, but aren't necessarily an objective improvement over what was there before. And when they're spending hundreds of millions of dollars and creating massive operational impacts to accommodate the extensive construction, it really makes you wonder about the purpose of it all. Is it worth the trouble, when ultimately so much of it is simply style without substance?
One of the biggest project management challenges of the park's original build was the huge amount of concrete pavement that had to be poured after construction equipment was gone, but cured before the park opened to guests. It's typically one of the last steps in construction, but due to the scale of the project it had to be done in a patchwork style as construction wrapped up in individual areas. Placing many acres of pavement is difficult in a park that's under construction, but even more challenging in one that's open daily for guests.
When the first changes to the pavement appeared at the newly-expanded walkway next to Imagination, I posted the following in the old Rosewalk thread:
These posts were written in mid-August 2019, a few weeks before the big D23 announcement about all of Epcot's various changes. As we've watched the various updates roll out over the last couple years, the line about replacing the old pavement "simply for the sake of change" really seems to hit home. Whether "the new designers are being as thoughtful and deliberate as the original team" remains to be seen, but it doesn't seem especially promising: at best, they're restoring elements that have been forgotten to time; at worst, they're giving us an empty shell and trying to make us believe there's something inside it.
So many of the changes they're making are fine in their own right, but aren't necessarily an objective improvement over what was there before. And when they're spending hundreds of millions of dollars and creating massive operational impacts to accommodate the extensive construction, it really makes you wonder about the purpose of it all. Is it worth the trouble, when ultimately so much of it is simply style without substance?
And we all know just the quote they'll use too. There's already an awkward shrine to Walt's (in)famous Griffith Park bench at the entrance to DL's Great Moments with Mr. Lincoln, and we all know that Walt is every bit as deeply connected to the Epcot theme park as he was to Disneyland, which is why he's going to have his new statue there. Without benches, DisneyParks™ wouldn't exist, so it's really just a return to their most pure and original form. It's "Walt Disney's Dream," don't cha know?
hpyhnt 1000
Well-Known Member
Funny, because I wouldn't say it's ignored completely. Guests, even first time visitors in my experience, notice the asphalt of Dinorama, because it's ugly and unbefitting an otherwise exquisitely designed park.
The sooner it disappears the better.
I appreciate posts about the little details. But as others have said, the inauthentic PR-speak doesn't help.
What I find most telling about this last post is that the most numerous (and highest liked) replies/comments refer to the fiber-optic sidewalk. I cannot fathom why they would not recreate something that seems so straight-forward to install and maintain. I guess maybe I answered my own question. Maybe it wasn't as easy/inexpensive to install and maintain. Otherwise, I would think installing a new version would be a huge win for everybody.
What I find most telling about this last post is that the most numerous (and highest liked) replies/comments refer to the fiber-optic sidewalk. I cannot fathom why they would not recreate something that seems so straight-forward to install and maintain. I guess maybe I answered my own question. Maybe it wasn't as easy/inexpensive to install and maintain. Otherwise, I would think installing a new version would be a huge win for everybody.
James Alucobond
Well-Known Member
I feel like you outlined why it's not "simply for the sake of change", though. This will be much easier to maintain since adjacent sections of pavement now seem much more intentionally variegated, and the color itself will be something easier to match. While there's something to be said for leaving well enough alone, if you're digging up basically the entirety of the park, you may as well make this update since the technology it was originally targeting is obsolete. Why deal with the hassle for something that no longer benefits guests in any tangible way? I do feel some nostalgia for the old color, but I think it's more 80s nostalgia than Disney nostalgia.
Is it confirmed there will be no fiber optics or dynamic lighting? I had always assumed the magenta path to the festival center in the concept art was trying to convey that since the alternative was that, well, the pavement was actually magenta, which seems kinda crazy.
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
It hasn't been since roughly 2007, IMO. Some would argue earlier.
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
Somewhat interesting if they're going to define the areas by the materials in the pathway. I know there was a mystery pink path in the concept art.
tparris
Well-Known Member
It’s so awesome seeing that building with a paint job that doesn’t look like someone barfed all over it