News 'Beyond Big Thunder Mountain' Blue Sky concept revealed for Magic Kingdom

[Brer Panther]

The Disney Vault used to be a treasure trove of content to draw from. Now, as I've said before, they seem to be only interested in around a dozen or less titles. If it's not Toy Story, Moana or Frozen it's garbage...even if it was a consistent money maker in the past or would lend itself better to a ride.

Word. I wonder if this is an Iger-mandated thing specifically or if it's the whole company believing this.

even the Disney Renaissance films taking 2 full decades to get anything resembling a major attraction (and some of those STILL don't even have one!!)

Considering how the Little Mermaid ride and Tokyo's Beauty and the Beast ride turned out, I'm not sure Iger's Disney could make a good Aladdin, Lion King, or Hercules attraction even if they tried...

The blatant borrowing of major elements from MMRR and RotR for Zootopia makes DHS seem like a poor fit due to redundancy.

Yeah, it'd be pretty redundant having three trackless screen-filled dark rides in one park.

 

[UNCgolf]

Just from watching ride videos, Zootopia looks like it may be the worst trackless ride they've built.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

The other problem with building a direct clone of SDL's Zootopia is that it only has one ride.

I think it's safe to say that MK needs more than one new ride, and spending years and so much money to clear the space necessary to build that one ride in this spot would be a huge waste of resources.

 

[Brer Panther]

Just from watching ride videos, Zootopia looks like it may be the worst trackless ride they've built.

I dunno, Remy's Ratatouille Ride seems slightly worse. The Zootopia ride isn't great but at least it has animatronics.

 

[UNCgolf]

I dunno, Remy's Ratatouille Ride seems slightly worse. The Zootopia ride isn't great but at least it has animatronics.

Yeah, Remy is the other one in the running. Those appear to be the two worst IMO.

I feel like Zootopia was supposed to be an E ticket, though, and I don't think Remy was supposed to be more than a D. That factors into it.

 

[_caleb]

1. Post a rumor here
2. People agree with rumor
2. Quote the rumor and affirming posts on your clickbait YouTube channel (be sure to mention that you saw the rumor here, and point to WDW Magic insiders’ track record)
3. Rake in that ad money
4. Post clips from your YouTube channel here as added promotion

Is this how it works?

 

[Fox&Hound]

Just from watching ride videos, Zootopia looks like it may be the worst trackless ride they've built.

I agree it is pretty lackluster. Lots of screens and not a lot of exciting movement. I was excited for it to come to AK (I know I am in the minority) but after seeing it I am glad it never came to fruition.

 

[co10064]

Yeah, Remy is the other one in the running. Those appear to be the two worst IMO.

I feel like Zootopia was supposed to be an E ticket, though, and I don't think Remy was supposed to be more than a D. That factors into it.

To me the difference is Zootopia is supposed to be a major E-ticket that can anchor a whole land on its own... IMO it fails at that. Rat on the other hand is more modest in its approach and rightfully makes its spot as a great C or good D ticket.

 

[Horizonsfan]

Unsure if borrowing is the right word, they're all just screen-heavy attractions using the same trackless ride technology. There's now 10 (I think) trackless rides of varying caliber but they've definitely leaned into the system a lot (rise x2, railway x2, rat x2, beauty & the beast, pooh, mystic manor, and now zootopia). This isn't to hate on any of them specifically but I think the formula is getting a bit old and at a minimum shifting away from heavy screen usage would benefit future attractions.

When I say borrowing, I’m referring to literal experiences within the ride, not really the vehicle usage. Though, yes the marketability of trackless vehicles as a novelty is gone.

Zootopia’s big climax, a trackless vehicle dropping down a level is literally the same as rise. Also, the opening scene is characters riding a car out to greet the audience like MMRR.

It’s pretty blatant borrrowing on those elements. I think they’d have to redesign the experience to be less of a blatant cut-copy job on those fronts.

IMO trackless rides, like omnimovers or the flume boats, are a tool to tell a story and can be re-utilized multiple times in any given park. They’re not like a raft ride or dumbo style spinner where, yes, three in one park would be a ridiculous waste of resources (looking at you Aladdin). Those experiences depend on their novelty rather than being a story tool.

 

[Brer Panther]

The problem with having multiple trackless rides in one park is that most of them fall into the same traps... slowly moving through scenes, parking in front of a screen, spinning around in a big empty room... it makes the trackless dark rides feel more similar to each other than, say, It's a Small World feels to Pirates of the Caribbean.

 

[Rich Brownn]

I take "AA heavy" with a heavy grain of salt. Relatively speaking, perhaps there will be a few more AA's than usual for Universal standards, but again I think an amount similar to POTC is a huge stretch. Every time a new Universal attraction is in the works, people oversell how many they will have. I've been around long enough to remember when Gringotts was supposed to have an impressive Voldemort AA according to some sources. Kong's AA's were also oversold during development. It also depends on your definition of "AA". People often mistakenly call mostly static figures AA's.

Unless this is old information, the Monsters ride is supposed to use the Kuka Arm ride system seen in Forbidden Journey. So presumably a fast paced ride with a lot of motion to the vehicles. Unless they change things up with that ride system for the Monsters variant, it's not a system that sounds like it would be likely to be mixed with a significant AA population. Forbidden Journey has a lot of physical sets, but there's not a whole lot of motion to those sets. Mostly just that one simplistic dragon figure and the Dementors (which don't really have motion of their own, but rely on the Kuka arms they're attached to along with fans blowing their cloaks to simulate motion). And i'd be hard pressed to call those "animatronics" since they have fewer axes of motion than some of the figures in classic Fantasyland dark rides.

The Ministry dark ride I think was described as similar to Tower of Terror where it can stop at different floors and even exit the vertical shaft to travel horizontally. Much like the elevator used in the Potter films. Again though, i'm hesitant to assume it will have a lot of AA's. It sounds like something they'd do with some physical setpieces but using projected characters. Kind of like the Gringotts preshow with Bill Weasley.

We already know what to expect from the Nintendo stuff. Mario Kart is physical sets with AR projections of the characters. Yoshi uses a handful of simple figures that don't qualify as AA's. The DK coaster blueprints have been leaked many times now and there's not going to be enough space for significant amounts of AA's (probably just one or two around load/unload at most along with mostly video projection). Maybe the HTTYD show will have a few AA's though, there was an existing stage show that went on tour that used some impressive puppets/AA's.

I take "AA heavy" with a heavy grain of salt. Relatively speaking, perhaps there will be a few more AA's than usual for Universal standards, but again I think an amount similar to POTC is a huge stretch. Every time a new Universal attraction is in the works, people oversell how many they will have. I've been around long enough to remember when Gringotts was supposed to have an impressive Voldemort AA according to some sources. Kong's AA's were also oversold during development. It also depends on your definition of "AA". People often mistakenly call mostly static figures AA's.

Unless this is old information, the Monsters ride is supposed to use the Kuka Arm ride system seen in Forbidden Journey. So presumably a fast paced ride with a lot of motion to the vehicles. Unless they change things up with that ride system for the Monsters variant, it's not a system that sounds like it would be likely to be mixed with a significant AA population. Forbidden Journey has a lot of physical sets, but there's not a whole lot of motion to those sets. Mostly just that one simplistic dragon figure and the Dementors (which don't really have motion of their own, but rely on the Kuka arms they're attached to along with fans blowing their cloaks to simulate motion). And i'd be hard pressed to call those "animatronics" since they have fewer axes of motion than some of the figures in classic Fantasyland dark rides.

The Ministry dark ride I think was described as similar to Tower of Terror where it can stop at different floors and even exit the vertical shaft to travel horizontally. Much like the elevator used in the Potter films. Again though, i'm hesitant to assume it will have a lot of AA's. It sounds like something they'd do with some physical setpieces but using projected characters. Kind of like the Gringotts preshow with Bill Weasley.

We already know what to expect from the Nintendo stuff. Mario Kart is physical sets with AR projections of the characters. Yoshi uses a handful of simple figures that don't qualify as AA's. The DK coaster blueprints have been leaked many times now and there's not going to be enough space for significant amounts of AA's (probably just one or two around load/unload at most along with mostly video projection). Maybe the HTTYD show will have a few AA's though, there was an existing stage show that went on tour that used some impressive puppets/AA's.

1) The FJ ride vehicles can speed up or slow down. And you MoM is outdates - it now uses a larger variation of SCOOP but with the elevators

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

So in Q`1 2024, we are looking at a potential Boardroom earthquake. It's impossible to know yet just how strong this shakeup will be. There is a plausible "chance" that we could see a gigantic shake-up that could radically change the course of the company's current direction and goals. (I do hope this happens)

I really think people need to stop hoping for this. Any “boardroom shakeup” is almost certainly going to be about maximizing short term revenue and stock price value, and not about investing in the parks with an eye towards future decades. If this shakeup happens I’m going to go out on a limb here and predict we get nothing new, nothing, for at least 10 years.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

Just from watching ride videos, Zootopia looks like it may be the worst trackless ride they've built.

It also killed a kid in it’s first few months of operations, so there’s that. A pair of mickey ears on the tracks shuts down MMRR for 45 minutes, but a young kid jumps out of zootopia and the ride doesn’t even throw up enough of a fault to prevent the kid from being run over? That’s a hell of a fail Disney.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Like I said, I’m ok with us getting Zootopia…someplace. Just not here, I was one of the few people who didn’t mind it going in AK though I do understand why that not be the best idea.

I like Zootopia better as an MK expansion than a DAK expansion. That being said, it's a really odd property that doesn't have a natural fit in WDW.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Just from watching ride videos, Zootopia looks like it may be the worst trackless ride they've built.

Luigi has entered the chat.

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

It also killed a kid in it’s first few months of operations, so there’s that. A pair of mickey ears on the tracks shuts down MMRR for 45 minutes, but a young kid jumps out of zootopia and the ride doesn’t even throw up enough of a fault to prevent the kid from being run over? That’s a hell of a fail Disney.

Where are you seeing that the kid died? All I can find is articles saying there was an injury. With no further comment on the severity of the injury. They also reopened the ride the next day, with the statement "all guests are required to comply with the resort's operational guidelines". I think there would have been more time had it been a death, and definitely an acknowledgement of the accident.

 

[Cliff]

I really think people need to stop hoping for this. Any “boardroom shakeup” is almost certainly going to be about maximizing short term revenue and stock price value, and not about investing in the parks with an eye towards future decades. If this shakeup happens I’m going to go out on a limb here and predict we get nothing new, nothing, for at least 10 years.

I suspect that "if" a massive Boardroom bloodbath happens, the new Board will want Disney to make Marvel, Pixar and Lucasfilm products that people WANT to see and spend money on. I think they will make Disney create attractions that impress people and make them WANT spend money going to the parks.

Disney is an entertainment company and the more they entertain people...the more profit they make. The more their products and attractions "attract" people...the more profit they make.

Current Disney is a creatively bankrupt right now. Imagineering is dead and they havent built anything very interesting whatsoever in the past 8-ish years. Don't say that Cosmic Rewind is a great Imagineering masterpeice...that's a Vekoma masterpeace. 90% of what makes that ride so much fun was all Vekoma's work.

I dunno...Disney needs a massive shakeup and complete reboot and I hope somebody pulls the plug and resets the power button soon.

 

[Disgruntled Walt]

1. Post a rumor here
2. People agree with rumor
2. Quote the rumor and affirming posts on your clickbait YouTube channel (be sure to mention that you saw the rumor here, and point to WDW Magic insiders’ track record)
3. Rake in that ad money
4. Post clips from your YouTube channel here as added promotion

Is this how it works?

Only #1 applies to me, right? I don't make videos.

 

[britain]

I suspect that if there is a corporate bloodbath, it would make substantial changes to the organization overall (“Sell ESPN, sell ABC, merge with this company, not that company. Buy those assets, sell those assets. Spin off those divisions.”) But it would make very little difference regarding the nuanced creative decisions that we worry about (“Why is there no fountain at the center of Epcot now? Does Indy violate AK’s theme? Should Galaxy’s Edge be timeless or sequel specific? Does Zootopia fit behind Big Thunder?”)

Stock price driven suits don’t care, no matter if they are waging war with other stock price driven suits.

We just happened to be “lucky” that DCA’s aesthetic failures were so bad and so publicly tied to Eisner that Iger was able to play the White Knight Who Cares About Good Imagineering by approving its big redo.

There is no obvious black eye today that is equivalent to DCA. As far as the financials go, the parks are doing “everything right.”

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

I suspect that if there is a corporate bloodbath, it would make substantial changes to the organization overall (“Sell ESPN, sell ABC, merge with this company, not that company. Buy those assets, sell those assets. Spin off those divisions.”) But it would make very little difference regarding the nuanced creative decisions that we worry about (“Why is there no fountain at the center of Epcot now? Does Indy violate AK’s theme? Should Galaxy’s Edge be timeless or sequel specific? Does Zootopia fit behind Big Thunder?”)

Stock price driven suits don’t care, no matter if they are waging war with other stock price driven suits.

We just happened to be “lucky” that DCA’s aesthetic failures were so bad and so publicly tied to Eisner that Iger was able to play the White Knight Who Cares About Good Imagineering by approving its big redo.

There is no obvious black eye today that is equivalent to DCA. As far as the financials go, the parks are doing “everything right.”

I agree with your assessment, and think it's almost scarier that they're in the kind of place they are now with the parks.

It feels to me very similar to the situation the Studio now finds itself in - they were chugging along turning out projects that often merely chipped away at the artistic integrity of the brand, but no one inside paid real attention because the movies were making tons of money . . . until they weren't. It can be harder to solve a death by a thousand cuts situation than a single major laceration. At least then you know where to put your energy. The Studios clearly don't see clearly what their issue is.

I would argue that a post-2012 DCA has itself proved that the parks are trending down a similar path. Within half a decade the park's vision had basically reverted to what it was before its big redo. Only now its making money, as you say, so they're even less concerned. DHS and EPCOT have since seen similar investments, and yet their park experiences are only marginally better for the guests despite being noticeably better for the bottom line. What happens if or when that stops? Do they have the internal wisdom necessary to correct course?

Now, the parks have a lot more institutional clout than the Studios do - even if you didn't like the new attractions, many of the classics are still there to to make a park day worth it, unlike movies which each have to stand on their own legs. In theory, the parks can always just be expanded to improve the value proposition. But if the tide ever turns the way it has with the movies that's actually a much bigger issue, since the parks prop up so much of The Walt Disney Company, and Disney is still showing that they don't quite have their finger on the pulse of what their customer considers issues.

The fact that the park's black eyes are less obvious than DCA 1.0 may simply make them harder to address if that pot starts to boil over.