Avengers Campus - Reactions / Reviews

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
The problem is Disney should give you a pickup time and your food should be bagged up and ready at that time.

The silly "come here at this time and then tell us you're here and we'll start to make it" system is dumb.

Can you imagine if a restaraunt did this? Makes no sense. Let me show up when its ready, why waste the customer's time?
It is how most other fast food and quick service restaurants deal with online orders. People would be more annoyed by cold food than a short wait. Disney though is not incentivized to have short waits and has been spending years making people wait as much as possible.
 

Absimilliard

Well-Known Member
And now for the land, I'm going to start with a quote from my friend: "Star Wars Land looks way better."

I should note that my friend does not care for Star Wars (I don't think she's seen most of the movies) but is a big fan of the MCU, and that was her main takeaway. And I agree with her - Avengers Campus absolutely suffers in comparison to Galaxy's Edge. Say what you will about the choice to place the land on a new planet rather than a known location like Tatooine or Naboo, but at least they establish a sense of place for the land, and the level of detail put into everything honestly places the land into the grand tradition of great Disney lands. Avengers Campus....does not have that. It is more in the grand tradition of Pixar Pier, with buildings just slapped together without rhyme or reason. It really did remind me of the terrible "neighborhoods" concept Pixar Pier uses, in that this is the Spider-Man area, this is the Ant-Man area, this is for the Guardians, etc. There's a huge lack of cohesion in everything going on here that is to the detriment of the land.

I should add on top here that the setting and buildings are boring to look at. Again, to compare this to Galaxy's Edge, there is no wow moment like rounding the corner and seeing the Falcon, and there's not even a lived-in moment like walking down the bazaar or the transition to the outskirts of the town where the Resistance is. Avengers Campus is just a bunch of square buildings with little to differentiate them beyond some signage. It's night and day stuff, and creates a land that my group was very excited to leave.

I mentioned it in the Spider-Man ride review, but the characters are the clear best part of this land, and the sheer volume of characters available to interact with is the biggest selling point here. Like I've mentioned before, some of the costumes were really good, the Iron Man one was bad enough that I wondered why they even bothered to go with a setting where he's still theoretically alive, and everyone did a good job embodying their characters. My one detracting point is that the shows just grind the land to a halt, and they clearly have not figured out a way to run those shows yet while also moving people through the land in a good way.

Pyms.....Pym's was the biggest disappointment for us as a group. I mentioned earlier that mobile order is a train wreck in its current form, but the food and drinks left a lot to be desired as well. We got all three of the cocktails to try, with the X-Periment being fine if not extremely sweet with no kick despite saying it has habanero syrup, the Particle Fizz being an absolutely-terrible attempt at a hard seltzer, and the Honey Buzz being the clear best option and one I would actually consider ordering in the future. The food was ok as well; I had the PB3 which was the best of the group though messy enough that I'd hesitate ordering it again, one of our group had the Pym-ini which he described as a "poor attempt at a muffaleta" and with a single serving that was half of what I got with my sandwich. Another of the group got the Atomic Fusion Pretzel, of which the buffalo sauce was the clear best part of a disappointing dish.

Here's my overall takeaway: this land is disappointing in a bunch of various ways that are much harder to fix than what we got from Galaxy's Edge. At least with that land, there were solid bones that just needed a few additions (the opening of RotR, a larger restaurant/cantina, entertainment) to really shine as an exceptional land, but having a generally-strong underbelly to work with. Avengers Campus....doesn't really have that. It's a bland land that is carried by the sheer volume of characters, which means that when Disney eventually decides to cut the entertainment budget here, you're just left with a boring, bland land with not much going for it. This isn't even a situation where a rumored Avengers E-ticket would fix things, but merely act as a band-aid. For as much money as Marvel brings into the company, for them to trot out an offering that is barely at the same level of what Universal made over 20 years ago is embarrassing for all parties.

After seeing the Pym-Ini sandwich and its price point, I set out out to recreate it at home in Canada and see what it would taste like. Reading your review make the problem obvious: Disney went cheap, cheap on the ingredients!

I got restaurant grade foccatia bread, 2x of which ended up the same size as the family sized Pym-Ini. Then, I got packaged Saputo provolone cheese and hit a local supermarket for genoa salami, rosemary ham and figured a nice tomato pesto would be appropriate. Found some pasta sauce and then assembled it, pressed it in my bread press and...

It was AMAZING. The texture, flavor mix and light bread all meshed together for an awesome sandwich. Now I read your review and its the complete opposite of mine.
 

CaptinEO

Well-Known Member
I can see why they do it that way. So it's a bit fresher for you. If they made it for you. Sat it there. Then it gets cold or go to waste bc someone wants to have it remade. Things happen all the time that might make you miss the right time.
Makes me think of my local starbucks. There are times someone's frapp is completely melted by the time they get there then they have to remake it bc they were late picking it up.
It doesn't make sense to me.

They'd rather inconvenience every person who orders to avoid a situation where a few people may be late?

This means now everyone is inconvenienced instead of only late arrivals being inconvenienced.

As it stands now some people have to wait 30-40 minutes after having a pickup time and then clicking "I'm Here". It's going to anger more people than a system that just gives you a pickup time and tells you when its ready.
 

el_super

Well-Known Member
I am just wondering as I lam let down by your assessment. Your thoughts don't make me want to go to Anaheim just to see this land as I initially wanted to.

As someone who thinks most of the bad reviews here are a little excessive, please do not come to Anaheim JUST to see this new ride/land. There's a lot more to do at Disneyland.
 

el_super

Well-Known Member
This means now everyone is inconvenienced instead of only late arrivals being inconvenienced.

If the entire kitchen has to stop to remake an order, everyone (mobile order or not) is inconvenienced. If it happens enough times, people would just end up waiting an extra 30 to 40 minutes and no one would really know why....
 

dovetail65

Well-Known Member
As someone who thinks most of the bad reviews here are a little excessive, please do not come to Anaheim JUST to see this new ride/land. There's a lot more to do at Disneyland.
Well I have been to Disneyland many many times, one of my kids lives about 30 minutes from the Park(well if there was no traffic). I am actually off to the airport(ORD) today to send him back home to CA. He is taking his little sister and her girlfriend with him to visit Ca for their first time. I go to WDW far more and prefer it over Disneyland, if WDW had this land in FL I most likely wouldn't make a special trip to Ca to see it. I can always visit my son and use it as an excuse to go to Disneyland though!

Your point is taken, there are some with very harsh thoughts on Disney, Disneyland and WDW on this forum that many times I don't understand. I probably shouldn't base my trips on their comments, I need see for myself.
 

mickEblu

Well-Known Member
It is how most other fast food and quick service restaurants deal with online orders. People would be more annoyed by cold food than a short wait. Disney though is not incentivized to have short waits and has been spending years making people wait as much as possible.

Short wait being the key phrase. Not 45 minutes from the time you click “I’m here.” Still I can’t imagine these are still issues when the parks are staffed appropriately.
 

DavidDL

Well-Known Member
... They'd rather inconvenience every person who orders to avoid a situation where a few people may be late? ...

Exactly. If I place an order for something at a place like Chipotle for 3:00pm, I expect to walk in the door and have it be waiting for me right around 3:00pm. If I place the order for 3:00pm and show up at 4:00pm, then frankly it's my own fault if the food is cold. This is also ignoring how dumb it is for Disney to expect Guests to know exactly what they're going to be in the mood for hours and hours in advance. I don't walk into the park at 9:00am and say "Hey, you know what's going to sound good today at exactly 4:40pm? A Dole Whip!"
 

Rich Brownn

Well-Known Member
The directors of the film and other sources have confirmed that yes, they did. Different branched timelines were created from each point that was changed due to a time heist. Putting the stones back protects the future of that new timeline but creates a new one, regardless.

View attachment 565014

Although the answer to how Cap returned to the main timeline is simply by using his last batch of Pym Particles.

Here is an additional bit of reading that goes into more detail and helped me understand a bit more about Endgame: https://www.thisisbarry.com/film/avengers-endgame-timeline-explained-no-plot-holes/#teams

I understand where your sentiment is coming from, because during the conversation between Hulk and the Ancient One, the visuals seem to indicate that a new timeline would be erased entirely if a stone were returned. But if this were the case, how would returning, say, the power stone to the 2014 timeline in any way return Thanos and his forces (which traveled to 2023 and died) to life in that timeline? It wouldn’t. Perhaps that’s where the TVA comes in.
The film itself makes a point that returning the stones will not create alternate timelines. Otherwise, despite your map, that discussion was completely poiintless. And the whole Pym particles thing seems much more convuluted that saying Cap just stayed out of sight (At least one of the producers agrees with me) In the end, I guess believe what you want. Me, I choose to believe Cap just stayed in the past as it makes more sense accounting for the number of convuluted ways Peggy made sure her husband was never named, mentioned or even photographed (kinda weird, don't ya think?)
 

DavidDL

Well-Known Member
The film itself makes a point that returning the stones will not create alternate timelines. Otherwise, despite your map, that discussion was completely poiintless. And the whole Pym particles thing seems much more convuluted that saying Cap just stayed out of sight (At least one of the producers agrees with me) In the end, I guess believe what you want. Me, I choose to believe Cap just stayed in the past as it makes more sense accounting for the number of convuluted ways Peggy made sure her husband was never named, mentioned or even photographed (kinda weird, don't ya think?)

Allow me to read you the dialogue between the Ancient One and Bruce:

"Remove one of the stones, and that flow splits. Now this may benefit your reality but my new one, not so much. This new branch reality, without our chief weapon against the forces of darkness, our world would be overrun. Millions will suffer. So tell me doctor, can your science prevent all that?"

"No. But we can erase it. Because once we're done with the stones, we can return each one to it's own timeline at the moment it was taken, so, chronologically, in that reality, it never left."

I think this exchange makes it quite clear that a new timeline is being created at each removal and the stones were returned to those respective, newly created timelines to protect them from being overrun or thrown out of balance as Banner isn't talking about erasing the new timeline, he's talking about erasing the darkness that would overrun it. In terms of things being kinda weird, don't you think simply putting something like the Power Stone back in the 2014 timeline being all they need to do to not create an alternate one is kinda weird? I mean, Thanos and his forces physically leave that timeline and come to the main one. They're dead in that reality. Gone. Returning the stone isn't going to bring them back. Or another timeline where part of HYDRA thinks Steve is on their side. Returning a stone wouldn't undo that. Only the TVA pruning those timelines, would.

Again, I understand why someone seeing the visuals might think no new timelines are created (it was very poorly visualized) but between the spoken dialogue and directors intentions, plus all the new timeline storylines and upcoming films, I think it's pretty clear the alt timelines are a thing. Or they try to be.

-and regarding Cap and Peggy, I guess I could see the argument made for that and it making some sense. However, didn't Peggy get her own, canonical show? If Cap went back to spend time and keep his date with the Sacred Timeline Peggy, one could be forgiven questioning why he wasn't present in that show. It makes more sense for him to be with her in an alternate reality so the events we know with Sacred Timeline Peggy remain consistent.

But I do agree that, in the end, I guess believe whatever you want.
 
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el_super

Well-Known Member
Your point is taken, there are some with very harsh thoughts on Disney, Disneyland and WDW on this forum that many times I don't understand. I probably shouldn't base my trips on their comments, I need see for myself.

Oh yeah .... don't let it discourage you from making a trip, just do so knowing that there is a lot to see and do at Disneyland, without making it completely dependent on seeing the Spider-Man ride.
 

DavidDL

Well-Known Member
@dovetail65; Especially since Rise of the Resistance and Spider-Man are not guaranteed experiences with the lottery system. Do what you can to best prepare to try and get them but try to operate with the mindset that not getting in at all is a distinct possibility. Basically, make sure you think there's enough for you to enjoy in the parks otherwise, just in case those two don't happen. Do that and you'll get your moneys worth out of your trip.
 

Rich Brownn

Well-Known Member
Allow me to read you the dialogue between the Ancient One and Bruce:

"Remove one of the stones, and that flow splits. Now this may benefit your reality but my new one, not so much. This new branch reality, without our chief weapon against the forces of darkness, our world would be overrun. Millions will suffer. So tell me doctor, can your science prevent all that?"

"No. But we can erase it. Because once we're done with the stones, we can return each one to it's own timeline at the moment it was taken, so, chronologically, in that reality, it never left."

I think this exchange makes it quite clear that a new timeline is being created at each removal and the stones were returned to those respective, newly created timelines to protect them from being overrun or thrown out of balance as Banner isn't talking about erasing the new timeline, he's talking about erasing the darkness that would overrun it. In terms of things being kinda weird, don't you think simply putting something like the Power Stone back in the 2014 timeline being all they need to do to not create an alternate one is kinda weird? I mean, Thanos and his forces physically leave that timeline and come to the main one. They're dead in that reality. Gone. Returning the stone isn't going to bring them back. Or another timeline where part of HYDRA thinks Steve is on their side. Returning a stone wouldn't undo that. Only the TVA pruning those timelines, would.

Again, I understand why someone seeing the visuals might think no new timelines are created (it was very poorly visualized) but between the spoken dialogue and directors intentions, plus all the new timeline storylines and upcoming films, I think it's pretty clear the alt timelines are a thing. Or they try to be.

-and regarding Cap and Peggy, I guess I could see the argument made for that and it making some sense. However, didn't Peggy get her own, canonical show? If Cap went back to spend time and keep his date with the Sacred Timeline Peggy, one could be forgiven questioning why he wasn't present in that show. It makes more sense for him to be with her in an alternate reality so the events we know with Sacred Timeline Peggy remain consistent.

But I do agree that, in the end, I guess believe whatever you want.
Loki certainly muddled the line as 1) No alternate tiimelines exist until (spoiler) they are created by Female Loki. and 2) If Cap created a new timeline, the TVA would have stepped in, removed him, and reset the timeline. Unless Loki isn't correct. Or something.
 

DavidDL

Well-Known Member
Loki certainly muddled the line as 1) No alternate tiimelines exist until (spoiler) they are created by Female Loki. and 2) If Cap created a new timeline, the TVA would have stepped in, removed him, and reset the timeline. Unless Loki isn't correct. Or something.

Which goes alllll the way back to my original complaints and questions about Loki as a series. Granted, there are still 4 episodes left to help explain things but in general, what I've seen so far totally muddies up or calls into question the standing of how these universes and timelines worked back when all we had was Endgame. Like, does the TVA allow certain timelines to exist as long as they don't threaten the Sacred one or crash into/cause a war with another? Someone told me if I watch the bit explaining the Sacred timeline that I can apparently see smaller, multiple ones running parallel to it but I haven't looked into that, yet. There is also that bit about how what the Avengers did was "supposed to happen" so maybe they're granted some leniency in certain respects. Maybe Cap was allowed to have his own timeline that didn't interfere with the Sacred one because they needed him to be able to deliver the shield to Falcon towards the end of Endgame. Who knows.

"Or something" is definitely a fair statement to make given what we have so far. I generally don't care for time travel as a story telling device because so few movies/games/etc. handle it in a way that doesn't immediately call into question a bunch of other things. I guess we'll just have to see where they end up as Loki plays out.
 

chadwpalm

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
-and regarding Cap and Peggy, I guess I could see the argument made for that and it making some sense. However, didn't Peggy get her own, canonical show? If Cap went back to spend time and keep his date with the Sacred Timeline Peggy, one could be forgiven questioning why he wasn't present in that show. It makes more sense for him to be with her in an alternate reality so the events we know with Sacred Timeline Peggy remain consistent.

Agent Carter (the show) took place in 1946, about a year after Steve Rogers' "death". In Endgame (according to the movie writers), Rogers went back to be with Peggy around 1948 just after the show was canceled. So the show conveniently takes place between the two events preventing the need to explain why he wasn't in it.

The results of Steve's action to go back and be with Peggy differ depending on who you ask. The writers state that Steve was still in the main timeline when he went back. (https://www.cinemablend.com/news/24...in-america-was-at-the-end-of-avengers-endgame). If this was the case, perhaps the Timekeepers chose to simply integrate Steve into the Sacred Timeline because they felt that it wouldn't generate too significant of an impact if he simply laid low. If I'm not mistaken, Peggy was involved in the formation of S.H.I.E.L.D. and was in the scene at the beginning of Ant-Man that took place in 1989. She still may have done all those things despite Steve being there since he would want to make an effort not to drastically change the timeline.

However, the directors of the movie state that his going back to be with Peggy created a new timeline branch that doesn't affect the main (Sacred) timeline (https://www.cinemablend.com/news/24...-captain-americas-avengers-endgame-conclusion). If this is the case, how did he give the shield to Sam in the main timeline? It is suggested that perhaps after Peggy's death in 2011 he jumped back to the future in the main timeline to do it. This doesn't make sense to me since if he was in an alternate timeline and jumped forward he would still be in the same alternate timeline. Perhaps the TVA intervened. We simply don't know.

Neither of these explanations is canon since it was never explained on screen. Perhaps Loki (the show) will explain it or we will just have to continue guessing.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Agent Carter (the show) took place in 1946, about a year after Steve Rogers' "death". In Endgame (according to the movie writers), Rogers went back to be with Peggy around 1948 just after the show was canceled. So the show conveniently takes place between the two events preventing the need to explain why he wasn't in it.

The results of Steve's action to go back and be with Peggy differ depending on who you ask. The writers state that Steve was still in the main timeline when he went back. (https://www.cinemablend.com/news/24...in-america-was-at-the-end-of-avengers-endgame). If this was the case, perhaps the Timekeepers chose to simply integrate Steve into the Sacred Timeline because they felt that it wouldn't generate too significant of an impact if he simply laid low. If I'm not mistaken, Peggy was involved in the formation of S.H.I.E.L.D. and was in the scene at the beginning of Ant-Man that took place in 1989. She still may have done all those things despite Steve being there since he would want to make an effort not to drastically change the timeline.

However, the directors of the movie state that his going back to be with Peggy created a new timeline branch that doesn't affect the main (Sacred) timeline (https://www.cinemablend.com/news/24...-captain-americas-avengers-endgame-conclusion). If this is the case, how did he give the shield to Sam in the main timeline? It is suggested that perhaps after Peggy's death in 2011 he jumped back to the future in the main timeline to do it. This doesn't make sense to me since if he was in an alternate timeline and jumped forward he would still be in the same alternate timeline. Perhaps the TVA intervened. We simply don't know.

Neither of these explanations is canon since it was never explained on screen. Perhaps Loki (the show) will explain it or we will just have to continue guessing.
How does Biff Tannen from 2015 get back to 2015 to return the Delorean after he has given himself the sports almanac that creates the alternate 1985 that Marty returns to?
 
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Mac Tonight

Well-Known Member
Ah yes... MCU continuity... we all know that time-travel never has any negative consequences...

200.gif
 

DavidDL

Well-Known Member
Agent Carter (the show) took place in 1946, about a year after Steve Rogers' "death". In Endgame (according to the movie writers), Rogers went back to be with Peggy around 1948 just after the show was canceled. So the show conveniently takes place between the two events preventing the need to explain why he wasn't in it.

The results of Steve's action to go back and be with Peggy differ depending on who you ask. The writers state that Steve was still in the main timeline when he went back. (https://www.cinemablend.com/news/24...in-america-was-at-the-end-of-avengers-endgame). If this was the case, perhaps the Timekeepers chose to simply integrate Steve into the Sacred Timeline because they felt that it wouldn't generate too significant of an impact if he simply laid low. If I'm not mistaken, Peggy was involved in the formation of S.H.I.E.L.D. and was in the scene at the beginning of Ant-Man that took place in 1989. She still may have done all those things despite Steve being there since he would want to make an effort not to drastically change the timeline.

However, the directors of the movie state that his going back to be with Peggy created a new timeline branch that doesn't affect the main (Sacred) timeline (https://www.cinemablend.com/news/24...-captain-americas-avengers-endgame-conclusion). If this is the case, how did he give the shield to Sam in the main timeline? It is suggested that perhaps after Peggy's death in 2011 he jumped back to the future in the main timeline to do it. This doesn't make sense to me since if he was in an alternate timeline and jumped forward he would still be in the same alternate timeline. Perhaps the TVA intervened. We simply don't know.

Neither of these explanations is canon since it was never explained on screen. Perhaps Loki (the show) will explain it or we will just have to continue guessing.

I agree that just about anything can change at this point, haha. In terms of what timeline Cap ended up in, I can understand the case for both variations, given what you and others have posted and both options present their own issues to be explained. However, I tend to lean towards the alternate timeline version of things because how he returns can be explained by simply saying he had enough Pym Particles left for one last jump back to deliver the shield. Additionally, the alternate timeline explains why the shield was repaired when it was given to Sam because as we know, it was destroyed in the battle with Thanos. So the given shield may be an undamaged one from the alt timeline.

But like @Rich Brownn mentioned, it is awfully convenient than Peggy's husband is left unnamed and never shown. Between that and the writer's beliefs, there's an argument to be made for that option, too (especially if the TVA is out pruning timelines).

I guess we'll see once things "settle down" a bit. If that ever happens. It would be nice if MARVEL put out a visual guide book like Star Wars does to help explain things once the multiverse of madness truly kicks into high gear.
 

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