AVATAR land coming to Disney's Animal Kingdom

[Mike S]

Regardless of theme, DHS needs those types of attractions. It's also getting two E-Tickets in Star Wars Land. It still needs more but the MK is seen as a fleshed out park because it has rides like Dumbo, the Teacups, etc. DCA is seen as fleshed out and has the Bugs Land rides, Paradise Pier rides .... it's no different.

Maybe if they announced a purpose built Mickey ride (not in the GMR building) or the Monsters Inc. coaster, the flat rides would have gone over better but they're something the park lacked.

Maybe if space was better utilized by not having a flat ride and smallish coaster take up 10 acres. I still say a land of C and D dark rides would've been the better option.

LM is a perfect example of what I'm talking about. It's a very solid D ticket. A lot of people say they are OK with C and D tickets but then call this ride a failure and somehow because it actually has a nice queue it's a bigger failure. So if a Lion King or Jungle Book dark ride on par with LM was built in AK to add capacity I'm pretty sure we'd get the same reaction as LM and if the rides added were C ticket flat rides people would really revolt.

LM gets flak because of the various areas of broken immersion in the ride. Even Disney has tried quite a few times to fix it. Frostrom is a better D Ticket but still has problems of its own regarding location and going the retheme route rather than new. NRJ will likely top both easily.

Martin, this was probably discussed somewhere before, but did Cameron ever approach UNI or UNI approach Cameron about the Avatar property?

I don't believe Uni approached him but of course I could be wrong.

I read on OU that he went to Uni first but when they said no to a full land he went to Disney. Their idea was a Banshee sim to replace Terminator apparently.

My answer to that would be stick with MK then. At some point in the past WDW had 4 unique parks with different experiences. If ride count is what matters MK is the go to park or better yet just visit DL. I hate that every park is moving towards a MK clone but I guess the public gets what it wants.

Disney's also looking to pull people from MK to the other parks. As long as whatever rides are added to AK don't break theme or come at the cost of the animals I don't see the big deal.

I think one of the problems is a top quality zoo like The Columbus Zoo costs $20/day. If you are going to call it a theme park and Nahtazu! and then charge $100/day. People are expecting a lot more than zoo experiences.

Disney Magic doesn't count?

 

[Kman101]

I guess the land usage for Toy Story doesn't bother me as much because I know they have other areas they can expand, or rides and shows they can replace, etc. I agree it's probably not a good use of the acreage but they consider TSMM the e-ticket and the other two rides give the land three rides. They could have used another flat ride as well. I don't disagree with wanting other rides but that probably wasn't going to happen. A more fleshed out Pixar Place would have been the best choice but Toy Story is what we got and they need the rides like that to be a fleshed out park. They still need more to do, I'm not arguing against that.

Anyway .... back to Pandora LOL

 

[flyerjab]

LM is a perfect example of what I'm talking about. It's a very solid D ticket. A lot of people say they are OK with C and D tickets but then call this ride a failure and somehow because it actually has a nice queue it's a bigger failure. So if a Lion King or Jungle Book dark ride on par with LM was built in AK to add capacity I'm pretty sure we'd get the same reaction as LM and if the rides added were C ticket flat rides people would really revolt.

Agreed. Although, if Disney built an expansion somewhere that did have 5 world class E tickets that were properly maintained, I doubt we would complain about that either.

What is funny for me is that I like a tiered stratification of rides. I actually like having an E adjacent to a D with a B or C in the same space. I think that it really helps round out the experience.

Also, and this may sound weird (or irritate some), but being a fan of NFL, I like the way that area is set up. Instead of an E, it had 2 Ds with LM and 7DMT. Also it has an exceptionally themed dining location that I love, as well as the village area. I have talked before about how I am a new Disney fan (2009 and after). There is a lot I did not grow up with compared to many others on the boards. I sometimes think that allows me to appreciate the newer approaches (for better or worse) that they take a bit easier. I love the highly themed restaurant and hope this con

I bet Iger wished Lucas would have given him a heads up that he was thinking about selling LucasFilms. There probably would never have been AvatarLand if that happened. Just a few months apart.

Well, considering I like what they are doing with both, I am glad it turned out the way that it did.

With all of these new expansions happening, I wonder if they are mindful with how much is being spent where as this can obviously show which land or IP is deemed the most important. I have always held to the belief that no matter what was done, that Star Wars would get the top level treatment. Pandora might knock your socks off visually, but there is probably a reason why we are getting 1 E and 1 C/D. Star Wars appears to be getting the 2 big rides, both possibly in the E category, as well as the largest area. Toy Story might have 3 rides total, but the theming appears to be lacking, and of course one of the rides is a B ticket.

 

[HauntedMansionFLA]

Agreed. Although, if Disney built an expansion somewhere that did have 5 world class E tickets that were properly maintained, I doubt we would complain about that either.

What is funny for me is that I like a tiered stratification of rides. I actually like having an E adjacent to a D with a B or C in the same space. I think that it really helps round out the experience.

Also, and this may sound weird (or irritate some), but being a fan of NFL, I like the way that area is set up. Instead of an E, it had 2 Ds with LM and 7DMT. Also it has an exceptionally themed dining location that I love, as well as the village area. I have talked before about how I am a new Disney fan (2009 and after). There is a lot I did not grow up with compared to many others on the boards. I sometimes think that allows me to appreciate the newer approaches (for better or worse) that they take a bit easier. I love the highly themed restaurant and hope this con


Well, considering I like what they are doing with both, I am glad it turned out the way that it did.

With all of these new expansions happening, I wonder if they are mindful with how much is being spent where as this can obviously show which land or IP is deemed the most important. I have always held to the belief that no matter what was done, that Star Wars would get the top level treatment. Pandora might knock your socks off visually, but there is probably a reason why we are getting 1 E and 1 C/D. Star Wars appears to be getting the 2 big rides, both possibly in the E category, as well as the largest area. Toy Story might have 3 rides total, but the theming appears to be lacking, and of course one of the rides is a B ticket.

A blessing in disguise

 

[GoofGoof]

I bet Iger wished Lucas would have given him a heads up that he was thinking about selling LucasFilms. There probably would never have been AvatarLand if that happened. Just a few months apart.

Luckily for us he didn't. I'd much rather have Avatar Land and SW Land then SW Land and more stock buy backs

 

[GoofGoof]

Disney's also looking to pull people from MK to the other parks. As long as whatever rides are added to AK don't break theme or come at the cost of the animals I don't see the big deal.

Sure, I'm all for additional properly themed rides at AK (including Pandora). The post I replied to essentially said tourists aren't interested in the animals. They just want more ride count. If that sentiment grows louder it would be real easy to replace the safari with several e-ticket coasters including one of those bike things that everyone is so eager to see built. It would be a real shame to see that happen IMHO.

I think one of the problems is a top quality zoo like The Columbus Zoo costs $20/day. If you are going to call it a theme park and Nahtazu! and then charge $100/day. People are expecting a lot more than zoo experiences.

Agreed and IMHO they get a whole lot more. I'm not sure $100 worth, but multi-day tickets take care of that.

 

[Kman101]

Last time I checked I couldn't ride Everest or go on an African safari or see a production of Finding Nemo or Lion King at my local zoo

 

[JustInTime]

It's also Disneys problem if people choose not to visit or to curtail their stay. Adding another ten minutes of ride time is just the tip. I guess there needs to be enough for every type of guest. In a way like other parks. Kiddie spinners and rollercoasters to use a comparison.

It is baffling to me. Why more of the same? What is the point of spending the money to visit animal kingdom if the experiences are the same as the other parks? The whole point of wanting to visit each park is to get something different. If you do everything in AK, including the 3 shows (which are the best on property), walking trails, plus ride every ride and eat 2 meals, that's almost a whole day. Add Pandora and ROL and I won't have time to ride the train or visit Rafiki's anymore. I absolutely welcome new attractions but I don't know if the park will be in desperate need come the end of the year. I wouldn't mind Rafki's (or rather the train leaving and have an attraction built in its space leaving planet watch) going away for a couple of real attractions, however.

 

[the-reason14]

I concur. We were in DAK yesterday from 10 AM to 4:30 PM. It was fantastic, and we only went on 1 ride, quite possibly the best E ticket on property - Kilamanjaro Safaris. We went to The Nomad Lounge and had food and drinks from the lounge menu, and then walked the trails. The park is more beautiful than any other park in Orlando. I even put it above DA in UNI. It truly isn't even a comparison for me.

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I mean seriously, this is just a small sample, but the effort in design and aesthetics in this park is jaw-dropping. And so many miss out on it cause there main concern is rides and more rides. We spent 15 minutes at the Komodo Dragon exhibit learning about how it hunts and attacks its prey. The educational aspects of this park alone are worth the visit. But that is their prerogative I suppose.

This park fills me with anticipation of what Avatar will be like. I expect this same level of attention to detail.

You know I've never really taken the time to explore and appreciate AK let alone any Disney park for that matter. In the past I've been more concerned about rides like you say the majority of people are. I think for my next trip(whenever that may be)I'd like to slow down and actually explore the park and see it from a different point of view. Disney World has become as stale as potato chips sitting on a shelf for 10+ years and sinking to the bottom worse than Mariah Carey's NYE performance, so I need to look at it from a different POV next time I go. It'll be hard since I always feel I'm on limited time, but at this point everything in WDW is nothing I've never seen before and nothing I won't ever see again so I should be fine.

 

[DinoInstitute]

I concur. We were in DAK yesterday from 10 AM to 4:30 PM. It was fantastic, and we only went on 1 ride, quite possibly the best E ticket on property - Kilamanjaro Safaris. We went to The Nomad Lounge and had food and drinks from the lounge menu, and then walked the trails. The park is more beautiful than any other park in Orlando. I even put it above DA in UNI. It truly isn't even a comparison for me.

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I mean seriously, this is just a small sample, but the effort in design and aesthetics in this park is jaw-dropping. And so many miss out on it cause there main concern is rides and more rides. We spent 15 minutes at the Komodo Dragon exhibit learning about how it hunts and attacks its prey. The educational aspects of this park alone are worth the visit. But that is their prerogative I suppose.

This park fills me with anticipation of what Avatar will be like. I expect this same level of attention to detail.

I completely agree, it really is beautiful and highly themed like no other park is (that I've been to that is, though I can only imagine TDS is the main competitor for that). I don't think it's a stretch at all to say that once Pandora and RoL are up and running it will be the best park in the country.

Well, yeah, I don't disagree about DHS. Like I said, if you tried hard enough and did everything, stayed for the fireworks and then Fantasmic it's probably a full day but not everything appeals to everyone either so I can agree it's a 1/2 day park.

And that's the big difference between DAK and DHS in how long of an experience the day is, even if there's roughly the same number of stuff to do. In DAK, the lesser known attractions (for example the trails) can appeal to almost everyone. In DHS, the group of people that sees Disney Junior is not the same group that rides Rockin Roller Coaster.

It seemed like DAK had improved with its themeing since the last time we visited the park a few years ago. Even my wife made comments about how beautiful it looked. Even the ROL area blended right in there. Love the trails to explore. The ToL projection show was a highlight.

It really has. I was in DAK yesterday, and actually got to explore the Africa expansions for the first time. I was captivated by the detail and level of immersion there!

 

[flyerjab]

You know I've never really taken the time to explore and appreciate AK let alone any Disney park for that matter. In the past I've been more concerned about rides like you say the majority of people are. I think for my next trip(whenever that may be)I'd like to slow down and actually explore the park and see it from a different point of view. Disney World has become as stale as potato chips sitting on a shelf for 10+ years and sinking to the bottom worse than Mariah Carey's NYE performance, so I need to look at it from a different POV next time I go. It'll be hard since I always feel I'm on limited time, but at this point everything in WDW is nothing I've never seen before and nothing I won't ever see again so I should be fine.

I would definitely say that people should take one day, and slowly explore DAK. There is beauty everywhere that people rush by to get to Everest.

 

[Mike S]

Last time I checked I couldn't ride Everest or go on an African safari or see a production of Finding Nemo or Lion King at my local zoo

And still more is needed or else the "half day" moniker will continue.

You know I've never really taken the time to explore and appreciate AK let alone any Disney park for that matter. In the past I've been more concerned about rides like you say the majority of people are. I think for my next trip(whenever that may be)I'd like to slow down and actually explore the park and see it from a different point of view. Disney World has become as stale as potato chips sitting on a shelf for 10+ years and sinking to the bottom worse than Mariah Carey's NYE performance, so I need to look at it from a different POV next time I go. It'll be hard since I always feel I'm on limited time, but at this point everything in WDW is nothing I've never seen before and nothing I won't ever see again so I should be fine.

I did it with AK last trip. You won't be disappointed. The point of this though is to appeal to a wide range of people. Why is MK so much more popular? Options. If shows and slower paced exploration aren't your thing, you still have plenty to do. At MK you can easily spend a full day without ever stepping foot on Tom Sawyer Island. That's what AK needs with its walking trails.

 

[Kman101]

No one's disagreeing that AK needs more. But it's not a half day park and Pandora makes it even less of one. A nighttime show would also help

A Jungle Book dark ride or a Lion King dark ride or Mystic Manor would go a long way but one more ride doesn't really change what the park already has to offer

I personally skip Triceratop Spin and usually skip Primeval Whirl. I don't always do the trails. I love the trails. And I haven't seen Flights of Wonder in ages ... but there really is a lot of things to do. But I also know a park like this doesn't always appeal to everyone, as gorgeous as it is.

 

[flyerjab]

No one's disagreeing that AK needs more. But it's not a half day park and Pandora makes it even less of one. A nighttime show would also help

A Jungle Book dark ride or a Lion King dark ride or Mystic Manor would go a long way but one more ride doesn't really change what the park already has to offer

I personally skip Triceratop Spin and usually skip Primeval Whirl. I don't always do the trails. I love the trails. And I haven't seen Flights of Wonder in ages ... but there really is a lot of things to do. But I also know a park like this doesn't always appeal to everyone, as gorgeous as it is.

I think @Mike S 's point is for those that are ride-centric tourists, DAK will be a half day trip, probably even after Pandora opens.

But I agree with you in that it really isn't a half day park. For me not by a long shot.

 

[Kman101]

I think @Mike S 's point is for those that are ride-centric tourists, DAK will be a half day trip, probably even after Pandora opens.

But I agree with you in that it really isn't a half day park. For me not by a long shot.

I don't disagree. For those focused on rides, the park lacks, but it still has an OK variety. Pandora fleshes that out even more. A high quality dark ride would also go a long way.

 

[Slowjack]

It always made me laugh when people called AK a 1/2 day park, but to each their own. The fastpass commandos just want to hit rides as fast as possible without ever stopping to enjoy the surroundings.

I love Animal Kingdom, and love strolling around and taking in as much non-ride goodness as possible; it's certainly not a 1/2 day park for me.

But Disney has only Disney to blame for what you (accurately!) call the Fastpass commandos. With the Fastpasses and now the whole FP+ program, they are actively encouraging the idea that a park visit should be a surgical strike, a well-honed plan to swoop in, see those targeted items you most want to see, then get out. As long as FP+ is in place, many guests are going to evaluate WDW parks in terms of ride count.

 

[GoofGoof]

I love Animal Kingdom, and love strolling around and taking in as much non-ride goodness as possible; it's certainly not a 1/2 day park for me.

But Disney has only Disney to blame for what you (accurately!) call the Fastpass commandos. With the Fastpasses and now the whole FP+ program, they are actively encouraging the idea that a park visit should be a surgical strike, a well-honed plan to swoop in, see those targeted items you most want to see, then get out. As long as FP+ is in place, many guests are going to evaluate WDW parks in terms of ride count.

I actually think FP+ improves the situation with FP commandos compared to the classic FP system. I remember hearing people talk about splitting up their family and having a "runner" literally run to pull FPs for the group. Some people were so obsessed with accumulating FPs they completely missed the rest of the park. Now at least you have your FPs and assigned times and you can leisurely enjoy the other attractions in between your 3 "reservations".

 

[GoofGoof]

The point of this though is to appeal to a wide range of people. Why is MK so much more popular? Options. If shows and slower paced exploration aren't your thing, you still have plenty to do. At MK you can easily spend a full day without ever stepping foot on Tom Sawyer Island. That's what AK needs with its walking trails.

I don't think AK will ever come close to the ride count that MK has or should even try. I hear what you are saying about variety, but WDW has 4 parks so why not have each one provide a different experience like @JustInTime said here:

It is baffling to me. Why more of the same? What is the point of spending the money to visit animal kingdom if the experiences are the same as the other parks? The whole point of wanting to visit each park is to get something different.

If seeing animals and leisurely enjoying a beautiful environment is not your cup of tea there are 3 other parks to visit. I don't think they need to make all 4 parks appeal to everyone all the time. AK will never come close to MK in terms of attendance and it really shouldn't even try to. MK is the flagship and is designed to be that. Adding rides to AK to balance out the park is a good thing and necessary, but I don't want MK 2.0 (or should it be 3.0 now that DHS lost it's theme).

 

[DinoInstitute]

I actually think FP+ improves the situation with FP commandos compared to the classic FP system. I remember hearing people talk about splitting up their family and having a "runner" literally run to pull FPs for the group. Some people were so obsessed with accumulating FPs they completely missed the rest of the park. Now at least you have your FPs and assigned times and you can leisurely enjoy the other attractions in between your 3 "reservations".

I would agree with this. If you know what you're doing at least, with FP+ you generally have a better in park experience I find. The drawback from it in my opinion is having to book them so far ahead and being tied to that specific park that day/time if you want to keep them. But alas I'm starting to go off topic now

 

[GoofGoof]

I would agree with this. If you know what you're doing at least, with FP+ you generally have a better in park experience I find. The drawback from it in my opinion is having to book them so far ahead and being tied to that specific park that day/time if you want to keep them. But alas I'm starting to go off topic now

Agreed. I'm not saying it's a great system but it has some benefits and eliminating the need for "FP runners" is one of them.