An absolutely fantastic read that should be mandatory for all of us

[ELG13]

The thing with nostalgia, is that it changes. My kids will remember a very different Disney than I do. And it will be the same with their kids. Change is hard. Really hard. And when it's change at Disney it can sometimes feel like our own childhood is being erased. But a new childhood, a new group of nostalgic kids, and for us, new memories will be made. We can go with our grandkids and tell them about Mr.Toads wild ride or 20,000 leagues. We can talk about Disney BEFORE it took months of planning and a several thousand dollar investment. Who knows what Disney will look like in 20, 30, 50 years, but I can tell you I'll be along for the ride!!

 

[Parker in NYC]

There are just some people who take life too seriously or to find something wrong with anything. Was I upset that they changed Soarin’? Sure, but for about 5 minutes. You can’t stop change. It’s inevitable. It’s necessary.

Oh, I haven't forgotten.

 

[captainbuzzy]

Nostalgia sells to a small group. Sure I miss things from my childhood and early adulthood trips to WDW but I appreciate that things have to change. I just got back from a trip and was really excited about some of the changes especially GE and RTOR. Reading the article just made me feel overwhelmingly sad so I choose not to take her perspective.
What I will say overall my concern is things are losing their identity by plunking down IP that does not fit... Avengers in Epcot being the glaring example.

 

[ELG13]

Nostalgia sells to a small group. Sure I miss things from my childhood and early adulthood trips to WDW but I appreciate that things have to change. I just got back from a trip and was really excited about some of the changes especially GE and RTOR. Reading the article just made me feel overwhelmingly sad so I choose not to take her perspective.
What I will say overall my concern is things are losing their identity by plunking down IP that does not fit... Avengers in Epcot being the glaring example.

Yes...just because it's Disney does not mean there's a spot, currently, for something. Trying to fit a square peg and all.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Nostalgia doesn’t mean attractions can’t be refreshed and enhanced. The Alice dark ride in DL is nothing like the original attraction, it’s been updated several times over the years. Same with haunted mansion, spaceship earth, etc. if you keep what works and update it, it’s a win win.

Completely tearing out great movie ride, backlot tram tour, snow whites dark ride and the Dinos in universe of energy is not that.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

There are just some people who take life too seriously or to find something wrong with anything.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

Nostalgia sells to a small group.

Selling nostalgia is the one thing that has consistently delivered big bucks to Disney since the 1940s.

One of the major selling points of Disney+ is its access to the entire animated "vault", a series of movies that routinely turned out money every 7-10 when re-released to theaters or video, even when newer Disney movies faltered. Another hyped aspect is The Simpsons, a show that hasn't been in its prime since the previous century.

Most Disney Princesses predate the year 2000. The newest Star Wars movie deliberately tried to tie itself with the original trilogy (for better or worse). The company celebrates anniversaries all the time. The most recent "Disneyland After Dark" was an 80s night with a tribute to Videopolis, which closed in 1989. People are gushing over the "baby" of a character that has been around since 1980.

They sell nostalgia all the time. "Remember the Magic" was the theme song for WDW's 25th anniversary.

Next year is WDW's 50th anniversary. Expect nostalgia to be a major focal point of the marketing campaign.

 

[Trackmaster]

We're certainly seeing unprecedented crowd levels these days. A moderately busy day in the late 00's to early 10's is now a "light" day. There are basically no slow days anymore where everything is walk-on. This is further hindered by the fact that Disney has tirelessly ensured that slow seasons don't really exist anymore, as crowd levels are spread more evenly throughout the year. Your best bet for low crowds these days would be September after Labor Day and Late January through mid February, and even then, it's a few days here and there at best.

At this point I think another recession is the only thing that will stop it, as clearly raising prices and charging for more things has not been enough.

I completely disagree about the recession. Less money for the park, and less foot traffic means less investment, understaffing, and underbuilt parks. People may not like the idea of crowds, but with more demand comes a more rich spectrum of options, more rides, more investment, more capacity, and longer hours.

I totally disagree with your opinion that the park is never dead. I take 20+ gate trips per year, and over half of them its just not that crowded. Even some dead days. I've been when Haunted Mansion and Tower of Terror post 13 minute wait times (AKA its a walk on), I've heard of friends who could lay down on Main Street to watch the fireworks, and I've had sub 15 minute waits in 7DMT. Slinky Dog and 7DMT are so easy to get FP+ for on the day of its not even funny. Honestly, Disney is just never that bad Monday-Thursday during the traditional school year unless something major is going on.

I'd advice going during the middle of the week during the traditional school year and to really work on a great FP+ lineup, and make sure to continue to book after your first three. Also, unlike most parks that start slow and pick up steam, Disney starts fast, but gets dead later in the day. If you get to the park later and stay until close, you're in good shape (maybe outside of Friday-Saturday).

All in all, I think that the later hours, 365 operations, and adequate staffing help make Disney manageable if you know when to go.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Selling nostalgia is the one thing that has consistently delivered big bucks to Disney since the 1940s.

One of the major selling points of Disney+ is its access to the entire animated "vault", a series of movies that routinely turned out money every 7-10 when re-released to theaters or video, even when newer Disney movies faltered. Another hyped aspect is The Simpsons, a show that hasn't been in its prime since the previous century.

Most Disney Princesses predate the year 2000. The newest Star Wars movie deliberately tried to tie itself with the original trilogy (for better or worse). The company celebrates anniversaries all the time. The most recent "Disneyland After Dark" was an 80s night with a tribute to Videopolis, which closed in 1989. People are gushing over the "baby" of a character that has been around since 1980.

They sell nostalgia all the time. "Remember the Magic" was the theme song for WDW's 25th anniversary.

Next year is WDW's 50th anniversary. Expect nostalgia to be a major focal point of the marketing campaign.

I disagree that nostalgia is Disney’s big thing that they sell and has historically defined their product. Nostalgia is part of it and common, but more broadly I believe Disney is at their best when they are selling optimism. Even nostalgia I would place under optimism as we are typically nostalgic for things that are hopeful and optimistic, not cynical and dour.

I agree with others that the essay was a bit of mess. It made me sad as it came across as the work of someone with an incredibly thoughtful body of work who simply no longer cares.

 

[Trackmaster]

I disagree that nostalgia is Disney’s big thing that they sell and has historically defined their product. Nostalgia is part of it and common, but more broadly I believe Disney is at their best when they are selling optimism. Even nostalgia I would place under optimism as we are typically nostalgic for things that are hopeful and optimistic, not cynical and dour.

I agree with others that the essay was a bit of mess. It made me sad as it came across as the work of someone with an incredibly thoughtful body of work who simply no longer cares.

One one thing that Walt Disney said that defines what you're talking about is when he said that Disneyland will never be finished (I think in its first year of operation). He had always planned for it to be living and breathing, and not something that was always supposed to be persevered 100%. So they try to strike the balance between nostalgia and excitement/innovation. At this point they're probably going to the side of nostalgia too much, and haven't opened enough over the past 15 years.

 

[Ariel1986]

The article made me roll my eyes so much by half way through that I stopped reading

 

[lazyboy97o]

One one thing that Walt Disney said that defines what you're talking about is when he said that Disneyland will never be finished (I think in its first year of operation). He had always planned for it to be living and breathing, and not something that was always supposed to be persevered 100%. So they try to strike the balance between nostalgia and excitement/innovation. At this point they're probably going to the side of nostalgia too much, and haven't opened enough over the past 15 years.

Huh? “Disneyland will never be complete“ has absolutely nothing to do with what I said. The rest of the quote also actually references not adding or changing anything. Most importantly, Walt wasnt thinking about his park being shaped by people who dislike his park and would have preferred to sell it off. Not building attractions had nothing to do with nostalgia.

 

[Little Green Men]

Nostalgia doesn’t mean attractions can’t be refreshed and enhanced. The Alice dark ride in DL is nothing like the original attraction, it’s been updated several times over the years. Same with haunted mansion, spaceship earth, etc. if you keep what works and update it, it’s a win win.

Completely tearing out great movie ride, backlot tram tour, snow whites dark ride and the Dinos in universe of energy is not that.

The backlot was a sad shell of itself and was shortened so many times, and taking up lots of space.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

The backlot was a sad shell of itself and was shortened so many times, and taking up lots of space.

Agreed. But my first trip to Disney world catastrophe canyon was pretty much my favorite thing.

I would have loved to see a reimagined DHS instead of the tear down and start over approach.

 

[eliza61nyc]

Agreed. But my first trip to Disney world catastrophe canyon was pretty much my favorite thing.

I would have loved to see a reimagined DHS instead of the tear down and start over approach.

I think everyone has one of those rides. A ride that one just fell in love with. I still can't understand the love for the great movie ride, it sucked but I think I'd storm MK with pitchfork and fire if they ever messed with Haunted Mansion. One of my favorite rides is Soarin in Epcot, which is fairly new and our favorite all time ride is FOP. I do take a lot of heat here because I haven't watched one Martin video that has made me long for these bygone days so maybe it's one of those things where you had to experience it to appreciate it.

I guess we could say that almost everything could be updated as opposed to being torn out but even that comes with criticism. can you imagine the meltdown folks would have had if TGMR would have been updated with Disney and marvel IP??

 

[Pirate Magic]

Agreed. But my first trip to Disney world catastrophe canyon was pretty much my favorite thing.

I would have loved to see a reimagined DHS instead of the tear down and start over approach.

I agree. Even now every time I see The Golden Girls and they show the house, I say to myself that was in DHS. Disney has so much land why do just add on. I was so sad when they tore all those houses and made Backlot Tour smaller for the stunt show I saw that once and never went back.

 

[the_rich]

I dont go to disney for rides I rode in the 90s. I go there because I can regain that feeling of being a child. I remember the times I had there with my family and specifically my father who passed when I was young. That's my nostalgia, not the individual rides but happy memories made there. Nostalgia is different for everyone and that's what disney is selling.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I agree. Even now every time I see The Golden Girls and they show the house, I say to myself that was in DHS. Disney has so much land why do just add on. I was so sad when they tore all those houses and made Backlot Tour smaller for the stunt show I saw that once and never went back.

Disney has committed to the idea that they only want people doing the bare minimum to be “satisfied” with buying a ticket. They don’t want you wasting time on attractions, so they replace instead of actually add. Billions of dollars later and Disney’s Hollywood Studios won’t really be much bigger or have much more to do than before.

 

[Disstevefan1]

Skipped out halfway (maybe just a quarter?) through. This isn't a rational business analysis as much as it's therapy.

The argument (from what I read) all falls apart right at the beginning:
This is something Disney had really lost sight of in the 90s and 00s: delivering the kind of experience people want in a way they are prepared to pay for.

Maybe you could argue that this happened within the last six months, and really only due to price increases. The parks have been exceptionally crowded for decades now. Its a shame that someone cant dedicate so much time to an analysis of why their current offerings are so popular compared to previous generations, instead of still lamenting this failed premise that they have lost their way and are struggling for business.

Totally agree! The parks are more mobbed now than ever. They sell out numerous hard ticket events, EPCOT is nearly a year round food festival, we went there a random Saturday during F&W last year and it was so mobbed we didn’t want to stand in a snaking line to by a $7 food sample.

What ever WDW lost, they gained in another way! WDW is always mobbed!

 

[RobWDW1971]

Totally agree! The parks are more mobbed now than ever. They sell out numerous hard ticket events, EPCOT is nearly a year round food festival, we went there a random Saturday during F&W last year and it was so mobbed we didn’t want to stand in a snaking line to by a $7 food sample.

What ever WDW lost, they gained in another way! WDW is always mobbed!

Yup, as is often said on these threads - if the people are lined up for slop, don't blame the chef for making it.