Al Lutz: Carsland for WDW, FLE not Bringing in Guests

[cookiee_munster]

right, well if they can bring a test track clone back into walt disney world then im expecting an indiana jones ride for wdw too. ah'thankee!

EDIT - ive yet to read the entirety of this thread. im about to goto bed. so ill have a read tomorrow. hopefully it'll only be a few hundred posts bigger...

 

[Tim_4]

You ask why it's bad to clone rides. The answer is simple. Every ride that gets cloned means one less unique experience somewhere in a Disney Park.

EDIT TO ADD: I'll never understand why Disney thinks it's a good idea to cannibalize their own customer base by duplicating attractions on different coasts. It makes absolutely zero sense to me. I get that when you clone a ride, you save on design and production costs... But that's like not seeing the forest through the trees. Dumb. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

You're describing maybe 5% of Disney Parks guests. The fact is, 95% of people who visit WDW will only ever visit WDW. They don't need to be distinct from a business perspective because almost nobody visits both.

 

[Captain Neo]

9 year olds want rides not meet and greets

 

[heatherkatheleen]

I still believe CircusLand is what killed the FLE. No one even talks about it. Had the entire area been used for the FLE, you'd have a much grander expansion and many more things to offer. Doing CircusLand on the cheap (and trying to base a whole land on a spinner and a previously successful retail location) has seriously diminished what they were trying to accomplish with the FLE.

Tell me about it! I know someone who vacationed recently with a 4 and 5 year old... totally the demographic for the circus themed area and the kids had NO interest in it apparently.. Even they were bored and confused as to why it was there. If that isn't a bad sign, I don't know WHAT is!

 

[Jane Doe]

For those who aren't in 'the know', I should imagine the most disappointing thing about going to visit the newly opened New Fantasyland is that there is a huge building site in the middle with a large crane sitting plumb centre. Then there is the disappointment of The Little Mermaid and it's blunt edge technology. Spirits are raised by the rather delectable cinnamon rolls and the surprisingly nice attempt at copying Butterbeer. Bewilderment follows next as you notice the largest line in the park is for a restaurant selling sandwiches and salads. By then you've had enough of fighting the crowds and try to walk to Dumbo but find that there's no way through past the Little Mermaid and you fight the crowds again, glancing up at Beast's castle and the forced perspective that clearly doesn't work and wonder to yourself just why you bothered at all.

But all the negativity will soon be gone when people can pay for goods with touch technology.

 

[HMF]

i think everything being discussed it nothing more then just rumors until there is an official announcement.

If Al Lutz said it it is way above rumor status.

 

[tblundy]

My thoughts about the FLE, since the original announcement, were….eh!

The details are wonderful. The theme of the area is spot-on but there is nothing great. More stores. Another restaurant. New trees. But what is going to keep the people with the money (a.k.a. the parents) from coming back? Nothing. We went once…and we don’t need to see it again. Even my kids agree.

If this was supposed to be Disney’s answer to the Harry Potter addition over at Universal…they failed. Big time. The HP area is exciting with exciting rides. FLE…a double-Dumbo which my kids are no longer interested in.

 

[HMF]

Well, actually, I think that Carsland, as executed in DCA, isn't a bad fit for either park (DCA or DHS), because it is a romanticized version of the "cars-land" of California itself: the gold at the rainbow's end of the nation's most romanticized road, Route 66, which of course, originally took you from Chicago to Los Angeles (through Hollywoodland itself, right to Santa Monica and ending at the beach at the Pacific Coast Highway itself!)... at the time that Hollywood was in its prime.

So, it clearly fits the theme of both parks: one based on "the Hollywood that never was, and always will be," and one based on a "California adventure."

I strongly believe that Cars Land will be marketed as an extension of Pixar Place rather than it's own land.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

I think the be WOW factor for the FLE comes with a new E-ticket attraction or two. That will come when SDMC opens. We go in a few weeks, and I am really only super excited to see the Circus area. The rest is just filler until SDMC opens.

I for one would love to see Carsland at WDW, I know I am the only one. But we are close enough to drive to WDW and we would do so for cars, vs flying the whole family to DL.

The 7 Dwarfs Mine Train will not be an E-Ticket.

 

[Captain Neo]

It was hilarious when Rasolu unveiled new fantasyland at D23 at first everyone was really excited and hyped when he said "We are doubling the size of MK's fantasyland...." and then literally all the applause and everything died when he said "so that you can meet more of your favorite disney princesses!" as he showed more and more meet and greets instead of rides most the audience was groaning and mumbling. They should have known then even Staggs had enough common sense to swap out the cinderella meet and greet for the mine cart ride but its really just putting a bandaid on a bullet wound.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

I don't think the Cloned rides are as big an issue as the slow opening little by little and all the re-themed rides, that really weren't re-themed just remodeled, renovated, or moved.

Just imagine if you went 2 years ago, then didn't go back till next year then poof.... all of the changes were in place. It would seem much more awesome!

Having been to what is open in the New Fantasyland, I just don't think so. There really is little awesomeness to it. But I agree that it's not the fact that Ariel's is a clone. It's that it's not compelling. It's simply, meh. The New Fantasyland is pretty. Well most of it is, I think the execution of Storybook Circus is less interesting than what was there before. But there really is no significant content to any of it.

And I do think that TDO staged opening was a plan to get the same family to return 3 times to see the new stuff as it opens. 2012 for Ariel/Belle, 2013 for Princess Fairy Tale Hall, and 2014 for 7 Dwarfs Mine Train. I can Imagine only the most Pixie Dust Addled Mind would consider doing that.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

You're describing maybe 5% of Disney Parks guests. The fact is, 95% of people who visit WDW will only ever visit WDW. They don't need to be distinct from a business perspective because almost nobody visits both.

I don't disagree... But I believe it's a "chicken or the egg" scenario. Are there similar rides on each coast because people generally don't visit both, or do people generally not visit both because there are similar rides on each coast?

In the 60's it was a huge deal to cross the country... It's not anymore.

 

[Alien]

I think we need to give Disney some time truthfully, not since mike Eisner has Disney been pumping out new rides, and resorts constantly... Disney World just got Test Track 2.0 and Fantasyland and 7 dwarfs coaster and Avatar land soon

if CarsLand is gonna happen at all we wont know anything about it for a while, at least until the 7 dwarfs coaster opens


so chill

 

[hiptwinmama]

You're describing maybe 5% of Disney Parks guests. The fact is, 95% of people who visit WDW will only ever visit WDW. They don't need to be distinct from a business perspective because almost nobody visits both.

I couldn't have said it better myself... the ride cloning is not the issue, it's when it's half a$$ execution.

 

[Captain Chaos]

And not have a Disney trip for a year

And you wouldn't miss anything... Universal on the other hand......

 

[Goofyernmost]

Actually, all the original rides you speak of have their own variations of them at each park, all are very unique to their respective park. Only the new ones like Soarin and Mermaid are the same.

Obviously you know how you want to live your life, and if its paycheck to paycheck that's fine. But you do save up to go to WDW, so why not save up for a little longer and you go to West? The differences are striking. I grew up going to WDW and never thought I'd want to see DL, EVER. I didn't go to DL until I was 30 years old. Now I go about 4 times a year since I'm stationed in California. Last year we only went a couple times and then saved up for a year to go to WDW this past Christmas.

You don't have to 'splain anything to me. If you don't see a reason to go to DL, then don't go. The money obstacle though is kinda a flaccid argument, unless you just don't see any value added to experience the original Disney experience that is DL.

I think you need to reread the first paragraph. I do not have a paycheck week to week. I have a monthly check from social security and it doesn't cover my current expenses. When I pay out money it doesn't come back with the next paycheck. When it's gone it's gone. There is no saving up!

I'm also at the age where I am seeing a lot of my friends and acquaintances my age and younger buying the farm. I am not going to wait to live my life for a couple of years when I don't know if I even have a couple of years. Granted if I do buy the farm, I will have money left over for my kids, but I'd like to think that I will live longer and I need to make sure they don't have to support me. I have been to DL in the past and my brain will not let me spend triple just to see a theme park ride. I don't think any responsible person would. When I was earning a paycheck every week I had no problems at all spending it.

With the current management at WDW, you don't seriously think that Carsland won't be modified do you?

 

[ChrisFL]

Most Disney parks don't have THAT cohesive of a theme anyway. I'd be happy with fantastic attractions that are story-driven. Even Tokyo Disney Sea, which gives most of us nightly wet dreams, doesn't have that cohesive of a theme. It just has fantastic attractions.

I have to disagree and NOT just because I'm a DisneySea "foamer". The overall theme is that each land is a true "port" of call and is also set in its own time period. Each land by itself is fully cohesive and the lands are very well established and aren't blending into each other.

 

[Adam5897]

I think we need to give Disney some time truthfully, not since mike Eisner has Disney been pumping out new rides, and resorts constantly... Disney World just got Test Track 2.0 and Fantasyland and 7 dwarfs coaster and Avatar land soon

if CarsLand is gonna happen at all we wont know anything about it for a while, at least until the 7 dwarfs coaster opens


so chill

Avatar might not even happen yet and construction hasn't started at all so it won't be opening anytime soon if it even happens.

 

[ChrisFL]

Sorry, I hate to compare this to Harry Potter because it's been done so many times before...but WDW doesn't "get it."

Harry Potter opens up and it has completely put IoA/UniOrlando on the map...
If you really think about it...
1. One groundbreaking new attraction.
2. Retheming of the land.
3. Retheming of a major attraction.
4. Retheming of a children's coaster.
5. Retheming of restaurants and shops.

Now...Fantasyland...to DATE (Excluding 7DMT)
1. One cloned attraction
2. One new restaurant
3. Retheming of a land where kid's could visit the homes of their favorite characters to a circus.
4. Retheming of a children's coaster.
5. Loss of attraction (Snow White)

What is the MAJOR difference if you break it down?
We have a GROUNDBREAKING NEW ATTRACTION! (Yes, Anything with Harry Potter slapped on it would open eyes...but if there is no substance, the name only means so much)

So...because Fantasyland didn't reach expectations...we're going to do a cloned land which isn't even the "full land."
Will that get people to rush to WDW if they've already been to DL? On the flipside...most visit WDW...so will they bother going to DL if they can experience this great land at WDW?

That's why people are pushing Star Wars Land. It's new...it's wanted...it could be groundbreaking...it could put the Studios on the map and bring in people in droves!

There's a few other reasons why WWOHP is doing better than FLE

WWOHP brought lots of NEW people to Uni/IOA who have never had a major reason to visit before, and I don't just mean normal WDW visitors but visitors to Orlando in general.

FLE didn't increase attendance by people booking an EXTRA trip to WDW or deciding to book a trip when they haven't been before.

WWOHP didn't have a HUGE construction zone in the front of the entire land that isn't completed yet, the way FLE does.

MK is the second most well-established park in the world and #1 in Global attendance...TDO needs to focus on the OTHER struggling parks, not adding to the #1 park (but fixing up the exsting attractions)

 

[Genie of the Lamp]

I'm also at the age where I am seeing a lot of my friends and acquaintances my age and younger buying the farm. I am not going to wait to live my life for a couple of years when I don't know if I even have a couple of years. Granted if I do buy the farm, I will have money left over for my kids, but I'd like to think that I will live longer and I need to make sure they don't have to support me. I have been to DL in the past and my brain will not let me spend triple just to see a theme park ride. I don't think any responsible person would. When I was earning a paycheck every week I had no problems at all spending it.

With the current management at WDW, you don't seriously think that Carsland won't be modified do you?

You would be my perfect example if I were to write a letter to Disney/Burbank one day about why they should look into giving baby boomers like you some serious Disney trip discounts. That's one thing they are going to have to look into with baby boomers retiring left and right and wanting to travel more. They do it for the veterans now, so why can't they do it for the seniors. O that's right, WDW is the #1 family/tourist destination in the world and for TDO's sake that means they'll go after younger parents with younger children (more $ being shed out=their definition of long term strategy). But who are we kidding, this ain't gonna happen as Disney NEVER lowers prices, but if I were in charge, I'd be doing everything in my power to make sure you would be able to afford and see Carsland at DCA if you were willing to do so. But let's look at it currently. Yes, current management at WDW should think that Carsland won't be modified and should be in full scale with possible touches/magic that seperates itself from the orginal. Of course, I perfer my plan I outline in the DHS Carsland thread on page 194 but I guess this will do as it least is something we are possibly going to get.