A Spirited Valentine ...

[doctornick]

Honestly, the Academy should restrict voting for Best Animated Feature and Short to members who actually watched all the nominees. Disney films should win on their merit, not by default because kids of Academy members fill out the category or voters don't give a ****.

That's certainly true and it gives Pixar/Disney a huge edge when it comes to winning awards (not only for the feature film, but the animated shorts too) which are sometimes undeserved (*cough* Brave *cough*).

That said, while you could certainly make the case for Kubo, Zootopia is an absolutely fantastic film in its own right and very deserving of the win. It's been so long since the film was out that it may be hard to recognize how well received it was and how much praise it (justifiably) got for its well done treatment of race relations wile still being an entertaining film enjoyable to both children and adults.

 

[Quinnmac000]

That's certainly true and it gives Pixar/Disney a huge edge when it comes to winning awards (not only for the feature film, but the animated shorts too) which are sometimes undeserved (*cough* Brave *cough*).

That said, while you could certainly make the case for Kubo, Zootopia is an absolutely fantastic film in its own right and very deserving of the win. It's been so long since the film was out that it may be hard to recognize how well received it was and how much praise it (justifiably) got for its well done treatment of race relations wile still being an entertaining film enjoyable to both children and adults.

Disney also lost out on their gimme award for best song. So despite them always winning animated feature, winning anything else is not a sure thing.

 

[doctornick]

Disney also lost out on their gimme award for best song. So despite them always winning animated feature, winning anything else is not a sure thing.

Not sure what you mean. La La Land was always the clear favorite in the category and Moana winning would have been an "upset", at least a mild one. It certainly wasn't a "gimme" for Disney.

Disney won the three awards you'd expect them to have won going in. Best Song was a possibility but not likely. Rogue One was never going to win Sound Mixing. The reality is that Disney, for better or worse, doesn't release Oscar bait movies so they aren't going to win much of anything until they change their philosophy of which films to produce.

 

[NearTheEars]

uh oh...seems people aren't reacting well
http://www.polygon.com/2017/2/26/14746694/avatar-world-james-cameron-commercial-oscars

What I hate about Twitter stories is that you can always find a few tweets on any side of a topic and link them in an article to fit your narrative. There's probably tons of "OMG can't wait for fly on a banshee," tweets too.

Now the relevance thing ........ can't defend that.

ETA: Just did my own anecdotal pandora/avatar search and scrolled through about a dozen positive tweets before getting to the one about haunted dreams.

 

[matt9112]

Not sure what you mean. La La Land was always the clear favorite in the category and Moana winning would have been an "upset", at least a mild one. It certainly wasn't a "gimme" for Disney.

Disney won the three awards you'd expect them to have won going in. Best Song was a possibility but not likely. Rogue One was never going to win Sound Mixing. The reality is that Disney, for better or worse, doesn't release Oscar bait movies so they aren't going to win much of anything until they change their philosophy of which films to produce.

Better yet society could move on and concern ourselves with more important things.

 

[MisterPenguin]

uh oh...seems people aren't reacting well
http://www.polygon.com/2017/2/26/14746694/avatar-world-james-cameron-commercial-oscars

Wow, look at all the handfuls of negative comments!

 

[FigmentForver96]

uh oh...seems people aren't reacting well
http://www.polygon.com/2017/2/26/14746694/avatar-world-james-cameron-commercial-oscars

They took three comments to fit their narrative for the article.

 

[NearTheEars]

Well .....maybe Moana won after all. Let's go check the card.

 

[flynnibus]

uh oh...seems people aren't reacting well
http://www.polygon.com/2017/2/26/14746694/avatar-world-james-cameron-commercial-oscars

This just in.... people are stupid

 

[BrianLo]

Unfortunately the animation awards still suffer from a serious lack of interest. Disney's sweep of animation awards is too often due to marketing and name recognition.

True... but if that's all that mattered the Illumination movies would have picked up oscar noms. Or Pixar for that matter this year. It's definitely been name recognition in the past though.

I think this year the category picked a great selection of nominations and the actual race was very competitive. Any of them could have won really. Zootopia certainly wasn't undeserving, like say Brave.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

Unfortunately the animation awards still suffer from a serious lack of interest. Disney's sweep of animation awards is too often due to marketing and name recognition.

That's certainly true and it gives Pixar/Disney a huge edge when it comes to winning awards (not only for the feature film, but the animated shorts too) which are sometimes undeserved (*cough* Brave *cough*).

That said, while you could certainly make the case for Kubo, Zootopia is an absolutely fantastic film in its own right and very deserving of the win. It's been so long since the film was out that it may be hard to recognize how well received it was and how much praise it (justifiably) got for its well done treatment of race relations wile still being an entertaining film enjoyable to both children and adults.

To the credit of the Animation branch's nominating committee, they did choose a diverse array of films that reflect both the high level of talent and variety of methods that encompass the medium. But that's only so much. Imagine if the same two actors won 9 out 10 years, that would be nuts, as if they won by default. It's not good for a competition that's meant to be decided on merit to have a default choice. It devalues the award and the people who win it. Byron, Rich and the entire Zootopia crew are incredibly passionate and talented filmmakers who created a world, quite frankly, I want to explore and wedded it with real life problems, no matter how messy the end result may be, and it is. They worked too hard to just receive this honor by default. Animation is more than just Disney and Pixar. The Academy robs itself and the public, who do pay attention to films that are nominated for/win Oscars, of a richer appreciation of this beautiful art form.

Addendum: It would also be super helpful if, going forward, Disney and the other studios, made more agressive awards plays in categories beyond Best Animated Feature and Best Song like Production Design, Art Direction, Costume Design, Screenplay and, the big kahuna, Best Picture.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

True... but if that's all that mattered the Illumination movies would have picked up oscar noms. Or Pixar for that matter this year. It's definitely been name recognition in the past though.

I think this year the category picked a great selection of nominations and the actual race was very competitive. Any of them could have won really. Zootopia certainly wasn't undeserving, like say Brave.

You have the nominating committee to thank for the lack of Illumination films, but it's generally understood many members who vote in this category are picking their kid's favorite film or haven't seen all the nominees; a major disqualifier.

 

[PiratesoftheHM]

Moana was the far more ambitious film in everything from story, setting, and as cultural showcase. Throw in a good score and it really is remarkable it didn't score a win. The inferior movie won no doubt.

Though this says leaps and bounds about Walt Disney Company's Animation divisions. Since 2012 they've won everytime. 11 total wins within their library. Very impressive.

Completely disagree. Zootopia was a political movie at an important time. While I love Moana for representing POC, the story is pretty generic fantasy-adventure movie. The only song that did anything for me in that was the 3 variations of How Far I'll Go. Shiny took away a lot of credibility for the score/integration of music into the plot for me in that film.

Based off initial previews and just the premise of an animal movie about a detective, Zootopia surprises audiences with an allegory for racism/xenophobia (albeit, a messy one). In my opinion, Zootopia was a much more creative and surprising film. I had extremely low expectations for it and they were far surpassed, while I had high expectations for Moana which were barely, barely met.

I still think Moana is the weakest Disney "Princess" musical film. Only Brave is worse, and it's not a musical.

 

[peter11435]

I got the name of the shows confused okay. Plus I'm not that familiar with french names for Disney attractions.

Simple mistake. I just wanted to make sure people know what is and is not being replaced.

 

[DDLand]

Completely disagree. Zootopia was a political movie at an important time. While I love Moana for representing POC, the story is pretty generic fantasy-adventure movie. The only song that did anything for me in that was the 3 variations of How Far I'll Go. Shiny took away a lot of credibility for the score/integration of music into the plot for me in that film.

Based off initial previews and just the premise of an animal movie about a detective, Zootopia surprises audiences with an allegory for racism/xenophobia (albeit, a messy one). In my opinion, Zootopia was a much more creative and surprising film. I had extremely low expectations for it and they were far surpassed, while I had high expectations for Moana which were barely, barely met.

I still think Moana is the weakest Disney "Princess" musical film. Only Brave is worse, and it's not a musical.

The level of sophistication in synthesizing the disparate legends and beliefs of Traditional Polynesian peoples into a coherent story and plot was impressive. The unprecedented care they took with a culture that has constantly been misunderstood and misrepresented was landmark. The infusion of the different (from a typical Domestic/European worldview) into a realm that has become a little comfortable was fresh.

Moana was playing Chess while Zootopia was playing checkers.

 

[Quinnmac000]

The level of sophistication in synthesizing the disparate legends and beliefs of Traditional Polynesian peoples into a coherent story and plot was impressive. The unprecedented care they took with a culture that has constantly been misunderstood and misrepresented was landmark. The infusion of the different (from a typical Domestic/European worldview) into a realm that has become a little comfortable was fresh.

Moana was playing Chess while Zootopia was playing checkers.

Yea they took so much care they decided to merchandise an offensive costume with it. And didn't Pacific Islanders have issues with Maui's image and portrayal? Especially the lack of Hina who Maui couldn't do all the things he bragged about in the song You're Welcome without. As for the Kakamora, they were a real tribe of short statured people of the solomon islands and coconut is a somewhat a racial slur so trying those two together was rather bad taste on Disney's part to put those two things together.

Well, it was great they opened up a new culture to young children who may not have any knowledge or interest and helped put a role model for young pacific islander children, to say that it was sosphicated and they took care compared to Zootopia is very much not accurate.

 

[tribbleorlfl]

The level of sophistication in synthesizing the disparate legends and beliefs of Traditional Polynesian peoples into a coherent story and plot was impressive. The unprecedented care they took with a culture that has constantly been misunderstood and misrepresented was landmark. The infusion of the different (from a typical Domestic/European worldview) into a realm that has become a little comfortable was fresh.

Moana was playing Chess while Zootopia was playing checkers.

This.

 

[Princess Leia]

While I preferred Moana to Zootopia, both had a lot going for them in terms of technical achievements. Both had a crazy amount of detail (the water in Moana/fur in Zootopia), both had great stories (yet both had some flaws), and I think they were both great additions to the Disney canon.

So while I liked Moana more (I'm almost always going to like Disney musicals over their non-musicals), I'm not upset that Zootopia won.

I'm starting to feel the same way about City of Stars winning over How Far I'll Go. I read a few anonymous ballots by Oscar voters, and it looks like a lot chose the La La Land songs for originality. If Disney campaigned for We Know the Way, they might have won Best Song. Lin Manuel Miranda is going to have another shot (Hamilton pun intended) soon, he's not going anywhere.

I am super pleased that Piper and Jungle Book won in their respective categories.

 

[doctornick]

True... but if that's all that mattered the Illumination movies would have picked up oscar noms. Or Pixar for that matter this year. It's definitely been name recognition in the past though.

I think this year the category picked a great selection of nominations and the actual race was very competitive. Any of them could have won really. Zootopia certainly wasn't undeserving, like say Brave.

Brave and maybe Big Hero Six are the only Disney or Pixar films that have won Best Animated Feature that were "undeserved" IMHO. I mean, you can always make cases were one film "should have" won over another, but I think it's probably more important that they film that does win isn't an unreasonable choice and has a solid resume for being deserving.

If Finding Dora had won, there would have been a good case for it going to a movie/studio just because of name recognition.

 

[Princess Leia]

Brave and maybe Big Hero Six are the only Disney or Pixar films that have won Best Animated Feature that were "undeserved" IMHO.

I'm with you on both films. I think Big Hero 6 won since it was the only film from Disney or Pixar nominated that year, but it didn't deserve it. The only other film I had seen from that year's nominee list was How to Train Your Dragon 2, and that was a much better film.

I think that a major issue with the animation category is that there is very little structure in the voting guidelines. Are voters basing their votes for the most popular, best story, or best animation techniques? Look at this year's nominees- 2 were CGI based, 2 were stop motion (not sure about My Life as a Zucchini, but Kubo also employed CGI scenes), and 1 was traditionally animated. The most popular doesn't always win (Wallace & Gromit beat both Howl's Moving Castle and The Corpse Bride), but it seems to happen more often than not. Winning for the best story seems to be a mixed bag.