A Spirited Perfect Ten

tribbleorlfl

Well-Known Member
When they first launched Ironman, no one was sure what would be next, and how it would grow, but yet Disney and Marvel did, as they had Easter eggs in the credits. We now know, they had a long term plan, and that plan involved Hero's we have not seen in Movies in the past. Plus long term plans to move to new series with Avengers as the climax.
While I agreed with most of what you said, I do want to point out IM was produced by Marvel Studios and released by Paramount in 2008; as such, Disney had nothing to do with the Nick Fury post-credits scene or the seeds of the shared universe. Remember, Hulk's rights were at Universal, further complicating the effort to make Avengers in the first place.
 

Darth Sidious

Authentically Disney Distinctly Chinese
While I agreed with most of what you said, I do want to point out IM was produced by Marvel Studios and released by Paramount in 2008; as such, Disney had nothing to do with the Nick Fury post-credits scene or the seeds of the shared universe. Remember, Hulk's rights were at Universal, further complicating the effort to make Avengers in the first place.

The first Iron Man was the best. There have been some great movies recently but that movie started it all.
 

Rodan75

Well-Known Member
Devin Faraci and others have suggested that X-Men not come back, initially, after they reset their universe with Secret Wars.

I don't disagree with their business mentality, you need to put the creative in places where you get the biggest band for the dollar. But that is a crappy thing to do to those fans.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
Considering how the Marvel purchase was talked, spammed, and displayed in every single news paper and online news site of any form... I disagree with your notion of "aren't aware".

As Disney and general themepark fans we all focus on things related to TWDC when news comes out. It's not necessarily true of the general population. There are major mergers in nearly every industry but most people don't care unless they work for one of the companies or at least in the industry. Even if the Wall Street Journal detailed the transaction and a news story flashed up on Yahoo or CNN or a local newspaper people may have glanced at it and forgot about it. It happens almost daily.

I still don't think the general public thinks of Marvel movies as Disney movies. Disney is Mickey Mouse, The Lion King and now Olaf. Not Captain America or Hulk. Same goes for Star Wars.
 

spacemt354

Chili's
As Disney and general themepark fans we all focus on things related to TWDC when news comes out. It's not necessarily true of the general population. There are major mergers in nearly every industry but most people don't care unless they work for one of the companies or at least in the industry. Even if the Wall Street Journal detailed the transaction and a news story flashed up on Yahoo or CNN or a local newspaper people may have glanced at it and forgot about it. It happens almost daily.

I still don't think the general public thinks of Marvel movies as Disney movies. Disney is Mickey Mouse, The Lion King and now Olaf. Not Captain America or Hulk. Same goes for Star Wars.
I think Disney is becoming more cognizant of that fact and it seems like they are trying to place their name on anything MCU recently. An example would be the College Football Championship game on ESPN where the second Avengers trailer premiered. Also the Ant-Man trailer on ABC's Agent Carter.

I agree that initially the general public was unaware of that (or simply didn't care) but now the names Disney/Marvel are becoming much more synonymous.

Especially in the argument of who will take the box-office in 2015. Avenegrs 2 or Star Wars? A popular answer has been Disney...since they will win either way.
 

Phicinfan

Well-Known Member
As Disney and general themepark fans we all focus on things related to TWDC when news comes out. It's not necessarily true of the general population. There are major mergers in nearly every industry but most people don't care unless they work for one of the companies or at least in the industry. Even if the Wall Street Journal detailed the transaction and a news story flashed up on Yahoo or CNN or a local newspaper people may have glanced at it and forgot about it. It happens almost daily.

I still don't think the general public thinks of Marvel movies as Disney movies. Disney is Mickey Mouse, The Lion King and now Olaf. Not Captain America or Hulk. Same goes for Star Wars.
Again I can agree with this.

I do think though, that Disney feels they are missing a key consumer in the young adult males. So by getting the Star Wars franchise and Marvel franchise they are looking to gain in that catagory. While I agree, I for one don't want Marvel in MK or Epcot or AK, I don't have an issue if they added some attraction in DHS. But then again, I hate there is not recognition in DHS for all the really key early movies like Davey Crockett, Herbie, Bed Knobs and so on. I would be all for DHS being a big TOOT The Disney movie horn and have a section for Animation(classic disney ie Mickey and co.), Pixar ( toy story et. al.), Star Wars and then Marvel, but realize the Marvel won't happen due to US.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
Again I can agree with this.

I do think though, that Disney feels they are missing a key consumer in the young adult males. So by getting the Star Wars franchise and Marvel franchise they are looking to gain in that catagory. While I agree, I for one don't want Marvel in MK or Epcot or AK, I don't have an issue if they added some attraction in DHS. But then again, I hate there is not recognition in DHS for all the really key early movies like Davey Crockett, Herbie, Bed Knobs and so on. I would be all for DHS being a big TOOT The Disney movie horn and have a section for Animation(classic disney ie Mickey and co.), Pixar ( toy story et. al.), Star Wars and then Marvel, but realize the Marvel won't happen due to US.
Disney's approach to integrating Marvel has been a little cautious. I agree that Marvel targets a key demographic group for Disney that was needed, but they are walking a fine line between "family entertainment" and appealing to male teenagers and young adults. I think they did keep the brands seperate for that reason in the beginning. You still get the financial benefit of Marvel's success but you don't hurt the core brand. With that approach you also fail to maximize synergies of the acquisition. As @spacemt354 pointed out above they do seem to be making more of an effort recently to promote Marvel films as being made by Disney. It may be a shift in thinking. Either way the theme parks (outside of FL) are still lacking any significant Marvel presence. Maybe that will change soon too.
 

lebeau

Well-Known Member

I swear I just suggested Pratt for Jones the other day on my site!

Indy, however, should be recast. gasp I know. Blasphemy! But the character is bigger than the actor. Indy is like James Bond or Batman. He’s iconic. Future generations should have their own Indiana Jones just like every generation has their own Bond or Batman. Harrison Ford is great and he owned the role. But it’s past time. Indy shouldn’t be in his 70’s tracking down aliens and whatever. He should be in his 30s. And there’s plenty of talented actors of the appropriate age who could pull it off. Chris Pratt basically played Han Solo in Guardians of the Galaxy. Tone down the goofiness just a bit, slap a hat on him and teach him to use a whip and you’ve got a good Indy.
 

tribbleorlfl

Well-Known Member
Spider-Man is not *needed* right now. My point is that he *may* be needed for Phase 4 after Avengers: Infinity War part 2. You just backed up what I was saying. Disney will make the appropriate offer to Sony when they need Spider-Man. They don't *need* him now, they are riding high. After IW part 2? The future is murky especially if new characters are not as well received as Iron Man/Cap/etc. Disney/Marvel would have certainly have liked Spider-Man back for Civil War, however my guess is the price was too high and it wasn't worth it.
This is pure speculation, of course, but I almost wonder if they decided that adding Spidey in to CA:CW wouldn't have worked from a story perspective (rather than a financial one. I mean, there are only been 3 ways to incorporate him, and none really were options for various reasons:
  • Merge TASM 1&2 with the MCU as cannon and with Garfield returning as Spidey. This was apparently least palatable to Marvel because the leaks suggested he would not return (which is a shame, because though I didn't like the movies, I liked Garfield as Pete/Spidey). Wise choice as neither TASM or Avengers shows signs of each other's presence, and people would wonder where was Spidey during the "Battle of New York"
  • Treat CW as Spidey's origin story, which would then lead into his appearance in IW 1&2 (and likely solo movies set in the MCU). This wouldn't work as CW is going to have too much going on to have room for an origin story, plus Spidey's role in the comic story would require an established, well-known superhero in the movie. BP serves that role (only in reverse) better than an origin Spidey.
  • Introduce Spidey as an established hero in the MCU (ala Batman in BvS:DoH) without showing his origin. I suppose this could work as most people know his origin story already, you just run into the same problem as fusing TASM w/ the MCU: where was he during Avengers 1&2, IM3, CA:TWS and AoS?
I suppose they've going to run into the same problems if the deal gets worked out for IW 1&2, they just have more time to craft a narrative that fits in with what they've created already. Who knows, a new Spidey solo origin film setting up his appearance in IW could still be made, it just makes my head spin we could be seeing a third Spidey origin in 15 years due to Sony's malfeasance.
 

doctornick

Well-Known Member
Not exactly. If they wanted to buy the movie rights from Sony they would. Sony would part with them for the right price. They know they messed up Spider-man.

I don't think that's really true. I mean, sure, Sony would sell the Spider-Man rights (just like Uni would sell the Mavel theme park rights) for the "right price". That price would be astronomical.

Sony knows that the Spider-Man movie franchise has gotten a bad rap. But they know it is still a valuable character. So, they want to find a way to retain and reinvigorate the brand while still making money off of it. Hence negotiations with Disney....

Disney/Marvel Studios would surely love to have creative control of Spider-Man and be able to use him in the MCU (and for solo films). Sony would like to make money with minimal downside. The obvious and likely outcome for an agreement would be for an agreement where Disney/Marvel uses Spider-Man but Sony gets some percentage of the box office. Which is something similar to the agreement Disney made with Paramount int he early years of the MCU.

But Disney doesn't want to make Spider-man movies. They have all the super heroes they need.

I would totally disagree that Disney doesn't "want" to make Spider-Man movies. I think the folks at Marvel Studios would love to and the higher ups at Disney would encourage that since Spider-Man is a huge mover of merchandise -- having quality solo films with him (especially ones that integrate with the MCU) would be a huge boost.

They don't "need" Spider-Man back and they will be fine if they don't get him. But I'm sure Disney would be thrilled to work out a mutually beneficial deal to be able to make films with Spider-Man.

But unless Sony gives up and offers to sell Spidey back dirt cheap (which I can't imagine they will be dumb enough to do), Disney isn't all that interested in buying the rights back.

"Buying" outright at the price that Sony would be willing to sell them? No, I would not think so.

Getting back the rights? Yes, I would think Marvel would be extremely interested.
 

spacemt354

Chili's
This is pure speculation, of course, but I almost wonder if they decided that adding Spidey in to CA:CW wouldn't have worked from a story perspective (rather than a financial one. I mean, there are only been 3 ways to incorporate him, and none really were options for various reasons:
  • Merge TASM 1&2 with the MCU as cannon and with Garfield returning as Spidey. This was apparently least palatable to Marvel because the leaks suggested he would not return (which is a shame, because though I didn't like the movies, I liked Garfield as Pete/Spidey). Wise choice as neither TASM or Avengers shows signs of each other's presence, and people would wonder where was Spidey during the "Battle of New York"
  • Treat CW as Spidey's origin story, which would then lead into his appearance in IW 1&2 (and likely solo movies set in the MCU). This wouldn't work as CW is going to have too much going on to have room for an origin story, plus Spidey's role in the comic story would require an established, well-known superhero in the movie. BP serves that role (only in reverse) better than an origin Spidey.
  • Introduce Spidey as an established hero in the MCU (ala Batman in BvS:DoH) without showing his origin. I suppose this could work as most people know his origin story already, you just run into the same problem as fusing TASM w/ the MCU: where was he during Avengers 1&2, IM3, CA:TWS and AoS?
I suppose they've going to run into the same problems if the deal gets worked out for IW 1&2, they just have more time to craft a narrative that fits in with what they've created already. Who knows, a new Spidey solo origin film setting up his appearance in IW could still be made, it just makes my head spin we could be seeing a third Spidey origin in 15 years due to Sony's malfeasance.

Well it was announced some time ago that Marvel is no longer doing origin stories after Phase 2. So Dr. Strange will begin with Steven Strange already being Dr. Strange. Same with Black Panther, Captain Marvel, etc.

So Spider-Man wouldn't need a rehash of his origin story with Uncle Ben, gaining powers, etc in the MCU.

The way I thought they would integrate him for Captain America: Civil War would be a post-credit scene at the end of Avenegrs: Age of Ultron. They could have cast a young 18 year old Spidey, who wouldn't have had his powers yet for the New York battle in Avengers 1 because he was only a kid. That would make the chronology more effective. In the post-credits scene they could show Peter looking at the devastation of Ultron and telling himself that he has to do something. Hence get involved in a superhero civil war.

Idk, obviously that's not happening, but something like that could be in-store if a deal goes through in the future.
 
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Cesar R M

Well-Known Member
There is a bill in congress for the civil rights violation to Seymore Spiddy. I had no idea this was related to Marvel. . .
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Rodan75

Well-Known Member
My alternative pick was Tom Hardy. I think there's a lot of guys who could play the swashbuckling action hero.

I was thinking Armie Hammer would be the right age and look, but then...well...the Lone Ranger. But there are a number of actors who can thread the needle of being serious and fun without going parody. I think Pratt's performance in Jurassic World will probably tell us that he would be fine as Indy.
 

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