A Spirited Dirty Dozen ...

[Cesar R M]

I'm not even from Florida and I know feeding wildlife is a recipe for disaster, Of course up here it's now Bear problem season. Black bears not a problem they eat berries,honey,grubs and roots and are shy, Brown bears well they eat ANYTHING and are aggressive to boot

but what about precious who wants a selfie with a moose or a brown bear?

 

[BrianLo]

Was Ignite The Dream showing at night? Also how many characters were out that day besides Mickey?

Yes and there was a fireworks tag at the end celebrating the grand opening. That was an unexpected nice touch as people began trying to move. Some Chinese anthem type song that was about 5 minutes long, orchestrated and with a choir. I'm sure it hold some importance but I admit I was clueless what song it was. Interestingly the tag just used projected stills from Ignite the dream on the castle sans characters.

Sorry I admit I generally don't pay attention or know anything about the characters. Baloo and Rafiki were at the Happy Tribal M&G. The only truly minor characters I noticed in the parade were Lotso and the mime from Rapunzel.

Apparently Lotso is outrageously popular. I find that kind of amusing, but kind of a nice redemption arc for the actual character. I'd find it amusing if there was a subtle nod to the character somehow winding up in China in TS4.

 

[alphac2005]

Because they don't have quality people working for them in management and they don't listen to frontline CMs when they reort issues. They just don't.

I wrote in the gator thread about how I witnessed this behavior with a family throwing pizza to a gator in front of the Beach Club (pond on the right as you are walking in from buses) years ago and told them to stop and explained how dangerous it was (as well as illegal) and was told to (blank off). I then went in and demanded to speak to the unduty manager who seemed unfazed and uninterested in what was going on. But he promised that he'd call the animal control group. A few days later I was back there and the gator was sitting right in the same spot waiting for a hand out ... tossing a piece of pepperoni. This bull--it has been going on for many years and Disney flat out doesn't want to offend a doll...I mean a Guest.

This is where I say they have responsibility because they don't flat out tell Guests -- NO, you can't do this! It is dangerous. It is against the law. And if you do we'll toss you off our property.

I am not surprised one bit that people have been reportedly doing so at the Poly Bungalows because that is exactly the behavior I'd expect from many people (sadly). And, ultimately, I think they are the reason that kid is dead.

My wife's first comment about guests feeding alligators (my goodness, the disease of stupidity is apparently rampant) is exactly what your read is, you simply can't tell people to do or not to do anything. "I paid XXXX for this vacation and I can do what I want." I so hope the pendulum swings back towards companies becoming firmer. They're all so concerned about every whiner and complainer showing up on (buzzword) social media, that they've become virtually complicit. Legal has sucked the life out of so many things places, but the flip could be that legal starts to order a crackdown on stupidity even if it makes a mommy blogger mad. We'll see.

 

[Soarin' Over Pgh]

A new coworker followed me home yesterday.

I'm renaming him Rufus and he shall sit on my desk and keep me company.

The Secret Life of Pets merch has me hook, line and sinker so far. God help me if there are blind boxes/bags and plush sets on the way (I'm sure there are both)... This may very well be the one time I'm sold on a movie before it's even out, solely based on it's cute merchandise.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Honestly it reminds me a lot of what the critics say about nfl, the queue and the outside are worthy of an e-ticket but it's a c-ticket attraction.

Kong is without a doubt an E Ticket from beginning to end.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

If you're talking about motion simulator tech in the RV's, then I think it should be pointed out that IJA started the trend at DL and Universal has used similar tech in previous attractions. Also, billing the Hulk as a whole new ride is overselling it. its a refurbishment similar to what DL's Space Mountain got and what WDW's almost and should've got. When all is said and done, the Kong attraction may not my cup of tea, but I hope you enjoy it for what it is.

The RVs don't have motion tech like IJA, they park on and get locked into massive bladder driven motion platforms. But the truly State of the art part is the WiFi guidance system. It is a far more complex system that Energy/GMR.

The ride is 5:50TRT.

The ride is exactly what I expected. And it is a great ride. Is it "The Best Ride"? No. But it is a solid addition to the parks line up. And it also serves to break up the string of water rides on that side of the park. If a guest doesn't care to get wet, there is a dearth of things to do on that side of the park.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

And I'm not I simply was using trucoats logic, I have no problem discussing universal but people freak out whenever you criticize anything they do. Put crapping all over Disney gets you praise and high fives all over this board.

Universal fans have no problem with legitimate criticism. We don't really have time for butt hurt Disney fanboi blather.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

I don't hate universal not at all, it's the fact that universal gets praise for rides and tech that Disney would get slammed for that bothers me. The standards are not the same for two parks, universal gets praise for a ride that Disney would get slammed for.

If Disney had built Kong, WDW fans would be wetting themselves with glee.

 

[BrerJon]

That's a loaded question. I would have liked to have heard exactly how it was worded. But he sure can't think on his feet to save his life because that wasn't the right way to answer at all.

A bit of investigative digging and I've found the clip. Here you go, about a minute in - doesn't make Iger look good at all:


Also gets mentioned in this summary by the same reporter, Robin Brant, who seems to be trying to do actual journalism, much to Disney's annoyance:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-36524973

He tweeted this too:
"Door stepped @Disney ceo Bob Iger - he didn't like it - then got soaked doing ptc (x5) on #shanghai Rapids ride. Different to Westminster."

 

[BrianLo]

I believe the NYT reported it was capped at 35,000. Considering what you get regularly at MK, DL and TDL, that number, if true, is very, very small and designed so that everything goes smoothly until the press goes home in a few days ...

http://www.shanghaidaily.com/metro/...anding-sooner-rather-than-later/shdaily.shtml

This article is interesting, not sure if it was posted somewhere already. They quote 40k, which might make some sense.

Also Toy Story confirmed, as we knew (it's currently just dirt, I did some sleuthing).


Stop me before I go on - but has anyone actually been to the ecological zone - aka the second theme park site? Because if not I have a weird adventure and photos to share. There is a lot more temporary development than I expected and the second theme park site is accessible to the public.

 

[Nickels5]

If Disney had built Kong, WDW fans would be wetting themselves with glee.

We will have to agree to disagree, Kong does nothing for me personally. I feel its a good ride but it doesn't move the needle in either direction.

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

Here's a video of a gator in the Rivers of America very close to the connecting Splash Mountain flume, along with some geniuses feeding it popcorn (at least the woman says not to feed it anymore, but not much was done to stop it in the first place)-


There's another video that I won't post (someone added horror music and I feel that posting it would be insensitive) of a gator trying to actually climb over the barrier separating the River and the connecting Splash Mountain flume. A cast member is standing there with a pole trying to keep it from getting over. You can find it easily enough by searching youtube for "alligator splash mountain".

 

[tirian]

Since similar questions have been asked of me, I am going to copy my long post regarding the organization of Shanghai Disneyland that I just posted in the thread I started on Shanghai Disneyland.

---

When I say that Tomorrowland is a disorganized mess, I am not referring to the aesthetics or attraction line up. Spatial organization is about how spaces are created, how program elements are situated and how people move about the space. Tomorrowland ignores six decades of good theme park design, but that should not be shocking given its lead (whose Mark VII project started with telling Bob Gurr to pound sand and ended with a monorail fleet one short that did not fit on the beam way and had no ventilation). Since I have made similar comments and been asked to expand on them elsewhere I am going to take the long way around to answering this question so that I can repost it where appropriate.

In the design of architectural spaces there are two primary concepts relating to how objects (most typically walls) shape space: space making objects and objects in space. The classic example of space making objects are old city squares or typical urban streets. They are well defined in the boundaries and image by their surroundings. An object in space would be something like a barn sitting in a field, the expanse is what really defines that place. Theme parks are very much built around the definition of space, space is where theme is expressed and the experience of a theme park is one of moving through a carefully choreographed series of spaces that create an emotional resonance.

In order to handle crowds Disney's strategy has typically been to expand the space. At the EPCOT Center this worked because Disney rather fully embraced the notion of an object in space. Each pavilion is a discrete entity and the intended focus of one's experience. Walking through Future World or around World Showcase is intentionally a secondary experience. The space works to define the separation. Even if World Showcase was built out each pavilion would still surround the large walkway and massive lagoon, and entering this large space would still occur in between the experience of each pavilion.

At Tokyo Disneyland, trying to fit the larger spaces into the traditional Disneyland framework has created a degree of awkwardness. There are large corridors that plow through the park and the experience is somewhat disconnected. This disconnect is most notable with Westernland where there are just too many conflicting notions of scale that still don't quite work well even when the expanse of the frontier would be a desirable experience. Potentially learning from their weirdness, the Euro Disneyland project properly rethought crowd management by introducing more variety to the means of moving about the park. The most famous example of this is the arcades which flank Main Street, USA but how many people realize that Liberty Arcade is part of a larger series of covered walkways which extend into Frontierland proper?

Shanghai Disneyland takes the large walkway strategy of Tokyo Disneyland and turns it up to 11 by trying to combine the World Showcase strategy. This though is a contradiction. A themed land is not a series of discrete experiences but one singular experience. A strong land acts as one and is therefore most suitable to defined space. One moved amongst and along the objects which define the space, which define the theme. The lands of Shanghai Disneyland have no definition. Imagine Main Street, USA as only half of its western side and the rest all being open space. The park throughout lacks definition. Objects sit in relation to little else and are supposed to be connected with other objects that off in the distance (a situation which will only grow worse as the foliage matures). This openness of space is made worse (most notably on Mickey Ave and Fantasyland) by overly reducing the scale of the buildings. Forced perspective (while often cut short to only be such) is not just reducing the heights of upper levels of a building. That is merely a means and it is in fact supposed to be an illusion. Effective forced perspective as traditionally used by Disney creates the illusion of multiple levels without such levels actually being habitable. Throughout Shanghai Disneyland such illusions do not exist. The upper floors are clearly way to be small for their to be occupied space. The result of buildings that are too small in very large spaces is that the non-human scale of both the building and the surrounding space is emphasized.

Finally, we get to the mess that is Tomorrowland. Like the rest of the park it follow the open space and defined edge pattern. It avoids the overly diminutive buildings issue but does't really fix them by lacking any sort of real definition to its scale. The land is the tossed into a blender by introducing the Armchair Imagineer's dream of multiple levels. Multiple levels look cool. They are part of the kinetics of a vibrant city as there is an interplay in the activation of horizontal and vertical space. Multiple levels though are not a big thing in theme parks, even when crowds are a concern, because they jumble the explicit shaping of the guest experience. Notions of push and pull, weenies, etc. all get complicated when there are many ways about and are seemingly tossed aside in Tomorrowland. There is no clear distinct path of travel. There is no clear means of moving about the land. It is a massive plaza and edge which abuts another plaza. There is no hierarchy of forms or places, too much tries to be important and it muddles the whole. There is no clear path that takes one directly through the land. TRON Lightcycle Power Run is best visible and accessed coming from the south (Gardens of Imagination / Mickey Ave) but this is practically a dead end situation. This is the upper level walkway that also access the main dining facility of rate land and the Jet Packs and attraction but it has no real connection the massive plaza below. Yes, there are stairs, but they are not part of the means of travel. This lack of hierarchy is then repeated by the lower level which lacks strong edges to give it definition and must be navigates entirely by signage. The light cycles are not dominate in view when entering and when they do finally asset themselves as the marquee attraction he design suggest an entry far removed while the person and object of desire are so physically close.

On the whole the park has failed at its organization and employed no well designed weenies. Since the edge condition is the dominate defining characteristic there is little to no visual hierarchy as everything sits rather independently. The Princess Sorority House and Roaring Mountain are the two most clearly visible landmarks throughout the park but also fail to act as weenies. There is no clear means of getting to either. The Gardens of Imagination (I guess random stuff tossed together is now considered imaginative) object direct movement towards Enchanted Storybook Castle. Roaring Rapids' entrance is not at all near its mighty peak, but would be passed on the journey if entering from the Gardens of Imagination. Treasure Cove is the only land that really starts to create any sense of defined space and its spectacular E-Ticket attractions turns its back on this peacemaking with the entrance instead located at the edge and facing Fantasyland.

With Frozstrom, New Fantasyland, Tangled Restrooms, and now SDL, today's WDI has proven it does not understand forced perspective or placemaking. It's a good thing they outsource rock work, because that is the only element pulled off successfully.

Perhaps that's why the new Star Wars Land/Experience/Shopping Center looks like an extension of Frontierland with spaceships. Disney has relegated almost all of its projects to rocks and trees.

 

[tirian]

We will have to agree to disagree, Kong does nothing for me personally. I feel its a good ride but it doesn't move the needle in either direction.

Many people have told me an updated Kongfrontation would have been better than Skull Island. I'll form my own opinion this November.

 

[asianway]

Many people have told me an updated Kongfrontation would have been better than Skull Island. I'll form my own opinion this November.

Im not a Universal hater, but...Kongfrontation sucked. Sorry, not sorry

 

[BrerJon]

Many people have told me an updated Kongfrontation would have been better than Skull Island. I'll form my own opinion this November.

With Jimmy Fallon and Spider-Man, another New York simulator ride would have been too much, so I think it makes more sense for them to try a new environment instead of just updating Kongfrontation.

 

[tirian]

Im not a Universal hater, but...Kongfrontation sucked. Sorry, not sorry

With Jimmy Fallon and Spider-Man, another New York simulator ride would have been too much, so I think it makes more sense for them to try a new environment instead of just updating Kongfrontation.

NYC doesn't belong in IOA, anyway.

 

[COProgressFan]

With Frozstrom, New Fantasyland, Tangled Restrooms, and now SDL, today's WDI has proven it does not understand forced perspective or placemaking. It's a good thing they outsource rock work, because that is the only element pulled off successfully.

Perhaps that's why the new Star Wars Land/Experience/Shopping Center looks like an extension of Frontierland with spaceships. Disney has relegated almost all of its projects to rocks and trees.

I agree, something has just been "off" about some of the recent additions. Beast's castle being one of the most noticeable failures of forced perspective, but also the Tangled toilets, as you mention. Haven't seen Frozenstrom area in person yet to judge. Won't even go into the issues surrounding the hub redesign. Sometimes its hard to put your finger exactly on why a space doesn't feel right, whether it's building size or placement, or just that it doesn't match the style or feel or surrounding areas. The post by @lazyboy97o did a great job though of explaining it.

As far as faux-rockwork; I've come to realize it's almost WDI's go-to design crutch. They do a good job at it, but it's over used everywhere. A relative, who had never been to WDW before, came with us on our last trip and after a week said he never saw more fake rockwork in his life (unprompted). Having visited for 30 years or so I never really thought of it that way, but he's right.

 

[flynnibus]

The RVs don't have motion tech like IJA, they park on and get locked into massive bladder driven motion platforms. But the truly State of the art part is the WiFi guidance system. It is a far more complex system that Energy/GMR.

But for what purpose? what does it add to the attraction experience vs other guidance systems? Beyond the loop before you enter the building, does anyone even have any views of the tram or path?

 

[flynnibus]

Im not a Universal hater, but...Kongfrontation sucked. Sorry, not sorry

I loved it for the magic of theme park experiences and would take it any day over 'whats the latest CGI and projection quality' movie watching experiences.