What happened to people?

[TheRealSkull]

I recently made my first trip back to WDW in about 4 years. I am relatively new to these forums, so I apologize if there is a more appropriate thread to have this discussion.

But there was something I had realized was different, and it only took me until coming home to realize it. It's the people.

I especially noticed this in people trying to fit everything in. Rope drop, merch, being first in line. I would really experience this at Cosmic Rewind where the guests would hardly pay attention to the pre show, talk over them, shouting inappropriate things in front of children, and rush to be the first ones to the doors before entering in the boarding area to prevent a longer wait time. And I especially noticed it when quite a few began not running, but sprinting to the ride vehicles, ignoring the cast members instructions to walk.

That is just one of many examples I encountered. Overall people seemed more on edge, more miserable, and ruder towards each other, forgetting basic courtesy and kindness. I did not let this affect my vacation whatsoever. But it was hard to look past it at times.

I now make more of an effort to let each cast member know how appreciated they are and to thank them for all of their hard work. I did before, but it seems like they need it now more than ever.

Anyways, thought I'd just post this here and wanted to hear everyone else's thoughts pertaining to this. I've seen discussions like this pop up but haven't noticed a thread dedicated to the topic. Again, if there's a separate thread for this kind of topic, I apologize.

 

[Graham9]

I especially noticed this in people trying to fit everything in. Rope drop, merch, being first in line. I would really experience this at Cosmic Rewind where the guests would hardly pay attention to the pre show, talk over them, shouting inappropriate things in front of children, and rush to be the first ones to the doors before entering in the boarding area to prevent a longer wait time. And I especially noticed it when quite a few began not running, but sprinting to the ride vehicles, ignoring the cast members instructions to walk.

That is just one of many examples I encountered. Overall people seemed more on edge, more miserable, and ruder towards each other, forgetting basic courtesy and kindness. I did not let this affect my vacation whatsoever. But it was hard to look past it at times.

WDW is an amazing place and we have always come away with lots of good memories. But visiting WDW has to be accompanied with a high degree of tolerance of all the things you mention. It has got worse over the years and when we return later this year, I'm sure we will have to put up with the rude miserable people which may be worse than our last visit a few years ago. I'm not sure what can be done about it, except maybe report any bad behaviour to the CM's which may result in getting them thrown out the park. Why people come to the park to be rude and miserable to the detriment to everyone else and pay a lot of money for it is a mystery to me. Perhaps it's a decline in social attitudes or something.

 

[George]

Why people come to the park to be rude and miserable to the detriment to everyone else and pay a lot of money for it is a mystery to me. Perhaps it's a decline in social attitudes or something.

The price of the vacation accompanied by a complicated queuing system that rewards you for getting up before 7AM that costs money is a big factor. Further, ALL queuing systems, going back to fastpass, have changed the psychology of going to the parks. Everything besides rides is devalued to such a degree that only rides are of value. Disney’s own vacation systems reinforce this! Now, these new systems of organization may be necessary due to the increase in crowds and the extraordinarily long period without a new gate to spread them out, but they have changed the mind set of a park visit completely.

On a recent visit, I got together with an old friend who is local. He goes to WDW for a few days every 5 years or so. We went to the parks together in HS a lot (85-88). He wanted to go to the HoP, PotC, and HM. He joined our group at BoG since he wanted to see what the food was like. I got him in our boarding group for Tron, but his interest was less than minimal. Mostly we just walked around, shared memories, and laughed. It helped me realize what a rat race WDW had become. I’ve been in MK many times over a period of time that could be described as 5 decades. All these vacation planning “tools” push me towards a theme park commando mindset and I’m faaar more resistant to it than a once in a lifetime vacationer. The current vacation structure coupled with the cost has definitely had an impact on guest behavior, IMO.

 

[Fox&Hound]

We have turned into a me, me, me culture. I am a teacher. Trust me- I get it. Sad, but I have come to expect that attitude most places now. Good for you for being a light and refusing to give in. Showing kindness to others is the best example we can set.

 

[Goofyernmost]

The price of the vacation accompanied by a complicated queuing system that rewards you for getting up before 7AM that costs money is a big factor. Further, ALL queuing systems, going back to fastpass, have changed the psychology of going to the parks. Everything besides rides is devalued to such a degree that only rides are of value. Disney’s own vacation systems reinforce this! Now, these new systems of organization may be necessary due to the increase in crowds and the extraordinarily long period without a new gate to spread them out, but they have changed the mind set of a park visit completely.

On a recent visit, I got together with an old friend who is local. He goes to WDW for a few days every 5 years or so. We went to the parks together in HS a lot (85-88). He wanted to go to the HoP, PotC, and HM. He joined our group at BoG since he wanted to see what the food was like. I got him in our boarding group for Tron, but his interest was less than minimal. Mostly we just walked around, shared memories, and laughed. It helped me realize what a rat race WDW had become. I’ve been in MK many times over a period of time that could be described as 5 decades. All these vacation planning “tools” push me towards a theme park commando mindset and I’m faaar more resistant to it than a once in a lifetime vacationer. The current vacation structure coupled with the cost has definitely had an impact on guest behavior, IMO.

Couple that with what has been happening in the world and especially this country and it is quite likely the reason for people being uptight and needing to get the value from what they are spending. It is the primary reason why after 40+ years of being a Disney Park Fan (especially WDW) all the desire to ever go there again is gone. I want to remember my escape location the way it was in it incorruptible form instead of how it is today.

I don't say that with any joy. I used to look forward to planning and preparing for every trip I made there, but now, nothing! It was a large part of my life and always something to daydream about, but I had to let it go.

 

[Weather_Lady]

I agree that our culture has become far more selfish, greedy, and nasty. However, in some ways, Disney did this to itself. It builds attractions it knows will be popular, with capacity that it knows will be insufficient. Then it inserts guests into a caste system/rat race that visibly pits the wealthy/G+/mentally or neurologically disabled crowd against the standby crowd all day long and makes guests feel competitive with one another and resentful of those privileged enough to skip ahead (or for the privileged, guilty for doing so), instead of like they're all in the same boat. Then it trains CMs to do absolutely nothing about line cutters, litterbugs, and other miscreants, incentivizing guests to believe they're part of a no-holds-barred, free-for-all battle just to ride something. To top it all off, Disney charges enormous amounts of money, such that guests feel the need to squeeze every dollar of "value" that they can from every minute of the experience, since many of us have resorted to cutting visits shorter and visiting less frequently to make WDW affordable. If my family misses an attraction because we didn't click a link fast enough or spent too much time waiting for something else, it feels like a big deal, because it is: it will be years before we get another chance at it, if ever. While our anxiety about that hasn't escalated to us engaging in bad behavior (although we're certainly not above positioning ourselves near the exit-to-loading-area wall during a preshow, when we know where it is), I can see how it would induce less mannerly people to do so.

Disney has perfected a recipe for heightened stress and boorish behavior by its guests... and its executives are laughing all the way to the bank.

 

[bmr1591]

You have to feel like you got your money’s worth to justify paying the high costs.

 

[mf1972]

we’ve either been lucky or just plain oblivious, but we haven’t seen the full blown rudeness or misbehavior. it doesn’t surprise me however. in general, people have become more entitled & rude as of late. i can put blame on a few things, but i’m trying to not break the rules here. for us, we just try to be courteous to other guests & be mindful & respectful.

 

[donaldtoo]

I agree with many above that Disney helped bring the bad behavior on themselves, but it also seems to me these days that people who were on the verge of being pigs have now gone full-on hog (with all apologies to actual porcine creatures out there ).
I don’t know if it was Covid, or what, but too many these days are completely off their nut.
At this point, I’m almost afraid to tell someone to have a great day anymore, for fear of their response.
And yes, I got a “Whatever.” response the other day.

 

[mysto]

People who have been raised by smartphones have grown up. Lord of the Flies meets raised by wolves, armed with a credit card.

 

[Mireille]

we’ve either been lucky or just plain oblivious, but we haven’t seen the full blown rudeness or misbehavior. it doesn’t surprise me however. in general, people have become more entitled & rude as of late. i can put blame on a few things, but i’m trying to not break the rules here. for us, we just try to be courteous to other guests & be mindful & respectful.

Yeah, I haven't really noticed it either. I have noticed some people wearing confrontational political slogans, which... I mean, it's a vacation, why wear something so provocative (as in, trying to provoke a reaction) at Disney World? I don't get it. But it's whatever, I just walk on by. Maybe it's easier because I almost always vacation solo? Also probably why the prices aren't as big of a deal to me because it's just a little more expensive for me, whereas for a family it's a LOT more expensive.

And maybe the people complaining are more easily irritated as well (due to higher prices and other things), so they attribute to rudeness just normal human obliviousness that we're all guilty of sometimes. I watch some park influencers on YouTube and I've seen the stories about people acting outrageously or drunkenly on parks sites or videos, but I've never seen any an influencer or an (egregiously) drunk person acting out or a fight when I've actually been there. I dunno.

 

[JIMINYCR]

Nothing new, it’s been happening for some years now. You aren’t the first to see it or post a rant about it. The same answers you are getting are the same given in the past. Rudeness and entitlement are the norm with some people now. Fortunately there are still many courteous guests that are at Dis but the bad ones stand out and overpower the nice people. I wish Dis would step up and deal better with the nastiness when it rears its head. Like mentioned above Dis is some what at fault by their park builds and policies. Still doesn’t give guest permission to treat others the way they do. Starts off at childhood when kids grow up without being taught manners and how to treat others.

 

[Andrew25]

Splitting it between both parties...

People

• Social Media - people care more about showing off they are at WDW, versus living in the moment. Take a pic of the castle, post it, put your phone away and enjoy the day.
• Cost - with how expensive it becomes, people have become more aggressive/selfish of making sure that THEY and their family's experience matches expectations, and NOBODY will get in their way
• The "Insiders/Locals" - I'm sure some of you on here have done it, but there's a big culture of "showing off" that you know the parks by reciting lyrics/spiels or speeding through the GOTG queue... nobody cares lol

Disney

• Biggest Issue: lack of capacity. People can justify increased prices when combined with additional expansions/investment into the parks
• The pressure to have a "perfect day" by having everything planned in advance along with justifying the price
• (partially People's fault) LL to Standby Ratios - wait-times are expected, but seeing waves of LL users be prioritized at the ridiculous ratios they've been using can be mentally depleting at times
• Attraction Downtime - Spending thousands of dollars to experience the parks, only to find some experiences down for tech issues is poor guest experience.

Mind you, 95% of the people at any given time are having fun, but there's certainly a decent amount of folks you can tell are just not having it lol

 

[Mr. Pusskers]

This new world we live in post 2020 is noticeably different. It seems it's an all about me crowd now a days and a forgetfulness of manors and how to interact with other families. in life prior and now it takes just take a deep breath and be patient. Everyone is excited to be there, and some people and teens talk during the pre-show and forget that other people are there and around them. It happened to me by accident once due to the excitement of finally going on a ride I never been on. My wife told me tone it down a bit. I looked at her and realized I had one of those I am sorry to people around me incidents and apologized and told them about the big kid in me came out. Everyone laughed and we went on the ride as friends. Seen some of those people again while having dinner and we waved at each other. So I can see how that happens.

What I do not understand is just being rude and knowing that you are so you can get to the front of the line or get a front seat. Maybe if you just asked me, I might say sure go in front of me and I will take the seats behind you. I have done that because a lot of the seats have the same feel because it's the ride experience and all its awe for the first time that has me. I never been on a ride at WDW and said to myself or wife, wish we would have been in the front seat. It's more like I have come off the ride, happy and perhaps acting like a character I seen or singing along to music.

I am at WDW 7 to 10 days most of the time so going on a ride again happens a lot. I try to ignore a lot of things I see and not let that spoil my actions and behavior. You really have to go way out of your way to ruin my moment in time before I go to a cast Member and explained what had just happened with someone to me along with others. I have done that once and once only. Yes, a person was removed and made me feel a little lousy that I had to take that action. My intent is to have fun and act like a kid and have a great day. I don't go on vacation to act like a jerk or cause anyone harm. I want to have fun and enjoy myself and maybe every now and then make a new friend while patiently standing in line like everyone else.

 

[StarWarsGirl]

I definitely noticed when I went to Disneyland that guests are way more chill. In 2017 I went to Disneyland and WDW within a week of each other, and this was glaringly obvious. It's since gotten worse.

I also notice a difference when I've gone to DVC events verses events open to the general public. People who come regularly are much more unbothered by anything going wrong.

The worst kinda of guests are the ones who make the once-in-a-lifetime trip and then expect everything to be absolutely perfect. There's nothing wrong with trips that you only do once, but expecting perfection is where guests dig themselves in a hole. For many WDW parkgoers, this is the case.

 

[JIMINYCR]

Disney

• Biggest Issue: lack of capacity. People can justify increased prices when combined with additional expansions/investment into the parks
• (partially People's fault) LL to Standby Ratios - wait-times are expected, but seeing waves of LL users be prioritized at the ridiculous ratios they've been using can be mentally depleting at times

Was an issue way back when Dis started the original FP paper ticket kiosks. Standing in the standby line and watching the CM allow huge numbers ( I forget what the ratio was at the time of FP allowed to go before standby next went) of FP ticket holders to skip the waits. I remember furious guests yelling at the CM's about why these people get to get on a ride when theyve been waiting a long time. Even when the CM's explained the process that they were following, it didnt calm them down. Some resorted to jumping over the lane into the FP line expecting to get ahead and then when they reached the CM collecting the tickets they were turned away because they held no ticket.

 

[DisneyHead123]

I thought I read somewhere that incidents on airlines went way up post Covid. I definitely noticed a lot more road rage and random acts of rudeness in that first year especially.

Also, what I’ve said before is that I think there’s a societal balance between individual freedoms and group pressure, and so far individual freedoms have increased with every generation. This is not all bad. There was a time when children were beaten with belts and sticks regularly and the local church would shame, gossip, and judge the h*ll out of you just for not fitting in. There are some great things about individualism. The dark side of it, however, is that sometimes people become more egocentric and less aware of the people around them.

 

[marni1971]

Society broadly and in general has gone down the pan. Sadly.

 

[Figgy1]

Raccoons and ferrets running free unleashed and uncaged

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

While there are broader aspects to this, GoG is a bit of a special case. The rush at the end of the preshow has much to do with the design of the ride, and the fact that nobody has been stationed to monitor how people behave when exiting. HM and Dinosaur both have CM's monitoring guests as they exit the preshow rooms in an orderly fashion. Disney should have done the same for GoG.

I would also say the question asked in the preshow invites a (comical) response from the audience. And a joking response fits in with the GoG theming of the attraction. I'm not endorsing crassness; I'm just not surprised.

People have been aggressive at rope drop for a very long time.

It now costs $25 per person for a Rise ILL. If one's family of 6 arrives early, and can be quick at rope drop, that's $150 gets to stay in one's pocket. THAT is the problem.

Treat people like cattle all day, and they will act like cows. IMO, much of the change has to do with decisions WDW has made to pit people against one another.