12 February 2003 Site Update: Project Gemini

Lee

Adventurer
Wow, a lot of strong feelings about this rumor. My 2 cents:

I have been going to Epcot since it opened, and the one thing I have always complained about is the lack of updating for the attractions. Living Seas is now so lifeless that it has become a ghost town, Wonders of Life is a total yawn, even it's "thrill" ride Body Wars, the Land boat ride is fun the first few times, but gets old pretty quick, and by now Spaceship Earth is in serious need of an overhaul. Let's face it, the attraction is showing it's age. The track rattles, quite often the sound goes out, the fiber optics are often not working, and the modern communications that are shown are nowhere near as good as the others, like Greece and the Cavemen. The attraction is crying out for updating and a little TLC.
Now, is a coaster the answer? I don't know. As a coaster enthusiast I would love to ride a cosaster in that sphere. I think seening coaster trains launched into the sphere from one of the Innoventions buildings would be breathtaking, and would be the talk of the theme park world. Mind you, I don't think for a moment that they would do it without some extremely heavy themeing, and "educational" moments.
If we are being completely honest, do we really think that the average park goer visits Epcot to learn? I don't think so. They want fun attractions, the most entertainment for their dollar, and if some learning happens, so be it. Why do you think MK does so much more business than Epcot? People want to ride attractions that make them smile, laugh, and yes even scream. Very few people spend much time at all lingering in the Epcot pavilions that stress learning over entertaining like Living Seas or Wonders of Life. Compare the lines there with the ones at Test Track or when Mission:Space opens. Those old pavilions will be relatively empty, and this is what tells Disney what the guests want. They look at where the lines are, and listen to guests who talk about the most memorable attraction from their visit. How many guests get home and gush to their frinnds abour Spaceship Earth? Compare that to the word of mouth about ToT.
Wow, I've gone too long already, but I must finish by saying that if it were up to me, I would make Spaceship Earth some sort of hybrid attraction between dark ride and coaster, in the spirit of Indy (but not that system). Tell some sort of communication story while giving the people a great ride. If that means that little kids can't ride it, so be it. Most kids don't get SE anyway, and many sleep through it.
 

Lauren

New Member
Spaceship Earth

I just hope that SE turning into a Coaster is just a rumor.
My parents can't even go on roller coasters and I don't like them
that much myself. I thought disney was a family park. If they keep building thrill rides. then my family and I will have no interest in Disney at all. There are a lot of people who can't go on thrill rides because of back problems. It is very sad too think that Disney doesn't care about the older guests who visit the parks. My family and I are DVC members, Florida passholders and stock holders. I just hope that we don't have to give any of it up because we can't enjoy Disney together as a family. Walt Disney would never approve of SE turning into a coaster
:cry:
 

Dizknee_Phreek

Well-Known Member
:cry: :cry: this is indeed horrible news...even if it is still just a rumor. i don't really think there's anything i can say that hasn't already been said...it's just heartbreaking. it certainly will be a huge tragedy if SE turns into a coaster. I consider it one of, if not the most, moving attraction Disney has to offer...the music at the end of it just reaches right down to the very core of me...i get tears in my eyes everytime i hear it! and they want to take that away and replace it with a thrill? that's just not something i get excited about...maybe all of us Epcot 'purists' should ban together and on its last day, ride it and absolutely refuse to get off!
you know, sure the amusement/theme park industry is having to evolve...but what's going to happen to FAMILY vacations? to spend quality time together, families are going to end up having to go the a National Park or something...which certainly isn't a bad thing, but also isn't the most exciting for a young child. I just wonder what Walt would have to say about all this if he could see what was happening...
i'm with Spark...if this happens and Disney doesn't stop to consider the consequences, i may just lose yet another reason to visit Epcot. sure, i'd ride it once out of curiosity, but no promises at all about a 2nd trip on it. i may end up sticking around Future World for 2 reasons...1 being Test Track (a lot of people don't like it, but i do...one of the few recent additions i actually like) and 2. Wonders of Life...i just like the atmosphere there. reminds me of Epcot's golden years! of course, i'll always go back to Epcot for WS!
btw, MKCustodial, LOVE your comments...oh so true! :wave:
 

SirNim

Well-Known Member
There is technology out there (and if there isn't, then it is in my head, my imagination, and thus it has total probability to be developed) I would think, that would be a new breed of coaster, one that isn't based on thrill. One based on stops and procedures. Imagine it for a moment.... *You are on a ride that happens to look like a coaster... You begin the typical ascent into the bowels of a geosphere that is the only one of its kind anywhere. You are slowly, yet smoothly, propelled up and up, faster and faster, until you hit remarkable soft brakes and stop. Right next to you, seemingly floating, is a stage with lights softly turning on. The car stops. Figures slowly emerge from behind this seemingly floating stage in the middle of pure blackness. You can see nothing but the stage. AAs come into view. They tell you the story of communications. Suddenly, the car dips, you are moving again, and this time, you enter the famed tunnel of wires, currently encounted as you go backwards on the modern SE. You are now being propelled through this tunnel of wires, you feel as if though you are riding the Internet. You emerge. You are in space. Again, pure blackness. Some stars blink in the distance. The car stops and seems to hover. You see a satellite... A man made one. And, you see Earth!! You "enter" the satellite, through a little door, and you car moves again, and you hurtle towards Earth!! Very softly, of course, but the IMPRESSION is that you are moving fast. You are now back in Earth. More AA stages come into view, they teach you about communication some more.*

That is what I think of when I hear the three words Spaceship, Earth, and Coaster in the same sentence. We can only hope Disney is pulling our leg with these new rumors, because I personally feel that a overhaul and gut of SE would set Disney up for disaster... Let us hope that this may never be... But if it Is, let us remember and hope that the technology, of which Epcot was founded on, and the Imagination, of which it takes shape, play a part in any new ride, and the philosophy of Walt Disney himself is not interfered with in any way... Long live the Omnimover!!!:D :D
 

Thelazer

Well-Known Member
The only problem I can see, is how the heck are they going to support a coaster inside of it?

Think about it, you'd have to pour a BUNCH of new support footings for the track. You can't just weld a coster track onto the wall of it. How would the sphere look with all those support beams comeing out of it runing the plaza area?

There is already a steel ramp that the current ride track is on. How are they going to rip that out to make room for a coster track? If you rip that thing out, well geez I think you'd have to take the whole sphere with it.

I think the more likely thing were bound to see, is something along the lines of a test track type like ride. It uses the current track space inside the sphere to go up, then at the top it "Bursts" out of the building "AKA DisneySea" and into some outside loop of some sort. Now, how that outside loop would be themed, well god only knows but I'd susepct along the lines of DCA Cala Screaming.

Jay
 

SirNim

Well-Known Member
I don't know, or rather think, we will see anything external, only because anything external will pretty much ruin the remaining ambience of Epcot...

I am thinking that if it does come down that a coaster of some sort will end up in SE, the coaster will most likely stick to the current track/floor... they will not be ripping out any of the support inside I don't see... Basically, I look at it as a Omnimover upgrade, you know... Basically keep the ride scenes intact, but make them much more dramatic and less tied together... Move them around and make it, well, more dramatic. A coaster can do that.. But I hope a coaster doesn't!:)


And if there is even CONSIDERATION of a coaster w/ Disney officials, it must be feasible, engineering-wise and such. If they have to add more supports to SE, then I think it would have been nixed a long time ago and we would have never gotten wind of this rumor...:)
 

DMC-12

It's HarmonioUS, NOT HarmoniYOU.
Originally posted by adr315
i see a SE coaster as direct competition to the Mummy coaster at USO...... Disney is probably hearing how incredible and immersive that ride will be, and they're out to top it.......

I see that the other way around... USF is building the mummy ride to try and top RnRc....
 

Pumbas Nakasak

Heading for the great escape.
Update yes, change perhaps, but replace??? NEVER!!!!

This has got to be the most stupid decision since i voted in the last election. Give us a new country first please rather than meddle with a classic.
 

Lee

Adventurer
Originally posted by imagineer boy
I don't think that SE will have a roller coaster inside of it. It's just to small to have such a thing. I'm betting that it will be a simulator.

Actually, size is not a factor. Spaceship Earth has more room than DL's Space Mountain.
 

orangefan15

New Member
NO COASTERS!!!!:fork:

Man, SE just shouldn't become a coaster...that's just wrong!! Don't kill a classic ride like that to put in another thrill ride. WDW was meant to be for families...putting more thrill rides makes it much less accessible to families who want to spend lots of time together. Even if its just a coaster simulation, that type of ride still has a tendency to make lots of people sick. I just don't see this as a good idea.
 

Lord Alfred

Member
My 2 cents...

I love SE.. It's one of my favorite rides and it embodies the spirit of Epcot during it's golden age ('82-'92). But the problem in designing anything that is futuristic is that it must CONSTANTLY be updated and made new again. First of all, SE is now but a shell of it's former self. Most of the changes haven't been for the better, but they were necessary to keep with the times. Either way, what's done is done. Secondly, the ride system itself is tired, worn, and out-of-date. It would take a major re-investment just to bring it back to top shape with it's original smoothness, quietness, etc. But then you have to ask yourself, "Does the general public want a slow ride where you travel through mostly static scenes of history?" The answer is no. Let me address a few complaints.

"But Walt's vision.."

Please, I love Epcot but it has very little to do with Walt's vision for the concept. To even use this argument is fallacy. The only vision we're messing with is those of the Imagineers who brought most of it to life in '82. And I figure most of them feel the place needs to be updated.

"They're taking away a ride that Adults and Kids can enjoy together"

In all seriousness, SE is not a ride that MOST kids or adults find interesting or fun. In fact, there is very little in Epcot for the kids that wasn't there in '82. SE is interesting and worth riding through, but it certainly won't leave a lasting impression with modern children or youth who will not want to ride through it a second time. As am Epcot lover, I was disheartened to hear friends and family members come back from their first trips to WDW and say "It was great!" Me: What about Epcot? "It was boring." Yeah, adults and kids can ride SE, but in reality most kids would only ride once, and most probably would never ride if you described it to them.

"A coaster?! Blech!"

I believe that a ride can be constructed that is both thrilling and educational, which is the WHOLE POINT OF EPCOT!!! SE as it is now is certainly still educational, but not thrilling to modern sensibilities. A high speed ride can be just as informative. Think about the name "Time Racers". That makes me think of a trip through history, just like SE, but you're moving a lot quicker for some of it. I have FAITH in the imagineers to come up with something that does not betray Epcot's mission. Despite some people's disappointment with the new Imagination or Test Track, they have indeed maintained the mission of the park.

"Why not make a new ride and keep the old"

Come on. They can't even afford to fix and keep CoP open, and that probably costs a pittance of what a massive ride like SE would cost. I don't blame AT&T for pulling sponsorship of SE. In its current state it's hard to hear the soundtrack over the squeaking and churning of the ancient ride mechanism. In the last several trips I've made to Epcot, I've NEVER waited in line for SE. I don't know why they even keep all those Queue areas in out front. I'm sorry guys, but it's simply not worth it.

Besides, Epcot and MK are both full-day parks as it is. First timers usually have to come back to Epcot on an additional day just to take it all in. If this were the attraction-weak MGM or AK, I'd tend to agree, but Epcot's got plenty for the non-regular visitor

In conclusion...

It's time for some of you to let go of something. NOSTALGIA. Epcot of old is DEAD. Let it go. In a way, by clinging to the past glory of our memories, we are betraying the very progressive spirit of Epcot. You can't keep putting update "band-aids" on a ride like SE or CoP and expect them to last forever. People change, and now most of them want and need something more stimulating to arouse thier interest. Original SE was great. It will live on in my memory, and I wish there was a special WDW DVD of it, CoP and other older attractions, but we have to learn to let things go.

Bring on Spaceship Earth: Time Racers!
 

Testtrack321

Well-Known Member
Rumor people. Some things might happen. Others might not. Soarin' might happen and that's all.

Lets just hope SE can remain the same with only minor alterations (SUCH AS REPLACING THOSE CREEKY VEHICLES!!!)
 

Lee

Adventurer
Lord Alfred, I could not agree more.
Your post said what I was trying to say with that long monologe I ended up with.
 

MicBat

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by happy snapper
Update yes, change perhaps, but replace??? NEVER!!!!

This has got to be the most stupid decision since i voted in the last election. Give us a new country first please rather than meddle with a classic.

:sohappy: :sohappy: :sohappy:
 

jcrb

New Member
Originally posted by wdwmagic
My source of info on that (who I have to say is highly reliable), was up until yesterday highly sceptical of the coaster rumor. But along came a document from the people who make such decisions, and it is listed as "Spaceship Earth COASTER". Now to what extent this is a coaster remains to be answered. And of course in its final version it may not be a coaster at all, but it is certain that it is under serious consideration right now.

Personally I will be very sad to see SE go. I would prefer it to remain in its current format.

are the people at Disney HIGH ????
 

Buford

New Member
High lives. Sounds like England in 1819.

*Looks like we need a reform bill after some LYRICAL BALLADS, men and women before their smug complacency becomes shattered*
 

AdLibSean

New Member
If this all goes through, anyone feel like chaining their body to the entrance with me?!! :animwink:

I don't think I can say anything else that hasn't been said. It's the most visited attraction in the park because of its location, and despite the vehicles and video-screens, its an INCREDIBLE attraction. I just don't understand- wait, I do now $$<------- RIGHT! My two cents...
 

Dizknee_Phreek

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by jcrb
are the people at Disney HIGH ????

hehehe! maybe THAT'S why they're always looking for more money...can't buy it if you don't have the cash! besides, they need paper for rolling :zipit: :lookaroun
 

Dizknee_Phreek

Well-Known Member
Originally posted by AdLibSean
If this all goes through, anyone feel like chaining their body to the entrance with me?!! :animwink:

I don't think I can say anything else that hasn't been said. It's the most visited attraction in the park because of its location, and despite the vehicles and video-screens, its an INCREDIBLE attraction. I just don't understand- wait, I do now $$<------- RIGHT! My two cents...

:sohappy: count me in!!! :D

and i agree...they seem to be in it more for the money these days than for making quality family entertainment.
 

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