Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[correcaminos]

Was it wrong though?

Read my post and see why I don't agree - it was an oversimplification that is dangerous to those who would not be the 1%

Sure the average may be there, but when you're in a different risk group, following averages is a bad idea.

 

[GoofGoof]

Without a vaccine, it is 99+ unlikely to die from covid, it least that’s what we were told.

That was a bad way to look a things from day 1. Was 9/11 no big deal because 99.999999% of Americans didn’t die?

Just about all of the deaths from covid are in the unvaccinated group. Our daily average of deaths still extrapolates out to 90,000+ deaths in a year. Just about all are preventable if people took the vaccine. That’s 90,000 families having an unnecessary funeral for a loved one. 90,000 people who played Russian roulette and lost. Breakthrough infections are possible in the vaccinated group but that‘s really only the case because covid has room to spread in the unvaccinated. In a fantasy world where everyone was vaccinated covid cases would go to zero or near zero each day and deaths would likely be single digits if any at all. All it would take is 90 seconds of people’s lives. Instead….we do it the hard way ;(

 

[DisneyDebRob]

Sorry to hear about your friend, but nothing in life is 100% safe, it's all a question of risk. Every time you get in a car you are at risk of becoming a statistic.

I understand the point you are making but the car reference is a bad comparison. In fact when anyone say you have risk driving in the car.. it’s true.. but their are laws to keep you safer. It’s the law to obey speed limits.. law to wear a seatbelt.. laws for no distractions like texting while driving.. no getting behind the wheel if impaired in anyway etc. All these combined make it tougher for you to die when in a car. Do people still die? Of course.. breaking the laws is the main reason.. speeding.. drunk drivers.. not being able to put down the phone because you have to text etc.
With Covid, there is just a good chance of not dying if your younger and in good health. That’s just taking a chance if you decide to not get the vaccine. No laws to help you have a better chance of surviving, none. There’s something that will help though, the vaccine. Get it. Stop believing you don’t need it. Get it.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

Tell that to my 20 year old friend who caught Covid and died within 2 weeks. Oh, they said, he's not at high risk. Now he's a statistic.

I’m very sorry to read that.

Sometimes, it's just your time.

Sorry to hear about your friend, but nothing in life is 100% safe, it's all a question of risk.

 

[mmascari]

The car analogy is fair, every time I get in my car it could lead to an accident and potentially death but I can tell you with 100% certainty if there was a shot or a device I could use that made it 95% unlikely I’d be injured in an accident and 99%+ unlikely to die I’d take it in a heartbeat.

I bet you did do this actually.

Are you driving a car from before 1968 with no seat belts?

Maybe that’s to far, perhaps a 1980 Pinto?

Maybe something newer than 1999 with air bags required?

How about crumple zones?

I bet you have a car with automatic emergency braking too. Soon to be required for all cars.

We do all kinds of things to make driving safer every year.

 

[DisneyCane]

Of course this is true, but with Covid there’s a vaccine that makes you 95% unlikely to even get sick if exposed and 99%+ unlikely to die. All you need to do is take 2 shots that combined take about 90 seconds to get. The car analogy is fair, every time I get in my car it could lead to an accident and potentially death but I can tell you with 100% certainty if there was a shot or a device I could use that made it 95% unlikely I’d be injured in an accident and 99%+ unlikely to die I’d take it in a heartbeat.

I agree and have been quite surprised at the number of people who elect not to take a safe and simple step to minimize their risk.

I bet you did do this actually.

Are you driving a car from before 1968 with no seat belts?

Maybe that’s to far, perhaps a 1980 Pinto?

Maybe something newer than 1999 with air bags required?

How about crumple zones?

I bet you have a car with automatic emergency braking too. Soon to be required for all cars.

We do all kinds of things to make driving safer every year.

We do but we could make driving almost 100% safe. We just aren't willing to make the trade offs in comfort, efficiency and cost. The crash that Ryan Newman survived last year at the Daytona 500 shows that vehicles can be made nearly 100% safe in any normal driving situation. We just aren't willing to wear helmets and five point harnesses, get 10 MPG and pay more for a safety cage.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

I agree and have been quite surprised at the number of people who elect not to take a safe and simple step to minimize their risk.

Continuing to mask and distance until the percentage goes up is also a “safe and simple step” to minimize risk and yet many get extremely hostile at the very suggestion.

 

[DisneyCane]

Continuing to mask and distance until the percentage goes up is also a “safe and simple step” to minimize risk and yet many get extremely hostile at the very suggestion.

There's no reason to continue to take those steps since the vaccine is available with no wait or hoops to jump through to anybody who wants to protect themselves. This has been the case for a couple of months now.

Also, as @GoofGoof has posted, there is a ceiling to the percentage vaccinated. For adults we're currently at 67.1% with at least one dose and, using polls and people vaccinated to date, @GoofGoof has put the ceiling at approximately 75% of adults. That's only an additional 8% from where we are now which isn't going to make a huge difference to community transmission.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

There's no reason to continue to take those steps since the vaccine is available with no wait or hoops to jump through to anybody who wants to protect themselves. This has been the case for a couple of months now.

Saving lives would be a reason.

 

[danlb_2000]

Saving lives would be a reason.

So what would your deaths per day threshold be for not wearing masks anymore?

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

So what would your deaths per day threshold be for not wearing masks anymore?

70% of the population vaccinated would probably be my threshold if I was solely going to determine the rules.

 

[DisneyCane]

Saving lives would be a reason.

The people who's lives would be saved are 99% people who choose not to get vaccinated and protect themselves.

70% of the population vaccinated would probably be my threshold if I was solely going to determine the rules.

I'm glad you're not making the rules. We may never get to 70% of the population vaccinated.

 

[Zummi Gummi]

70% of the population vaccinated would probably be my threshold if I was solely going to determine the rules.

Why should the vaccinated have to continue to suffer because of the actions of the unvaccinated? The vaccine is safe and available- anyone eligible choosing not to receive it at this point is rolling the dice and playing a “lottery with death” as the governor of West Virginia put it.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

The people who's lives would be saved are 99% people who choose not to get vaccinated and protect themselves.

I'm glad you're not making the rules. We may never get to 70% of the population vaccinated.

Such rules can be an incentive. As @Jrb1979 noted, Canadian provinces went slower on re-opening and used vaccination rates as the guideline for removing restrictions. Canada has now passed the USA in vaccines administered per capita and will pass the USA in fully vaccinated numbers soon as well.

Meanwhile in Florida the vaccinated rate was at 38% or so and suddenly the rules were all gone, leaving many of us going "huh?".

In Canada it's quite clear that getting vaccinated is the key to returning to normal. In the USA it's more or less optional, and the results are kind of unsurprising as a result.

 

[DonniePeverley]

Florida is averaging 2,241 cases/day, a 55% increase over the last 14 days.

That’s 17% of all cases in the US. Florida needs to surge its vaccine effort.

 

[willtravel]

Tell that to my 20 year old friend who caught Covid and died within 2 weeks. Oh, they said, he's not at high risk. Now he's a statistic.

I have a friend that said she will not get the Covid shot because of how many people who died from the shot. I think it works both ways.

 

[mmascari]

I have a friend that said she will not get the Covid shot because of how many people who died from the shot. I think it works both ways.

How many was it?

How many does she think it was?

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Why should the vaccinated have to continue to suffer because of the actions of the unvaccinated?

1. I don’t think wearing a mask in crowded public settings is suffering.

2. Children can’t be vaccinated yet. Pretty sure once children can be vaccinated and we get full FDA approval we can get pretty close to 70%. Just my guess of course.

 

[Zummi Gummi]

1. I don’t think wearing a mask in crowded public settings is suffering.

2. Children can’t be vaccinated yet. Pretty sure once children can be vaccinated and we get full FDA approval we can get pretty close to 70%. Just my guess of course.

We’ll have to agree to disagree about 1 (I was happy to do it before I was fully vaccinated, lest you think I’m one of the loons), but regarding 2, I think you’re right. Even if a small percentage of parents choose to vaccinate their children under 12, it’ll easily push the country over 70%, probably even 75%, though I don’t think it’ll get much higher than that. Too many people are way too entrenched on the anti-vaxx side.

 

[BrianLo]

Without a vaccine, it is 99+ unlikely to die from covid, it least that’s what we were told.

Do you engage in anything that has a 0.5% risk of mortality from a single exposure?

This demonstrates a grievous misunderstanding of risk and how statistics can be manipulated to imply something is ‘safe’. Getting COVID is incredibly risky for what people actually tolerate and accept in their everyday lives.