Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[GimpYancIent]

I don't know this, and I'm just speculating, but I wonder if the initial tests were rapid tests, which are far less accurate, and when the PCR tests came in, they came back negative? I know that has happened more often than not.

All too often!

 

[JoeCamel]

Now you see?

See what? A deliberate attempt to skew data? No, I see lazy

 

[oceanbreeze77]

Ive been very strict with my covid protocols, you all know that. But after being vaccinated, and feeling satisfied with the supporting data during the spring, I've spent the last few months having a blast. Gone out a ton, went on 3 trips, etc. I will now be scaling back drastically. At least until we get more research on this variant. I'm also weary because of the rising covid cases we are currently seeing. Hopefully this will blow over soon, but for the moment it is worrisome.

 

[hopemax]

I'm not looking to get into the mask debate, but the one thing that seems to be different than before was, at least at one time, things did take different turns in the past year +, but for a long time, I kept reading "You wear a mask to protect others" as only a properly fitting N95 mask was said to be effective for the wearer, but 2 layers of cloth were said to do something to prevent the wearer from spreading droplets. This was all prior to the vaccine being available and the wearer being vaccinated. But the WHO statement clearly says that even if you are vaccinated they want you wearing a mask to protect yourself. That seems to be a different message. Again, not looking to get into a debate, just offering an answer to the question of what changed"

I haven't interpreted the WHO recommendations to be primarily for the wearer. Their statements have stated it's to minimize community spread, same as it has been. There is a lot we don't know about the transmissibility of the variants. We know vaccinated people are continuing to contract the virus (it's not an impenetrable shield), and the virus is replicating well enough for people to test positive. So what does that mean for transmission? The studies so far show that transmission by vaccinated people is greatly diminished, but that doesn't equal zero. Laws of large numbers, again. I've seen studies that indicate a one-to-one transmission between a vaccinated person is unlikely because their viral load is lower. What I would also like to see is what happens when several positive, but vaccinated people work in the same poorly ventilated space for 8 hours, 5 days a week. Can people cumulatively expel enough virus that lingers, that an unvaccinated person can still become infected with a more transmissible variant like Delta, and then go onto infect other unvaccinated people in a one-on-one, full viral load manner. I interpret the WHO's recommendation is that we can't wait for updated studies with every variant of what is safe or not. It's better to be safe than sorry and if everyone continues the easy precautions of hygiene and mask wearing then that will deter new infections from occurring for everyone, which translates into less community spread.

Unlike the US strategy which is challenge trials for everything since the unvaccinated will be the ones to realize the consequences.

 

[Trauma]

I haven't interpreted the WHO recommendations to be primarily for the wearer. Their statements have stated it's to minimize community spread, same as it has been. There is a lot we don't know about the transmissibility of the variants. We know vaccinated people are continuing to contract the virus (it's not an impenetrable shield), and the virus is replicating well enough for people to test positive. So what does that mean for transmission? The studies so far show that transmission by vaccinated people is greatly diminished, but that doesn't equal zero. Laws of large numbers, again. I've seen studies that indicate a one-to-one transmission between a vaccinated person is unlikely because their viral load is lower. What I would also like to see is what happens when several positive, but vaccinated people work in the same poorly ventilated space for 8 hours, 5 days a week. Can people cumulatively expel enough virus that lingers, that an unvaccinated person can still become infected with a more transmissible variant like Delta, and then go onto infect other unvaccinated people in a one-on-one, full viral load manner. I interpret the WHO's recommendation is that we can't wait for updated studies with every variant of what is safe or not. It's better to be safe than sorry and if everyone continues the easy precautions of hygiene and mask wearing then that will deter new infections from occurring for everyone, which translates into less community spread.

Unlike the US strategy which is challenge trials for everything since the unvaccinated will be the ones to realize the consequences.

So I keep reading about all then unvaccinated people that Im suppose to be so concerned about because they can’t take 10 minutes out of their day to get a free shot.

If fully vaccinated people can spread it to other fully vaccinated people leading to hospitalizations and deaths in large enough numbers to be of concern then that’s a problem.

I don’t see any data that’s even close to suggesting that’s happening.

That’s just like the doom of rising case numbers in Europe.

I don’t care how many people are infected.

How many vaccinated people are infected and how many of them are sick enough to be hospitalized or die.

Those are the numbers that matter.

 

[Trauma]

Where I live is very democratic and everyone wore masks everywhere including me. I would say mask compliance was very very high.

When did our numbers plummet? When the vaccines came out.

The vaccines are like a mask on steroids.

Let’s focus on what really works. People need to get vaccinated that’s all it comes down to.

If not enough people do then this will never go away. The economy can’t survive work from home socially distanced mask world.

 

[Lilofan]

The Orlando Sentinel is reporting that Orange County is showing more cases of the Delta variant.

 

[hopemax]

So I keep reading about all then unvaccinated people that Im suppose to be so concerned about because they can’t take 10 minutes out of their day to get a free shot.

If fully vaccinated people can spread it to other fully vaccinated people leading to hospitalizations and deaths in large enough numbers to be of concern then that’s a problem.

I don’t see any data that’s even close to suggesting that’s happening.

That’s just like the doom of rising case numbers in Europe.

I don’t care how many people are infected.

How many vaccinated people are infected and how many of them are sick enough to be hospitalized or die.

Those are the numbers that matter.

My post was in regards to the World Health Organization’s recommendations. Their mission extends beyond what is good for the United States. The world does not have the vaccine availability you do. Or do you really expect that the WHO would say, “the United States is handled, so every other person on Earth, you do the same thing as them?”

Or did you just take my post as an opportunity to rant about something unrelated to why a world organization would say something different than an American entity?

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

Where I live is very democratic and everyone wore masks everywhere including me. I would say mask compliance was very very high.

When did our numbers plummet? When the vaccines came out.

The vaccines are like a mask on steroids.

Let’s focus on what really works. People need to get vaccinated that’s all it comes down to.

If not enough people do then this will never go away. The economy can’t survive work from home socially distanced mask world.

I’m not sure it’s ever going away, however… if the vaccinations can limit severe cases and deaths it becomes just another virus we live with.

A couple of my direct coworkers have been out with Covid since last week, both unvaccinated, and so far none of us who are vaccinated have shown any signs we caught it, working (who knows how many day’s) alongside a couple people who have since tested positive is pretty intimidating but also further proof to me that the vaccines work.

 

[DisneyCane]

Well DCL was to do a test cruise tomorrow, guess what happened on the way to the sailing?
Cancelled due to too many positive test results among the cast sailing (was all cast 300+). Don't count this virus out yet, it may rise fron the pit of vaccination.
Get your shot people, legitimate health concerns yeah but everyone else it is not worse than catching this crud, I'm 14 months out and still joint and muscle pain out of the blue, I'm concerned it may be what I deal with from here on out.

I think I read that most were false positives/ inaccurate tests but who knows if that was PR spin.

False results wouldn't be surprising. With all of these tests there are both false positive and false negative results. However, the lower the prevalence of infection, the more likely that false results are going to be false positive. If you have 300 people tested and none of them are actually infected, you can't have a false negative test.

When doing an experiment like this, they really need to do two swabs and send them to two different labs. If both tests agree then it is a true result. If there is a disagreement, they have to do another test in the same manner to break the tie.

Remember during college football season when Nick Saban tested positive and was going to have to be away from the team for two weeks (I don't think they lowered it to ten days at that point yet)? He insisted on getting several more tests in subsequent days and they all came back negative and he was released from the protocol.

 

[DisneyCane]

I’m not sure it’s ever going away, however… if the vaccinations can limit severe cases and deaths it becomes just another virus we live with.

A couple of my direct coworkers have been out with Covid since last week, both unvaccinated, and so far none of us who are vaccinated have shown any signs we caught it, working (who knows how many day’s) alongside a couple people who have since tested positive is pretty intimidating but also further proof to me that the vaccines work.

If it doesn't mutate to the point that immunity (both natural and vaccine induced) is no longer effective then it will eventually go away. At some point the total immune from vaccines or infection will reach the herd immunity threshold. It could be several years until that happens worldwide whereas, if the entire world got vaccinated at a high (70%+ probably) rate, it would go away in a few months at most.

To your point, the vaccines work. I hope that your employer doesn't give any extra sick leave benefits to those coworkers who elected not to be vaccinated and now have to miss work due to getting infected.

 

[DisneyCane]

Even though we dropped the optimism from the thread title I‘ll share this here anyway:

Study suggests Pfizer, Moderna COVID-19 vaccines could provide 'years' of protection

Study suggests Pfizer, Moderna COVID-19 vaccines could provide 'years' of protection

www.yahoo.com

That's great news. As I've previously expressed, if boosters were required it would really hurt the vaccination effort and the more frequent the worse it would be. If it was needed in 2-5 years, that would be acceptable to most and, if the virus hasn't been eradicated by then, would allow us to keep up the level of protection.

A sobering read from the BBC journalist and presenter Andrew Marr:

Marr on catching Covid after being double vaccinated

The BBC's Andrew Marr fell ill with Covid-19, despite being vaccinated twice.

www.bbc.com

To quote his concluding words, "stay cautious, stay safe."

A bit of sensationalism. His definition of "serious illness" has a very low threshold. The issue with COVID is when it causes people to have an illness which could be life threatening. A couple of days of uncomfortable "flu-like" symptoms is not an issue. I don't think there is anybody on earth over 25 years old that hasn't been sick like that at least once in their life.

I know the article was trying to encourage people who have been vaccinated to still take measures not to spread infection but could possibly add to a "vaccines don't work" narrative by anti-vax people.

 

[DisneyDebRob]

That's great news. As I've previously expressed, if boosters were required it would really hurt the vaccination effort and the more frequent the worse it would be. If it was needed in 2-5 years, that would be acceptable to most and, if the virus hasn't been eradicated by then, would allow us to keep up the level of protection.

A bit of sensationalism. His definition of "serious illness" has a very low threshold. The issue with COVID is when it causes people to have an illness which could be life threatening. A couple of days of uncomfortable "flu-like" symptoms is not an issue. I don't think there is anybody on earth over 25 years old that hasn't been sick like that at least once in their life.

I know the article was trying to encourage people who have been vaccinated to still take measures not to spread infection but could possibly add to a "vaccines don't work" narrative by anti-vax people.

The issue with COVID is not only getting a life threatening issue, but also possibly getting something that you may have to live with the rest of your life. Just ask a few posters here what they are still dealing with after a year or more of having it.
Bottom line still stands.. get vaccinated.

 

[DisneyCane]

The issue with COVID is not only getting a life threatening issue, but also possibly getting something that you may have to live with the rest of your life. Just ask a few posters here what they are still dealing with after a year or more of having it.
Bottom line still stands.. get vaccinated.

This story was about somebody who was vaccinated. I was commenting on him calling it a "serious illness" when, from the actual description of symptoms he didn't have a "serious illness" after being vaccinated.

 

[Polkadotdress]

Did he ever say what happens if it goes above 5% again?

From a recent article in the Orlando Sentinel:
"He said the positivity rate, which has been under 5% here for three weeks, would have to at least double to persuade him to reconsider."

 

[DisneyCane]

Did he ever say what happens if it goes above 5% again?

From a recent article in the Orlando Sentinel:
"He said the positivity rate, which has been under 5% here for three weeks, would have to at least double to persuade him to reconsider."

How do I get a ticket to whatever planet he is living on? In two days, a law goes into effect that makes it that a county government will not be able to do anything with respect to COVID. Not an executive order that is on shaky legal ground but a State law with clear legislative intent.

He can make recommendations and issue guidance but there will be nothing that can possibly have any legal power behind it.

 

[Heppenheimer]

How do I get a ticket to whatever planet he is living on? In two days, a law goes into effect that makes it that a county government will not be able to do anything with respect to COVID. Not an executive order that is on shaky legal ground but a State law with clear legislative intent.

He can make recommendations and issue guidance but there will be nothing that can possibly have any legal power behind it.

Wow, that is a spectacularly poorly thought out law, that a local government can not set health policy as they see fit for local conditions?

 

[dreday3]

After vaccinations and unfortunately people just protected because they caught it, won't Covid not go away completely but rather evolve into a flu-like illness - meaning it's yearly, people may get sick with a mild illness (severe in rarer cases) and we deal with it like other illnesses?

I know it's still "new" and people are worried about the Delta variant but, eventually, we can't start panicking or asking everyone to revert back to masks just because positivity rates start to increase. Even if the rates increase, yet hospitalizations/deaths don't - perhaps then it should be up to individual to wear a mask or not (would hope if you are sick, wear one).

I'm just saying - the train has left the station. I understand why the WHO is asking people to mask up, I just don't think it will happen again here in the USA.

 

[SamusAranX]

Re: DCL

It astounds me that after over a year, they still are experiencing problems with false-positive tests.

 

[Zummi Gummi]

Wow, that is a spectacularly poorly thought out law, that a local government can not set health policy as they see fit for local conditions?

Well, it's coming from the same guy who's fighting the cruise industry on vaccine requirements, so...