Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Tony the Tigger]

What's clear (at least to me) is that there is a point where the government does step over the line. Are we going to be required to wear masks indoors when the number of COVID deaths drops below the historical average of influenza death (36,000 per year)? Are we going to be allowed to shake hands again? At what point does the government step over the line and violate our pre-existing rights?

It seems pretty simple and standard to me: your rights stop at my nose. Ergo, your "right" to not wear a mask upon entering the public square (indoors) is trumped by the rest of the folks' right to life (either directly, person to person, or societally, by spreading and lengthening the pandemic.)

 

[Joesixtoe]

It seems pretty simple and standard to me: your rights stop at my nose. Ergo, your "right" to not wear a mask upon entering the public square (indoors) is trumped by the rest of the folks' right to life (either directly, person to person, or societally, by spreading and lengthening the pandemic.)

Like many others I have to wear a mask all day at work, I can't imagine the pounding my lungs take. You think covid hits your lungs hard, I bet inhaling your co2 all day long isn't any better and don't be surprised if there isn't lawsuits popping up in the future cause of this. Are masks indoors good? Sure, but we weren't created for it and let's not prolong something just because the science is so divisive on the subject.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Like many others I have to wear a mask all day at work, I can't imagine the pounding my lungs take. You think covid hits your lungs hard, I bet inhaling your co2 all day long isn't any better and don't be surprised if there isn't lawsuits popping up in the future cause of this. Are masks indoors good? Sure, but we weren't created for it and let's not prolong something just because the science is so divisive on the subject.

There is zero truth to the "CO2 buildup" theories. None whatsoever.

Do face masks make you retain carbon dioxide?

Do face masks impede your breathing or make you retain carbon dioxide (CO2)? Intensive Care Unit physician Greg Schmidt, MD, settles the argument for us in this Epi Explains video.

uihc.org

 

[DCBaker]

Current Florida vaccine report -

 

[Touchdown]

Like many others I have to wear a mask all day at work, I can't imagine the pounding my lungs take. You think covid hits your lungs hard, I bet inhaling your co2 all day long isn't any better and don't be surprised if there isn't lawsuits popping up in the future cause of this. Are masks indoors good? Sure, but we weren't created for it and let's not prolong something just because the science is so divisive on the subject.

Please do some research on lung physiology. You inhale CO2 every day. A mask makes little difference, not when compared to all your airway dead space (150mL or 5oz in a healthy person.)

 

[Heppenheimer]

There is zero truth to the "CO2 buildup" theories. None whatsoever.

Do face masks make you retain carbon dioxide?

Do face masks impede your breathing or make you retain carbon dioxide (CO2)? Intensive Care Unit physician Greg Schmidt, MD, settles the argument for us in this Epi Explains video.

uihc.org

As an example, one of my patients with advanced COPD wears a mask religiously (he can't afford to get COVID, or it will be lights out for him). Wearing a mask, his O2 sats drop not a pinch, and his respiratory rate remains the same. When he was in the ER once this year, his CO2 level remained within normal limits on blood gas analysis, despite mask use.

Medical masks do not cause CO2 retention. That would defy physics.

 

[Angel Ariel]

As an example, one of my patients with advanced COPD wears a mask religiously (he can't afford to get COVID, or it will be lights out for him). Wearing a mask, his O2 sats drop not a pinch, and his respiratory rate remains the same. When he was in the ER once this year, his CO2 level remained within normal limits on blood gas analysis, despite mask use.

Medical masks do not cause CO2 retention. That would defy physics.

This goes back to the fact that people *choose* to be uneducated about this. It doesn’t matter how many times you say it. SMH.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

As an example, one of my patients with advanced COPD wears a mask religiously (he can't afford to get COVID, or it will be lights out for him). Wearing a mask, his O2 sats drop not a pinch, and his respiratory rate remains the same. When he was in the ER once this year, his CO2 level remained within normal limits on blood gas analysis, despite mask use.

Medical masks do not cause CO2 retention. That would defy physics.

I mean, I get it. Masks and having to keep track of how close you are to other people suck.

But people are grasping at straws to get rid of safety measures RIGHT NOW, because that's what they want.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

Like many others I have to wear a mask all day at work, I can't imagine the pounding my lungs take. You think covid hits your lungs hard, I bet inhaling your co2 all day long isn't any better and don't be surprised if there isn't lawsuits popping up in the future cause of this. Are masks indoors good? Sure, but we weren't created for it and let's not prolong something just because the science is so divisive on the subject.

Sorry, don’t buy this at all. See: medical professionals. See also: I have asthma.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Sorry, don’t buy this at all. See: medical professionals. See also: I have asthma.

Me too. I wear a mask religiously when I'm around anyone who isn't in my bubble.

 

[danlb_2000]

No. Lift them today. Not “start thinking of maybe contemplating removing some restrictions.” I know you’re not ready to give up your safety blanket of restrictions, but there is no longer any justification for any of it.

That is a rather selfish point of view. At least give people who want to a chance to get fully vaccinated.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

That is a rather selfish point of view. At least give people who want to a chance to get fully vaccinated.

(Not to mention there are still teens who are physically the size of adults who can't get vaccinated yet. My 15-year-old is taller than me and weighs more than I do. I'm 5'5" and 110lbs.)

 

[danlb_2000]

Like many others I have to wear a mask all day at work, I can't imagine the pounding my lungs take. You think covid hits your lungs hard, I bet inhaling your co2 all day long isn't any better and don't be surprised if there isn't lawsuits popping up in the future cause of this. Are masks indoors good? Sure, but we weren't created for it and let's not prolong something just because the science is so divisive on the subject.

There are a lot of occupations that require regular wearing of masks, and not just in the medical field, also in places where there is risk of dust or other particulate inhalation. Mask wearing was also common in other countries, especially in Asia, prior to the pandemic. If there were serious risks to wearing a mask I think we would have known about it by now.

 

[vikescaper]

I know it is unscientific but I just checked my blood oxygen level with my watch and I am currently at 100%. That’s with wearing a mask all day at MK with the exception of when I was eating lunch or taking a break in a relaxation station.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

There are a lot of occupations that require regular wearing of masks, and not just in the medical field, also in places where there is risk of dust or other particulate inhalation. Mask wearing was also common in other countries, especially in Asia, prior to the pandemic. If there were serious risks to wearing a mask I think we would have known about it by now.

NOT wearing a mask while grinding metals in jewelry was a major contributor to my aunt's relatively early death in her early 60s.

 

[Chi84]

I was at WDW last week when the heat indexes were around 100. Wearing a mask was extremely uncomfortable in that kind of heat and humidity. People were doing the best they could, but we did notice a lot of groups sitting wherever they could find some shade passing some drinks around. As long as you were sitting and sipping a bottle of water, I think you were okay as far as the rules were concerned. Disney Springs was very crowded, and if there were CMs enforcing any rules, we sure didn't see them.

We went to use expiring DVC points and we ended up skipping MK and one of our HS days. We did spend a lot of time at Blizzard Beach and the resort pool. My advice to anyone who is uncomfortable with masks and is considering going during the summer would be to wait until WDW relaxes the mask requirement, at least outdoors.

 

[Tom P.]

Isn’t that what is happening? Multiple states already have no statewide Covid restrictions, individual local areas like Orange County FL are relaxing their restrictions in a phased approach. Blue state governors in NY/NJ/CT/PA have all either set dates for the removal of Covid restrictions or talked about the timing and even the CA Governor suggested all Cpvid restrictions would be lifted there by mid-June if vaccination pace continued. It seems to me like we are well on our way to start lifting the Covid restrictions almost everywhere.

No, Gottlieb was actually arguing that they should pretty much be lifted immediately, at least for a large portion of the country. He said, "And so I think we're at a point in time where we can start lifting these ordinances in a wholesale fashion."

When Fauci was later asked about Gottlieb's opinion that we could start losing the indoor mask mandates, Fauci said he agreed, but also added that it would be coming soon and that the CDC would be updating its guidance as our cases get lower. So Fauci was more measured. But Gottlieb clearly thinks most of the indoor mask rules should be gone now.

 

[GoofGoof]

No, Gottlieb was actually arguing that they should pretty much be lifted immediately, at least for a large portion of the country. He said, "And so I think we're at a point in time where we can start lifting these ordinances in a wholesale fashion."

When Fauci was later asked about Gottlieb's opinion that we could start losing the indoor mask mandates, Fauci said he agreed, but also added that it would be coming soon and that the CDC would be updating its guidance as our cases get lower. So Fauci was more measured. But Gottlieb clearly thinks most of the indoor mask rules should be gone now.

I agree with him. We can start lifting these ordinances in a wholesale fashion. That doesn’t mean everything has to be lifted today. Many states have either already lifted all restrictions or announced plans to lift most of them soon. It’s happening. We should all be happy and celebrate that the end is near.

I see some of this as the last gasp of people who spent over a year constantly fighting with each other. We are finally getting what most people wanted and restrictions are being lifted but some people (on both sides) aren’t ready to give up the fight. So people who wanted all restrictions dropped months ago are now going to gripe that it’s not happening fast enough because that’s all that’s left to gripe about. On the flip side people who claimed they wanted us to follow the science and keep reasonable restrictions for as long as they were needed now don’t want to see restrictions lifted, but that was the plan all along and they claimed they were on board.

For me, I’m happy to see the vaccine rollout working and happy to see the restrictions which were necessary at one point being relaxed. I’m perfectly happy to wait a little longer for everything to be rolled back. Where I live they opened the vaccine to the general public less than a month ago so many people who went in ASAP still haven’t gotten their second dose. In a month or less time we will be a lot further along. I also think we still need to fight to get the remaining people who are going to get the vaccine in and we can put this pandemic behind us for good.

 

[Chi84]

I just received a survey from WDW asking several questions about what I thought of the health and safety measures at SSR. It was very satisfying to fill it out.

 

[hopemax]

I am hoping someone tackles this mystery at some point. I would be interesting to do a deep analysis on the course of the pandemic from state to state to try to understand why it played out the way it did.

I don't think it's a big mystery as lay people might think. We track migratory patterns of animals, we tracked migratory patterns of early humans, I would bet that COVID outbreaks track with traditional migratory patterns of the local and transient populations of modern humans. Some states, even in pandemic, have a lot of movement; others even without a pandemic not so much. Vacationers, workers who live across state lines, business travel. If people wonder why Michigan was a hot spot, I would say look at the movements between UK - Toronto - Detroit - Elsewhere in MI. If people wonder why not the South, what would be the insertion point for the virus or a variant? What would be the event, the travel destination, the business destination that would have people exposed in place A , transporting to place B? If an area doesn't get a lot of "cross-pollination" that would be protective against a virus.

Limiting movement, either by an order or voluntarily (some places, simply aren't popular destinations) is more effective than most other mitigations. Wyoming's governor has joked through this that they've been social distancing since the founding of the state (although they forgot to consider the tourists) But for a lot of places it's true. Then you're looking at family gatherings like weddings (which may be outside) or the Halloween - New Years period. Some places may not know how well things are until those big yearly activities happen. We shouldn't be expecting an outbreak in a place people rarely go or rarely leave to immediately follow a dial change because the virus can't respond to it. Maybe the next flight to rural wherever for the virus isn't until somebody's June wedding. Kinda like how Disney opened WDW in Oct and attendance was low, but despite the big change in status (closed -> open) it took the event, Thanksgiving, to trigger the human migration. If the virus isn't in a location, and there's not a lot of opportunity to move into a location, nothing is going to happen. It's what happens when someone shows up with the virus, especially if there is a reason for a lot of people to gather (work, church, event, etc), then you see the effects.