Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Disstevefan1]

The estimate is from March of last year. It hasn’t been narrowed down.

My point was it was not a narrow estimate.....

 

[sullyinMT]

At the risk of turning this back into the mask thread of last summer, all I’m seeing is people saying they’re comfortable personally bu will continue to follow guidelines out of respect and to continue being an example in their community.

As I’ve stated before, if those same people get vaccinated and are now comfortable dining out where allowed or some other allowed activity, how else do we get to “normal” as people vaccinate? No one is saying they’re getting a vaccine and will storm their local NBA arena demanding to be part of a sellout crowd two weeks later. They’re (we’re) willing to wait it out, so to speak, but will likely participate a little more out of their homes.

 

[LittleBuford]

My point was it was not a narrow estimate.....

Because there were (and remain) many unknowns. You initially claimed that the estimates “were way off”, whereas you’re now saying they were too broad.

 

[hopemax]

What are you being so insulting about? No need to be so rude. Try reading the rest of my posts before you feel the need to lecture and scold. Did I say I was going without the mask? Nope, because we can't yet. But if we could (and I gave parameters of how in other post), I would.
In fact this is exactly what I posted
"I already stated I will continue wearing masks, following guidelines as obviously not enough people have been vaccinated yet.
But if that wasn't needed, if most were vaccinated, numbers drop, requirements dropped, etc. - why would I continue to wear masks after vaccination?"

Sorry you are upset because I believe the vaccine will work?

I explained why people would continue to wear masks, like you asked. I repeat: the vaccine will not work for everyone. We already know that. That has no relevancy to your personal willingness to follow the rules. I don't understand why you keep making it about that. It's not about you. It's about what the vaccine is and isn't. It's not an impenetrable shield. Do you disagree that some vaccinated will still get sick?

 

[oceanbreeze77]

The information coming out these past few days about the UK variant is concerning, but like Fauci said, its not a question of IF the vaccine works, but more a question of HOW MUCH the vaccine works against it.

 

[dreday3]

I explained why people would continue to wear masks, like you asked. I repeat: the vaccine will not work for everyone. We already know that. That has no relevancy to your personal willingness to follow the rules. I don't understand why you keep making it about that. It's not about you. It's about what the vaccine is and isn't. It's not an impenetrable shield. Do you disagree that some vaccinated will still get sick?

I'm not going to have a discussion with you as it would be fruitless.
You have a dedicated point of view and nothing will change it.

 

[oceanbreeze77]

Something to also pay attention to is that EU countries are starting to mandate stronger masks for everyone, saying that cloth masks do not work against this variant.

 

[hopemax]

I'm not going to have a discussion with you as it would be fruitless.
You have a dedicated point of view and nothing will change it.

Yes. I believe the math. And I will not apologize for acknowledging the risks that still exist, even with as wonderful as a vaccine as this appears to be. Significantly less risk is not the same as zero risk.

 

[DisneyCane]

Something to also pay attention to is that EU countries are starting to mandate stronger masks for everyone, saying that cloth masks do not work against this variant.

Interesting.

 

[Chi84]

I explained why people would continue to wear masks, like you asked. I repeat: the vaccine will not work for everyone. We already know that. That has no relevancy to your personal willingness to follow the rules. I don't understand why you keep making it about that. It's not about you. It's about what the vaccine is and isn't. It's not an impenetrable shield. Do you disagree that some vaccinated will still get sick?

What is your point, though? The vaccines are highly effective and should work to drastically reduce the virus. It’s true that some people will get sick despite being vaccinated. Are you saying that masks should be worn after the vaccine is available to all who want it and the number of cases comes down to a level where the government/businesses no longer require masks? If so, how long should that be? I’m talking about mandates. The option of wearing masks will always be available to those who don’t feel safe. There will never be zero risk.

 

[DisneyCane]

Yes. I believe the math. And I will not apologize for acknowledging the risks that still exist, even with as wonderful as a vaccine as this appears to be. Significantly less risk is not the same as zero risk.

As far as I've seen reported, not a single person in the trials (Pfizer and Moderna) who got the vaccine and still got COVID ended up hospitalized. If that remains true or even if it is true for 99% of the vaccinated who aren't protected from infection, you'd have something like 0.05% of people AT RISK of serious illness who have been vaccinated. At that point, the rest of society doesn't need to be protecting the at risk any more.

 

[dreday3]

Yes. I believe the math. And I will not apologize for acknowledging the risks that still exist, even with as wonderful as a vaccine as this appears to be. Significantly less risk is not the same as zero risk.

And because there is always going to be a degree of risk (as with everything), you are purporting what? We should all stay in masks indefinitely?

I have no idea what your point of contention is. My only take-away is that you seem upset that I would stop wearing a mask if we are able to.

 

[hopemax]

What is your point, though? The vaccines are highly effective and should work to drastically reduce the virus. It’s true that some people will get sick despite being vaccinated. Are you saying that masks should be worn after the vaccine is available to all who want it and the number of cases comes down to a level where the government/businesses no longer require masks? If so, how long should that be? I’m talking about mandates. The option of wearing masks will always be available to those who don’t feel safe. There will never be zero risk.

You really can't tell? You really think because I said, "Some may want to wait until virus circulation has actually dropped" that I am advocating for people to wear them after the drop? Why would anyone think that, except that they are trying to twist someone's words.

The continued mask mandates exist for a reason. We should respect and acknowledge those reasons and the experts who develop the restrictions and timelines. Instead, it's "I will do what I'm asked, but I think different about the necessity."

 

[dreday3]

You really can't tell? You really think because I said, "Some may want to wait until virus circulation has actually dropped" that I am advocating for people to wear them after the drop? Why would anyone think that, except that they are trying to twist someone's words.

The continued mask mandates exist for a reason. We should respect and acknowledge those reasons and the experts who develop the restrictions and timelines. Instead, it's "I will do what I'm asked, but I think different about the necessity."

Talk about twisting someone's words!

No one is questioning why we still have to wear masks right now. Again, I said - I already stated I will continue wearing masks, following guidelines as obviously not enough people have been vaccinated yet.

We are discussing after personally being vaccinated, we (some, not all) would feel more relaxed about not wearing a mask if allowed, but all the while understanding we still need to wear them.

Do you not understand the difference?

 

[DisneyDebRob]

Based on what’s being said right now, I’ll feel safe going without a mask a couple of weeks after getting the second shot. But I’ll follow all laws/rules as to precautions out of consideration to others. When the masks are no longer required or just recommended, I’ll stop wearing them.

I don’t want to get into this discussion to much.. most of the things from both sides has been said.. but your last sentence says when masks are no longer required.. or just recommended.. you say you won’t wear one. There’s a huge difference between not longer needed and recommended. I’m thinking if they are still recommended then that would be science saying it’s still not safe for some or all? Just trying to figure out the distinction you are making comparing the two. They are hugely different.

 

[correcaminos]

You shouldn’t, you’re not protected until 14 days after your second shot. After that though, I think you’re ok to let some of your guard down.

Yes and no. I still go out with masks and sanitize and clean like I always have. I will continue to do so until numbers drop and it is safe to lighten up some. I'm well beyond the 2 weeks as well. Only thing I started doing was letting people know I was vaccinated if it makes them feel safer having me help them out in their home.

 

[sullyinMT]

I don’t want to get into this discussion to much.. most of the things from both sides has been said.. but your last sentence says when masks are no longer required.. or just recommended.. you say you won’t wear one. There’s a huge difference between not longer needed and recommended. I’m thinking if they are still recommended then that would be science saying it’s still not safe for some or all? Just trying to figure out the distinction you are making comparing the two. They are hugely different.

I won’t answer for the poster, but my opinion of your question is that they’ll be required/mandated or they won’t.
In a few states and locales, SD and FL come to mind and I’m sure there are others, no state mask mandate exists. They’re still recommended, and compliance is variable. Though, to be honest, compliance is variable even with the mandates. But, from a policy standpoint, the areas that have a mandate now won’t likely change their policy tone to “recommended” so much as “no longer mandated, but people in x, y, z populations or those exposed to them should consider continuing their use in certain situations.”

 

[DisneyCane]

I don’t want to get into this discussion to much.. most of the things from both sides has been said.. but your last sentence says when masks are no longer required.. or just recommended.. you say you won’t wear one. There’s a huge difference between not longer needed and recommended. I’m thinking if they are still recommended then that would be science saying it’s still not safe for some or all? Just trying to figure out the distinction you are making comparing the two. They are hugely different.

It will be "not safe for some or all" forever most likely when talking about COVID. At some point it will be mostly people who choose not to be vaccinated.

There are some people (not saying you are one of them) who has an attitude that until everybody is 100% safe (i.e. SARS-CoV-2 is eradicated) that we must all take precautions and keep everybody "safe." Myself an many other people aren't going to do "mitigation" in perpetuity. Everybody is not safe from the flu and we don't really do anything to keep everybody safe from that so when the per capita deaths from COVID get into the same range as a bad flu season it is perfectly reasonable to stop all the "mitigation."

 

[hopemax]

Talk about twisting someone's words!

No one is questioning why we still have to wear masks right now. We are discussing after personally being vaccinated, we (some, not all) would feel more relaxed about not wearing a mask if allowed, but all the while understanding we still need to wear them.

Do you not understand the difference?

Yes, I do. But if someone appears to ask why someone else wouldn't feel that same level of relaxation, as you did in your response to Lilofan, they would be interested in an answer.

Or were you not trying to ask a question and were actually chastising someone for not feeling the same level of relaxation as you?

 

[correcaminos]

Vaccine isn't 100% efficacy. We want to have 100 million people vaccinated by May 1st. At 90% efficacy, that means 10 million of those people are still at risk. Some people with comorbidities won't want to risk being one of those unlucky millions for whom the vaccine fails. Some may want to wait until virus circulation has actually dropped to run naked, instead of just assuming they aren't Prim Everdeen and only have a single ticket in the Hunger Games lottery, the moment after their 14 days post shot has passed.

The key point you are missing is that there have been no deaths from those vaccinated and getting covid. I believe out of the thousands and thousands there was one severe case. So it isn't just about eliminating but also severely reducing the impact on the vaccinated. 95% will show now symptoms. 5% will. A tiny rare percentage might be not so great, but that's really not bad at all

That all said, I continue to mask up as normal and do not hesitate to act as I have been since last year until it is safe for most everyone to do so