On layoffs, very bad attendance, and Iger's legacy being one of disgrace

[ImperfectPixie]

In a perfect world, absolutely. But as the largest employer in the region and in the state, Disney holds most of the cards here. If people leave due to low wages, there's a dozen people with a Disney dream waiting to jump and take over their jobs.

Only to be disillusioned later.

It's a store I've seen repeated many times with the mouse.

That's because there's a positive feedback loop going in the US that enables lots of horrible things to continue unchecked.

 

[AEfx]

That's why a free market system works - if what you say is true and the marketplace both values the work of these people more and there is a disruption in supply/demand because they refuse to sell their labor for the current wage, then wages will in fact increase.

On the other hand, the massive amount of unemployment that will be coming when the government subsidized staffing ends will lead to a surplus in entry level workers chasing even fewer jobs due to downsizing. When that happens the leverage, especially for an employer like Disney, will only increase and that will be their time to extract painful concessions from unions who will have reduced leverage.

Will be interesting to watch it play out.

At Disney, for FOTL employees, it has to.

The CP is gone and likely not coming back anywhere near it’s previous form, if at all. College students don’t even know when they are going to be in a normal classroom again - they wouldn’t come back even if Disney wanted the liability.

Retirees are out. They are not going to be flocking to Disney to work. They are the highest risk group.

So the people left are those who need to make some sort of living wage.

Of course, that is unless anyone is of the belief that things are just going to go back to “normal”, anytime (or any year) soon. Aspects of life have changed and a lot won’t be going back.

Like “enhanced cleaning”. Does anyone think just when a vaccine or whatever becomes available for this specific issue, that any place is going to get away with just doing away with it? Or that the six feet social distancing markers are going anywhere? It’s twenty years past 9-11 but we still are doing bag checks.

Society is changing here, and I think anyone who truly believes that any time in the reasonable future they are going to walk into WDW and not recognize it is as in denial as anyone who thought bag security checks and showing your ID to get on a plane would only last until 2002 or 2003.

 

[Miss Bella]

I carry eight credit cards and I've never paid a penny of interest.

Auto loans at 0% are still a bad idea.

You end up paying more the car that way. I have no idea how many credit cards I have maybe 20 and about 10 I use. I'm waiting for a cruise refund. They told me I used 4 different cards. I can't remember why I used this many cards, but I'm sure it had something to do with making sign-on bonuses.

 

[mkt]

That's because there's a positive feedback loop going in the US that enables lots of horrible things to continue unchecked.

And when you give someone the truth as to how things are there, they refuse to believe, move down, sign a lease, get a job that they hate and can't afford to live off of, quit, break lease, and move back home angry.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

And when you give someone the truth as to how things are there, they refuse to believe, move down, sign a lease, get a job that they hate and can't afford to live off of, quit, break lease, and move back home angry.

The feedback loop includes way more than just Disney.

 

[mkt]

You end up paying more the car that way.

Not always. You treat the negotiation on price and the financing as different transactions. Focus on the out the door price, have preapproved financing, and don't be afraid to get up and walk. The car salesman and sales manager aren't your friends - they're people who want your money.

 

[mkt]

The feedback loop includes way more than just Disney.

A lot of people that have never worked for Disney hold the company in such a high regard, and they assume Disney is a great employer.

It isn't. But you can certainly make a solid middle-class life working there if you manage to get promoted to a leadership or professional role.

 

[mkt]

Exactly. And that's why Disney has zero motivation to either raise wages or provide a better working experience. You explained it perfectly.

People are becoming more and more aware of Disney's labor practices in Florida, and they're getting louder about it. Disney's last announced wage increase happened as a result. And it needs to keep happening. There's no reason for Orlando to be the lowest wage major US city.

 

[hopemax]

That's why a free market system works - if what you say is true and the marketplace both values the work of these people more and there is a disruption in supply/demand because they refuse to sell their labor for the current wage, then wages will in fact increase.

On the other hand, the massive amount of unemployment that will be coming when the government subsidized staffing ends will lead to a surplus in entry level workers chasing even fewer jobs due to downsizing. When that happens the leverage, especially for an employer like Disney, will only increase and that will be their time to extract painful concessions from unions who will have reduced leverage.

Will be interesting to watch it play out.

This is where I usually jump in, and point out how Disney in Orlando has corrupted this basic premise, by importing labor from the Caribbean and the College Program. Local wages do not have to increase, if you can simply get people from somewhere else. The House always wins. Yet somehow we still declare the system fair to all.

This time, though, I'm not sure unemployment will stay in a range where people will be content to fight over scraps. Rather than fighting for access to the full tables of the bourgeoisie. You have to believe you have a chance at the jobs that might exist to take the normal path to the front door. The numbers we're talking about for evictions, missed payments, unemployment. Too many people won't have the luxury of taking the normal path. Historically, these types of imbalances end very poorly. Especially, when one side effectively just told the other side, "we don't care if you get sick and die, shut up, go to work so I can have things."

 

[ImperfectPixie]

A lot of people that have never worked for Disney hold the company in such a high regard, and they assume Disney is a great employer.

It isn't. But you can certainly make a solid middle-class life working there if you manage to get promoted to a leadership or professional role.

I've been very, very fortunate that I've had far more employers that were genuinely good people than I have had bad employers...I didn't realize just how fortunate I was until I was in my late 20s/early 30s.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

And when you give someone the truth as to how things are there, they refuse to believe, move down, sign a lease, get a job that they hate and can't afford to live off of, quit, break lease, and move back home angry.

Well that is a bone chilling account...unfortunately accurate.

Exactly. And that's why Disney has zero motivation to either raise wages or provide a better working experience. You explained it perfectly.

Yeah...that’s how it has been.

But the tolerance for the “below living wage” seems to be ending.

And it’s not altruistic at all. It’s simply that ultra low wages to large parts of the population give those that have/make the money less people to sell to/exploit.

You can’t increase your wealth with a “ladder” that has the bottom 5 rungs sawed off...

The world is Changing in some ways..last 5 years has been rather shocking if you look at some of these nuts and bolts things

 

[mkt]

Maybe I have experience that you don't. Maybe I've seen people destroy their marriages by going into thousands of dollars of credit card debt buying damaged merchandise at Property Control. Maybe I've seen people abandon jobs that provide for their families for a minimum wage job and food stamps.

I knew people like that from when I lived in Orlando, I don't know of any other company that has such a cultlike culture.

 

[AEfx]

In a perfect world, absolutely. But as the largest employer in the region and in the state, Disney holds most of the cards here. If people leave due to low wages, there's a dozen people with a Disney dream waiting to jump and take over their jobs.

Only to be disillusioned later.

It's a store I've seen repeated many times with the mouse.

Do you not think, though, that so much is changed and is changing in our economy, that those “Disney Dreamers” are going to be anywhere near as eager to move to Florida?

And those people, as much as they may be online, what percentage of actual workers do “Disney lifestyles” represent?

Things have started to change among even the kool aid/YouTube bunch. You have some of the major influencers walking around parks with masks on because everyone who is home is watching out of curiosity, yet are pretty much telling people “yeah, you don’t actually want to come here”. Others (the DVC Moms) are pretty much saying “yeah,we may use some points on a stay next year, but we aren’t planning on the parks again for a long time”.

Do you really think the “lifestylers” who are willing to go broke working at WDW are going to make up for all the young and old people who no longer are a viable part of the future WDW work force?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

A lot of people that have never worked for Disney hold the company in such a high regard, and they assume Disney is a great employer.

It isn't. But you can certainly make a solid middle-class life working there if you manage to get promoted to a leadership or professional role.

Truth of the day award.

 

[Miss Bella]

Not always. You treat the negotiation on price and the financing as different transactions. Focus on the out the door price, have preapproved financing, and don't be afraid to get up and walk. The car salesman and sales manager aren't your friends - they're people who want your money.

I've learned the hard way. I'm probably one of the few people to ever get out of a car contract. I got home realized I'd been screwed over went back to the dealer made a big scene and got the contract torn up and renegotiated. It was the third car we've bought from this dealer. I'm glad we won't need another car for a few years.

Someone backed into my car last week in the employee lot. No note of course. I'm out a thousand bucks getting it fixed. 2020 has not been a good year.

 

[mkt]

Do you not think, though, that so much is changed and is changing in our economy, that those “Disney Dreamers” are going to be anywhere near as eager to move to Florida?

Only the salt of the earth midwestern types who would rather go broke working in warm weather than deal with another winter.

And those people, as much as they may be online, what percentage of actual workers do “Disney lifestyles” represent?

A reasonable amount, but even most of the ones who started like that are burned out and over Disney within a year.

Do you really think the “lifestylers” who are willing to go broke working at WDW are going to make up for all the young and old people who no longer are a viable part of the future WDW work force?

Nope. Disney's turnover is going to spike.

 

[mkt]

I've been very, very fortunate that I've had far more employers that were genuinely good people than I have had bad employers...I didn't realize just how fortunate I was until I was in my late 20s/early 30s.

I didn't have my first job with a good employer until I was 28.

 

[brianstl]

Only the salt of the earth midwestern types who would rather go broke working in warm weather than deal with another winter.



A reasonable amount, but even most of the ones who started like that are burned out and over Disney within a year.



Nope. Disney's turnover is going to spike.

Disney doesn’t need more employees now and won’t for a long time. They can afford to burn off 20% of their current parks employees and be fine. Have you seen the crowds in the parks?

Then if they need to add employees in 8
-12 months they won’t have an issue hiring employees. The unemployment rate in Orlando is above 17%.

 

[larryz]

Have an examples to your theory? Because I've never seen any separation agreements that try to manage anything like this.

And in the scenario we are talking about... we were talking about linkedin... which is a CV/job search platform - not just 'social platform'.

Your theory doesn't hold up.



Yes - and their focus is on your terms - not trying to put gag orders on how you address your work history.

Well, admittedly, the gag orders NDAs I've seen were pre-social media days, but they included both secrecy of terms AND non-disparagement clauses.

But face it -- IF an employer offers a huge incentive to keep the news of a mass layoff out of social media, and IF they put that in the NDA, and IF people sign it to take the severance, they'd be as bound to adhere to it as any other provision.

 

[larryz]

I was attacked by an ******* guest, guest denied and claimed self defense, Disney proceeded to not investigate and instead terminated my employment based off of a false accusation.

I finished my bachelors in hospitality, left the country, went back to school, did a bachelors in graphic design, started my career, did a masters in advertising, returned to the states, and am a passholder and shareholder now.

Wow, that sure is a Goofy story...