EPCOT New Play Pavilion to replace Epcot's Wonders of Life

[zeebs758]

It seems to me that Disney is phasing out dark rides which is very sad for me as I always loved them the best. They butchered Horizons, Universe of Energy, and Journey Into Imagination. In 1993 those rides were some of the most fantastic WDW experiences that were ever made along with the dark rides of the Magic Kingdom.

Disney isn't phasing out dark rides at all. The new Ratatouille attraction in Epcot is going to be a trackless dark ride. Rise of the Resistance in Galaxy's Edge is also a trackless dark ride. Details are sparse when it comes to Mickey and Minnie’s Runaway Railway but I'm pretty sure that will be a dark ride as well. There is also a Beauty and the Beast dark ride coming to Toyko Disneyland.

 

[FigmentFan82]

We are at a point where the destination itself is so crowded, almost anything they do will sell out, with a few exceptions.
A lot of it is due to the vast number of rooms and hotels they added to the resort without adding appropriate capacity to the parks

People staying onsite make up a relatively small number of the crowds as a whole that ultimately end up in the parks. There are huge numbers of people staying at the many hundreds of hotels offsite, as well as airbnbs and people simply driving in from other parts of Florida. The added WDW hotels are trying to grab market share from other offsite hotels. The large crowds are simply more people showing up.

 

[Ripken10]

People staying onsite make up a relatively small number of the crowds as a whole that ultimately end up in the parks. There are huge numbers of people staying at the many hundreds of hotels offsite, as well as airbnbs and people simply driving in from other parts of Florida. The added WDW hotels are trying to grab market share from other offsite hotels. The large crowds are simply more people showing up.

It was obvious he didn't know what he was saying when he said that adding onsite hotels was causing overcrowding. I kind of stopped reading after that.

 

[The Grand Inquisitor]

This is an interesting concept. I still wish Wonders of life would've been re themed to inside out or to a black panther themed pavilion. But its still better than nothing.

 

[Casper Gutman]

This is an interesting concept. I still wish Wonders of life would've been re themed to inside out or to a black panther themed pavilion. But its still better than nothing.

I’d actually challenge the idea that this is better than nothing. With the Pavilion sitting empty, the chance existed that the space might become something worthwhile. Now it will be full of a lackluster mishmash of not-very-much for the next decade at least, following in the sad footsteps of Innoventions or Imageworks or MGMs Animation Building.

Worse still, PP gives a pretty strong indication that the EPCOT “redo,” like the MGM redo, lacks anything like a coherent masterplan or a thematic approach intended to differentiate it from the other three parks.

 

[Bender123]

Gotcha. Yes, that was my line of thinking. The continuous utilization of Figment, the upcoming interim IllumiNations replacement show celebrating EPCOT Center, and the 35th anniversary merchandise a while back are also a good examples to support this point.

The issue isn't the imagery of old Epcot, it's the model that was old Epcot. People who go see figment and illuminations and go "Epcot" without connecting it with a 15 minute travel video produced by the Norwegian travel council or the ad for Exxon called energy exchange.

We think Epcot was one thing, when the reality was very different.

Don't mistake my thought for hatred of original Epcot...I loved it. It was just more than what wdw is marketing it to be.

 

[Animaniac93-98]

PP

Accurate, but maybe not the best acronym. Unless this is gonna have the most restrooms of any pavilion.

 

[Casper Gutman]

Accurate, but maybe not the best acronym. Unless this is gonna have the most restrooms of any pavilion.

Just try not to talk about it in the same sentence as Alien Swirling Saucers.

 

[lazyboy97o]

The issue isn't the imagery of old Epcot, it's the model that was old Epcot. People who go see figment and illuminations and go "Epcot" without connecting it with a 15 minute travel video produced by the Norwegian travel council or the ad for Exxon called energy exchange.

We think Epcot was one thing, when the reality was very different.

Don't mistake my thought for hatred of original Epcot...I loved it. It was just more than what wdw is marketing it to be.

Then what was the reality? If it wasn’t something well known with positive brand associations then it makes absolutely no sense to use that branding. You’re not going to see Ford revive Edsel, or another New Coke or Universal Orlando Resort go back to Universal Studios Escape.

 

[tomast]

Hate to disagree, but feel I must add a comment from my personal experiences. A lot of those ride names are simply not household names. Many people think the Magic Kingdom = Disney World. Some even think it's called Disneyland. These people don't have any idea what Big Thunder Mountain Railroad is let alone what the Carousel of Progress is or what the Tiki Room is. I've even spoken with people who went to the parks who couldn't name even half of the rides they went on. It's crazy. I don't know how someone can go to Disney World on two different occasions and still calls the Magic Kingdom Disneyland, but alas, it happened.

Our group here, and those who are Disney fans, are hyper aware of what's going on at Walt Disney World. There's an entirely different group who don't have a clue. Nothing against those folks, but just adding that there's a large segment who doesn't research and doesn't know a thing about the four theme parks - or that there even are four theme parks.

I can't fault Disney for shifting in the direction that's more commonly known. It's by far the easier route. It may disappoint me some, but I can't say I fault them when I've seen the other side of the coin - the people who don't book FastPass+ reservations, don't do any advance planning and don't know the ride names.

Thats 100% they even call Universal (both IoA and US) Disney

 

[bUU]

Be sure to tell Iger about ESPN.

What makes you think he doesn't know?

yes and no. Not all worlds fairs were based on new technology, some are, some aren't.

I believe it is more correct that expositions for most of their early history were staged to showcase industry generally, not just technology. Yes, it is more about culture now, but the underlying reason - the justification given for the public monies expended - is almost always still about how the fair will generate commerce for the host.

So Epcot still fits very well in the mold. The main difference is the timeframe. While fairs are looking to foster commerce at some projected time in the future, Epcot is looking to foster commerce before you leave the park.

 

[Chester&Hester Enthusiast]

Disney wouldn't be making changes if the original concept was as successful as the diehard fans assume it was. None of these decisions are being made just to spite you.

...or it's just cheaper to operate a roller coaster in the dark.

 

[Communicore]

I hope they add modern versions of the Coach simulators.

 

[Chester&Hester Enthusiast]

The issue isn't the imagery of old Epcot, it's the model that was old Epcot. People who go see figment and illuminations and go "Epcot" without connecting it with a 15 minute travel video produced by the Norwegian travel council or the ad for Exxon called energy exchange.

We think Epcot was one thing, when the reality was very different.

Don't mistake my thought for hatred of original Epcot...I loved it. It was just more than what wdw is marketing it to be.

Surely you understand that we yearn for more than the return of Spirit of Norway. I get tired of the assumption that Epcot purists want Disney to rebuild EPCOT exactly as it was in 1982, which is ridiculously untrue. We want a unified vision for the park in line with what it was intended to be. Inspiring. Thoughtful. Forward-thinking.

Instead we get nonsense like a Guardians roller coaster and a shoehorned Frozen ride. I guess these things are just more Disney, timeless, relevant, and family friendly.

 

[Missing20K]

What makes you think he doesn't know?

I'm sure he is well aware. Hence him touting 2 million subscribers to ESPN+ a few weeks ago.

However, there has been a serious lack of long-term, forward-looking level of contribution from ESPN to the overall mission of the enterprise, to use your own words. Only now has DIS decided ESPN needed a serious shot in the arm, ridding themselves of the polarizing political talking heads and adding a streaming service. Only after losing tens of millions of cable subscribers did they feel the need to look at the overall strategic mission of ESPN. DIS has lost untold millions because Iger and Co. did not anticipate the cord-cutting phenomenon early enough.

Sorry for the off-topic folks.

 

[eliza61nyc]

Surely you understand that we yearn for more than the return of Spirit of Norway. I get tired of the assumption that Epcot purists want Disney to rebuild EPCOT exactly as it was in 1982, which is ridiculously untrue. We want a unified vision for the park in line with what it was intended to be. Inspiring. Thoughtful. Forward-thinking.

Instead we get nonsense like a Guardians roller coaster and a shoehorned Frozen ride. I guess these things are just more Disney, timeless, relevant, and family friendly.

Quick question. Why is GoTG nonsense? just asking. it sounds like it will be pretty good. I can't say for sure because it hasn't opened but just curious why it's being dismissed as "nonsense".

 

[WondersOfLife]

Quick question. Why is GoTG nonsense? just asking. it sounds like it will be pretty good. I can't say for sure because it hasn't opened but just curious why it's being dismissed as "nonsense".

Many members on this forum are stuck in a nostalgic phase of what Epcot once was/could have been/will never be anymore.

Basically: IP-Less land. Especially when the IP doesn't fit in with Epcot's original intentions.

Me? At this point, I don't care. Bring on Magic Kingdom 3.0!

 

[Bender123]

Quick question. Why is GoTG nonsense? just asking. it sounds like it will be pretty good. I can't say for sure because it hasn't opened but just curious why it's being dismissed as "nonsense".

Mostly theme...if this were at the studio, I doubt people would care. It's IP just sort of hangs there in a no man's land.

 

[Chester&Hester Enthusiast]

Quick question. Why is GoTG nonsense? just asking. it sounds like it will be pretty good. I can't say for sure because it hasn't opened but just curious why it's being dismissed as "nonsense".

Because from what we know via Disney and our reliable insiders, nothing about it fits at Epcot. If this had been a new build at Studios, I doubt people would have as much of a problem with it. I'm not debating the quality of the attraction, as it hasn't opened yet. I'm sure it will be very well done for what it is.

Many members on this forum are stuck in a nostalgic phase of what Epcot once was/could have been/will never be anymore.

Basically: IP-Less land. Especially when the IP doesn't fit in with Epcot's original intentions.

Again, nobody is stuck in anything. We. Don't. Want. Disney. To. Rebuild. 1982. EPCOT. Center. Verbatim. We want Disney to hold itself to its own standard for themed entertainment, which involved its parks having their own clear identities. Shoving culturally-inappropriate characters into WS and superhero franchises into FW does nothing but water down the identity of the park as a whole.

Me? At this point, I don't care. Bring on Magic Kingdom 3.0!

So what exactly is the purpose of having different parks? Your username is literally a classic EPCOT pavilion, along with your avatar being an EPCOT original IP, so obviously you hold some kind of fondness for the original vision.

Plot Twist: Characters created just for Epcot are also IP. We don't have a problem with the presence of IP in the park as a whole. We object to the inappropriate way that the IP is being used. The issue is that management now considers the parks to just be a marketing tool to push their hot properties and further other parts of the brand. The people in charge no longer consider themed design and entertainment to be an artistic medium.

 

[eliza61nyc]

Because from what we know via Disney and our reliable insiders, nothing about it fits at Epcot. If this had been a new build at Studios, I doubt people would have as much of a problem with it. I'm not debating the quality of the attraction, as it hasn't opened yet. I'm sure it will be very well done for what it is.



Again, nobody is stuck in anything. We. Don't. Want. Disney. To. Rebuild. 1982. EPCOT. Center. Verbatim. We want Disney to hold itself to its own standard for themed entertainment, which involved its parks having their own clear identities. Shoving culturally-inappropriate characters into WS and superhero franchises into FW does nothing but water down the identity of the park as a whole.



So what exactly is the purpose of having different parks? Your username is literally a classic EPCOT pavilion, along with your avatar being an EPCOT original IP, so obviously you hold some kind of fondness for the original vision.

Plot Twist: Characters created just for Epcot are also IP. We don't have a problem with the presence of IP in the park as a whole. We object to the inappropriate way that the IP is being used. The issue is that management now considers the parks to just be a marketing tool to push their hot properties and further other parts of the brand. The people in charge no longer consider themed design and entertainment to be an artistic medium.

so again why is it "nonsense" or "inappropriate". because it doesn't fit in the old theme? that's all I'm trying to figure out. Is it because it doesn't fit in with the original vision?

let me start with this question, now I never went to Epcot when it first opened so please correct me if I'm wrong but Epcot was built to supposedly showcase new technology? I did get that the acronym was protype community of tomorrow.

and adding a rollercoaster some how waters down that identity? (that's a sincere question) or if it's superhero stuff it does not fit with the design?

just trying to figure out the vitriol for that and other rides when personally I slap happy they got rid of Ellen's and Maelstrom, so I'm looking forward to it.