Disney buys 1000 acres of land

[Thelazer]

Maybe it's time for structured park openings to get to the 5th gate.

MK closed Tue / Thurs
Epcot closed Mon / Sunday
MGM Closed Wed / Thurs
AK Closed Mon / Tuesday
5th Gate Closed Friday / Saturday.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

They "promise" to keep a certain percentage of property as wetlands/conservation because this gives them tax credit. It is not at all because they care about the environment. But the PR department spins it this way.

While basically true...that’s a little revisionist. They have spent a lot of money and time pursuing the conservation Agenda...

But that’s more in the rear view mirror

 

[HauntedPirate]

While basically true...that’s a little revisionist. They have spent a lot of money and time pursuing the conservation Agenda...

But that’s more in the rear view mirror

Many things that Disney was known for are in the rear view mirror. Oddly, while some of that started in the early 2000's, a lot of the machinations around that started in 2006. Purely a coincidence, I'm sure.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Yet everyone complains about overcrowding. Which one is it?
There is a demand and a shortage of capacity.

I just don't think that's true. The parks are busy and crowded. Saying that Orlando is over-saturated would imply that there are empty parks or parks that just aren't crowded. While this may be true during certain days during the year, it's definitely not true for the vast majority of the year. Disney can open a 5th park and it won't be empty or a failure and Uni can open a 3rd park and it won't be empty or a failure. It's not over-saturated

The parks of central Florida lack throughput capacity. More parks designed to create crowding won’t alleviate crowding.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Yet everyone complains about overcrowding. Which one is it?
There is a demand and a shortage of capacity.

The locals are the only ones complaining about over-saturation.

The parks of central Florida lack throughout capacity. More parks designed to create crowding won’t alleviate crowding.

That too. Adding x units of capacity is going to draw y incremental people. If y > x, your crowding problem just got worse.

 

[seascape]

Nintendo brings more ride possibilities than Harry Potter does but that does not make a land. A land like Happy Potter requires a single theme along with different rides. Nintendo has all the rides but in different environments. Disney's Fantasy land has a common theme of Princesses so it works. I do think a Nintendo park will work but then so does a Six Flags or Cedar Fair park. It just is not the same. Universal upped the game with Harry Potter and Disney responded with Pandora and SW:GE. If that is the future then Universal has to use 4 or 5 separate lands with rides that fit in those lI'mands

Its because they 'promise' to keep a certain percentage of their property as wetlands/conservation. So if they want to develop more of it, they need more land to keep that percentage. It doesn't point to any project in particular, but its not really about 'taxes'.



Its not really oversaturated as far as guests go, but as we saw with DAK, the guests from the other three parks spread out to the fourth instead of just adding new guests to fill park #4. It took quite a while before it averaged out to being another 'day' added to the average guest's trip.

The bigger problem with adding a 3rd park at Universal or a 5th at WDW are the employees. The market in Orlando just doesn't exist that would be able to support that many new workers, especially if they both were to open another park. Unless, of course, Disney and Comcast were to raise wages.

Disney gained market share in 2017 because of Pandora. Universal and Seaworld lost market
Share. Most likely same thing happened in 2018.

 

[danlb_2000]

That too. Adding x units of capacity is going to draw y incremental people. If y > x, your crowding problem just got worse.

I think this is one of the biggest challenges for MK. I would assume that most people visiting WDW are going to spend at least of day at MK. So if you add more to other parks and it draws more guests, MK has to be able to absorb some of that increase.

 

[Ripken10]

Even if labor were free, there's not enough potential incremental revenue to justify a 5th gate. Not now, not ever. Americans don't have enough vacation time to visit WDW for the amount of time it would take to thoroughly experience five parks. A family that visits for six nights now would continue to visit six nights in a world with five gates.

To be successful, you do no need families to visit all 5 gates. With the opening of Star Wars next year, you will have an entire group of people visiting WDW that will not have interest in the Magic Kingdom. They have never had an interest in WDW but now they do. Getting this group of people to extend their vacations. You also have locals, and those that take more frequent shorter trips that could appeal to another gate (EVENTUALLY). And finally, at a point they will want to increase the number visiting to a point that the current parks can't handle. All these will be eventual reasons to a 5th gate...EVENTUALLY. Certainly not short term

 

[jt04]

I think this is one of the biggest challenges for MK. I would assume that most people visiting WDW are going to spend at least of day at MK. So if you add more to other parks and it draws more guests, MK has to be able to absorb some of that increase.

Someday. My guess for the office pool is 2024.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Nintendo brings more ride possibilities than Harry Potter does but that does not make a land. A land like Happy Potter requires a single theme along with different rides. Nintendo has all the rides but in different environments. Disney's Fantasy land has a common theme of Princesses so it works. I do think a Nintendo park will work but then so does a Six Flags or Cedar Fair park. It just is not the same. Universal upped the game with Harry Potter and Disney responded with Pandora and SW:GE. If that is the future then Universal has to use 4 or 5 separate lands with rides that fit in those lI'mands.

Fantasyland is princess themed? That’s ironic since NONE of the original attractions were princess themed save the carousel...and most aren’t today.

And I’m sure disney LOVES that they upped the game with SE:GEJJSUX....

But here on earth it actually hasn’t opened yet

 

[JohnD]

I wish they would build the old Disney’s America park... but its not IP so that will never happen

If inside WDW, it wouldn’t suffer from NIMBY syndrome as it did in VA not to mention the Disneyfying of history in the Washington, DC area. I’m sure the chances are slim to none for this park though.

 

[MotherOfBirds]

Yet everyone complains about overcrowding. Which one is it?
There is a demand and a shortage of capacity.

As someone who lives here, it would only serve to make Orlando a miserable place to live

 

[Tom Morrow]

WDW does not need a 5th gate. I have my doubts as to how Universal's second property will pan out. WDW needs to continue beefing up the existing four parks to handle the new crowd levels as they failed to do so throughout the '00's and early '10's .

 

[The Pho]

Nintendo brings more ride possibilities than Harry Potter does but that does not make a land. A land like Happy Potter requires a single theme along with different rides. Nintendo has all the rides but in different environments. Disney's Fantasy land has a common theme of Princesses so it works. I do think a Nintendo park will work but then so does a Six Flags or Cedar Fair park. It just is not the same. Universal upped the game with Harry Potter and Disney responded with Pandora and SW:GE. If that is the future then Universal has to use 4 or 5 separate lands with rides that fit in those lI'mands

Harry Potter is a single entity that's provides very little in the way of unique areas to fully theme many areas for a park. Hogwarts being the most obvious, then there was Diagon Alley and not much else that is uniquely Potter (not to say that they couldn't manage another). Nintendo has many properties providing the same level of potential. If they do simply a Nintendo land, then yes it would come across as less immersive. But building Hyrule provides something that could be Hogwarts and more, building a Donkey Kong land could easily be a Pandora and more, the properties have more leniency that allow for greater park adaptation. Then there's the ease of placing Mario in nearly any setting and having it work. By the sounds of it, we can expect separate Pokémon, Hyrule, and Mario (with greater Nintendo) lands spread through the three parks in Orlando, each with the potential to provide completely unique experiences compared to the others. And within those properties are just as many options for rides and shows, because of the range the games have had.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Nintendo brings more ride possibilities than Harry Potter does but that does not make a land. A land like Happy Potter requires a single theme along with different rides. Nintendo has all the rides but in different environments. Disney's Fantasy land has a common theme of Princesses so it works. I do think a Nintendo park will work but then so does a Six Flags or Cedar Fair park. It just is not the same. Universal upped the game with Harry Potter and Disney responded with Pandora and SW:GE. If that is the future then Universal has to use 4 or 5 separate lands with rides that fit in those lI'mands

“Nintendo land” is not a thing beyond the naming of Super Nintendo World, which will contain Super Mario Bros., Yoshi and Donkey Kong. Those are interrelated properties ultimately going back to the original Donkey Kong game. Pokémon and The Legend of Zelda will be separate lands in the existing parks.

 

[mikejs78]

Monster bulk reply coming....

I would pretty much pay anything for the chance to walk through Ocarina of Time or Breath of the Wild's Hyrule (esp. considering they might be the same place!)

Haven't been to Uni in years. This exact thing would get me back.

It's Its not really oversaturated as far as guests go, but as we saw with DAK, the guests from the other three parks spread out to the fourth instead of just adding new guests to fill park #4. It took quite a while before it averaged out to being another 'day' added to the average guest's trip.

How did you arrive at this conclusion? 3 out of 4 WDW parks grew in attendance in 2017, and only DHS declined, and even then only by a little.

MK: +0.3%
Epcot: +4.2%
AK: +15.3%
DHS: -0.5%

So which parks did Pandora ciphon guests from?

Also, whenever a 5th gate does happen (and I don't think it will anytime soon), it won't be to get guests to visit more parks or extend their vacations. It will be to accommodate more total guests. With the introduction of date-based ticketing, I could see a future where a guest visits wdw and only sees 3 of 5 parks... But it will allow accommodating of more total guests in any given day.

Even if labor were free, there's not enough potential incremental revenue to justify a 5th gate. Not now, not ever. Americans don't have enough vacation time to visit WDW for the amount of time it would take to thoroughly experience five parks. A family that visits for six nights now would continue to visit six nights in a world with five gates.

Never say never As the parks get different themes/focus, you may have people only coming to visit 3 of the parks. I know people who have never had any interest in Disney who have already booked trips for 2020 to see Galaxy's Edge (poor souls). They plan on skipping MK entirely and focusing on DHS, AK for Pandora, and Epcot for the festivals. Eventually, the four parks won't be able to accommodate all the guests coming to wdw. And that's when a 5th gate will become necessary. But I think we are at least 15 years away from that.

The Dow dropping is just an indicator... let's give it six months or so and let's see...

She’s going down...

That’s how it works...and the people are going to be served the dinner they chose to order...at least in Western Europe and their new world counterpart

There will be a downturn sooner rather than later. The economy is and always has been cyclic, and we are due. But looking at the fundamentals, I think it's likely to be a fairly soft recession.

Fantasyland is princess themed? That’s ironic since NONE of the original attractions were princess themed save the carousel...and most aren’t today.

Snow White's Adventures? But your general point stands.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Monster bulk reply coming....

Snow White's Adventures? But your general point stands.

Good use of multiquote...but on steroids

I guess...but I don’t associate a black lit, tempura paint lsd-laced nightmare with anything “princess”

And say “never” on another park...for two big reasons

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

WDW does not need a 5th gate. I have my doubts as to how Universal's second property will pan out. WDW needs to continue beefing up the existing four parks to handle the new crowd levels as they failed to do so throughout the '00's and early '10's .

That basically ends this discussion...but I’m sure we will continue...

Now - have we figured out where bob Saget ISNT yet?

 

[kong1802]

Perhaps this is where Brazil is going?

 

[phillip9698]

Nintendo brings more ride possibilities than Harry Potter does but that does not make a land. A land like Happy Potter requires a single theme along with different rides. Nintendo has all the rides but in different environments. Disney's Fantasy land has a common theme of Princesses so it works. I do think a Nintendo park will work but then so does a Six Flags or Cedar Fair park. It just is not the same. Universal upped the game with Harry Potter and Disney responded with Pandora and SW:GE. If that is the future then Universal has to use 4 or 5 separate lands with rides that fit in those lI'mands

Disney gained market share in 2017 because of Pandora. Universal and Seaworld lost market
Share. Most likely same thing happened in 2018.

I fail to see how a pokemon land does not work as a theme.

How does a Mushroom Kingdom land not work? It's a cohesive theme.

If you split those two out from an overall Nintendo area you have more than enough material to draw from to create very immersive themes.