New Disneyland Parking Garage and Transportation Hub

[NobodyElse]

OK, my knowledge of AGW from experience.

The area where a possible bridge would go is currently an interior hallway with restrooms. Restrooms are on the north side of the hallway. When the area hosted the movie theater, the corner had Cinnabon store facing east. The south side is the wall for the parking structure. So the building, as far as I can tell, was designed to allow the addition of a bridge

Once again, when it comes to these images, you get what you pay for.

Here is a deep, dark, hallway that runs between the parking structure and the retail space. It leads to bathrooms, and a stairwell (as well as a door to a not-for-public-consumption hallway that runs at a 90 degree angle along the back-side of said retail, on down to the HOB space). This may or may not be the hallway @Darkbeer1 was speaking of, but to me it doesn't quite line up.

Here's a little something I came across. (It might be useful later.) Please excuse the shadows, exposure, etc. Phone camera and I was trying to avoid flash reflections.

In this image, I tried to overlay the above photo with a google earth image. Noted is: (orange) what would be the straight-line path from the assumed sky-way, (green) the existing hallway to the bathrooms, (blue) the existing off-limits hallway that runs north/south. Also note, I may have the shape of this hallway messed up a bit. I wasn't doing any measuring.

Please note (if you wish) there's a clear (or not so clear) delineation between the empty retail space on the bottom half of this image, and the future HOB structure on the top half, complete with expansion joint on the walkway to the right.

Here's a picture from just inside the door of the north/south hallway. I guess you can use the fire extinguisher housing for scale.

Here's a shot from a little further down. It's intended to show those expansion joints, as well as the fact that the stairs go up to a small platform (the joints in the walls bisect it) then back down. Use the hand rails for scale and perspective. It must be avoiding something important.

Put this all together and what does it mean? I don't know. That's what discussion is for.

And one more bonus picture, with a story. When it was time to leave, I drove down the ramps and was presented with a choice of two exits. One way led to Katella (and it's forced right-hand turn towards Harbor. The other would lead to Disney Way, and quick access to the southbound 5 (where I was going). Following their clear signage, I was confronted with this dilemma:

Oh GardenWalk. You never fail to disappoint.

 

[Old Mouseketeer]

Well, nothing says they couldn't build the skyway above (north of) the orange portion of the existing utility bridge, all the way through the retail space below the expansion joint. In a redevelopment of the scale that AGW needs, engineering a connector to a major resort like this can be a major prioity. AGW was built with the expectation of two significant hotels on the expansion pads north and south of the Fire Station, along with the assumption that the aging former Hyatt Hotel to the west would be developed into a major hotel property. This is one of the biggest reasons AGW failed (at least from the retail perspective). The existing street-front restaurants mostly have strong brands and deep pockets and so have a better chance of surviving. AGW was ugly and unpleasant. It had plenty of walking, but very little garden. Ultimately there was no "there" there.

 

[Deleted member 107043]

This is one of the biggest reasons AGW failed (at least from the retail perspective).

I agree that not having hotels adjacent reduced the amount of traffic passing through the mall, and you are right to point out how conceptually bad AGW was from the start. With DLR beckoning across the street there's only so many tourists who are going to wander down from their hotel rooms to eat at Bubba Gimp's or visit Sunglass Hut #982.

 

[Darkbeer1]

First off, the project did not make the Anaheim Planning Commission Agenda Calendar for Monday, so someone has placed a hold on it, probably a minor issue, but no official document release...

So, I went to Sushi Class at Roy's at AGW today, and took some photos/videos.

First off, interesting to note, the Pumbaa Lot was being used for guest parking today. (aka busy day)

Let's start with a video of driving down Manchester/Clementine from the North to Disney Way (North to South). This shows the road where it narrows at the Quality Inn and how it widens near the Pumbaa Lot.

https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Anaheim-GardenWalk-9172016/i-4kgNJRf/A

And let's go back, South to North, this time, looking at the side of the road where the Eastern Gateway will be built.

https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Anaheim-GardenWalk-9172016/i-dXw2sJQ/A

Now, a look at the AGW.

Let's start with the upper level hallway I described earlier, that might work with the possible bridge to the possible 4-Star Hotel. (Check out the Wincome thread I posted for that news).

Here is the property map, look at the Upper Level on the right, just north of the Parking Structure.

https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Anaheim-GardenWalk-9172016/i-cHHFnsc/A

https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Anaheim-GardenWalk-9172016/i-tLSJRjp/A

https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Anaheim-GardenWalk-9172016/i-rQpNm9b/A

https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Anaheim-GardenWalk-9172016/i-ThFLf8L/A

And a couple of photos of the future House of Blues.

https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Anaheim-GardenWalk-9172016/i-gDQQKMQ/A

https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Anaheim-GardenWalk-9172016/i-R5Lj9Gf/A

 

[Darkbeer1]

OK, testing to see if I can get photos to attach.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Quick Update... Nothing official is happening.....

That said, it has been awfully quiet in regards to the Eastern Gateway, but all the parties are scrambling due to issues like the Unite Here filing of the petition to stop the Wincome Hotel Tax Breaks. The "Political" wind is strong right now, and everyone is scrambling behind the scenes to figure out what to prioritize, and the upcoming election in November is not helping... We might be waiting a bit for something that would count as "news".

I think the current winner is Pepto-Bismol...

 

[TP2000]

View attachment 163064

OK, testing to see if I can get photos to attach.

That map has the "Opening Fall 2016" text on the new House of Blues location. That has been pushed back further to just "2017". I looked inside House of Blues recently and it looked like not much progress has been made and I wouldn't expect this to open before next summer.

Poor GardenWalk can never catch a break. Always something at that cursed place.

It might be worth checking with the native Gabrielino Indian tribe and see if they were using the GardenWalk land a few centuries ago as a burial ground. The mall is cursed.

 

[NobodyElse]

I looked inside House of Blues recently and it looked like not much progress has been made and I wouldn't expect this to open before next summer.

Yeah, when I peeked in a couple of weeks ago, sparks were flying, but honestly I couldn't tell you if it was still demo of the theater or construction for HOB. The place was still basically a shell.

 

[NobodyElse]

That map has the "Opening Fall 2016" text on the new House of Blues location. That has been pushed back further to just "2017". I looked inside House of Blues recently and it looked like not much progress has been made and I wouldn't expect this to open before next summer.

Poor GardenWalk can never catch a break. Always something at that cursed place.

It might be worth checking with the native Gabrielino Indian tribe and see if they were using the GardenWalk land a few centuries ago as a burial ground. The mall is cursed.

By the way, per this link:

So, it looks like they're trying to split the difference between the old "Fall 2016" plan and your "Summer 2017" guess. It seems plausible if they really hustle (and do a lot of the decorative work off-site for quick installation). Time will tell...

 

[Curious Constance]

Shouldn't they have waiting until the new location was up and ready before closing their DTD business?

 

[Deleted member 107043]

Shouldn't they have waiting until the new location was up and ready before closing their DTD business?

I'm guessing that their DTD lease expired.

 

[Curious Constance]

I'm guessing that their DTD lease expired.

You'd think they would have started construction of the new location in anticipation of their lease ending.

 

[lazyboy97o]

You'd think they would have started construction of the new location in anticipation of their lease ending.

That still assumes they knew their lease was ending far enough out. In Orlando, Universal was already well underway with Toothsome Chocolate Emporium before they got around to telling the NBA that their lease was being ended early.

 

[Curious Constance]

That still assumes they knew their lease was ending far enough out. In Orlando, Universal was already well underway with Toothsome Chocolate Emporium before they got around to telling the NBA that their lease was being ended early.

My kids tell me all the time to quit assuming things, and I never learn.

 

[NobodyElse]

You'd think they would have started construction of the new location in anticipation of their lease ending.

In our eyes it seems like it would make sense to offer a somewhat seamless transition, but it's likely we don't have a grasp of the entire picture.

• As mentioned, there could be lease issues we're unaware of
• There might even be some sort of clause restricting opening a new establishment within X number of months of closing
• HOB / LiveNation might feel it's okay at this point to just spread their acts out among their other venues
• We all know big companies love to cut overhead whenever possible (even temporarily) - They're probably enjoying not paying staff for a while
• They might have run into unforeseen issues with the new site, or just want to spread out the construction costs (sound familiar?)

See you in March for the next real update.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Well, the "Bergstrom" property had a planning commission filing for its property at 200 W Alro Way. (The property just north of Disney Way at I-5. A proposed 5 story, 174 room Hotel with underground parking is the project.(DEV2016-00055).

It takes the property on both sides of W Alro (The current entrance road that CM's use to enter Pumbaa) .

So it looks like someone has decided that the property has value. (There is another Hotel already being built next door.)

https://www.countryinns.com/anaheim-hotel-ca-92802/usaahca

 

[TP2000]

The Bergstrom's saga may finally be coming to an end.

What's telling here is that it will be another hotel. The Anaheim Resort District has had several thousand new hotel rooms built in the last three years, all by big national chains. (Hilton, Marriott, Starwood, etc.) And there are at least two thousand more rooms on the drawing boards or already under construction, most notably the four-star luxury hotels that have been covered in the news.

Thousands of hotel rooms added within a few years. That tells you how wildly successful the Disneyland Resort has become lately. Wow!

 

[NobodyElse]

Well, the "Bergstrom" property had a planning commission filing for its property at 200 W Alro Way. (The property just north of Disney Way at I-5. A proposed 5 story, 174 room Hotel with underground parking is the project.(DEV2016-00055).

It takes the property on both sides of W Alro (The current entrance road that CM's use to enter Pumbaa) .

So it looks like someone has decided that the property has value. (There is another Hotel already being built next door.)

https://www.countryinns.com/anaheim-hotel-ca-92802/usaahca

Thanks for that update.

Do you know if the Country Inn and Suites property is a basic rectangle surrounding the hotel, or if it is more "L" shaped? Last time I drove by there it was hard to tell if the plot along Manchester/Clementine was just being used for construction staging, or if it will be used for the hotel (parking, pool, etc).

 

[Darkbeer1]

Well, Disney has started the process again, and re-submitted its proposal (DEV2016-00014) on September 20th. This pushes the first possible hearing date to be November 14th. Amazing, after the election....

And more than likely Disney will know the status of the Wincome petition, and what the city council plans to do with it. (The signature verification count is due by October 14th from the Register of Voters, and could end up on the October 18th or 25th or November 1st Council Meeting).

Thanks for that update.

Do you know if the Country Inn and Suites property is a basic rectangle surrounding the hotel, or if it is more "L" shaped? Last time I drove by there it was hard to tell if the plot along Manchester/Clementine was just being used for construction staging, or if it will be used for the hotel (parking, pool, etc).

The Country Inn is a Rectangle, the Bergstrom Property is the Triangle.

Go this link, pull up the September 9th Deadline, and then click on the Red 6 circle, and it will pull up the map and zoom in for the Bergstrom proposal.

http://gis.anaheim.net/developmentactivity/

And here is a map of the Country Inn property.

http://gis.anaheim.net/PropertyInfo/?APN=08221311

There are two rectangles, the lower one is the Southern California Edison Right of Way for its power line towers. That land is severely restricted as to what can be done, and Disney will be lucky to get the Pedestrian Walk next to Harbor and Disney Way done.

The entrance to the Pumbaa Parking structure shouldn't be an issue, as all we are talking about is cars driving under the lines, just like elsewhere in the area.

 

[Darkbeer1]

The Bergstrom's saga may finally be coming to an end.

What's telling here is that it will be another hotel. The Anaheim Resort District has had several thousand new hotel rooms built in the last three years, all by big national chains. (Hilton, Marriott, Starwood, etc.) And there are at least two thousand more rooms on the drawing boards or already under construction, most notably the four-star luxury hotels that have been covered in the news.

Thousands of hotel rooms added within a few years. That tells you how wildly successful the Disneyland Resort has become lately. Wow!

Well, the "Chains" are not building the Hotels. The Chains sell their name. There was an interesting article about Marriott finally getting to purchase Starwood, and how Starwood has been selling of its company owned properties in today's news.

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/marriott-729942-starwood-hotel.html

>>Marriott and Starwood — like other hotel chains — own very few individual hotels. Instead they manage or franchise their brands to hundreds of individual owners, often real estate development companies. Those individual hotel owners are responsible for setting nightly room rates. It isn’t uncommon for a developer to own a Marriott, Hilton, Hyatt and Sheraton in the same city.<<

For example the Owners of HoJo's (Development/Hotel Company), got the land they used to build the new Courtyard and where Mimi's Café sits from CalTrans in return for losing part of its original property decades ago when the I-5 was expanded in the area.

So the developer looks at what is available, and which "names/brands" will match up with the planned property. Then they work with the chains to see what type of fees they will want in exchange for the use of the name. Plus, brands are careful to not have too many of the same specific brand in an area. So the developers want the lowest fees, while the chains want to try and maximize them.

Being an "independent" Hotel/Motel is tough, as working as a group you have a central booking agency, a Frequent Stay program and a "track record" " as the Chains do require minimum standards that are checked on a regular basis.

We just had a new Ayers Hotel built in Orange. (small local chain)

But I presume if Wincome goes through with its projects, that they will become branded 4 star Hotels.

And it isn't just Disney, but the Anaheim Convention Center is expanding again, and brings in and needs nice Hotels to host not just the guests visiting the Convention Center, but also support facilities, like meeting rooms at the Hotel itself.

And we also have secondary Convention facilities in town.

http://visitanaheim.org/partners/16852/anaheim-business-expo-center

And then you also have the Concert Venues in the Honda Center, The City National Grove of Anaheim, the upcoming House of Blues, and on occasion, Angel Stadium.

And of course, the sports events, Yes the Angels Baseball team, the Anaheim Ducks Hockey Team, but also teams like the LA KISS AFL team, multiple MotorSports events, College Basketball events including March Madness, and if LA gets the 2024 Olympics, the Honda Center will be the host for the Volleyball games. (Anaheim is home to the US National Volleyball Teams).

So yes, improving DCA, upcoming Star Wars Land, and the promise to the city to spend at least $1 Billion in major improvements to the DLR, with an extension if they spend another $500 million is helping drive the expansion, as the developers know that expansion will happen.

But it should be interesting to see if the Angels will get a deal to build a "new" Angel Stadium, which is supposed to be nicer and designed for other uses to maximize its revenue.